UKMT May 2017: Weak and Wobbly vs. Old and Knobbly

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > UKMT May 2017: Weak and Wobbly vs. Old and Knobbly

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jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

How do paper scottish fivers come into play with this plastic nonsense

# ¿ May 1, 2017 00:14

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# ¿ Apr 25, 2024 15:38

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

TheHoodedClaw posted:

They are all plastic too.

Yeah I'm saying I have some paper ones, they are presumably not usable anymore right?

# ¿ May 1, 2017 00:31

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

LemonDrizzle posted:

The German newspaper FAZ has an account of the midweek dinner meeting between May/Davis and Juncker, which is really not complimentary at all of the PM; the Economist's Berlin bureau chief did a translation of the highlights on Twitter: https://twitter.com/JeremyCliffe/status/858810953353367552

e: the Reuters writeup of the article is here: http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-may-idUKKBN17W09L

Unfortunately, this is likely to be an ongoing feature of the brexit farce, with the EU perspective on the proceedings being primarily reported in non-English language sources and thus less visible to the UK public.

I'm loving glad that this thing is being done with the best intentions by both sides, with the reasonable concerns hundreds of millions of EU + UK citizens taken into account, not the ego of a guy who let the EU collapse and some smug prick and his schoolteacher mistress taking charge.

# ¿ May 1, 2017 00:49

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

LemonDrizzle posted:

The EU is not collapsing, and EU citizens in general support the Commission's stance, sooooo...

The EU gave up earlier this year when the remaining rich members said they were fine with a "multi-speed" Europe.

I don't think EU citizens in general will actually support the commission's stance when �290bil of exports and �240bil of imports are put under threat because Juncker, Verhofstadt, and Barnier are too vain to get along with the quite stupid Davis, Fox, and May. The handful of people doing the negotiations are rich enough for it not to matter to them personally. The workers of Europe, not so much.

# ¿ May 1, 2017 11:23

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

forkboy84 posted:

https://twitter.com/TelegraphNews/status/858750626058035200

Have some Peak Lib Dem

Hypocrisy is a sin, Tim!

# ¿ May 1, 2017 11:26

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

Pissflaps posted:

It's his campaign.

He won three elections though so he might now something about winning them.

In six months' time, I'm sure JC will have won as many elections within 2 years as Blair managed in 10.

# ¿ May 1, 2017 11:46

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

TACD posted:

Inspirational stuff.

Right up there with the "I know how to win - I'm married to my wife!" line from Owen Smith.

# ¿ May 1, 2017 11:52

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

Seaside Loafer posted:

I've never understood the reluctance for landlords to take housing benefit people.

Partly presumed indolence on the part of the renters, partly worries that universal credit is going to be rolled out everywhere, which replaces HB with a cash donation that many people on HB will just spend, go into arrears on, and then have nothing to act as collateral on, and partly the fact that HB is very prone to political decisions.

Like if you're a medium-to-large scale landlord and 40% of your housing stock is occupied by people on HB and there's some cap or huge cut introduced to help save up for the Brexit Warchest, is it plausible that you can come to some arrangement with your tenants that doesn't involve kicking them out but does involve them paying enough to make your investment worth it, and non-emergency upkeep on the house affordable? Maybe, maybe not.

# ¿ May 1, 2017 12:12

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

Seaside Loafer posted:

I don't think that's true, I was on the universal credit September and November last year and I think there was a 'pay the rent straight to the landlord' option in it. I didn't choose that option because I didn't want her to know in case she kicked me out but I think its possible. It didn't cover the full rent but it was most of it. On less expensive places it probably would I guess. I don't understand the mentality, if you look on the website spareroom.co.uk practically every ad says 'No DSS'. This is stupid, if its a good person you cant loose if they are on benefits.

If it isn't a good person you can, though.

# ¿ May 1, 2017 12:17

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

Seaside Loafer posted:

Well thats the point of interviewing your tenants isn't it. Are you suggesting people on benefits are inherently a bunch of scumbags not worthy of having a roof over their heads?

No, I'm saying that people on HB are more or less like any other tenant, but typically with less stuff to put up as collateral/less chance of successfully getting the money you are owed if it ends up in small claims court. I can understand why banks won't lend to landlords in that instance, and hence why landlords are reluctant to take them on as a result.

More housing being built would help this unfortunate situation.

# ¿ May 1, 2017 12:43

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

Spangly A posted:

and you think this should be legal?

For now, probably, yeah.

It's a difficult situation for everyone involved. If the government is confirmed as the legal guarantor of last resort, more HB tenants will default, because that will be a more rational choice for them. At which point HB will not be handed out anymore, or will be handed out much more restrictively, because that is a big increase in liability on the public finances which the insurance and re-insurance markets probably wouldn't be able to handle if the government tried to protect itself in a less coercive way than cheerfully sending in the G4S bailliffs every time someone missed a month's rent.

Which is why building more housing is important, to suppress demand for rented property by giving people an easier time trying to not have to go into it.

# ¿ May 1, 2017 12:58

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

knox_harrington posted:

Interesting article in this week's Economist on this: https://www.economist.com/blogs/speakerscorner/2017/04/battle-builders

What an incredibly moronic article.

"In the big cities where local government cuts have been enormous, it looks like Labour is not doing so well in the last few years!!!!!!" yeah no poo poo, what about Big Gid's policy to replace any council houses sold with fresh housing? Oh that hasn't happened whatsoever, Nice.

# ¿ May 1, 2017 13:08

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

knox_harrington posted:

True, but it poses problems for Corbs promoting Labour as the party of house building.

Not really. Labour have not been in government, they have been in squeezed local government. People understand that. Osborne lied about the commitment to build as many houses as were sold by councils. Labour can claim, truthfully or not, that they would have done things differently and helped hundreds of thousands get on the ladder instead of pulling it up, etc. etc.

# ¿ May 1, 2017 13:25

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

TinTower posted:

https://twitter.com/theipaper/status/857994119389622279

Bristol, well known Northern city.

I doubt Maconie is selecting the jpegs, and he makes a valid point.

# ¿ May 2, 2017 11:07

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

Pissflaps posted:

hosed Up If True

# ¿ May 2, 2017 11:30

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

Regarde Aduck posted:

Abbot unable to get her point across? No way. I assume she's good at her job but they need to hide her from ever having to talk to anyone.

Her job is talking to anyone, that's literally her job.

# ¿ May 2, 2017 13:44

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

jabby posted:

For one, interviews with him and John McDonnell where they both refused to say anything negative about the then leadership, despite being heavily baited by the interviewer. Corbyn may have been a serial rebel but he never tried to undermine his party.

What about the time he congratulated George Galloway for beating a labour candidate?

# ¿ May 2, 2017 13:55

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

serious gaylord posted:

https://twitter.com/antony_calvert/status/853880478117617665

Yeah if only he'd have got a much worse coffee at roughly the same price from a local greasy spoon like a proper member of the working class, right? loving tory pricks.

# ¿ May 2, 2017 20:50

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

*in extremely rat leaving what they think is a sinking ship voice*

"Yeah my granddad's greengrocer's off-and-on girlfriend was Irish, can I have a passport please??"

# ¿ May 4, 2017 14:05

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

Sapozhnik posted:

Socially and economically progressive ideals are at least gaining some traction in the US

lmao

# ¿ May 4, 2017 17:35

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

*nearly two thirds of states turn red*

"I feel like the ideals of Bernie Sanders will come around any day now" I say as corporate tax drops twenty points, envrionmental regs are binned, and healthcare and social security is gutted to pay for military expansion

# ¿ May 4, 2017 17:35

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

Lord of the Llamas posted:

Bernie would have won. If for no other reason than the Comey letters wouldn't have happened.

Yeah okay bud.

# ¿ May 4, 2017 18:01

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

Lord of the Llamas posted:

You disagree? There's a good argument that it cost Clinton the election. Why would you think Bernie would've been in a worse situation otherwise than Clinton? Because the neoliberals would have all gone for Trump or something?

I think it would have been a very different election and that it isn't a useful counterfactual argument, especially in UKMT.

I think her collapsing and having to be dragged into the back of a truck that she tried to hide on 9/11 probably influenced the election more than Her Emails fwiw.

# ¿ May 4, 2017 18:12

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

Regarde Aduck posted:

Jeremy isn't going to win because the public is ideologically right wing. You love polls, you saw the poll that had 24% openly identifying as 'ethnic nationalists'. A further 25%, classed as the common sense voter, were found to have almost identical issues.

These people are not going to vote Corbyn whether he was amazing at his job or not. The country doesn't want a left wing government.

Frankly, I feel your issue boils down to wanting a centrist government with a red logo. You could vote Tory or lib dem but you want the red one. And you're angry that the red one is being silly and not being centrist.

Plenty of them are fairweather ethnonationalists who would hold a different position if there was more than a joke opposition, imo.

# ¿ May 4, 2017 20:02

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

If you think of the "common sense" people as basically politically ambivalent, the reason they're trotting out the government's line, which is anti-immigrant and right wing, is because the opposition is unable to form and expound upon their own narrative without someone loving it up, cf. Abbott or the amount of rollbacks on policy as McDonnell or Corbyn says something in the morning about fuckin trains or tax or whatever and scuttles back on it by the end of the day.

And I say that as someone who went out and did their Labour voting duty today.

# ¿ May 4, 2017 20:13

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

OwlFancier posted:

Maybe they also just think that blaming foreigners is correct and are actually racist?

I mean the country always does pretty well for itself in terms of aid donations and so on relative to literally everywhere else in the world other than Ireland, I don't think tarring everyone with the idiot racist brush is useful or even accurate.

# ¿ May 4, 2017 20:15

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

Fans posted:

When the headlines today are all "EU threatens Election says May" and "Hands off our election Brussels!" and not "May talks fantastically stupid conspiracy poo poo" I don't know why you'd think any leftist message is going to get out there.

End of the day you had Chaka Umunna talking sense about this last night on C4 news, and if the party is failing to deal with the press, that is a failure of the party apparatus.

# ¿ May 4, 2017 20:19

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

jabby posted:

Then it depends what you mean by 'more than a joke opposition'. If you mean Corbyn and McDonnell might have a shot at convincing people of left-wing ideas if they were better at their jobs, sure. If you mean that bringing back Miliband and his racist mugs would going to get people to be less nationalist by pandering to their nationalism, you're off your rocker.

What I mean is that I wish there was just more competence by the people that are there at the moment. All the way through the party. Corbyn, Watson, whole lot. The situation's a bit too critical atm for them to be able to give shuttle crash interviews. I don't think the "I'm not a racist but..." mugs were terribly successful or in any sense a good idea.

# ¿ May 4, 2017 20:22

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

OwlFancier posted:

If you start from the assertion that people can't just be vile then I suppose everything must be the fault of the Labour party but I continue to see no reason to believe that first premise.

I'm sure there is a solid core of dickheads in this country, right. But go back ten years and I think the mainstream opinions in this country were much more open and optimistic than now, because Labour and its message were properly out there. That's why you had Cameron hugging hoodies and talking about the Big Society and so on, instead of this race to the cynical, sharp-elbowed, nasty bottom you have now that Labour apparently doesn't know how to engage with and make a persuasive case against.

# ¿ May 4, 2017 20:28

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

TomViolence posted:

I think you're confusing matters of national spending policy with the actual opinions of the electorate themselves.

No I'm talking about your private disaster relief charity spending and so on, not .7% of GDP as government spending on foreign aid. We do well.

There's all kinds of articles about it, albeit largely from the hated Tory press but they're out there.

# ¿ May 4, 2017 20:31

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

OwlFancier posted:

Do you think there might have been other things that happened in the intervening 10 years other than Jeremy Corbyn? Or the Labour party in general?

Not to the extent there's been lately where the left wing message has just vanished into an echo chamber which is mad nobody else can hear it and in fact blames them for its own existence.

# ¿ May 4, 2017 20:31

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

OwlFancier posted:

Do you think perhaps there might have been something that happened in the intervening 10 years that wasn't related to the Labour party which caused people to not be very interested in spreading left wing messages to a wide audience?

Since you clearly have a loving brilliant idea, why not lay it out for me.

# ¿ May 4, 2017 20:38

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

ukle posted:

Had only Labour (great guy), Conservative (brown noser with property companies) and Green to choose from for the CC elections. Also heard the same from 2 other people in different area i.e. no LD but a green candidate. Have the Lib Dem's just given up on County Councils that they stand no chance in now? Its odd given the Greens are trying yet the LD's just not bothering.

We had 2 in my neck of the woods, plus two Labour candidates.

# ¿ May 4, 2017 22:52

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

Hoops posted:

UKIPpers aren't libertarians though, they're like protectionist populist social conservative. Maybe Farage was a libertarian but their voters aren't. Everything (everything) UKIP do is to appeal to people that are scared "They" are going to take something away from them, it's not really about left or right economics.

It's both, same as FN etc.

# ¿ May 5, 2017 00:03

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

Yeah but it's also a vehicle for the hard right, same as UKIP under farage was full of hosed off Labour voters. Party's trapped on the economy in a way that makes Labour or the Lib Dems look ideologically coherent.

# ¿ May 5, 2017 00:14

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

This is bad for, everyone.

# ¿ May 5, 2017 00:46

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

This is truly depressing.

# ¿ May 5, 2017 01:03

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

Namtab posted:

No I guess it's all the fault of jezza and nothing else, curse him for making old people tories

*in incredibly nuanced voice* it is partly, in fact quite a lot, Jezza, but not 100% him.

# ¿ May 5, 2017 01:16

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

spectralent posted:

Owen Smith* is of course sweeping back to near 100% of the vote right now with his massive dick and incredible personal charisma.

*I literally forgot his surname, what a character.

Absolutely. He know what it takes to win, after all, he's married to his wife.

# ¿ May 5, 2017 01:18

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# ¿ Apr 25, 2024 15:38

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

GaussianCopula posted:

It seems to me that the Tories will have effectively unified the center-right to far-right spectrum in their camp, while the center-left to far-left is splintered into many small parties, and therefore the UK (or England at some point?) will be governed by them until either the Left unifies or the right splinters again.

Nope, the centre-left to far left has a single party in England, it's Labour, and people do not want to vote for it.

# ¿ May 5, 2017 12:02

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