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Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


Leo Bonhart or Geralt or Keira Metz for pack choice? I know nothing about this.

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Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


Electronico6 posted:

You already have Geralt, Leo Bonhart is good but is very specific to a play-style of Nilfgaard(Reveal mechanic) so it needs a lot of support across all colours, while Metz will enhance any starting Northern Realms decks.

IIRC it was been discussed here that NR is one of the best factions for beginners with semi-competitive decks for not too much dust, am I right?

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


Game's very interesting but holy poo poo are card abilities explained badly.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


Why the gently caress can't I loving finish the second final challenge quest against monsters. Why does the retard AI summon 18 worth of stats casually with 1 loving card left while I'm throwing my poo poo dumb cards at them.

Also 2 hundreds weather effects.

Just kidding game's amazing but it does an awful job at explaining anything and I'm not seeing this reaching critical mass unless they do something about the keywords.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


I guess finding Villentretenmerth in a pack was a good thing because that card alone gave me a 9 win streak in casual in my first 9 Gwent games ever.

And I don't even have Yennefer Conjurer or other super popular cards, just a dumb NR Foltest deck with Keira Metz, Philippa, Triss and Villenblabla. I've had 1 insta concede, 2 shame concedes (I suppose calculating units' power in advance can be tricky if you're new and there are multiple catapults on the boards, buffers, etc) and a bunch of games where I drop the thing and the other guy slows down a lot, looks at his hand for the longest time and makes a a bunch of poo poo plays.

I swear sometimes I can almost hear the sound of their souls being crushed.

How strong is the dragon? Is it even good in non-trash tier? And should I remove either Philippa or Triss from my deck in favor of vanilla Yennefer? They're both very reactive cards and it doesn't look like I always get the value I should off of them.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


is there a way to counter the loving annoying as all gently caress monster weather spam

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


Goblin posted:

clear skies, every faction has a silver now that can cast clear skies and two other spells, every faction (i think, my memory could be wrong) also has a bronze that can clear weather from a single row, decoy if you want to bounce one of those back again

the silver "mage" cards are basically auto includes imo, they put points on the board, can clear weather, and have utility if you don't need the clear. the bronze version is usually worth running a single copy at least, anything that can clear while putting at least a few points on the board is nice

2 clear skies and Sile are not nearly enough because they actively play around them and there's gently caress all you can do when they have 4-5 chances to massacre your rows with frost

2 games in a row where I use both clear skies and yet I have all 3 rows with frost in the last round

weather feels super cheap and bad

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


I also pity you if you think hs has terrible non-drawing order RNG and this doesn't because my last rounds are usually as fun as ragnaros shots

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


this 99% weather monster decks meta is fun, I especially like going against people netdecking a loving top 100 deck after 8 hours of playtime and losing even with Sile + 3 Clear Skies

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


General Morden posted:

post the top 100 deck 2 days into open beta

you can watch it on twitch, it's what less sophisticated streamers that aren't named lifecoach are using

you'll hear a lot of woooosh sounds though, might want to lower your speakers, hth

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


Asehujiko posted:

Reached rank 10 and unlocked ranked play, don't feel much drive to continue, at least not as long as weather is so dominant that RNR is an auto include in every deck.

I was angry as gently caress about weather too, but after playing more I think we're overestimating the effect of RNR on the game here. And Weather Monsters isn't top tier at all, it's just more frequent at low ranks. I'm rank 9 and I'm not seeing it as often, now it's usually either Spy Nilfgaard, Buff Skellige, Consume Monsters, Blue Stripes NR and a bunch of weird Sco'iatael decks. That said, I am playing Weather Monsters, but with a few techs to counter Nilfgaard and Skellige decks that put a bunch of big boys on the board.

RNR is probably still a bit too strong but we're in the first days of the open and they have showed fantastic reaction times so far, so if that becomes a problem I'm confident we'll see nerfs/counters very soon.

EDIT: this game is so much better than HS in terms of competitive viability, pure fun, and business models it's not even funny. It also looks prettier (and more mature) except for some menus, but those will certainly be changed before release.

Kawabata fucked around with this message at May 27, 2017 around 22:44

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


Minrad posted:

All the rnr/drought havers are in ranked, dont worry. It hasnt gone anywhere.

I'm rank 9, not level 9. Yes I'm seeing RNR and droughts from time to time but they aren't ruining my experience at all. I find Skellige is much more aggravating against my deck but still not Hearthstone unfair.

That said I've been blessed by lady luck and got Ciri, Caranthir and Ge'els in the first 20 or so kegs so I'm basically climbing with a legit decent Weather deck, only missing the Witches and Caretaker. I only lost once from 6 to 9.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


Minrad posted:

Ah. My experience is still seeing it almost every game, but it can depend on what deck you yourself are playing on if they'll actually play it or not, since people are better at playing and playing around rnr/drought. People will sit on RNR for a long time if I get a big morkvarg on the board, since they know it'll just get decoyed and I'm not gonna fill the other rows if I can't help it.

Yeah, about that: I think Morkvarg is the most unfair card in the game right now, and probably the strongest value wise.

He doesn't even have a real counter.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


Electronico6 posted:

It's time for Letho to shine again.

Oh that's right he does have a counter.

But it's a pretty hard tech and a faction golden that seems to be hard to put into any of the established Nilfgaard decks. Also, I definitely haven't had enough experience playing Nilfgaard to know if he's even decent in non-Skellige matchups.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


Minrad posted:

The thing with Morkvarg, and the NG/ST deploy swings, is that you have to be willing to play some card advantage down now. There's no more last turn d-bomb/weather/etc to blow you out so card advantage isn't as amazing as it was in CB.

I got dunked by a Monster playing willing to play ... it was 3 CA down by baiting me to pass while I was 20 str up in round 1, I think? Then he locks Morkvarg, kills it, and steals it with Caretaker to win round 1, then ended up winning round 2 as well when I failed to bounce back after blowing too many buffs on Morkvarg in round 1.

Yes but how many cards you have to invest to kill the thing is also the issue. Even locking and killing is usually wrong because he will be 100% resurrected.

Caretaker is amazing though.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


8-Bit Scholar posted:

GOD DAMMIT

This game has me fighting against its mechancis more than anything else. I still find myself blindsided where I think I'm understanding game descriptions correctly only for the score multiplyers I expect to come to never actually materialize.

But worse is that twice now I've been cost a clear victory because the game asked me to reshuffle my deck on the third round and I inadvertently pressed X instead of Square. An "are you sure" prompt would be much appreciated, I do not really need to reshuffle my cards in the third round game!

GAH I hate not winning when I should have won

I don't get this post. No sarcasm meant.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


8-Bit Scholar posted:

I had a revive lady in my hand, ready to bring my victory move; instead I hit the X button and redrew her instantly, giving me a useless card and resulting in a draw.

Oh, right. That never happened to me, but yes, they should probably copy HS system where you cross a card but don't discard it until you also click accept.

hampig posted:

Gotta say I'm finding some of the mechanics a little obtuse also. Cards that I expect to draw or play another card just do nothing and I can't figure out why, I had to go google what weather does because there doesn't seem to be anything in the UI that tells me, cards that 'buff a unit to their left' and then seem to buff the whole row, stuff like that. Nothing that won't go away with more play time and not being a complete beginner, but if I didn't already know the Witcher world, play Gwent in Witcher 3, and be curious about this new CCG, not sure I'd be persisting.

Hovering over a card will explain the keywords but yes, weather effect should be indicated somewhere and they should make the difference between Stregthen/Boost and Spawn/Summon easier to understand at first glance.. This is pretty normal for an open beta though, HS had positioning bugs for months and keyword inconsistency for years.

Kawabata fucked around with this message at May 28, 2017 around 01:37

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


RatHat posted:

Should I craft Ragh Nah Roog or Drought? Which is better?

RNR but I wouldn't craft anything other than bronze and maybe a silver or two for at least a week or so.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


ShowTime posted:

Rag. Rag will almost always get the full value of 3 strength a unit, while Drought will not.

Drought also runs into the issue of triggering Deathwish units, potentially making the enemy board stronger.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


8-Bit Scholar posted:

Right so Skellige is loving bee's knee's murderbeast central, provided I get enough revivers. I'll have to stack the deck with more of them once I gather, but I'm still seeing what cards are out there. Either way, I'm finally out of the starting gate and getting wins in multiplayer.

This game has a lot of wonky issues but the core gameplay is quite solid and I love how they've developed the system. I have no idea how well-balanced it is: I haven't touched Northern Realms and Nilfgaard seems to be tailor-made to destroy my Skellige strategy. I have a bunch of elf cards and I've made a deck, so I guess I'll try and see how they play.

Judging by rank10+ streamers the weakest deck currently is NR; Nilf and Sk the most popular, Monsters and Scoiatael in the middle. Matchups are never incredibly polarized. Also, unlike Team 5, CDPR isn't afraid of buffing/nerfing/completely changing several cards at a time if they think the meta isn't as interesting as they want it to be.

Yeah the core gameplay is excellent and boy those premium cards look incredible.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


Gorman Thomas posted:

If you play a card into a weathered row (specifically biting frost) will it's ability not trigger? I tried playing a Wild Hunt Hound into biting frost and wasn't prompted to use biting frost my opponent's row.

That's because you finished the Frost Weather cards in your deck. The hound still uses your own cards.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


Drunk Driver Dad posted:

I love all the Witcher stuff, but I never played Gwent in W3. Looking at some videos this seems like it's much more interesting than hearthstone and such. Guess I'll give it a shot. Are there(or going to be) a shitload of different cards to build decks with? I like variety.

For a public beta there's already a good number of different cards to build your deck with. I would say about as much as HS had at release, it feels like. And every card has a heavier "weight" to it because unlike HS you can count the poo poo cards on the palm of one hand.

Steve2911 posted:

This is cool, but are the current loading screens just a beta thing? Seems a bit ridiculous to have them between just about every screen even if they are really short.

They only last a second on my pc but yeah they are kind of dumb. I'd say they're definitely a beta thing.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


Welp, found RNR in a keg. Still unsure whether I should replace Ciri with it in my Monsters Weather.

Ciri is consistently 14 points of value distributed over 2 rounds without any possible counterplay. RNR is usually 6 to 12 in a single round because even when you use it after the frosts to try and bait clear skies, players do know RNR is probably there too so they'll still eat a frost or 2 to play around it.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


brawleh posted:

RNR is honestly broken in terms of how strong it is, 6 average damage on board if they can answer, with no upper limit if they can't and on average it's the cost of a bronze card as well - clearing on average is a big loss in tempo, having to clear RNR and to a lesser extent drought really sucks - Ciri is strong, but It's much better to run RNR.

The big problem with gold weathers is that their strength goes way beyond board value, unless you row stack but that just opens you up to biting frost - itís ridiculously strong in a weather monsters deck.

But there definitely is an upper limit because the opponent can play around it by placing minions intelligently, or just pass. Not to mention damaged units can sometimes be healed/target dummied back into hand and replayed, RNR is only good in one round, and it's also somewhat more situational than Ciri.

It's still a ridiculously strong card but I don't think it's always the superior choice.

Kawabata fucked around with this message at May 28, 2017 around 14:11

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


CJ posted:

I think going first is a huge deal now. For instance, when i play against a reveal nilf deck if i got first i can get the Savage Bear down, then protect it from the siege card that does damage when revealing with my removal. If i go second i have to remove first and he gets a few turns in where my bear isn't doing damage. That can be the difference on whether i can remove one of his cards or not. Another example is against the Skellige decks with hunters. The person who gets to go first can remove their opponent's bear with the 3 damage from playing the hunter. It really feels like a coinflip some matches.

IIRC it's the opposite, going first is still considered a disadvantage in general but that can change depending on your deck archetype, your opponent's, and the kind of starting hand you got.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


BabyRyoga posted:

Lost another game cause Summoning Circle bugged out again. Man, this card is garbage.

I haven't seen this reported anywhere else so far, are you sure it's a bug? If it is report it, CDPR is pretty quick at responding.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


BabyRyoga posted:

I don't think they intend for the card to fizzle, unless it is played before your opponent has played any units at all in any given match. How do I go about reporting a bug to get an official response on the way the card should work?

There should be a thread/subforum ad hoc in the official forums I think.

Here: http://forums.cdprojektred.com/foru...tech-support-ac

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


Flayer posted:

I think the opposite, it feels like going second is actually advantageous since you can keep responding to your opponents plays while they have to try and get value out of being countered. Going first generally feels like you have to go for a generic value play (eg a Resilient unit or something you want in the graveyard or just the highest value card you have) and your opponent might have a counter. That insane 25 strength Nilfgaard gold is the epitome of a killer first turn since your opponent cant do anything except demote it or try to get Brave value.

No if you drop that on your first he'll just pass and you'll probably lose the game.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


Electronico6 posted:

You forgot Roach in there. But yeah folk don't T1 Tibor. Unless you have renew or something.

also don't play renew unless you already have 200+ hours of gwent competitive play and are extremely good at deckbuilding

alternatively, don't play renew

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


No Wave posted:

Renew is good and not very difficult to use, I'm not sure what he's talking about.

No Renew the card is very simple but building a deck that employs Renew successfully isn't. There was a lot of theorycrafting about it during the PTR.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


Xtanstic posted:

I run renew because I opened one and I don't have any other more exciting golds and it's better than royal decree which ends up a dead card in later rounds.

Oh it's much better than Decree.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


No Mods No Masters posted:

Instead of being a big dumpster fire behind the clown store, it's a fun game

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


I will immediately spend my Meteorite on Tibor because holy poo poo.

Did premium cards ever look this good in a card game? I don't think so.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


This thread reminds me that it's very important to spend 95% of your dedicated gwent time actually playing gwent and getting better at it (in no way the meta is figured out and each faction has at least 2 viable ladder decks with the possible exception of NR only having 1), and only the remaining 5% reading reddit or this thread.

The amount of "meta is hosed, laddering sucks" desperate cries is deafening. You can netdeck 70% of any good deck, tech the remaining 30% and you're good to go. You will climb pretty high too. I'm currently rank 12 with an incomplete Eredin weather running Ciri and Triss and loving Yennefer(not YenCon) and Scorch. I win most of my bad matchups because swarm/consume decks never expect Yennefer, and massive Nilfgaard/Scoiatael dudes never expect the last round Scorch. I have a pretty bad w/l ratio vs Skellige but hey, you can't have everything. I have no Rag Nar Roog or Drought, I swear you can climb without those too and have fun doing it!

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


Inverse posted:

whats the best budget deck i can grind for weeks so i can play a real deck with,

Eredin weather or Dagon weather. Craft 3 Celaeno Harpies if you don't have them already.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


No Wave posted:

So the inspirational post is the one telling you to netdeck as closely as you can?

GWENT

Sorry I missed this but since you're a hs regular you of all people should know that deviating from a netdeck by about 30% and still being able to climb to 12 against the RnR and Roach and Witches on turn 1 dudes who bought dozens of kegs is very impressive gameplay wise. I wasn't in the closed beta either so it's definitely not because I'm great at the game. From 10 to 12 I had a total of 3 games where my opponent's card quality simply overwhelmed me, the rest were close or winnable with better RNG/plays.

Note that the Eradin weather netdeck isn't even considered tier 1, so there's that as well.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


No Wave posted:

That is also why Saskia is ok and golems are obscene.

Yeah that's one of the best turn 1s in the game.

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


ShowTime posted:

Nilfgaard is one of the top decks and reveal can work in it. Spotters are pretty drat good. Just focus on having the last play in a game and your spotter should win for you. Nilfgaard is by no means the top deck though and people in the top 200 report never seeing it. It's lots of Skellige Morkvarg/Olgierd and Scoia'Tael Control.

IIRC in his last stream Lifecoach was saying NG spies, ST control and SK morkvarg/olgierd are the best three decks right now in no particular order, with some consume/weather hybrid Monster decks having some success too. But Lifecoach is better at winning tournaments than he is at predicting card value/metas, so who knows.

I don't think the card pool will be an issue in terms of variety because while Gwent's is currently small, this is a bit deceiving since they've showed they're not afraid of balancing existing cards to keep the meta interesting. With 20 new cards every 2 months it looks like much more work will be invested into each existing/new piece, making less cards count more.

Kawabata fucked around with this message at Jun 1, 2017 around 21:13

Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


will people learn that emoting at the end of the match will always cost them 5 ore/scraps

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Kawabata
Apr 20, 2014


ShowTime posted:

Even if the emote is the well played emote? I use that one a lot. I also use the Dandelion avatar, so maybe that condescending tone rubs people the wrong way.

No of course, I emote well played too. But yeah I'm not giving 5 ores to the guy that emotes "thank you" after a completely out of the blue last round last turn scorch.

I suppose for some players emoting is more important than getting stuff because they have to know they probably won't get a gg after that.

EDIT: hey Dandelion buddy!

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