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Q_res
Oct 29, 2005

Domo Arigato, Mr Roboto.


PoptartsNinja posted:

Is that so? I wasn't clear on the timeline, I thought Necropolis was newer.

Yeah, Necropolis' initial release was back in 2016.

Jack B Nimble posted:

Uuuuugh I had no clue HBS was not doing well, they're absolutely my favorite non AAA dev team.

As it's been quite a while I can't cite specific clues, beyond the Paradox buyout. Still at the time, reading between the lines, I got the impression that this game nearly sunk HBS and Paradox basically pulled their rear end out of the fire.

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fennesz
Dec 29, 2008



Jack B Nimble posted:

Uuuuugh I had no clue HBS was not doing well, they're absolutely my favorite non AAA dev team.



I'd happy play the hell out of any new Shadowrun or BattleTech titles they put out, forever.

And Tyler Too!
Aug 15, 2007
ROCKET JOCKEY OWNS

Stichelin it is, thank you!


Dyz posted:

Where? How?

Asking for a friend .

https://www.reddit.com/r/mechwarrior/wiki/mechwarrior4/mercenaries/download

Dyz
Dec 10, 2010



Thanks for this!

Will try it later tonight.

I R SMART LIKE ROCK
Mar 10, 2003

I just want a hug.



Fun Shoe

Since we're on the subject; an update to my MW5 play-through. I was fine with the ai until about difficulty 9 or 10 when enemy assaults sparingly turn up. My lance mates are running up to medium laser range against a loving Victor

I feel like half the game is helping ai so they don't get themselves killed. The after action report show my kills at least doubling if not tripling them. So it's all the micro management of Battletech without the time to do so due to real-time

I'm sure mods will help but a lot of them are still broken with the move to steam. So my desire to play is fading fast consider that the steam summer sale coming up in 2 weeks

also is there actually a MW5 thread? All I saw was this and MWO

Organ Fiend posted:

Lmfao that PGI tried to copy BATTLETECH's map/contract system/etc and utterly failed at it.

How did those loving rear end-clowns get the Mechwarrior licence to begin with, and who's the dumb rear end that sold it to them?

I R SMART LIKE ROCK
Mar 10, 2003

I just want a hug.



Fun Shoe

what really helped my longevity with battletech was ( I think mission control ) expanded map spawn positions for both the player and ai. So even a map you've played dozens of times can still feel fresh

after 25 hours in MW5 I'm fairly sure I've seen every permutation of map start

I... I think I'm starting to actively dislike it

Q_res
Oct 29, 2005

Domo Arigato, Mr Roboto.


I R SMART LIKE ROCK posted:

My lance mates are running up to medium laser range against a loving Victor

So at one point my "go-to" lance in MW5 was myself in a Royal Highlander, a stock Archer 2R (4 MLs and two LRM-20s), an Orion VA (AC/10, 2 MLs and 2 SRM-4s) and a Warhammer 6R (2 PPCs, 2 MLs, 2 SLs and an SRM 6) that I pulled the MGs and ammo out of and used the weight for more armor. Assassination contract, check the first two areas we're murdering everything with ease. Finally face the boss fight, it's an Atlas RS, Stalker 3F and Cent 9A with vehicle support (Manticore and a couple other, lesser tanks). The Archer rushes the Atlas while the Orion and Warhammer stay behind me while I'm trying to rip the Atlas apart with my LRM-20 and Gauss Rifle. The Archer got his poo poo wrecked so fast I was still navigating the lance command menu when he lost his RT. You absolutely have to babysit them every second because they will do something game ruiningly stupid if you let them.

Zephro
Nov 23, 2000

I suppose I could part with one and still be feared...


fennesz posted:



I'd happy play the hell out of any new Shadowrun or BattleTech titles they put out, forever.
Yeah, same, I'd happily pay for another Shadowrun game or BattleTech 2. I'd never even heard of Necropolis and I'd assumed that since HBS had had three well-reviewed games in a row (Dragonfall, Hong Kong and BT), things were going well for them :/

Mr Luxury Yacht
Apr 16, 2012




They outright don't understand range and will just run to whatever distance will let them use all their weapons against any target.

If you give an AI mech all LRMs and a single MG they will rush assaults every time in order to plink with that one MG.

Someone either in this thread or the MWO one posted that you can sort of mitigate it by building their weapon groups to have all the ranged weapons first and the last ditch close weapons in group 6 since the AI takes weapon group number into account for priority.

sean10mm
Jun 29, 2005

It's a Mad, Mad, Mad, MAD-2R World


I R SMART LIKE ROCK posted:

what really helped my longevity with battletech was ( I think mission control ) expanded map spawn positions for both the player and ai. So even a map you've played dozens of times can still feel fresh

after 25 hours in MW5 I'm fairly sure I've seen every permutation of map start

I... I think I'm starting to actively dislike it

I only tried what I assume is a long obsolete version of MC, which would rarely spawn you in places you couldn't escape without jump jets (or at all).

Organ Fiend
May 21, 2007

custom title


Mr Luxury Yacht posted:

Someone either in this thread or the MWO one posted that you can sort of mitigate it by building their weapon groups to have all the ranged weapons first and the last ditch close weapons in group 6 since the AI takes weapon group number into account for priority.

I presume that this, much like ghost heat in MWO, is undocumented.

I R SMART LIKE ROCK
Mar 10, 2003

I just want a hug.



Fun Shoe

sean10mm posted:

I only tried what I assume is a long obsolete version of MC, which would rarely spawn you in places you couldn't escape without jump jets (or at all).

I was specifically referring to these features:
https://www.missioncontrolmod.com/docs/features/extended-boundaries
https://www.missioncontrolmod.com/docs/features/reuse-of-story-maps
https://www.missioncontrolmod.com/docs/features/custom-contract-types

I believe what you're talking about is:
https://www.missioncontrolmod.com/docs/features/random-spawns

I don't know if any of these fix the issue but they've most certainly have been trying to reduce how often it occurs. You can also turn this specific feature off:
https://www.missioncontrolmod.com/blog/release-0.2.3/

quote:

Fixed unit spawns that didn't allow a unit to move
https://www.missioncontrolmod.com/blog/release-0.3.0

quote:

Fixed Extended Lances adding bad spawns for the additional lance units
https://www.missioncontrolmod.com/blog/release-0.4.30

quote:

Random Spawns: Fixed issue where mechs wouldn't be able to move after spawning (stuck in one place from spawn)

I R SMART LIKE ROCK fucked around with this message at 19:17 on Jun 10, 2021

Organ Fiend
May 21, 2007

custom title


PoptartsNinja posted:

Is that so? I wasn't clear on the timeline, I thought Necropolis was newer.

The answer to both of those questions is 'Microsoft'

When MW4 was being developed, I remember everyone was like "Micro$oft is going to ruin Mechwarrior! MW4 is doomed!" What do you know? The dev team was actually engaged and made incremental changes based on feedback, and then they went and made what is arguably still the best multiplayer Mechwarrior game to date.

Who knew that Microsoft would finally ruin Mechwarrior by selling the licence!

Psion
Dec 13, 2002






Zephro posted:

Yeah, same, I'd happily pay for another Shadowrun game or BattleTech 2. I'd never even heard of Necropolis and I'd assumed that since HBS had had three well-reviewed games in a row (Dragonfall, Hong Kong and BT), things were going well for them :/

I mean obviously we don't know the details but their games got successively bigger and maybe they'd reached the end of kickstarter-backed growth and caught the interest of pdx who made an offer? I don't think we have enough facts to assume whether BT did well or not in terms of financials, tbh

Jack B Nimble
Dec 25, 2007




Soiled Meat

I always assumed Battletech was a big hit, but that's entirely based around how much buzz it had both among my friends and journalists.

PoptartsNinja
May 9, 2008

He is still almost definitely not a spy




Soiled Meat

Organ Fiend posted:

Who knew that Microsoft would finally ruin Mechwarrior by selling the licence!
They didn't.

They only leased it.

Jack B Nimble posted:

I always assumed Battletech was a big hit, but that's entirely based around how much buzz it had both among my friends and journalists.
I think part of the problem was the preorders. Everyone who wanted BattleTech preordered it, so they got a big influx of cash that wasn't repeated when the game launched because everyone BattleTech was on the radar for had already preordered it.

Organ Fiend
May 21, 2007

custom title


PoptartsNinja posted:

They didn't.

They only leased it.

So theoretically, they could get it back, right?

Do the lease terms include Microsoft reserving the right to fire Russ Bullock and Paul Inyoue into the sun?

PoptartsNinja
May 9, 2008

He is still almost definitely not a spy




Soiled Meat

PGI started making MW5 around the time the lease was coming due, to show that they had plans to actually make use of the license to make money (because MWO wasn't doing much of that at the time).

Microsoft renewed the license agreement but other than that I have no details.

Edit: It's why I scoff at the idea that PGI did any of this out of love. They made MW5 because rent was coming due and they were short. They would've milked MWO for all it was worth if only the playerbase had let them turn it into the giant robots version of World of Warships.

Something something something Transverse.

PoptartsNinja fucked around with this message at 20:57 on Jun 10, 2021

anakha
Sep 16, 2009


Say 'Thank you, Ershin'.

Say it.




Why BEX is awesome:
It's January 4th 3052 in my career run, I'm on Luthien, and in line with the lore, there's a Smoke Jaguar presence on the planet and I can take missions against the Jags.

Why BEX loving sucks:
The allied Drac lance spawns on the other side of the map with a binary of Clan Mechs in between, and in the first turn, half the Dracs are killed. In the second turn, my Bull Shark gets sensor locked by a Loki and headshot by a Mad Cat's PPC before I can even make my first move.

Zeroisanumber
Oct 23, 2010



Nap Ghost

What advantage does a -2R Marauder have over a stock version. I bought it via parts on the black market and so far it just seems like a cool ride.

sean10mm
Jun 29, 2005

It's a Mad, Mad, Mad, MAD-2R World


Zeroisanumber posted:

What advantage does a -2R Marauder have over a stock version. I bought it via parts on the black market and so far it just seems like a cool ride.

Double heat sinks. Base cooling of 60 instead of 30. Fewer ballistic but more energy hardpoints than the 3R.

sean10mm
Jun 29, 2005

It's a Mad, Mad, Mad, MAD-2R World


Ratzap posted:

I installed this and it started ok. Loaded a campaign save at the very first miners mission. It played through fine and I noticed a few of the mods but the map wouldn't finish. I get back to the miners where they turn on you, the waypoint disappears along with the objective and nothing happens.
Should it work with campaign or does it have to be a career game?

Going back to this, I did a new campaign mode start and ran that mission with no hitches. Not sure what could be breaking the mission since none of the mods should even interact with the campaign mode missions. I literally just zipped the mod files I"m playing with for BetterThanVanilla 1.2 so

Aside from what I already posted, earlier, assuming you're playing on Steam you might need to just verify integrity of game files and then re-run the modtek injector.exe.

There's also been an update to Modtek I believe, but all the mods were tested on version 7.7.7, the HBS modloader hasn't been tested with these so I have no idea if it works with everything or not.

Zeroisanumber
Oct 23, 2010



Nap Ghost

sean10mm posted:

Double heat sinks. Base cooling of 60 instead of 30. Fewer ballistic but more energy hardpoints than the 3R.

It's been so long since I played the tabletop game that I forgot about the heat sinks that come with the engine. Thanks for the explanation.

fennesz
Dec 29, 2008



anakha posted:

Why BEX loving sucks:
The allied Drac lance spawns on the other side of the map with a binary of Clan Mechs in between, and in the first turn, half the Dracs are killed. In the second turn, my Bull Shark gets sensor locked by a Loki and headshot by a Mad Cat's PPC before I can even make my first move.

Exactly why I abuse evasion and/or cloaking against clans. Just make sure you have a decent impression of which enemy mechs have the AoE sensor lock and focus them down ASAP. That, and anything with a UAC/20. The only way I was able to do any clan content before I had multiple clan assault mechs was abuse line of sight and initiative with Phoenix Hawks. Just make sure their pilots are good so you can reserve initiative to 1, alpha strike a CT from the back, and do it again next turn and jump away.

If you try to fight them straight up you just get absolutely manhandled.

Zeroisanumber
Oct 23, 2010



Nap Ghost

Anyone who is rolling with IS gear and tries to take Clanners on in a straight fight deserves what they get.

anakha
Sep 16, 2009


Say 'Thank you, Ershin'.

Say it.




Both my lances were under ECM cloaking, but Mechs can still be sensor locked while under ECM.

Bloody Pom
Jun 5, 2011




I'm stockpiling artillery mechs in BTA for when I feel like taking on the clans. gently caress your honor, I have Long Toms.

Clans got a similar rebalance in BTA to PTN's tabletop thread, trading range and heat efficiency for up-front damage. Clan mechs even have an innate accuracy penalty to all melee attacks except DFAs. The mod expects you to fight dirty if you want to beat them.

Bloody Pom fucked around with this message at 05:38 on Jun 11, 2021

fennesz
Dec 29, 2008



anakha posted:

Both my lances were under ECM cloaking, but Mechs can still be sensor locked while under ECM.

Crucially this eats a turn of theirs though. Much better to get sensor locked or force a sprint from them to break your cloak instead of eating multiple gauss shots.

anakha
Sep 16, 2009


Say 'Thank you, Ershin'.

Say it.




fennesz posted:

Crucially this eats a turn of theirs though. Much better to get sensor locked or force a sprint from them to break your cloak instead of eating multiple gauss shots.

Yup, it was just really bad luck that both my team and the Drac allies were visible to the entire Clan binary that mission and that most of that binary could move before I could.

juggalo baby coffin
Dec 2, 2007

How would the dog wear goggles and even more than that, who makes the goggles?



i think i like mw5 more than most people, but the lancemate ai is very annoying. the range they run into seems to just be connected to their average weapon range, rather than like the role of their mech or the range of their most powerful weapon

like when i swapped out the medium lasers on my catapult for small lasers so that i could fit more LRM ammo in, the AI using it started running into small laser range and getting owned.

i wish there was just a better orders system, like if i could set an engagement range for each one, or how close they stay to me, or if i could use the map to indicate an area for them to hold.

idk, i think a lot of people are residually mad at PGI over MWO stuff, MW5 is a perfectly good mechwarrior game, but its not a great game. they could have stood to steal more from HBS, like the upgradable ship, the more in-depth pilot skills. it's not super fun having to jump back to industrial systems for repairs, even though i get that unlike the argo, the leopard doesnt have a proper repair bay.

MW5 has its own benefits, like it has a moving timeline like BEX does, it has a lot more weapon types and systems than stock battletech, the maps are a lot more detailed and interactive, it feels good to drive the mechs and they are all distinct in their own ways. there's a lot of detail and love put into stuff like the cockpits and animations.

my #1 complaint though is the lack of melee and proper DFA. those are my favourite moves in battletech and it's just weird that they're not in.

Q_res
Oct 29, 2005

Domo Arigato, Mr Roboto.


I'm always a little surprised that people think it's weird that Melee isn't in MW5 when it's literally never been in a Mechwarrior game, unless you count tackling in the MWO beta. Which I don't, really.

Stravag
Jun 7, 2009



You could slam into stuff in 3 and 4 and cause damage but yeah no melee weapons or punches or kicks. Just incidental damage from clumsiness

juggalo baby coffin
Dec 2, 2007

How would the dog wear goggles and even more than that, who makes the goggles?



Q_res posted:

I'm always a little surprised that people think it's weird that Melee isn't in MW5 when it's literally never been in a Mechwarrior game, unless you count tackling in the MWO beta. Which I don't, really.

i know its never been in mechwarrior, but its so popular in battletech that i dont know why they wouldnt finally put it in. you can sorta bash into people for mild damage, and i took the AC/10 off an urbanmech by landing on it with a highlander, but that's about the extent of it.

Q_res
Oct 29, 2005

Domo Arigato, Mr Roboto.


I mean, Melee is a helluva lot easier to implement in a turn-based game. Melee usually sucks in FPS games.

girl dick energy
Sep 30, 2009

You think you have the wherewithal to figure out my puzzle vagina?


Stravag posted:

You could slam into stuff in 3 and 4 and cause damage but yeah no melee weapons or punches or kicks. Just incidental damage from clumsiness
Didn't MW4 have DFAs implemented, though? It's been a while so I could be wrong, but I think I remember using a Shadow Cat to fire a billion lasers, then jump on things when I inevitably started overheating because proper heat management is for chumps and cowards who aren't in FULL ALPHA 24/7.

There is a reason my favorite mechs are the Shadow Cat, the Nova Cat, and the Black Knight, and it isn't just because Clan mechs have better aesthetics.

Ratzap
Jun 9, 2012

Let no pie go wasted


Soiled Meat

sean10mm posted:

Going back to this, I did a new campaign mode start and ran that mission with no hitches. Not sure what could be breaking the mission since none of the mods should even interact with the campaign mode missions. I literally just zipped the mod files I"m playing with for BetterThanVanilla 1.2 so

Aside from what I already posted, earlier, assuming you're playing on Steam you might need to just verify integrity of game files and then re-run the modtek injector.exe.

There's also been an update to Modtek I believe, but all the mods were tested on version 7.7.7, the HBS modloader hasn't been tested with these so I have no idea if it works with everything or not.

Yeah I just used the links in your post which was the 7.7.7 ModTek. I've verified, downloaded the 1 failed file, ran the injector again. Loading the save is no good, it's still stuck - presumably because it's past the trigger point already. I'll play through one more time to see if it'll work.

Edit: loaded the save and used restart mission then played it through again. That worked (of course Glich got a head hit).

Ratzap fucked around with this message at 11:14 on Jun 11, 2021

Devorum
Jul 30, 2005


Does anyone actually enjoy the fatigue mechanic in BEX? I forgot to turn it off, and drat is it annoying only being able to do one mission a week unless I bleed myself dry hiring seven more MechWarriors.

What career settings do folks usually use?

Devorum fucked around with this message at 10:54 on Jun 11, 2021

Jobbo_Fett
Mar 7, 2014

It would be a sad error in judgement to mistake me for a corpse.


Clapping Larry

Q_res posted:

I mean, Melee is a helluva lot easier to implement in a turn-based game. Melee usually sucks in FPS games.

Just have it so that you toggle melee, LMB is left arm, RMB is right arm. Clicking swings the arm, prevents ranged weapons from being shot from that arm, then base damage on weight and remaining armor

juggalo baby coffin
Dec 2, 2007

How would the dog wear goggles and even more than that, who makes the goggles?



or even go more actiony and have something like doom's canned melee attacks. it would be cool to get a first person view of goomba-stomping another mech into the dirt

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pun pundit
Nov 11, 2008

I feel the same way about the company bearing the same name.



Ratzap posted:

Yeah I just used the links in your post which was the 7.7.7 ModTek. I've verified, downloaded the 1 failed file, ran the injector again. Loading the save is no good, it's still stuck - presumably because it's past the trigger point already. I'll play through one more time to see if it'll work.

Edit: loaded the save and used restart mission then played it through again. That worked (of course Glich got a head hit).

In general, in-mission saves work less well than star map saves in the game overall. This goes double if you have mods that add assets.

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