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cheese-cube
May 28, 2007

OMNIA SUNT COMMUNIA





What OS gets the best hash rates? Or is that a dumb question and do you just go bare metal.

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Paul MaudDib
May 2, 2006

"Tell me of your home world, Usul"


Dren posted:

I haven't set up VT-D with pci-e passthrough, last I looked it seemed like kind of a pain in the rear end. My guess is that it doesn't fully address the security concerns but I don't know the architecture well enough to say.

"Secure enough". It's obviously not impossible for exploits to jump the sandbox and they do occasionally happen but you're now assuming a deliberate attack on yourself rather than just low-hanging fruit of scanning your network for shares, dropping cryptolocker onto anything writeable, and calling it a day.

Someone with a pile of zero-days is always going to get you if they really want, but some random nerd's PC probably isn't that juicy a target compared to say, Amazon. You just have to put up enough of a speedbump that quick-and-dirty mass attacks aren't going to get you. A locked-down VM on a separate VLAN segment is more effort than 99.99% of people are going to bother with.

(neither here nor there since nobody is really targeting nerds with sandbox-jumping malware attacks, but: there is an interesting argument that the blatantly obvious approach is actually an essential element of Nigerian Prince scams, it self-selects for targets who are too stupid to see the scam coming so the scammer doesn't waste time on people who are too smart to wire $10k to Africa just because an email told them to. I would argue there is probably a parallel here, anyone who is smart enough to have their mining running in locked-down VMs on a separate VLAN segment hopefully also has offline backups and is going to give you the middle finger if you try and cryptolocker them. Or in other words, the only additional people that deploying an advanced attack would get you are also extremely unlikely to actually pay.)

Paul MaudDib fucked around with this message at Jun 21, 2017 around 20:01

SamDabbers
May 26, 2003

Oh my god...

Lipstick Apathy

Dren posted:

I haven't set up VT-D with pci-e passthrough, last I looked it seemed like kind of a pain in the rear end. My guess is that it doesn't fully address the security concerns but I don't know the architecture well enough to say.

The whole idea behind VT-d/IOMMU is to enforce access control on DMAs between a VM's memory and PCIe devices. The PCI topology on your motherboard is divided into groups, and devices within the same group share the same partitioned memory space, so they (and their assigned VM) can read/write each others' memory, while devices in a different group cannot. Good implementations of VT-d put each physical PCIe slot, and sometimes on-board components like NICs, into separate groups so that each device can be individually assigned to a different VM while still maintaining the isolation.

Some cards, like 10G NICs and non-gaming GPUs, support SR-IOV, which is an implementation of access control on the card itself, so you can arbitrarily partition the card's resources (NIC queues, execution units, memory, etc) and assign each partition to a separate VM.

Short answer: properly implemented it should mitigate concerns about malicious GPU code affecting things outside of a VM.

SamDabbers fucked around with this message at Jun 21, 2017 around 20:01

Twerk from Home
Jan 17, 2009


Somebody just sold 100k ETH (coins, not dollars worth) at market price and there was a flash crash where some people have made or lost paper millions in an instant. This is so dumb. Some buy orders under $50/coin got filled, and now it seems to be worth $300/coin again.

Edit: If anybody wants to check it out themselves, looks like the trading range of ETH for the last 24 hours is from $0.10 - $355.98: https://api.gdax.com/products/ETH-USD/stats

Dren
Jan 5, 2001



Pillbug

SamDabbers posted:

The whole idea behind VT-d/IOMMU is to enforce access control on DMAs between a VM's memory and PCIe devices. The PCI topology on your motherboard is divided into groups, and devices within the same group share the same partitioned memory space, so they (and their assigned VM) can read/write each others' memory, while devices in a different group cannot. Good implementations of VT-d put each physical PCIe slot, and sometimes on-board components like NICs, into separate groups so that each device can be individually assigned to a different VM while still maintaining the isolation.

Some cards, like 10G NICs and non-gaming GPUs, support SR-IOV, which is an implementation of access control on the card itself, so you can arbitrarily partition the card's resources (NIC queues, execution units, memory, etc) and assign each partition to a separate VM.

Short answer: properly implemented it should mitigate concerns about malicious GPU code affecting things outside of a VM.

that is cool, thanks

Watermelon Daiquiri
Jul 10, 2010


i kinda wish that updated nvidia thing posted earlier was linux terminal compatible I have a spare 970 in my server at 70% intensity that I need to find a good algorithm for (since it cant change on its own, and the dual mining would seem nice)

Paul MaudDib
May 2, 2006

"Tell me of your home world, Usul"


cheese-cube posted:

What OS gets the best hash rates? Or is that a dumb question and do you just go bare metal.

Barring a specific problem it doesn't matter, everything performs roughly the same.

NVIDIA cards on Windows 10 have hosed-up Ethereum performance due to semi-recent changes in how the memory caching works. You either need to run an old driver, mine a different coin, or run Win7/Win8/Win8.1/Linux.

NVIDIA's Linux drivers are kinda funky and I was running into some trouble getting control over fans/power limits/etc. I would imagine that it would eventually be doable within another few evenings of tinkering and this should be a "do it once, write it down, problem solved forever" kind of situation. However apart from the lack of low-level GPU control, everything was running normally at the given defaults.

I think AMD's Windows drivers are clownshoes, I have tons of problems with GPUs losing their drivers and poo poo. GPU-Z and Afterburner will stop working and hashrates will go way down. Going into Device Manager and manually re-installing the device driver using "have disk" for one of the cards (automatically fans out to all identical cards as well) then restarting usually fixes it. Failing that running DDU and reinstalling the whole driver has always fixed it. This behavior doesn't seem normal and I'm wondering if my risers are occasionally disconnecting or something, but it just doesn't happen with the NVIDIA cards I have.

With Linux, I think AMD does have a similar problem where it's nowhere near as trivial to control power/fans/voltage as on Windows. However, AMD doesn't sign their VBIOS so in theory you can encode all this poo poo into the VBIOS and then the card will automatically set power limits/voltage/etc in any environment.

(Since we're on the topic of VBIOS, I have tried tweaking memory timings on my RX 480s but I've been unable to get any flashed VBIOS to work ever, across multiple cards. They just aren't recognized until I flash the original back.)

Running NVIDIA and AMD cards at the same time is possible under Windows but I don't think it is possible under Linux. Both the AMD and NVIDIA Linux drivers are heavily tied into the Xorg stack and you need to be running their appropriate driver in the Xorg session before you can run CUDA/OpenCL on them. Otherwise they don't show up to CUDA/OpenCL apps. I think it might be possible to run an Xorg session on a dummy output so the drivers are running, which could in theory let you have both at the same time. But I am pretty much at the limit of my Linux sysadmin ability here, Xorg is pretty black magic as far as I'm concerned.

Paul MaudDib fucked around with this message at Jun 21, 2017 around 20:20

1gnoirents
Jun 28, 2014


Thanks for thread, I just broke the very first rule in the OP which was buy a 1070 specifically for this. However I got it at MSRP after looking at ebay prices I figured, at worst, at the moment, id break even (even after shipping, PP fees, ebay fees, the works). Also I have a machine to plop it into. Also it will be running somewhere other than my home (so no power bills).

I guarantee the moment I get this card in my hands the entire market will crash. You may blame this directly on me when the day comes, I don't mind.

MaxxBot
Oct 6, 2003

you could have clapped

you should have clapped!!


1gnoirents posted:

Thanks for thread, I just broke the very first rule in the OP which was buy a 1070 specifically for this. However I got it at MSRP after looking at ebay prices I figured, at worst, at the moment, id break even. Also I have a machine to plop it into. Also it will be running somewhere other than my home (so no power bills).

I guarantee the moment I get this card in my hands the entire market will crash. You may blame this directly on me when the day comes, I don't mind.

Just came in the mail



I'm about maxed out on PCI-E slots, heat, and power at this point though. Just gotta get a couple powered PCI-E risers to get all of the cards I have running.

Risky Bisquick
Jan 18, 2008

PLEASE LET ME WRITE YOUR VICTIM IMPACT STATEMENT SO I CAN FURTHER DEMONSTRATE THE CALAMITY THAT IS OUR JUSTICE SYSTEM.


1gnoirents posted:

Thanks for thread, I just broke the very first rule in the OP which was buy a 1070 specifically for this. However I got it at MSRP after looking at ebay prices I figured, at worst, at the moment, id break even (even after shipping, PP fees, ebay fees, the works). Also I have a machine to plop it into. Also it will be running somewhere other than my home (so no power bills).

I guarantee the moment I get this card in my hands the entire market will crash. You may blame this directly on me when the day comes, I don't mind.

Ethereum down to 300295 USD from 350/360

Paul MaudDib
May 2, 2006

"Tell me of your home world, Usul"


Fauxtool posted:

I also would like to know what makes one good and which ones to buy. Im building a new gaming PC and I plan on tossing 2-3 of my older cards into my old pc and I want to do it right without burning down my home with a 4 year old mobo

By the way the ones I got were from "MinerParts.com" and I ordered through Amazon. All of the ones I got seem to be working apart from possibly one which disconnects every now and then (still working on this), so decent success rate. However, all the companies here are ordering from the same shady Chinese sources so I don't know if there are really any that are "better". You do probably want one of the later revisions, like Rev6 or 6C.

I would either go with the type that have a Molex input or the type that have a PCIe 6-pin input, and do not use any of the SATA power adapters that come with them. They are all the "overmolded" type, the plastic eventually softens and the pins inside short out and cause a fire - even under SSD-level power consumption let alone when hooked up to a GPU. You should under no circumstances ever use these for anything, they are literally a fire waiting to happen. Just throw them out.

Each GPU may draw up to 75W from the slot so that's your goal for the risers. Molex's connector is rated to up to 11A per pin, at 12V that's 132W. So do not do any situation which ends up with 2 risers drawing through a single Molex (eg no molex-to-molex Y-splitters).

Technically 6-pins also have a 75W limit but you are probably OK at up to 150W because in practice most connectors are specified for 8-pin usage anyway (the extra 2 pins in the 8-pin are sense pins, the 6-pin part carries all the current). So ideally no situations where more than 1 riser/GPU is plugged in to a single PCIe 6-pin and hard limit no more than 2 per 6-pin (i.e. a single Y-splitter).

There are also PCIe riser types that have a SATA power connector (on the board). I would give these a pass, SATA has 3 12V pins rated at 1.5A each, that gives you 54W which isn't enough. (and yet another reason not to use those Molex-to-SATA cables, even in the best case you would be overdrawing them...)

Paul MaudDib fucked around with this message at Jun 21, 2017 around 21:07

Fauxtool
Oct 21, 2008



so on something like this the idea is to take the 6pin from the PSU and plug it directly into the pci-e riser?
https://www.amazon.com/Onvian-Minin...words=pci+riser

eames
May 9, 2009



Don Lapre posted:

I have a customer who wants me to build him a 6 gpu 1060 rig. should i tell him hes dumb or take his money

both!

Paul MaudDib
May 2, 2006

"Tell me of your home world, Usul"


Fauxtool posted:

so on something like this the idea is to take the 6pin from the PSU and plug it directly into the pci-e riser?
https://www.amazon.com/Onvian-Minin...words=pci+riser

I think that's the safest overall if you have the 6-pins to spare, and you can probably even do a single Y-splitter safely on 6-pin. Running molex risers is also fine, just don't put a splitter on these. Keep SATA entirely out of this picture, including in cables/adapters.

It's all just a question of how many power connectors the card+riser need vs what your PSU gives you. Modular can be nice here since you can often mix-and-match the strings a little bit. For example my PSU has two "PERIPH" type sockets, instead of running 1 molex string + 1 SATA string I could run 2 molex strings.

Just avoid splitters/etc as much as possible and generally minimize the number of adapters/connectors you are using because each one is a place to heat up and cause a fire.

Paul MaudDib fucked around with this message at Jun 21, 2017 around 21:19

1gnoirents
Jun 28, 2014


Risky Bisquick posted:

Ethereum down to 300295 USD from 350/360

1gnoirents fucked around with this message at Jun 21, 2017 around 21:29

future ghost
Dec 5, 2005

det er noget at leve for

Bread Liar

I think bitcoins and cryptocurrency is dumb as hell, and while this trend is clearly loving the market and screwing over everyone trying to build gaming machines, I'm really thrilled that I bought my old cards cheap and turned around and sold them for a 1:1 upgrade years later thanks to bitlords.

That said, to anyone buying old mining cards when this bubble pops, be on the lookout for cards with serial-based warranties. Both of the ex mining cards I bought, the 290 and 280X, eventually had their fans fail and had to be RMA'd. Neither of them had any other hardware problems but that's something to consider. On the plus side I got yet another upgrade with a 390 replacement so maybe that's not a terrible thing.

tehinternet
Feb 14, 2005
Weclome 2 teh Internt


Goddamn

what a post

E: seriously though, this market is insane. Rational actors, right?

tehinternet fucked around with this message at Jun 21, 2017 around 21:33

Kazinsal
Dec 13, 2011




hahaha

Paul MaudDib
May 2, 2006

"Tell me of your home world, Usul"


future ghost posted:

I think bitcoins and cryptocurrency is dumb as hell, and while this trend is clearly loving the market and screwing over everyone trying to build gaming machines, I'm really thrilled that I bought my old cards cheap and turned around and sold them for a 1:1 upgrade years later thanks to bitlords.

That said, to anyone buying old mining cards when this bubble pops, be on the lookout for cards with serial-based warranties. Both of the ex mining cards I bought, the 290 and 280X, eventually had their fans fail and had to be RMA'd. Neither of them had any other hardware problems but that's something to consider.

(And to explain a little bit more: Some companies like EVGA and Gigabyte offer transferrable warranties, usually tied to the date of manufacture or the original registration date. These are big plusses for any used card but especially if it's been used for mining. I personally do think that mining takes a moderate toll on hardware, particularly the fans, and repasting them isn't a terrible idea either since that can get dried out from the constant heat.)

If you can talk the seller into a discount, a card with a dead fan could even be a good deal. A G10 bracket is literally $25 and AIOs start around $50-60. If you can talk the seller into a $50 discount then you just got a liquid-cooled card for $25.

Probably not worth it on low-end cards but 1070s/1080s/1080 Tis will strongly benefit from an AIO cooler especially for gaming (it's less of a gain with mining where you want to keep the power under control anyway). Summer is starting in earnest here and my temps are up, I'm thinking an AIO bracket might be a nice upgrade for my main gaming GPU.

If mining on 1080s/1080 Tis ever becomes a thing, it might even be a valid choice there to keep temps down and performance/efficiency up. A $75-per-card upgrade is too expensive to use with huge gangs of low-end cards, but if you have a powerful/expensive card then it might be something you could amortize in a reasonable amount of time.

There is also a fairly cheap ($67) full-cover waterblock for RX480s made by XSPC, the downside is that with a waterblock you are limited to one specific card (whereas the G10 fits virtually any reference board ever made) but it would be efficient (keep the VRMs nice and cool) and you wouldn't have to handle tons of individual radiators.

Paul MaudDib fucked around with this message at Jun 22, 2017 around 04:41

Harik
Sep 9, 2001


Turns out the real money is in shovels and shovel accessories.

The guy behind optiminer doesn't ask you to pay him, he just takes 1% of your cycles to mine for himself. That's the deal for using his optimized miner.

That's a few million in fake dollars from checking the known deposit addresses.

Enos Cabell
Nov 3, 2004



Ok, where do I have to move to get same day delivery?

wargames
Mar 16, 2008

official yospos cat censor


Hasn't been posted yet here so

https://twitter.com/StockTwits/stat...621142734778368

eames
May 9, 2009



Today I learned that some people are margin trading buttcoins and their fantasy alternatives.

Fauxtool
Oct 21, 2008



eames posted:

Today I learned that some people are margin trading buttcoins and their fantasy alternatives.


A risky trading method mixed with an extremely volatile item. What could go wrong?

Watermelon Daiquiri
Jul 10, 2010


is there anything that uses seti or folding stuff as the algorithm for mining? it seems stupid to be wasting energy on pointless hashes when you can at least get SOMETHING tangible from it

1gnoirents
Jun 28, 2014


haha just got this email



dont worry guys, now it will go up because I'm about to cancel

Cinara
Jul 15, 2007


Watermelon Daiquiri posted:

is there anything that uses seti or folding stuff as the algorithm for mining? it seems stupid to be wasting energy on pointless hashes when you can at least get SOMETHING tangible from it

Foldcoin and Curecoin are two I know of.

Kazinsal
Dec 13, 2011




HOLY gently caress LOL

Whoever speculated this thread wouldn't last long might have been right. Time for some popcorn

eames
May 9, 2009



it'll probably last a few weeks and will then be resurrected in 3 years.

Paul MaudDib
May 2, 2006

"Tell me of your home world, Usul"


Watermelon Daiquiri posted:

is there anything that uses seti or folding stuff as the algorithm for mining? it seems stupid to be wasting energy on pointless hashes when you can at least get SOMETHING tangible from it

Yeah, Seti and F@H and tons of other projects can use GPUs and there is a standard "BOINC" platform to let researchers queue up tasks.

Someone even made a FoldingCoin that distributes rewards based on F@H results, although it's not really worth anything it might help offset some of the power you spend.

Kazinsal
Dec 13, 2011



Coinbase posted:

Ethereum Buys and Sells Offline
Buys and Sells for Ethereum are offline while we work to resolve an issue.

Whitest Russian
Nov 23, 2013


Is there a way to tell Nicehash not to mine unless the return is above a certain amount?

Cinara
Jul 15, 2007


https://www.nicehash.com/?p=faq#faqs5

Or just check the settings, there's an option in there.

Fruit Chewy
Feb 13, 2012


Whitest Russian posted:

Is there a way to tell Nicehash not to mine unless the return is above a certain amount?

It's like right at the top of the main gui options.

spasticColon
Sep 22, 2004

In loving memory of Donald Pleasance


And tomorrow there will be a glut of barely used 1070s and 580s on ebay for cheap.

Whitest Russian
Nov 23, 2013


Fruit Chewy posted:

It's like right at the top of the main gui options.

Oh wow, literally right there in the middle. drat that's pretty bad.

xthetenth
Dec 30, 2012

Mario wasn't sure if this Jeb guy was a good influence on Yoshi.



Coinbase is showing eth at $328 now? What's that tweet pointing to?

Facebook Aunt
Oct 4, 2008



Ham Wrangler

xthetenth posted:

Coinbase is showing eth at $328 now? What's that tweet pointing to?

It was a flash crash. Somebody dumped a bunch of Eth, causing the price to crater. Then it quickly rebounded. This had no effect on anyone holding Eth or mining Eth.

Hilariously though, some people were margin trading eth. The crash triggered various margin calls and stop loss type things, so the margin traders were wiped out.

Using your spare GPU cycles to mine is all fun and games, and if it all goes to poo poo won't cost you more than some wasted electricity. Do not attempt to margin trade on unregulated exchanges.

Anime Schoolgirl
Nov 28, 2002

~perfect~
battlebrother





Facebook Aunt posted:

It was a flash crash. Somebody dumped a bunch of Eth, causing the price to crater. Then it quickly rebounded. This had no effect on anyone holding Eth or mining Eth.

Hilariously though, some people were margin trading eth. The crash triggered various margin calls and stop loss type things, so the margin traders were wiped out.

Using your spare GPU cycles to mine is all fun and games, and if it all goes to poo poo won't cost you more than some wasted electricity. Do not attempt to margin trade on unregulated exchanges.

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Risky Bisquick
Jan 18, 2008

PLEASE LET ME WRITE YOUR VICTIM IMPACT STATEMENT SO I CAN FURTHER DEMONSTRATE THE CALAMITY THAT IS OUR JUSTICE SYSTEM.


Why the hell are people margin trading unregulated magical internet money? Stick to wallstreet jfc

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