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Welcome to the French Politics Megathread! I decided to make this thread because my fellow French goons and myself are annoying everyone in the EuroPol megathread by obsessively posting about France and French politics. Also, the Germans have their own thread, and since we're AT LEAST as important as they are in world politics, it's only normal we'd have ours as well. If you don't want a primer on French institutions and want to start shitposting right now, feel free to skip to the end of this huge ungainly post, where you will find a single rule for posting in this thread (hint: it's about posting while fascist). France is a great country! A former colonial Empire on which the sun never set either, it still maintains a couple colonial possessions here and there and has a lot of influence on international politoh who am I kidding. 65 million people and maybe 100 million native French speakers worldwide, let's be serious. Our economy is mediocre, our politics are petty, and our international entanglements are bumbling. France is a  Our current President is Emmanuel Macron, a babyfaced former banker who stabbed a lot of people in the back to get where he is now, including his mentor, former President François Hollande, and the senior members of the Socialist Party whom he had been governing with and under as Minister of the Economy. He is a, uh, "social-liberal", which is a nebulous term that is meant to obfuscate his resolutely pro-business and pro-employer bent. He owes his election to the fact that his main opponent, François Fillon, crashed and burned a few months before the election when it was revealed he The President is elected every 5 years in a national election in two rounds. The first round eliminates all but two candidates, and the second round decides the winner. His role in the French 5th Republic is theoretically limited: he chooses the Prime Minister out of the parliamentary majority, he can dissolve the Assemblée Nationale (one chamber of parliament), he signs the laws, he's the head of state and leads the armies. And a bunch of minor stuff. Technically, he's not supposed to be the one in charge of setting policy, because that's the job of the Prime Minister, but it turns out that the Prime Minister is more often than not an obedient soldier who bends to his will. Speaking of the Prime Minister, here is our current Prime Minister, Édouard Philippe:  A former member of the right-wing Les Républicains party, he quit it (or was excluded from it?) upon his nomination. He's a former high level civil servant, who turned to the private sector and later on was elected mayor of Le Havre, a coastal city. A technocrat who will probably remain obedient and spend his time turning Macron's ideas into actual policy. The Prime Minister's job is to get policy through Parliament, and then enact it. He is also in charge of the adult daycare full of bloated egos that is called the French government. He arbitrates disputes. The Assemblée Nationale has the power to destitute him, which is why he is usually selected from amongst the ranks of the majority. In this instance, it is not exactly the case, but the current Assemblée is fine with him. When the Assemblée and the President are not from the same party, then the Prime Minister is the one with all the actual power. This has happened three times since 1986, and will never happen again since the presidential and parliamentary elections now take place almost simultaneously and the Président and the Députés are all elected for 5 years. The current government is kinda weird. It's full of people from both the PS and LR, with a bunch of centrists, an ecologist, and a few other unaligned folk. The right wing is in control of the money (they've got the Prime Minister, the Economy and the Finances), arguably also of the Interior (police and so on, Collomb's policy being a continuation of vallsian and guéantist policies before it), but they all have macronist drivers behind them. The PS holds foreign affairs and the army. Ecologist Nicolas Hulot holds the ministry of Ecology, but he's also handled by two mahouts. Who can tell what's going to happen with this weird Frankenstein's monster of a government? I certainly can't. Anyway. The President and the Prime Minister are the two ugly heads of the executive hydra. The legislative branch is also divided into two: the Assemblée Nationale and the Sénat. The Assemblée (composed of Députés) is the "lower" chamber of parliament. They write the laws. It often turns out that the Assemblée will more or less blindly follow the lead of the government. It is uncertain what the current Assemblée will do - whether it will think by itself or blindly obey, because it is made up of a lot of novices and who knows? They might decide to rebel a bit? Here's what it looks like: 
The other half of the parliament is the Sénat. I'm not going to spend a lot of time on it, because it's boring, full of old people and it smells like pee, but basically it's a solidly right-wing institution that can be easily circumvented through a clever application of constitutional tools. Its members are not directly elected by the people. LREM has not had an occasion to establish a foothold in there yet, but it's unlikely that they will because the Senate favors well-established parties. Whatever. Who cares about them, right? I'm also not going to provide any information on the judicial branch. Click on the wikipedia links provided above if you want more details. SPECIAL THREAD RULE: Other than the regular forums rules, I'd like it if the mods enforced an additional rule ITT: Please don't post while under the influence of fascism. Thank you very much. NEW RULE: Starting on page 2, every page must have a youtube link to some good music. 
Flowers For Algeria fucked around with this message at 20:16 on Jun 30, 2017 |
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Jun 27, 2017 21:45
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Reserving this to copypaste good effortposts by people who want to contribute to our understanding of this shitshow. EDIT: best posts ITT: x420ReDdIT_Br0nYx posted:«Et la séparation des pouvoirs ?!» m'écrié-je, alors que je rapetisse et me transforme en épi de maïs Flowers For Algeria fucked around with this message at 06:26 on Sep 13, 2018 |
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Jun 27, 2017 21:46
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BluesShaman posted:
I can't argue that Germany has had a big role as an international victim ever since 1945. Not a role as an international actor though EDIT: we whooped your country's rear end in 1944 and we're ready to do it again
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Jun 27, 2017 23:05
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Gort posted:So, I know nothing of French politics but I'm eager to learn. Why was Hollande considered such a failure? I actually had a bit of hope when I heard you guys had elected a left-winger back in the day. You want my honest answer? He and his team had zero charisma and were unable to control the narrative about their successes and failures. Hollande has a goofy face and a goofy voice, and there lies the reason of his unpopularity. Because let's be honest, he was not very competent and his New Labour-ish policies were ineffectual at best and harmful at worst, but he was certainly not as bad as Sarkozy. And yet Sarkozy still kept a core of popularity. The right hate him because he's a Socialist, and therefore a leftist idiot. The left hate him because he betrayed everything he stood for and followed a deeply liberal agenda and furthered the overton window shift to the right. The "center" will prefer Macron, a young-ish technocrat who speaks their language. Even the PS hate him, because he's a useful scapegoat. Poor François Hollande. I pity him. He's unpopular, but transparent at the same time: in the end, people simply didn't care about him. I remember back in 2012, I woke up one morning and looked at my ex and said "Sarkozy isn't President" and we shared a smile. Not so with Hollande today. Dommolus Magnus posted:Oh! Are the brits jumping in to save you this time, too? I'll readily admit that the British contributed to the liberation of France in their way. But let's be honest. It was mostly a French effort. The X-man cometh posted:Is he better than Fillion? Yes, but only in the sense that dying in your sleep with a pillow over your face is better than dying in a ditch after a severe beating. Flowers For Algeria fucked around with this message at 07:44 on Jun 28, 2017 |
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Jun 28, 2017 07:41
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LeoMarr posted:friendly reminder Hollande turnednfrance into a proto venezuela. 
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Jun 28, 2017 08:12
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Deltasquid posted:I didn't realize Mélanchon was so rabidly anti-EU that he'd throw poo poo fits for seeing the flag hanging at the Assemblée Générale lol. One grumpy remark upon seeing the flag in the middle of the floor of the Assemblée Nationale is not really "a poo poo fit".
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Jun 28, 2017 10:49
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exmarx posted:How closely do députés typically stick to the party line when voting on legislation? It really really depends on how powerful the government is. Under Sarkozy, the members of the then-UMP majority were fully under control. Fillon may have been grumpy as Prime Minister and he may have resented and despised Sarkozy, he was overall an obedient tool. Not so under Hollande: a significant (but not significant enough) fraction of the PS députés were in open rebellion against the rightwards shift of the Valls government, going so far as to vote against key pieces of legislation and almost managed to file a motion of censure that could have brought the government down. As for "Party lines", it's a bit more complicated. The government and the party are different beasts, and the government takes precedence and the party follows the government. The opposition generally follows party lines.
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Jun 28, 2017 13:03
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Bulbo posted:She's in charge of the international negociations regarding the arctic and antarctic zones (drilling rights, new waterways opening due to melting icecaps...). She literally just watches penguin videos all day.
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Jun 28, 2017 13:05
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Kassad posted:So who's up to welcome Trump like he deserves to be? Exactly my thought. I hope there is a loving RIOT. we could have both the left AND the nationalists in the streets at the same time
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Jun 28, 2017 22:08
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Kurtofan posted:*senators dont count f u Turns out that senators do count! They're being instrumental in emptying the "law to moralize public life" of its substance!
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Jun 28, 2017 22:46
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No it's not a joke we are literally passing a law called "Moralisation de la vie publique".
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Jun 28, 2017 22:47
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unpacked robinhood posted:The half clock in the back is super distracting. 8:20, la France qui se lève tôt Edit lol the book is Mémoires de Guerre by Charles de Gaulle Dude is crazy Flowers For Algeria fucked around with this message at 13:44 on Jun 29, 2017 |
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Jun 29, 2017 13:34
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also he's tempted by the fascist way of treating migrants
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Jun 29, 2017 14:12
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Kurtofan posted:who's bacchus borloo EDIT: music for page 4: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRTDC9Z5UdE
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Jun 30, 2017 20:13
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Our own personal South America.
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Jul 1, 2017 11:16
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unpacked robinhood posted:Macron inaugurated the freshly opened Paris Rennes LGV with a speech about how we're now past ambitious infrastructure projects and we need to work on "la mobilité du quotidien" with no further explanation. Privatizing roads in major cities and auctioning them to the highest bidder
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Jul 1, 2017 22:37
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Kassad posted:Nope, they gave him a painting. This is an especially cruel article.
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Jul 1, 2017 23:41
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Kurtofan posted:compared to Jupiter on top of Mount Olympus, what are we mortals You should strive to be a billionaire, you sans-dents trash
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Jul 2, 2017 18:52
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Oh ahahahaha
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Jul 2, 2017 23:07
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What a snoozefest of a speech. He sounded like Hollande at his most mediocre.
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Jul 3, 2017 15:37
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Speaking as a Frenchman living near Paris and as a connard myself, it's just something you gotta get used to. The secret is to interact with as few people as possible and throw hostile looks at everyone.
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Jul 4, 2017 07:16
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lost in postation posted:Can't wait to be empowered right into a ditch! Inch'allah Edit ever since I heard he was back i've been in an mc solaar mood deal with it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0E76VlShWHQ Flowers For Algeria fucked around with this message at 13:42 on Jul 4, 2017 |
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Jul 4, 2017 13:24
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Liberalism is an incredibly powerful force, able to co-opt and subvert even the legendary French bureaucracy and its bureaucrats. High-level civil servants leaving the public sector to profit from sweet private money has become so commonplace that we even have a word for it ("pantoufler"). These people don't give a poo poo about the State and will gladly kill it with a thousand cuts. Macron is one of those.
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Jul 5, 2017 12:07
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Yeah we loving love pomp, especially when it comes to Presidents. This image is par for the course. The culotted clowns in a row are also always there in the Assemblée Nationale IIRC. On July 14th, if you care enough to pay attention, you'll also witness another pretty backwards and dumb scene: a huge military parade along the Champs-Elysées, complete with fighter planes and poo poo. I'm actually pretty sure that it will stir Trump's loins so much that I wouldn't be surprised if he decides he wants a parade for the next 4th of July. (But yeah there's a definite authoritarian streak in Macron's style and in the institutional reforms he advocates)
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Jul 5, 2017 14:12
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icantfindaname posted:To what extent is the modern Fifth Republican state/bureaucracy a creation of the Vichy period, in institutional terms? I know a good number of high-level collaborators like Papon et al continued postwar, but how about the institutions rather than people? I just read a book about how Japan's postwar economy was basically created during the war, with various state planning bureacracies that were instrumental in the postwar being more or less continuations of agencies created in the 1930s. I know the Third Republic was supposed to have been a laissez-faire/free market thing, and postwar France heavily diritiste/state-planned. Is it pretty much the same story, that the planning-state was a continuation of, or at least was created by, wartime fascism? Approximately 0%. The Fifth Republic dates back to 1958. The Fourth Republic dates back to 1946, and it was fully created by a Constituent Assembly (in effect it was a parliamentary regime much like the Third Republic, but with an actual constitutional framework which the Third lacked). Hell, I mean, the most vague notion in our constitutional jurisprudence, the "principes fondamentaux reconnus par les lois de la République" ("fundamental principles that are recognized by the laws of the Republic", a bunch of liberties that are not mentioned in the Constitution but upheld as principles with a constitutional value) exclude laws that come from Vichy. And the only significant piece of administrative jurisprudence I can think of that comes from Vichy times is the decision enshrining the right for a civil servant to disobey an order if the order is illegal and threatens the good operation of the service. The bureaucracy far predates Vichy, and the institutions are pretty removed from Vichy. EDIT: also interventionism was pretty important during the Third, especially starting in the 20's.
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Jul 5, 2017 14:46
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icantfindaname posted:Have anything to read about the rise of interventionism/dirigisme in the pre-Vichy Third Republic, in that case? Actually pretty much anything about interwar France Sorry, no. All I might have somewhere in a HDD is a bunch of notes from a class about Economic Interventionism in France, but it'd be in French and mostly focused on the administrative side of economic interventionism (what was legal, what became legal through jurisprudence, and stuff like that). And French administrative law is abstruse and stupid. I'll look around. MP me if I forget about you. lost in postation posted:I always picture Valls when I think about Thiers. Valls wouldn't have hesitated one second before executing all the communards. Valls liked to think of himself as some sort of reincarnation of Clemenceau. The man who had the military open fire on the striking coal miners.
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Jul 5, 2017 15:09
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Al-Saqr posted:lol can't wait for Macron to deliver France to the Nazi FN on a silver platter thanks to him being a neolib fuckhead who insists on destroying people's lives instead of trying to fix them. Talk about a Jupiter sized rear end in a top hat. He won't because we of the Real Left will loving destroy the FN by being loud and active in the next 5 years.
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Jul 5, 2017 19:44
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Maybe they can have a daily show on TF1 right after the JT, maybe it could replace Nos Chers Voisins for the better as a comedy show.
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Jul 7, 2017 18:34
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Some topical music https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pmetwm6VWgc
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Jul 11, 2017 20:47
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How dare you say that France ever did anything wrong in Africa? This is an insult to all those who were there, who gave their lives for their country. Ça suffit la repentance
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Jul 12, 2017 08:21
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~l'aventure coloniale~
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Jul 12, 2017 12:34
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I'm such a gullible idiot piece of poo poo fucker that it's only now that I realize I've actually voted for the loving FN's platform in the 2nd turn of the presidential election http://www.lemonde.fr/immigration-e...01_1654200.html http://www.liberation.fr/france/2017/07/11/a-calais-quand-ils-ont-compris-que-l-eau-n-etait-pas-buvable-ils-l-ont-jetee_1583179
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Jul 12, 2017 16:15
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Today there's an anti-Trump and anti-Macron demonstration at Place de Clichy at 2 PM. Just sayin
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Jul 14, 2017 06:48
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Toplowtech posted:Yeah but at that game of only saying what people want to hear, sooner or later he may end up creating enough contradictions to gently caress himself up. In that sense he's the living embodiment of capitalism
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Jul 17, 2017 12:42
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Dieudonné used to be cool And now he sucks rear end bigly
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Jul 17, 2017 17:54
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same
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Jul 19, 2017 10:14
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Trump's take on Macron:quote:HABERMAN: He was very deferential to you. Very. https://mobile.nytimes.com/2017/07/19/us/politics/trump-interview-transcript.html
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Jul 20, 2017 11:39
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Kassad posted:https://twitter.com/leJDD/status/889007700910145536 Not low enough.
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Jul 23, 2017 17:27
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The new line of argument in support of the APL reduction is "well it'll be compensated by the elimination of the taxe d'habitation" So essentially it's still taking from the poor to give to the rich. 
Flowers For Algeria fucked around with this message at 16:36 on Jul 25, 2017 |
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Jul 25, 2017 16:34
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lost in postation posted:Both of my friends who were militantly En Marche (tee-shirts, pins, went to the inauguration, the whole shebang) now sigh / pull a face every time I mention his name. It's a small but real comfort. gently caress them imo
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Jul 25, 2017 19:24
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