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Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

You didn't watch him do it?

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Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

You know, back at my first restaurant job I used to think I wanted to keep working through instead of taking a break. The sous would always offer and I'd always say no because it felt wrong to go sit and do nothing while there was still a lot of stuff that needed to be done. Eventually corporate started cracking down and I was forced to start taking my breaks no matter what. At the very start it stressed me out but soon enough I realized that I was feeling a lot better and my attitude was improving and I really started to cherish my breaks. It can be so tempting to just keep the blinders on, stay in go-go-go mode, and work yourself to death, whether out of a sense of responsibility to your team, being competitive, or just plain addicted to losing yourself in the rush. But the reality is I was worse at my job and had a shittier attitude when I wasn't well rested. Being able to take 30 minutes to decompress, recover and practice a little patience made all the difference. And wouldn't you know it, the restaurant didn't fall apart while I was gone for a half hour and we still managed to get all our work done. So please do take your breaks if you have the option and allow yourself to enjoy them - you're worth it ;)

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

Chef De Cuisinart posted:

I'm in Seattle for 2 days, where should I eat/drink/get high?

Had Ba Bar last night, some of the best noodles I've had, chatted with the owner, cool dude, told me to explore the Chinatown area.

Is there any tourist-y things I should do?

What do you like and where are you staying? Chinatown's got some solid eats for cheap. Kedai Makan on Capitol Hill has fantastic Malaysian. Junebaby is getting some great press right now, haven't been myself. Bar del Corso is always great for fancier pizza and Italian small plates. Uncle Ike's is a fun weed shop. Carkeek Park is really beautiful with tons of trails through wooded sections and a big beach with a great view of Puget Sound. You could take a ride on a ferry, maybe to Bainbridge Island where you could eat at Hitchcock.

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

Well, you know her and the situation better than we do. Just remember you have to keep working with this person and stewing over it won't make that any easier.

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

Nah, you didn't do anything wrong. It doesn't happen very often in my own experience but it's definitely not unheard of and it sounds like you made their night special. Good on ya :)

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

Babylon Astronaut posted:

All menu changes should be concerned with profitability, first and foremost.

Well that's certainly one way to look at it.

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

Babylon Astronaut posted:

If you want to have any room for culinary creativity, you really need to. You aren't helping anything if you aren't sustainable.

You don't have to sacrifice every menu choice to profit to be sustainable. I can tell you that from experience.

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

Babylon Astronaut posted:

Of course you don't. I think I'm talking over your head. Above all, you need to have whatever it is be profitable. You can even account for good will as an asset, that's perfectly reasonable, but if it's losing you value, it is a non-starter. At the same time, concrete financial information will win any arguement. If you can't even tell me the amount of sales that would cover the cost, there's no there there. Your uncompromising craft cocktail needs to be costed out, and priced appropriately, then, you get the longer leash. profit covers all sins and people loving love to see the numbers. How much value do you get from your ice choice, and how much does it cost? Does it increase volume, ticket average or both? Simple, understandable answers to these questions , backed by data should let you get away with anything you dream of to improve the operation.

I'm not disputing that costing is very important and that profitability is always something you have to be mindful of. I was merely taking a shot at your comment that "All menu changes should be concerned with profitability, first and foremost" which I think is really overstating your point.

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

pile of brown posted:

It kind of isn't though, there's really no justification for making unprofitable menu changes or decisions when running a business for profit. No matter how good perfect or delicious something is, and no matter how much you want to sell it, if it's not generating profits it will slowly and surely kill your business. It's honestly worse if it's popular and unprofitable.

Example: I worked at a resort that started a promotion designed to bring in customers during our slowest happy hour day. Tuesdays from 4 to 6, every appetizer on the menu was half off. It was incredibly popular- to the point where the kitchen staff started talking about "take it in the rear end tuesdays," loading all saute pans into the convection open during prep time to preheat, etc. The problem was, we were selling scallops, abalone, etc. for a loss, and selling $5 happy hour sangria nowhere near made up for selling abalone that costs $75/lb for $11 a plate. The customers loved it, but it was a terrible idea because nobody considered the profitability of it.

I totally understand where you're coming from, and Babylon Astronaut too. A business above all needs to be profitable at the end of the day, I'm really just pushing back on the attitude that every choice you make with your food needs to be profit-driven to be able to reach that point (which, to be fair, maybe I'm reading too much into your wording Babylon). I work at a small chef-driven creative restaurant where our menu can change weekly or even daily depending on what's available from the farmers we source from. The chef-owner, who is a good friend of mine, could be making more money if he so chose. Sure, the produce we get is pretty fantastic but we could definitely get away with using cheaper stuff and I believe the majority of our customers wouldn't know the difference. But the chef likes being able to support these folks we're working with. We make enough money from tasting menus and wine pairings that we can afford to do so. He loves what he does, as do the rest of us, and if he wants to run a dish for a short time that's not making us much money but he's just excited about it then we can do so because at the end of the day we'll still be in the black. If he were looking to maximize profit, then yes, many of the decisions he makes would be wrong. He didn't open this restaurant to be a money machine. He's spent a lot of time in places like that before and knows how to play that game well. He opened the restaurant to be a place he could be excited and satisfied to come in to every day and make a lot of people's nights special while still being able to pay his bills and so far we're doing well in spite of those decisions.

Thoht fucked around with this message at 21:29 on Mar 13, 2018

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

Babylon Astronaut posted:

If your change isn't bringing in more people or more money, you're just masturbating with people's livelihoods. If your poo poo is worth it, go out and get what it's worth. But if you think something isn't good enough to be sold at a sustainable price then you're again, whacking off with people's futures. Yea no, it's the number one concern, above all else.
I guess I'm quibbling over semantics. I wholeheartedly agree with you that jeopardizing other people's livelihoods for pride is a reckless and self-centered act.

quote:

If you have to use less expensive ingredients to stay profitable, then you either do it, or go under.
Absolutely. Luckily we have enough wiggle room that that's not an issue for us.

quote:

"Uncompromising chef-owner with tenuous understanding of business going belly up because of stupid pride" is a tale as old as time. A chef should be a leader above all else, and if you are not insuring the continued existence of your operation, you are failing those who put their trust in you.
My friend has a better than tenuous understanding of business; he's run some very profitable restaurants as a CdC before this. I can also assure you that insuring we stay afloat and that we all still have jobs is a responsibility that weighs heavily on him. I've known him for years and he cares deeply about the people working for him. If we were at risk, I know he would trim whatever needed to be trimmed to make us viable. He's not an uncompromising man at all. My point was that we're not currently at risk and there's room in our budget for the occasional splurge.

quote:

I had a chef-owner tell me "I don't cook for other people. I cook what I know to be correct." Ok, then stay the gently caress home and stop getting other people wrapped up in it. Cook your food at home, and spare us.
That guy sounds like a real rear end-hat. It seems like you've been burned with this stuff before so I can understand you taking a cautious approach.

quote:

Spending money for no measurable competitive advantage is OK if you're just trying to slowly bleed a trust fund or something, but if you have bills to pay, "sorry, we can't afford to keep you, but the ice is clear" is.... cold comfort.
Thankfully our bills do get paid on time and I still always get the hours I need, regardless. I do realize that we're in a large city that can support this kind of endeavor and that not everyone lives in an area where it would be feasible. Anywho, I think I misread your intentions with your original statement, and if so I apologize. I think we mostly agree. I don't mean to downplay the importance of keeping the business on stable financial ground. As a business owner you owe it to the people working for you. I merely wish to give an example of there being room for some responsible fun. Thanks for the vigorous discussion!

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

Holy poo poo I missed that. Nice one lol

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

In Washington you can get in deep poo poo for not carding.

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

Sounds like you're doing the right thing. Good on you for keeping track of those hours and I think it's a good sign that they retro-payed you for them. I think October and your 1 year anniversary would be a good time to bring it up to someone in management you trust and let them know how you feel about the situation. If they can't or won't give you an all-around raise, well then it might be time to start shopping around for some place that will value you more. We're rooting for you, JD!

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

JacquelineDempsey posted:

I want to start a bar that serves nothing but malt liquor. Steelies, Mike's, Earthquake, Colt 45, maybe try to find some vintage Crazy Horse and Private Stock, get some those posh spiked seltzers...

Do they even make kegs of malt liquor? Has anyone ever seen it on tap in the wild?

Edit: Colt 45 and Mickeys are still available, and you used to be able to get Olde English and Schlitz. They do exist!

We make malt vinegar out of Olde English at the restaurant I work at. The chef definitely got some looks when he was buying a shitload of 40s at the corner store.

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

pile of brown posted:

Can you explain why it makes sense to do this?

Do you mean like from a profit/labor perspective? It doesn't. We do it for fun, because it's interesting, because it makes a good story for guests. We age it in oak and it gets really wonderful. We only use the malt vinegar on one dish so it's not like we run through a lot of it.

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

I'm in, PM me a link as well.

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

virinvictus posted:

Please tell me the pain is worth it with Birkenstock’s.

They do get comfortable eventually. Mine took a long time though and I honestly don't know if I'd do it again.

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

A great attitude can make up for a whole lot of inexperience, in my opinion. I was listening to Dominique Crenn on the radio the other day (one of her restaurants just got 3 Michelin stars). She was saying she hardly pays any attention to where people she's interviewing for the kitchen have worked previously. What she looks for is a thirst for learning, a real desire to be at that restaurant, a great work ethic. I think if you ask most chefs, they'd much rather have someone with all that who maybe needs extra mentoring than some CIA grad who thinks they know everything already.

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

Test Pattern posted:

I have never understood people whose political stance includes "I, personally, should get murdered."

JacquelineDempsey posted:

a whole lot of internalized homophobia and self-loathing

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

Most cooks I've known are goofballs/weirdos to varying degrees (I include myself here) so I think you'll do fine.

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

For something close-ish to the Fairmont that isn't too expensive I'd be looking in Capitol Hill, Beacon Hill, or maybe Queen Anne. Let me know if you want any restaurant recs when you get here! Oh, I also heard The Reef pot shop on Capitol Hill is offering a 40% industry discount if you bring a pay stub.

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

Chef De Cuisinart posted:

Nah man, they're terrible because ragu.

I'm going to miss HEB/Central Market when we move to Seattle next month :(

Don't know if it's the same company but we have Central Market here (and Town & Country). They're pretty dope.

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

Republicans posted:

Dog Update: He figured out how to get past the empty cardboard box so more drastic steps had to be taken to keep him out of the kitchen.



He looks so defeated :smith:

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

Science WHORE posted:

Help, the imposter syndrome has set in. All my other coworkers have been to culinary school or have been professionally trained in french pastry and I'm just like "yooooooooooooooooooooo I made some macarons once, I've whipped an egg white". I'm sure it's all in my head, because everybody is super kind and professional as gently caress, but we are working on a menu for opening and I feel like every suggestion I make is stupid as hell (except I will defend to the death candied orange peel on top of earl grey ganache) .

I doubt anyone there thinks less of you for not being as formally educated and if they do they can go gently caress themselves. Some of the worst people I've had to work with were people who went to C.I.A. and thought they already knew everything.

Just try to always keep learning and growing and you'll be golden. Get in the habit of reading cookbooks and sites like Serious Eats. When people at work say something should be done a certain way, ask them why. Stuff like that.

Thoht fucked around with this message at 05:21 on Nov 30, 2019

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

Google Docs has some decent resume templates.

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

Doom Rooster posted:

The only thing I can think of that y'all didn't prep me for is an attitude thing super specific to me/the industry I came from, so wouldn't have expected you to cover it. From the tech industry, process is process. Except in startups, literally everything, every detail, has an EXACT way it is supposed to be done. I kept asking stuff like "After I have portioned these bags of brisket, what should I put them in?, and where on the wok shelf should they go?" thinking like "Half hotel pan, far right side of the shelf" and the answer was actually "Whatever pan they fit nicely in, and anywhere there is room on the shelf". I kept/keep looking for ultra-precise directions, when to some extent I should be figuring it out and making something work.

To be fair, this can vary a lot depending on the kitchen. I'm sure they appreciate that you want to do it the right way and it sounds like you're picking up on their culture pretty quickly.

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

Speaking of kitchen music, does this take anyone else back?

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

Animal-Mother posted:

[...]but I do occasionally wake up in the middle of the night thinking I'm late for work and I start to get dressed before my brain comprehends the numbers on the clock and what they mean.[...]

One time I did this and got halfway through breakfast before my partner stumbled out of bed and said "What the hell are you doing?" Annoyed because I thought it was pretty darn obvious, I replied "Getting ready for work." They then said "It's 3AM!" I looked at the clock, heaved a big sigh, and went back to bed for a couple hours.

Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

fizzymercury posted:

I ripped a fingernail half-off with this horrible poo poo. I slid my hand under it to pick up a box and my ring finger caught it right at the edge and sliced under the nail like butter. It was brutally painful in a way that still makes my knees weak to think about.

I attempted to glue my fingernail back on with super glue. It was spectacular how much that failed to work.

Oh man, this made me reflexively wince so hard.

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Thoht
Aug 3, 2006

w4ddl3d33 posted:

what should i wear to a trial shift as a prep cook? are there any blog posts/sites/exposés i should read beforehand?

Anything but chef whites, lol.

I'd say work pants, non-slip shoes, a clean t-shirt, and an apron. You can always just ask them, too. If nothing else, it shows that you care and you're proactive about doing things right.

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