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Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised

El Gallinero Gros posted:

Rick Sanchez seemingly has that mantle now. Like, I initially enjoyed Rick and Morty but I've made zero effort to watch new episodes because of this realization. It doesn't help that the fanbase is some kind of toxic, and apparently the new ones are getting panned.

I did enjoy the Lone Wolf and Cub inspired short with them, though. Good animation, good fight scene.

More recent episodes are actually making it about as unsubtle as it's ever been how pathetic, abusive and petty Rick is.

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Jedit
Dec 10, 2011

Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014

Proudly supporting the Lowtax Spine Fund 2018-19


Dreadwind posted:

Yeah, Tyler Durden is a complete authoritarian rear end in a top hat who goes way too far in the idealization of the noble savage. But I always felt for the Narrator

Did you completely miss the point of the movie? The Narrator is Tyler. To be more exact: the Tyler we see separate from him is his own idealised version of self - the person he wants to be. The only difference between them is that "the Narrator" inhibits himself and Tyler doesn't. Saying you hate Tyler but feel for the Narrator is like saying that you hate Trump supporters except the ones who stayed home because they were worried what their friends would think if they found out.

Tiggum
Oct 23, 2007


rodbeard posted:

I'm dreading the upcoming wheel of time show because I don't want to find out how wrong I've been about what people's names are supposed to be.
Those books had pronunciation guides in the back. And they were insane.

Punkin Spunkin
Jan 1, 2010

Catching up to god quicker



I like that the mad men mlk assassination episode wants me to believe the petes, trudys, dons of the world actually wouldve cared at all
I guess you can charitably interpret it as expressions of riot anxiety/fear ("what will the negroes do to us now?!?")rather than think the show actually expects me to believe its personally-affected grief...
But then the only real black character immediately has some line probably written by a room full of white dudes about the "fools running in the streets" (concern trolling about rioting and looting, which strikes particularly deep considering recent events)
I dont even like her, she's so personally invested in being a perfect palatable friend to these characters like she watches the show and knows to understand that under joan's/peggy's/don's bristling rude exteriors there's.....?????????

Punkin Spunkin has a new favorite as of 11:52 on May 29, 2020

Eclipse12
Feb 20, 2008



Ghost Leviathan posted:

More recent episodes are actually making it about as unsubtle as it's ever been how pathetic, abusive and petty Rick is.

But Rick is still godlike, always right, and never has any actual consequences unless it's just to show how "tortured" he is. So I don't buy it that they're showing that he's bad. The show is just right up its own rear end set this point. The last handful of episodes were awful.

hawowanlawow
Jul 27, 2009

it was a joke, michael!

I've been rewatching the first couple seasons of Rick and Morty for the first time since they came out, and they're pretty fuckin funny y'all

Cleretic
Feb 3, 2010

Like a bull in a china shop.

Well, if the bull owned the china shop.


Eclipse12 posted:

But Rick is still godlike, always right, and never has any actual consequences unless it's just to show how "tortured" he is. So I don't buy it that they're showing that he's bad. The show is just right up its own rear end set this point. The last handful of episodes were awful.

I've started to realize that there's a lot of nerds that hold being correct over being right. It doesn't matter how much they depict him as being an awful, terrible fuckup of a person to them, because they don't give a poo poo, they see him saying things that are, factually speaking (at least in the show's world), correct.

I started noticing it in Final Fantasy XIV, weirdly enough. There's a scene at one point where all the 'good' nations finally have a sit-down meeting with the big evil Emperor. The actual intent of that scene is to show that, while the nations you've walked at this point are all flawed and have sins in their past or present the Empire is A: even worse, and B: led by a man who is completely unreasonable, and whose outlook on the world is clearly batshit insane. I find that most people get that overall, but there's a group of players that see that whole scene, and whose only takeaway is that the Emperor delivered a 'verbal smackdown' by calling out one of the six-ish nations for how it treats its tribal minorities. They even completely ignore that the Empire handle their tribal minorities with genocide.

There's no getting through to these people, because they really do value the willingness to say factual truths beyond any actual moral character or history.

MariusLecter
Sep 5, 2009

NI MUERTE NI MIEDO


Cleretic posted:

I've started to realize that there's a lot of nerds that hold being correct over being right. It doesn't matter how much they depict him as being an awful, terrible fuckup of a person to them, because they don't give a poo poo, they see him saying things that are, factually speaking (at least in the show's world), correct.

I started noticing it in Final Fantasy XIV, weirdly enough. There's a scene at one point where all the 'good' nations finally have a sit-down meeting with the big evil Emperor. The actual intent of that scene is to show that, while the nations you've walked at this point are all flawed and have sins in their past or present the Empire is A: even worse, and B: led by a man who is completely unreasonable, and whose outlook on the world is clearly batshit insane. I find that most people get that overall, but there's a group of players that see that whole scene, and whose only takeaway is that the Emperor delivered a 'verbal smackdown' by calling out one of the six-ish nations for how it treats its tribal minorities. They even completely ignore that the Empire handle their tribal minorities with genocide.

There's no getting through to these people, because they really do value the willingness to say factual truths beyond any actual moral character or history.

Facts don't care about your feelings.

e; there's no ben shapiro emote, it would be too small

Casnorf
Jun 14, 2002

Never drive a car when you're a fish

context is for kings

Ugly In The Morning
Jul 1, 2010

Don't look at me-
I'm ugly in the morning
When the headaches gone
The sun is not.
Forgot to turn the alarm
On - on


Pillbug

Punkin Spunkin posted:

I like that the mad men mlk assassination episode wants me to believe the petes, trudys, dons of the world actually wouldve cared at all
I guess you can charitably interpret it as expressions of riot anxiety/fear ("what will the negroes do to us now?!?")rather than think the show actually expects me to believe its personally-affected grief...
But then the only real black character immediately has some line probably written by a room full of white dudes about the "fools running in the streets" (concern trolling about rioting and looting, which strikes particularly deep considering recent events)
I dont even like her, she's so personally invested in being a perfect palatable friend to these characters like she watches the show and knows to understand that under joan's/peggy's/don's bristling rude exteriors there's.....?????????

I think not being able to really understand their reaction is partially from being desensitized thanks to the 24 hour news cycle and always being told "<giant awful thing just happened>, oh god, we're hosed". Even if they didn't personally give a poo poo about MLK I could totally buy being shocked for it when you're not already neck-deep in news stories about terrorism, genocides, and donald trump having a twitter account.

hawowanlawow posted:

I've been rewatching the first couple seasons of Rick and Morty for the first time since they came out, and they're pretty fuckin funny y'all

Check out Solar Opposites if you haven't seen it, it's just Justin Roiland and I think his brand of outlandish sci-fi hijinx works way better without Dan Harmon's "I am the worst, but also very smart, woe is me" brand of depressed alcoholism. The characters are bad people, yeah, but it's more because they're aliens and don't give a gently caress than being actively toxic people like Rick.

THOT PATROL
Nov 16, 2017


Jedit posted:

Did you completely miss the point of the movie? The Narrator is Tyler. To be more exact: the Tyler we see separate from him is his own idealised version of self - the person he wants to be. The only difference between them is that "the Narrator" inhibits himself and Tyler doesn't. Saying you hate Tyler but feel for the Narrator is like saying that you hate Trump supporters except the ones who stayed home because they were worried what their friends would think if they found out.

this is probably partially a function of whether you came to fight club first by the movie or the book - the endings are radically different, & the book ending makes the narrator way more sympathetic on revisiting, since you know he ultimately realizes how horrifying tyler is (& thus the horror of what he himself is capable of)

Dreadwind
Dec 1, 2009





THOT PATROL posted:

this is probably partially a function of whether you came to fight club first by the movie or the book - the endings are radically different, & the book ending makes the narrator way more sympathetic on revisiting, since you know he ultimately realizes how horrifying tyler is (& thus the horror of what he himself is capable of)

Yeah pretty much this, I read the book first. Obviously for most of the movie the Narrator does want to be Tyler Durden, but by the end he realizes he doesn't want this anymore. You could argue he was just scared at how big his project was becoming, but I like to think he was more like that ex-KKK guy who realized just how hosed up everything he was doing really was and then devotes the rest of his life to helping others. Again, main complaint is that the movie focuses entirely on the destruction of the existing with no regard whatsoever as to what comes after, this includes the Narrator and how he is going to address the horrible things he did.

rodbeard
Jul 21, 2005



Tiggum posted:

Those books had pronunciation guides in the back. And they were insane.

Yeah if I ever learned how to use those that knowledge was lost years ago. Also the racially accurate casting for the TV show really makes it obvious how weird the geographical layout of the world is. The desert dwelling nomads are basically Irish. Basically all the real world's races are present in the wheel of time in a continent roughly the size of the US with no major geographical hurdles that would stop people from having regular contact. The books illustrator had no idea what anybody looked like and nobody bothered to correct him and continued to use him for all the books too. Lan is basically supposed to be a blue eyed asian Conan the Barbarian. The first book cover even had an extra person that got cut after Jordan gave notes to the artist but before he finished the book.

BaldDwarfOnPCP
Jun 26, 2019



Laterite posted:

The great Gen X cop-out: "Man, all this poo poo sucks. I sure hope someone figures out how to fix it someday. Well, what are ya gonna do?" *Pixies song starts playing*

TBF that is a really great song.

It was weird when they remade fight club note for note in the form of mr robot.

They acknowledge it head on though so good on them

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CPY-Ou8MR44

Punkin Spunkin
Jan 1, 2010

Catching up to god quicker



Holy poo poo the MLK jr episode of the Boondocks is such cringy bullshit looking back
I can barely handle how bad this show is gonna be, but it should've felt poo poo back then to most people too
This is so loving bad. This is so loving cringe.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OuD_0LFSnyY

Punkin Spunkin
Jan 1, 2010

Catching up to god quicker



The anime-y style animated physically exaggerated stereotypes of black people, the Bill Cosby-esque "good" "bad" black people dichotomy...
The idea that somehow black culture or "black on black violence" is so much worse now than in MLK's time that he'd show up to give a speech about how all the stereotypes are real. As if he never experienced frustration with black culture when he was alive, as if somehow black people and black culture are so much more "ungrateful" or degenerated now.

I get the joke was partially that MLK was acting so not-MLK-y, but thinking of the thoughts and assumptions white people must've formed, felt were validated, and must still form watching poo poo like this is genuinely scary. Especially in a time like this.

Punkin Spunkin has a new favorite as of 18:58 on May 29, 2020

Mooseontheloose
May 13, 2003
crazy people don't like me

Eclipse12 posted:

But Rick is still godlike, always right, and never has any actual consequences unless it's just to show how "tortured" he is. So I don't buy it that they're showing that he's bad. The show is just right up its own rear end set this point. The last handful of episodes were awful.

I watched the latest episode and something made me sort of uncomfortable watching it and having Jerry lead the undesirables and the type of people they described as the people who don't do anything for anyone. It reeks of the only thing that is worth anything is STEM people but even within the context of the show Rick hasn't produced anything to improve anyone else's life but his own. And oddly, the only person willing to defend Jerry is Morty.

Its hard to describe but they need to have some of the characters to occasionally pull something over on Rick because we run into the problem you have now with Rick. Cartman was kinda similar except occasionally he would get completely owned by someone.

Fumaofthelake
Dec 30, 2004

Is it handsome in here, or is it just me?

Jerry should have let him die on the Whirly Durly then just have a new Rick show up at the end of the episode with no explanation.

the_steve
Nov 9, 2005

We're always hiring!


4-Star NoJoeneral

If this becomes a Trump AV, you'll know that a centrist decided to throw a tantrum over being proven wrong about something.

Mooseontheloose posted:

I watched the latest episode and something made me sort of uncomfortable watching it and having Jerry lead the undesirables and the type of people they described as the people who don't do anything for anyone. It reeks of the only thing that is worth anything is STEM people but even within the context of the show Rick hasn't produced anything to improve anyone else's life but his own. And oddly, the only person willing to defend Jerry is Morty.

Its hard to describe but they need to have some of the characters to occasionally pull something over on Rick because we run into the problem you have now with Rick. Cartman was kinda similar except occasionally he would get completely owned by someone.

In a way though, Jerry does keep winning against Rick, just not in an obvious slam dunk sort of way.

The fact is that Beth is still choosing to be with him, and that pisses Rick off to no end because he knows Beth could do exponentially better, at least by his standards of better.

Despite all of their problems, they try to make it work, and Rick has to see that every single day, because for all of his talk of nihilism, he needs his family, and that still includes Jerry.

But, like I said, the problem is that that isn't a super obvious and showy win, and Rick still gets to do God Science dunks on everybody to assert his superiority.

hyperhazard
Dec 4, 2011

I am the one lascivious
With magic potion niveous

The one R&M episode I had a real issue with was the one where he dates Unity, the hive mind who can control people on a whim. Summer finds it unethical that she's making slaves of people. Wacky hijinks ensue, and the twist at the end is that the people were terrible and being part of a hive mind was better for everyone.

Except most of the wacky hijinks were Rick having sex with Unity through the people she controlled. Like, hundreds of women in a stadium having an orgy. Completely against their will. And it was played for laughs.

That icked me out.

pentyne
Nov 7, 2012

I posted a 7 point defense of corporate wage theft because my brain is full of worms.

hyperhazard posted:

And it was played for laughs.

This is kind of the main problem with R&M. There's a ton of dark poo poo they do that is horrifying and all but then its all "Rick is the uber genius who solves everything" no matter what else and there isn't a real consequence.

If the show had ended in S2 where Rick gives himself up so his daughter stops destroying her family's happiness to keep him around because of her abandonment issues it would've gone down as a Good Show. Burn hot, burn fast.

food court bailiff
Oct 2, 2007

fast n furious foodstuff



Soiled Meat

Iím still absolutely flabbergasted that Pickle Rick became such a meme when the entire point of that episode is how bad and broken and wrecked he is.

the_steve
Nov 9, 2005

We're always hiring!


4-Star NoJoeneral

If this becomes a Trump AV, you'll know that a centrist decided to throw a tantrum over being proven wrong about something.

pentyne posted:

This is kind of the main problem with R&M. There's a ton of dark poo poo they do that is horrifying and all but then its all "Rick is the uber genius who solves everything" no matter what else and there isn't a real consequence.

If the show had ended in S2 where Rick gives himself up so his daughter stops destroying her family's happiness to keep him around because of her abandonment issues it would've gone down as a Good Show. Burn hot, burn fast.
Especially when the season 3 premiere reveals that he only did it to get back at Jerry for poo poo talking him.
He destabilizes an entire intergalactic government in order to get back at his son-in-law. Not even to get revenge for his murdered friend BirdPerson, just because of Jerry complaining about him when he thought he wasn't being eavesdropped on.

food court bailiff posted:

I’m still absolutely flabbergasted that Pickle Rick became such a meme when the entire point of that episode is how bad and broken and wrecked he is.

But he turned himself into a pickle. Isn't that the funniest poo poo you've ever seen?

hawowanlawow
Jul 27, 2009

it was a joke, michael!

yeah he's bad but I don't need him to be good or even learn anything, I don't care

Eh! Frank
Mar 28, 2006

I gave up blow and adderall for you



Fallen Rib

the_steve posted:

Isn't that the funniest poo poo you've ever seen?
I still can't tell if that meme is mocking the scene and how fans of the show treat it like it's the greatest thing ever, or if it's agreeing with the fans that it's hilarious. Either way, the meme is funnier than the actual show.

Pick
Jul 19, 2009

Ooh, a captive audience!
Yum yum.


Nap Ghost

in other great moments of House, Cameron and Chase start loving one another when Cameron steals a dying homosexual's stash of potentially contaminated party drugs and Chase comes by when she's high and fucks her. then she shows up to work the next day still high and House makes fun of Chase for being a rapist. this is the start of the Chase/Cameron romance which lasts the rest of the show.

Alaois
Feb 7, 2012

D U S T M A N


if you replaced that massive attack song from house's intro with like, literally any normal television show intro theme its prestige would immediately drop by 70%

Pick
Jul 19, 2009

Ooh, a captive audience!
Yum yum.


Nap Ghost

I mean, same with Hannibal

Pick
Jul 19, 2009

Ooh, a captive audience!
Yum yum.


Nap Ghost

Hannibal intro: "so no one TOLD you life was gon-na be this waaaaay"

Sid Vicious
Jan 1, 1970



Yeah on Netflix House has like a weird knockoff of Teardrop and it's not good

MariusLecter
Sep 5, 2009

NI MUERTE NI MIEDO


Eh! Frank posted:

I still can't tell if that meme is mocking the scene and how fans of the show treat it like it's the greatest thing ever, or if it's agreeing with the fans that it's hilarious. Either way, the meme is funnier than the actual show.

For sure the resurgence of the pickle meme recently has been super irony.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ifntgj005LA

Orcs and Ostriches
Aug 26, 2010




The Great Twist

Alaois posted:

if you replaced that massive attack song from house's intro with like, literally any normal television show intro theme its prestige would immediately drop by 70%

It was on Netflix ages ago and I did a bit of a rewatch, and I still liked the show at the time. They didn't license that song so they replaced it with something else. You are 100% correct

Laterite
Mar 14, 2007

It's Gutfest '89

Grimey Drawer

Huh, it's almost as if Rick & Morty is actually misanthropic bullshit.

the_steve
Nov 9, 2005

We're always hiring!


4-Star NoJoeneral

If this becomes a Trump AV, you'll know that a centrist decided to throw a tantrum over being proven wrong about something.

Laterite posted:

Huh, it's almost as if Rick & Morty is actually misanthropic bullshit.

Yeah, but being self aware about it is supposed to give it a pass to most people.

Don't get me wrong, I'm going to watch it of it's on and probably laugh, but I can't imagine a world where I'm basing my identity off of it or treating it as some sort of guide to life like most assholes.

Turpitude II
Nov 10, 2014


Arivia posted:

Yeah, I don't think that applies to B99, where the archetypes are set up and then repeatedly undercut. One of my favourite moments of the series is when Captain Holt says "I have been working with Jake Peralta for three years now, of course I know the FUNKY. COLD. MEDINA." and then they rap it together.

Boyle has to learn to not be a food snob all the time.
Santiago is only able to find the ability to lead once she stops being such a stickler for procedure and office work.
Amy figures out that not everything can be solved by axes.

Some of the characters don't really grow - Gina just moves on, she doesn't change - but I think that's different.

this song was always awful, but especially so if it's still being used in current media when people should know better.

Jedit posted:

No, we don't, because the gun was blatantly planted and the bullet Duggan was initially claimed to have fired into a cop's body armour turned out to be from a cop's gun. The riots kicked off because unlike in America, we still think it's impolite for the police to murder a black man without justification.

this post aged hilariously, though.

Cleretic
Feb 3, 2010

Like a bull in a china shop.

Well, if the bull owned the china shop.


Turpitude II posted:

this song was always awful, but especially so if it's still being used in current media when people should know better.

Jake has poor taste in media, this is a remarkably established part of his character. If he likes it and it's not Die Hard, it's probably awful, or at best dumb fun.

Arivia
Mar 17, 2011


Cleretic posted:

Jake has poor taste in media, this is a remarkably established part of his character. If he likes it and it's not Die Hard, it's probably awful, or at best dumb fun.

yeah as a trans woman I find it hilarious, it's a joke about Jake and Holt, not the song itself

Jake has already gone through a bunch of scenes where he goes "oh, this thing I like is actually bigoted and I need to deal with that", most notably Ace Ventura for the exact same reason. There's a whole episode about it, honestly.

Jokerpilled Drudge
Jan 27, 2010

Level: 3

Things dragging down Once Upon A Time: Season 7 was actually the best season in years and season 8 would have probably been a winner. Those small-town-Maine sets were getting really tired and the new roles for old characters as well as half the cast being replaced was honestly a good breath of fresh air.

Kaiser Mazoku
Mar 24, 2011

Didn't you see it!? Couldn't you see my "spirit"!?

Don Gato posted:

Toph is implied to have a much deeper connection to the earth since she also senses vibrations to see, and learned earthbending from blind badgermoles, probably the first person to do it since people first learned it from them in the misty past.

Ah, true. That makes sense.

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christmas boots
Oct 15, 2012

To these sing-alongs of siren songs
To oohs to ahhs to big applause
With all of my anger I scream and shout
America, I love you but you're freaking me out


Biscuit Hider

Kaiser Mazoku posted:

Ah, true. That makes sense.

One nice touch is that her movements are drawn from a different school of Kung fu than what the rest of the earthbenders use

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