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InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

LORD OF BOOTY posted:

as someone who's not straight: it is a little bit of An Issue that yet another tough lady in fiction is being portrayed as LGBT, continuing the stereotype that all LGBT women are tough or butch in some way
otoh tough butch lgbt women are often laffy ha ha jokes while lgbt women that they want the viewers to be sympathetic to are often femme so they can be like "see, this woman is one of the good ones who still does proper woman things and is attractive to your presumed cis male willy"

issues of lgbt representation are complex and lead to a lot of circular firing squads tbh

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InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

ToxicSlurpee posted:

If you cast somebody out they'll end up in a situation where the only company or audience they'll ever have again is racists which will make it way more difficult to convince them that what they did was wrong and they should endeavor to be less of a poo poo.
lol no you idiot

"b-b-b-but if we're mean to racists they'll only have racist friends and continue to be racist!!! you are morally obligated to be friends with and fans of racists because otherwise iss you're fault they're racist" lol

just lol

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

ToxicSlurpee posted:

So nobody should ever be given an opportunity to change and be a better person if they do something lovely. Got it.

You're saying that if you cast someone out they will become more racist. That is what you said. And since casting people out forces them to become more racist then you can't cast people out, you have to keep them in your circle, you can never ever be angry with them because being angry with them would be casting them out and therefore driving them further into the welcoming arms of people more racist than they already are. Now, my view is that if you actually get better and stop being a poo poo person, then maybe we can think about welcoming you back into the fold, but you are saying that we cannot cast them out of the fold ever at any point because casting them out means that they can only hang out with racist people, so you're not even actually considering or debating the concept of forgiving someone after the fact, you're saying that we have to forgive them the instant they do it and never cast them out or punish them for their views because casting them out is morally wrong because it will force them to be more racist. For fucksake

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

Sir Lemming posted:

Maybe it's the privilege talking, but the above is the way I usually prefer to look at it. Nearly everyone joked about that stuff back in the day because the culture encouraged it, and if you weren't specifically an activist or whatever, you just joined in that shared notion of what the acceptable targets are. But if they currently still do that stuff and/or complain about the PC Police holding them down, then it's time to get the knives out.

otoh all the homophobic and transphobic poo poo that was normal in the 80s and 90s made me hate myself for being a disgusting monster that everyone hates back then when i was a child and i don't like revisiting it now either

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.
other consumer products in the 90s included Will & Grace and Ellen

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.
I guess I just have a knee-jerk reaction to attempt to excuse homophobia... I mean like yeah I guess you're right that if they had had gay characters in Star Trek the Next Generation people would have complained but it's 2019 and if you have gay characters people still complain and I'm just not really into attempts to absolve showrunners Etc from blame for being part of the same culture and reinforcing that culture in the name of capitalism. Like other shows managed to have gays on even in the past so yeah I'm going to continue to personally judge and hold accountable the vast majority who chose not to do so because they were scared? I don't think Rick Berman deserves death or whatever but I do think that it needs to be acknowledged that he was part of why Star Trek did not have gay characters and not just be like "well you can't blame Rick Berman at all because other people were also homophobic in addition to him"

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.
I'm not claiming that my decision to be tired of making excuses for the past is particularly productive or that anyone else should agree with me, just that I am really loving tired of making excuses for people being lovely when I was a child when those same people are still being lovely when I am an adult and the only thing that seems to have worked to improve things over my lifetime is ignoring the shity people and carrying on with being homo in spite of them, you know?

e: i am gay and trans and 36 years old, for context

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

bad posts ahead!!! posted:

i've always had a soft spot for the aristocats (hoo boy that asian cat though...) and 101 dalmatians. i love that old, gritty, kinda scratchy animation. it still looks great

it was made with lovely photocopies, that's the secret to that style ftr

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

yeah people gave it a lot of poo poo because they didn't spend the extra time and money to clean up the lines but gently caress it, that's a cool aesthetic

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

FilthyImp posted:

By Kevin Smith's account, Willis harbors no illusions about the kind of films he works on.

And unlike Cage, who will genuinely give a performance, seems that Bruce just checks out if it's a cashgrab.

Meanwhile if you work minimum wage at a retail job you have to give 110% effort every single shift and make sure that all of your valued guests know how much you're thrilled to have the chance to serve them today lol gently caress any actor who will do that when they're making more for that job then some kid at McDonald's makes in 3 years and that kid at McDonald's has to put on acting every single time they go to work

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.
it's not like it's completely foreign to white north american culture either.... anne of green gables series is FULL of it

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

El Gallinero Gros posted:

That also takes place in 19th century though doesn't it?
written between 1908 & 1936. trope of "childhood sweethearts will obviously grow up to become lovers" remains throughout 20th century & lingers into 21st: see Hallmark films

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

Alaois posted:

lmao at the idea of "the girl next door" is some alien, inscrutable trope of the far nippon

god im glad i'm not the only one fuckin sozzed by this discussion tbh

it's such a thing i don't know how to explain a pond to a fish? i just thought of anne of green gables, a relatively obscure example, first bc netflix is trying real real hard to get me to watch it every time i go look at the witcher

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

BioEnchanted posted:

Also didn't "Dumb" used to be used to refer to mute, rather than deaf (hence the phrase "Struck Dumb" to mean speechless)? That's weird if it's to describe a deaf guy.
Nick Andros (the character) is both deaf and mute

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

Antifa Turkeesian posted:

I feel like the assumption in the show is that deafness entails being mute, but it's a plot point that he can't communicate with the guy from COACH because he's illiterate and Rob Lowe can only communicate by writing things down and apparently not even by sign language, which doesn't seem to exist in the world of the movie.
in the book he's explicitly both deaf and mute not just "mute because he's deaf", although the lack of sign language remains an issue caused by stephen king being a fool

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

Push El Burrito posted:

Yeah it wasn't until like late 2000s, early 2010s that the r word became a mainstream slur.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F71MkjhIOT8
nope it was considered bad to say in the 90s but it didn't, and still doesn't, actually stop anyone from claiming it's fine and hilarious because humans are lovely and love to laugh at slurs hth

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

Krispy Wafer posted:

The Stand was written in 1978 and originally took place in 1980, then recon'd to 1985 with the paperback version, and then changed again to 1990 in the expanded edition. But most of the language is still stuck in 1978. But its Stephen King's 1978, so really 1958.

King also did a poo poo job of updating large parts of the book to reflect his inexplicable need to advance the calendar with each revision. So Larry tries to get an ambulance by calling the hospital instead of 911. A couple of survivors later enjoy some brews with pop-tops. Stupid poo poo.
some people will pick on the failed updating by pointing out the absurdity of the main guy being a big rock star whose big hit single was "baby can you dig your man" in 1990 but there was never a time when that song wouldn't've fuckin sucked

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

Elissimpark posted:

I could hear that coming out of Jon Spencer, but lol at the Blues Explosion hitting the top of the charts.

i guess the black keys could do it

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

mind the walrus posted:



Not before 2002 they weren't, although yeah the emotional vulnerability and homoeroticism was always there because well, yeah it's always been there.

what are the pre-2002 superhero movies where the hero wasn't considered buff by the standards of the time in which it was made?

although lol at anyone thinking the MCU originated the homoeroticism. batman & robin was so homoerotic it literally turned me queer irl

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

Doctor Spaceman posted:

Keaton and Clooney (and to a lesser extent Kilmer) as Batman.

ah yeah see i was thinking "they still made the suit buff" but the original post specified the actor being buff and having shirtless scenes, objection sustained

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

Ugly In The Morning posted:

In the Iliad, Achilles was killed by an arrow to the chest. The ankle thing is like the world’s best known fanfiction.
Early sources state he was killed by an arrow to the heel. The story about his mother dipping him in the river, thus granting him immortality so his heel was literally the only place he could have been shot, was from later sources.

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.
yeah the very idea of 'canon' in regards to "the classics" is fuckin dumb. poo poo was created collaboratively building upon other people's earlier writings over the course of years, just like the Omegaverse and with even more animal sex

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

CharlestheHammer posted:

Yeah it also ended like five years ago so I don’t know why it’s coming back now

three years ago, and it's on Disney Plus so teens stuck at home from Covid for months are now going through the dregs of streaming and revisiting it is my guess

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.
At my school we had the "Creative Playground" which was a massive all-wooden structure with a castle tower and slides and ladders and climbing and a fireman's pole and a wood-and-rope bridge. I think there was a movement around those things in the late '70s and '80s, because there's quite a few results with that specific name on google. They took it down around the turn of the millennium and now there's just some plastic swingsets. Sucks.

e: There was also a village playground in a town park which had a giant rocketship made out of metal bars to climb on. Very fun to climb all the way up and then get to the top which was painted a different color and find out the paint had absorbed a ton of sunlight and was burning hot so you lose your grip and fall down the middle of the missile and die lol. They didn't take that out until a couple of years ago, and that wasn't over safety concerns, it was to sell it for scrap metal because nobody used the park anymore

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

Torquemada posted:

Luckily Hollywood has already made ‘Demolition Man’, so a template exists for cryogenically freezing Derek Chauvin in case future crime-free societies need someone experienced in killing minorities.
you're implicitly giving derek chauvin way, way, way too much credit for being individually bad in some unique way that makes him special. he's just a completely standard cop who did poo poo thousands of cops do all the time, he just got filmed. his murderous racism is not special or unique. he is not special or unique. his crimes are not special or unique. this is standard and he should not be treated like an exception, that lets the entire rest of the system off.

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.
i feel like that joke was simply "lol this man is also fat" and you're being too generous tbh

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

Macdeo Lurjtux posted:

The below the line crew on Spider-Man took up a collection and offered Joe Mangienello $500 to accidentally knock him up

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

Macdeo Lurjtux posted:

I googled around a bit, a transwoman is one of the lead writers and they've created an original character that's a transman and cast an actual transman in the role. So it seems like they recognize that understanding of gender has changed in the last 20 years and are approaching it with their heart in the right place.

trans is an adjective. a woman can be a trans woman. a man can be a trans man. it is not an issue of there being women and transwomen, men and transmen: trans women are women, trans men are men, trans is an adjective, thank you for your time.

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

hard counter posted:

if the trans community heavily leans towards one form
we do and you should have just shut the gently caress up right here. i'm not reading your goddamn linguistic-theorizing bullshit. just respect the loving usage.

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.
And if you say it the way you suggest people argue that that is nonsensical and basically there is no way for a trans person to exist or speak without somebody questioning them like an rear end in a top hat, just like you just did and are currently continuing to do. shut the gently caress up and LISTEN.

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.
gonna write paragraph upon paragraph of rambling justification of calling gay people gayboy because english is germanic but I'm not a bigot y'all

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

Pastry of the Year posted:

This whole "being mad for the sake of getting to take virtuous shots in" thing
um i am getting mad very genuinely because this affects my actual personal life, thanks for accusibg me of doing it performatively!!! very cool!

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.
oh just say "gently caress you" and probate me then. For gently caress's sake, what an assholish response.

(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.
yeah no i love jjba but i could not justify this nor could i in good faith ever recommend it to others. it really is just utterly bizarre. it is like metal gear solid in that straightforward explanations of the things that happen in it sound like fake or exaggerated meme versions, and also in that it is Quite Problematic. hell i say i "love" it but i don't love huge parts of it and major things about it, it is THAT kind of "i love that media." if you noped out due to the misogyny you spared yourself the goddamn loving Admirable Nazi character, for instance!

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

MadDogMike posted:

(powerful men, at least; women are just things to be seduced not seduce themselves).


on the contrary, the medieval European view was that women were the seducers because women are massively lustful, their wild horniness constantly corrupting innocent men who would totally have been celibate if women weren't constantly demanding sex

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.
disco was nonwhite and also gay and that's why it had to be publicly hated and destroyed as an American national pastime for decades after it was actually relevant

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.
"Crap" is probably the worst word Mormons are allowed to say

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

Blood Nightmaster posted:

I don't think E.L. James is Mormon, that would be Stephenie Meyer (the one who actually wrote Twilight/was later used as a basis for Fifty Shades)

I feel like the large amount of craps are due to her just trying and failing to Americanize things?? Like if somebody born and raised in the US tried to write a novel based in the UK and assumed the best way to get that across was if every character interjected with a "bloody [x]!" every two minutes

lmao i was this many minutes old when i realized those are not the same person/not by the same author, my bad

InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

Torquemada posted:

By all accounts he was hit hardest by Freddie’s death, and turned himself into the group’s accountant after he retired in the mid-90’s.

something about this phrasing made me picture him turning himself into an accountant by tapping himself with his magic wand, like that duel between merlin and the witch in the disney sword in the stone

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InediblePenguin
Sep 27, 2004

I'm strong. And a giant penguin. Please don't eat me. No, really. Don't try.

SiKboy posted:

Honestly though, I kind of feel like his friends and bandmates are in a better position to judge what Freddie would have wanted than I, a random fan of his who never met him, am.

ok but like if freddie literally expressed what he wanted and then they did something else so that it would make them money, which is what it sounds like, i think that's lovely. just because "they knew him" doesn't mean they are going to do what's right when he's no longer around instead of doing what makes them more money, that's very rare in human beings actually

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