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darnon
Nov 8, 2009


There potentially is some hope for the ban states in the House submitted by one of the WNY representatives.

HR 3576

Wishful thinking, perhaps, but it'd potentially kill any AWBs (excepting pistols), mag bans, and even allow SBR/SBSes.

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Craptacular
Jul 11, 2004



darnon posted:

There potentially is some hope for the ban states in the House submitted by one of the WNY representatives.

HR 3576

Wishful thinking, perhaps, but it'd potentially kill any AWBs (excepting pistols), mag bans, and even allow SBR/SBSes.

Highly wishful thinking. If Congress is dragging their feet on national CCW reciprocity, then I don't see them passing this anytime soon. Even if it did pass it would require that the feds enforce the law and prosecute any NY State Attorney who enforced state law which conflicted with the new federal law. The feds might enforce the law under some presidents but almost certainly wouldn't enforce it under others. And because it would just be a couple states affected, there wouldn't be nearly as many people protesting if the feds didn't enforce it, unlike national CCW reciprocity. Of course this is all after years of legal battles where the law would likely have an injunction against enforcement during the court case.

That said, it's a good thing because it takes the battle to the antigunners istead of waiting for their next proposed ban and just responding to it.

It would also be fun to see someone in NY register something like an 80% 1911 or Glock receiver as an SBR. Then when they make the gun, just not attach a shoulder stock, mostly nullifying the fact that pistols aren't included in the law.

frunksock
Feb 21, 2002



darnon posted:

There potentially is some hope for the ban states in the House submitted by one of the WNY representatives.

HR 3576

Wishful thinking, perhaps, but it'd potentially kill any AWBs (excepting pistols), mag bans, and even allow SBR/SBSes.

We were chatting about this in the California thread:

joat mon posted:

Federal preemption is the broad term for the can of worms that this opens up.
Just as the Civil Rights Act of 1964 expanded people's rights where some states had abridged those rights, a Second Amendment Civil Rights Act could do the same thing, if enacted into law.

The Chris Collins bill has been filed as HR 3576. It feels like a red meat/vanity bill. There are no cosponsors, not concomitant Senate bill, an attorney fee provision, and the text has none of the hallmarks of a bill intended for passage (the most telling being a lack of any language addressing the preemption issue and no legislative intent to guide the resolution of the inevitable preemption issues)

Pursesnatcher
Oct 23, 2016



Grimey Drawer

Today Norway, not being part of the EU but absolutely hellbent on being first past the post with EU directives anyway, had the first draft of a brand new gun law served to its public. This should be interesting to other eurogunners, as it is (afaik) the first attempt to implement-ish the so-called EU gun ban.

Most of the draft is mainly just codifying current practice as law. Gun safes remain mandatory, and background checks are formalized and expanded. The threshold for refusing a permit is lowered, but should still not be a problem for most law-abiding citizens, as long as they don't cavort with criminal elements. A requirement of getting a doctor's certificate of a clean bill of health, while initially proposed, did not make it into the actual draft. Same goes for the proposed requirement of getting a permit to own deactivated firearms. However, it seems deactivated firearms will have to be registered with the authorities; upon registration, the police will then be able to refuse registration and thus prevent undesirable elements from owning such things.

On the more controversial points, the draft is kind of a win. There were two initial propositions. 1: Total ban on all pistol mags holding more than 18 rounds, as well as all detachable rifle mags, and all rifles holding more than 6 rounds total internally. 2: (And this is somehow crazier still) All rifle mags holding 10 rounds or more, and all pistol mags holding 20 rounds or more, to be subject to registration, and requiring a separate, specific permit to hold. None of these made it to the actual draft. What we got instead was a blanket ban on semi-auto rifles originally designed as fully automatics and/or for military or police use (this includes things like the HK MR556). However, exceptions will be made for certain collectors and competition shooters meeting as-of-yet unspecified requirements. To top this off, the ban will be retroactive, and current owners who are unable to meet said requirements will have a three year grace period to get rid of them. With luck, however, the as-of-yet unspecified requirements will simply mimic the current requirements you de facto have to meet for purchase. Right now, you'll need to be an active competition shooter for a minimum of 24 months, meeting a minimum level of activity, before the shooting association will give you the recommendation you need to apply for a permit. So far, for Norwegians, things don't seem like they'll change too much.

However, the prime minister did go on TV to declare that the draft would ban all semi-automatic handguns and rifles, and that you don't need more than 5 rounds in a rifle to hunt anyway. So there's that.

Meanwhile in the EU proper, the Czech Republic is taking the whole gun ban to court for being dumb, unconstitutional, and maybe even a little bit communist.

Edit: Before anyone asks, yes, I did just call a blanket ban on semi-auto rifles "kind of a win".

Pursesnatcher fucked around with this message at 19:10 on Sep 1, 2017

BeAuMaN
Feb 18, 2014

I'M A LEAD FARMER, MOTHERFUCKER!


My goondolences. As a Californian, I wish you the best against these laws, as we already have bans on mags larger than 10 rounds on both rifles and handguns. As a side note, we have a limitation that you can only buy one handgun per month. Recently a law was being pushed through that would make that limitation apply to -all- firearms, so you could only buy one firearm a month, but that got amended out the other day, so at least we got some sort of win.

Probably should do a general overview of California gun laws in this thread, but it's sometimes hard not to go into the weeds since they're so draconian.

Edit: Here have some flow charts (Which are now out of date, given the new Assault Weapon law and regs)
Rifles: http://www.calguns.net/caawid/flowchart.pdf
Handguns: http://www.calguns.net/caawid/hgflowchart.pdf
Shotguns: http://www.calguns.net/caawid/sgflowchart.pdf

BeAuMaN fucked around with this message at 00:32 on Sep 3, 2017

Craptacular
Jul 11, 2004



BeAuMaN posted:

Probably should do a general overview of California gun laws in this thread, but it's sometimes hard not to go into the weeds since they're so draconian.

Do it. This flowchart to determine if a rifle is Cali-legal is bad enough.

BeAuMaN
Feb 18, 2014

I'M A LEAD FARMER, MOTHERFUCKER!


hahaha you went for the same thing I was thought to edit back in. Flow Charts: A Life in California.

Edit: I have to ask... concerning the Czech's demand for protection of personal ownership of firearms... I did read that history on Jan Zizka, and how the Hussite wars had the peasantry successfully defeat fully armored knights with wagons, guns, crossbows, and flails. Is this perchance part of their cultural reasons for enshrining gun ownership?

BeAuMaN fucked around with this message at 00:54 on Sep 3, 2017

Miso Beno
Apr 29, 2004


Tryin' to catch me ridin' dirty


Fun Shoe

I kept waiting for the punchline hidden in that flowchart. I guess being a Californian gun owner is the punch line.

frunksock
Feb 21, 2002



The punchline is that those flowcharts are actually way simpler than how things are now, which may no longer even been expressible in flowchart form.

this is my attempt at tricking BeAuMan into updating them.

BeAuMaN
Feb 18, 2014

I'M A LEAD FARMER, MOTHERFUCKER!


frunksock posted:

this is my attempt at tricking BeAuMan into updating them.

hahahahahahahahahahaha...
...


...though to be honest, I don't think we're at a point where we can do a new flow chart yet... the dust still hasn't settled. For rifles and shotguns you'd just add after the bullet button question "Did you buy it before 1/1/2017?" "Yes -> Register it before 6/30/2018 (or whatever the new deadline is)" "No -> illegal CA Penal code blah blah". There were a lot of new definitions in the AW Reg law... but interestingly one of the only silver linings is that the definitions only apply to 30900 (The registration law)... however in the initial draft they originally going to apply them to 30515, which has the general definitions for what is and isn't an assault weapon... so the scope of those new definitions will only be limited for registration.

Getting into that, for non-Californians... this is what ARs are going to look like I imagine (as this seems to be the most palatable post-ban product so far):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h69CU84eDl4

That's right. California is going back to stripper clips into fixed magazines.

Shima Honnou
Dec 1, 2010

The Once And Future King Of Dicetroit



College Slice

That's neat and it's nice to see John Goodman being active but the fact that it's something borne out of necessity instead of fun is just, man. Glad I don't live in California.

darnon
Nov 8, 2009


It would have been nice if they had designed those so you could pop a stripper clip of 10 in to charge. As it is you'd need multiples of those things already loaded. That adds up in cost pretty quick considering they cost about 3x as much as a common AR mag.

madeintaipei
Jul 13, 2012



BeAuMaN posted:

Edit: I have to ask... concerning the Czech's demand for protection of personal ownership of firearms... I did read that history on Jan Zizka, and how the Hussite wars had the peasantry successfully defeat fully armored knights with wagons, guns, crossbows, and flails. Is this perchance part of their cultural reasons for enshrining gun ownership?

A couple of invasions flollowed by occupations in living memory probably has a little to do with it. Big, powerful neighbors makes a people wary. Hell, the majority of the Czech part of my family emigrated from Jihlava/Ilgau in '68.

NickBlasta
May 16, 2003

Clearly their proficiency at shooting is supernatural, not practical, in origin.


It's kind of weird but this thread really reads just like a European NRA email.

BeAuMaN
Feb 18, 2014

I'M A LEAD FARMER, MOTHERFUCKER!


NickBlasta posted:

It's kind of weird but this thread really reads just like a European NRA email.

I couldn't even begin to imagine what a European NRA mail would look like. Someone from Europe please post a link to one.

~Coxy
Dec 9, 2003

R.I.P. Inter-OS Sass - b.2000AD d.2003AD

Look at this police cadet looking all serious holding a medium-format camera.
(2017 AU gun amnesty)

Im Ready for DEATH
Oct 5, 2016



Why did they let that child put on cop uniform

MrTuffPaws
Feb 7, 2005



~Coxy posted:

Look at this police cadet looking all serious holding a medium-format camera.
(2017 AU gun amnesty)



Camera guns. An excellent excuse to shoot combat photographers.

The reporter in Max Headroom used one on the show.

Dogbrisket
Jun 10, 2009



~Coxy posted:

Look at this police cadet looking all serious holding a medium-format camera.
(2017 AU gun amnesty)



Too bad it's not a real gun because that cop is in dire need of some arms.

Sten Freak
Sep 10, 2008

Despite all of these shortcomings, the Sten still has a long track record of shooting people right in the face.


College Slice

The one picture this article shows from the amnesty has some nice milsurp in it.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-41196637

Pursesnatcher
Oct 23, 2016



Grimey Drawer

Sten Freak posted:

The one picture this article shows from the amnesty has some nice milsurp in it.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-41196637



It saddens me to think that those lovely little things have since turned into slag.

BeAuMaN posted:

I couldn't even begin to imagine what a European NRA mail would look like. Someone from Europe please post a link to one.

I wish we had an NRA, things might have been different. Latest developments is that, after the worst parts of the gun ban failed to pass, the EU instantly set out drafting an ammunition ban instead. Right now they're gathering feedback from the public, a process which will end this December.

"You may keep your guns, but good luck feeding them".

BeAuMaN
Feb 18, 2014

I'M A LEAD FARMER, MOTHERFUCKER!


My goondolences. They recently passed Ammo Background Checks in California last year, and they'll be going into effect.... starting next year? Background check fees, no more ammo shipped to your house... there's some exceptions that many of us will be taking advantage of (like C&R/FFL03 with CA CoE) but that will require cooperative businesses.

Have you considered reloading? Or is that going to fall into the new regs as well? Granted you should fight this all the way since once they limit you to reloading you'll be a smaller demographic to regulate into non-existence, but it's an alternative.

BeAuMaN fucked around with this message at 02:34 on Sep 10, 2017

MrTuffPaws
Feb 7, 2005



BeAuMaN posted:

My goondolences. They recently passed Ammo Background Checks in California last year, and they'll be going into effect.... starting next year? Background check fees, no more ammo shipped to your house... there's some exceptions that many of us will be taking advantage of (like C&R/FFL03 with CA CoE) but that will require cooperative businesses.

Have you considered reloading? Or is that going to fall into the new regs as well? Granted you should fight this all the way since once they limit you to reloading you'll be a smaller demographic to regulate into non-existence, but it's an alternative.

Nevada is just a car drive away from much of California.

BeAuMaN
Feb 18, 2014

I'M A LEAD FARMER, MOTHERFUCKER!


MrTuffPaws posted:

Nevada is just a car drive away from much of California.

I mean, yes, but also technically illegal with the new ammo background check laws, with few -very slim- exceptions.

MrTuffPaws
Feb 7, 2005



BeAuMaN posted:

I mean, yes, but also technically illegal with the new ammo background check laws, with few -very slim- exceptions.

Pursesnatcher
Oct 23, 2016



Grimey Drawer

BeAuMaN posted:

Have you considered reloading? Or is that going to fall into the new regs as well? Granted you should fight this all the way since once they limit you to reloading you'll be a smaller demographic to regulate into non-existence, but it's an alternative.

Reloading is pretty widespread, but they're being proper sneaky this time. Instead of an outright ban on ammunition, they're trying to ban lead shot, followed by lead bullets. "It's for the environment, you see - and your health!".

Miso Beno
Apr 29, 2004


Tryin' to catch me ridin' dirty


Fun Shoe

but you see there's no safe lead exposure levels

ROHS electronics kinda blow chunks

wait a minute honey
May 12, 2006


So if Australia's gun laws couldn't get any more retarded, the Desert Tactical Arms series of BOLT-action firearms have being banned because of 'Military Appearance'

The NSW government's very own 'firearm experts' have determined that:

Enquiries were made of the Firearms Registry in regards to the Desert Tech (previously known as DTA or Desert Tactical Arms) and the various models. As such, a determination was made by our firearm experts which deemed it to be a prohibited firearm as per item 7, schedule 1 prohibited firearms in the Firearms Act 1996.
7 Any firearm that substantially duplicates in appearance (regardless of calibre or manner of operation) a firearm referred to in item 1, 5 or 6.
(1 Any machine gun, sub-machine gun or other firearm capable of propelling projectiles in rapid succession during one pressure of the trigger.
5 Any self-loading centre-fire rifle of a kind that is designed or adapted for military purposes.
6 Any self-loading shotgun of a kind that is designed or adapted for military purposes.


EDIT:People are saying the government says it replicates the QBU-88!

I'm so happy I moved to NZ

wait a minute honey fucked around with this message at 08:15 on Sep 11, 2017

fatman
Oct 20, 2005

"I DON'T WANT A RIOTING SCUMBAG AS A NEIGHBOUR"? WELL I DON'T WANT A FUCKWIT GUN NUT AS A POSTER


wait a minute honey posted:

So if Australia's gun laws couldn't get any more retarded, the Desert Tactical Arms series of BOLT-action firearms have being banned because of 'Military Appearance'

The NSW government's very own 'firearm experts' have determined that:

Enquiries were made of the Firearms Registry in regards to the Desert Tech (previously known as DTA or Desert Tactical Arms) and the various models. As such, a determination was made by our firearm experts which deemed it to be a prohibited firearm as per item 7, schedule 1 prohibited firearms in the Firearms Act 1996.
7 Any firearm that substantially duplicates in appearance (regardless of calibre or manner of operation) a firearm referred to in item 1, 5 or 6.
(1 Any machine gun, sub-machine gun or other firearm capable of propelling projectiles in rapid succession during one pressure of the trigger.
5 Any self-loading centre-fire rifle of a kind that is designed or adapted for military purposes.
6 Any self-loading shotgun of a kind that is designed or adapted for military purposes.


EDIT:People are saying the government says it replicates the QBU-88!

I'm so happy I moved to NZ

Lets not forget my favorite of a pump action shotgun being a cat c, and yet a pump action rifle a cat b

TheAsterite
Dec 31, 2008


Thanks Maryland for guiding my hand into a Scar 17 purchase because the cool .308 battle rifles like the FAL and M1A are banned.

(Yes I know I could still get an AR 10 )

A.o.D.
Jan 15, 2006

The Suffering of the Succotash.


TheAsterite posted:

Thanks Maryland for guiding my hand into a Scar 17 purchase because the cool .308 battle rifles like the FAL and M1A are banned.

(Yes I know I could still get an AR 10 )

That makes zero sense. How is a SCAR or an ar10 fine but a FAL or an M1A bad? What is the language on the laws banning that like?

TheAsterite
Dec 31, 2008


A.o.D. posted:

That makes zero sense. How is a SCAR or an ar10 fine but a FAL or an M1A bad? What is the language on the laws banning that like?

They went the named ban route: http://mdsp.maryland.gov/Organization/Pages/CriminalInvestigationBureau/LicensingDivision/Firearms/FirearmSearch.aspx

A.o.D.
Jan 15, 2006

The Suffering of the Succotash.


I just can't.

Warbadger
Jun 17, 2006


A.o.D. posted:

That makes zero sense. How is a SCAR or an ar10 fine but a FAL or an M1A bad? What is the language on the laws banning that like?

Probably wasn't in the picture book or advertisements they flipped through to pick out scary looking guns from.

Alternatively it was, but wasn't painted black.

TheAsterite
Dec 31, 2008


A.o.D. posted:

I just can't.

What's interesting is that they banned the AR 15 and all copycats except for the Colt AR-15 Sporter H-BAR rifle. So under the general copycat rules, you can build/purchase any AR 15 as long as it is advertised or marked as a heavy barrel.

Edit: Also interesting is they banned all AK 47 and copies, but since the VZ 58 has no interchangeable parts with the AK, the VZ is also legal.

TheAsterite fucked around with this message at 17:51 on Sep 13, 2017

MrTuffPaws
Feb 7, 2005




What defines a copy? In California is by make and model, so a IZ Saiga is banned but a RAA Saiga is legal, or at least it used to be before the most recent rollout of gun laws.

astropika
Jul 5, 2007
no, not really

MrTuffPaws posted:

What defines a copy? In California is by make and model, so a IZ Saiga is banned but a RAA Saiga is legal, or at least it used to be before the most recent rollout of gun laws.

They actually tried to ban by "series" in California, the AK and AR "series" which was held to mean anything similar, this was in response to off-list lowers, but it got nullified by Harrott v. County of Kings in 2001 which said they had to name all members of the 'series' for it to be prosecutable.

astropika fucked around with this message at 05:59 on Sep 14, 2017

Miso Beno
Apr 29, 2004


Tryin' to catch me ridin' dirty


Fun Shoe

Gun laws are a mess.

Morshu
Sep 30, 2009

Attack monkey! Monkey attack!


TheAsterite posted:

Edit: Also interesting is they banned all AK 47 and copies, but since the VZ 58 has no interchangeable parts with the AK, the VZ is also legal.

Not only that, but there are several AK74s that you can buy in MD. The law specifically states 47s are banned, and since the 74s use different barrels, bolts, etc. they're legal. I'm in MD and picked up a SLR104 krink a week ago. Our gun laws are really dumb right now...

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Shima Honnou
Dec 1, 2010

The Once And Future King Of Dicetroit



College Slice

Miso Beno posted:

Gun laws are a mess.

I'm still waiting on my Big Book of Shitlaws that the ATF was supposed to send me with my C&R.

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