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LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

It really didn't help that literally every joke was in a trailer, but I thought it was fine. Give it a couple seasons to grow its beard.

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LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Rhyno posted:

Well Worf was security so I figured maybe it was girl with poorly defined super abilities.
How were they poorly defined? Her planet's gravity is way more hardcore than ours, so she's super strong.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

At least the joke was from back when he was still involved with the show and it was funny.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Accretionist posted:

I agree, it's over the top. Adding physics is the only way I'd be happy be with it. I mean, you'd need the mass of a wrecking ball to knock out a vault door by running into it.
:goonsay:

I've been here fifteen years and that is my first Goonsay.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Zebulon posted:

He's promoted to Captain partway through the series, and is given command of the U.S.S. Defiant in addition to being in charge of DS9. So he was a Captain, and was Captain of the Defiant.
Sure, but the show even pointed out that Dax, who wasn't a captain, would be called Captain when she was in charge of the Defiant.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Baronjutter posted:

The British can not complain about the humour in Orville after continuing to make more Red Dwarf after season 6.
You bite your tongue!

I mean, yeah, Series 1 and 2 are my favorite and it was different show after that that yet again lost quality when Rob Grant left, but I still loves me some Red Dwarf.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

After The War posted:

You are obviously insane, because Robert Llewellyn perfected the series. (And Isaac's cadence sounds closer to Kryten than Data to my ears.)
I like Kryten okay, but I miss Holly.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Mokinokaro posted:

It's Insurrection for me.

And it's not that Insurrection is HORRIBLE. It just really feels like an extended, and overbudgeted episode outside of that dumb dune buggy scene.
That was Nemesis. Dune Buggy was Nemesis.

Also, I totally get not wanting to watch a serial killer review movies and be terrible about women, but portrayal isn't condoning. Mr. Plinkett is not a hero. He's the villain of those reviews. It's like watching Silence of the Lambs and thinking it approves of eating people.

That being said, no narrative project RLM has ever produced has ever featured a woman with a job outside of sex work, so... yeah. Big fan, but they've got problems.

They weirdly poo poo on labor unions sometimes, for instance.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Bury your gays is a thing. Star Trek did it and I'm sick of it.

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BuryYourGays

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Cojawfee posted:

Oh TVTropes, it must be bad then.
It's bad because I'm sick of every queer person dying in loving everything ever. TV tropes just popularized the name for that.

I don't have to like it, and I don't. You don't need to explain to me why I should like it. I don't. And I'm not going to start because you articulated why it didn't bother you.

I'm sick of all of my representation in media getting loving killed. And I'm not going to stop being sick of it because you have an air-tight reason why it was okay this time. Because it's always okay, this time and you shouldn't be offended this time, because this time it's okay. But people say that every time.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

R-Type posted:

I for one sincerely hope that everyone that gets triggered by this stuff continues to trigger in an accellerating loop until they explode into a cloud of glitter
Making fun of people with PTSD is super fun, guys! Anybody who cares about anything is a square! Cynicism is the only way! Vote Libertarian!

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

counterfeitsaint posted:

Being mad about fictional gay people on TV and talking about it on the internet, that's like, textbook PTSD.

Like if you looked up PTSD in some kind of psychology book, there would probably be a picture of a guy furiously typing at a keyboard while frowning, and there's a TV slightly out of focus in the background.
Koalas got it.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Epicurius posted:

A much more patient, less inflammatory explanation of how LividLiquid also feels about the matter.
Thank you for that.

PaybackJack posted:

I guess you get more clicks if you scream about the outrage of a gay character getting killed than the medicore writing, warp speeding through plot twists and shallow characters.
You, and several others, are in the business of telling a queer person that them not liking that queer people always end up dead in fiction isn't okay, and that I should feel differently, and I just don't see how you justify that in your head.

What kind of person cannot stand the fact that I don't like a thing that always happens in fiction so badly as to move the goalposts all the way to "well you should only complain about the things I don't like."

It's deranged. It's demented. I'm allowed to not like a thing. I'm allowed to say I don't like a thing. But every time I do, there are a hundred people like you telling me that not only must I like the thing, but that my problem with it is somehow made-up.

And why do I give a poo poo what TV does with queer people? Because we get loving murdered for being ourselves, often, and people loving watch TV.

But take all that baggage, and throw it out of the equation. Take the fact that trans people are being actively drummed out of the military again and that this administration is openly hostile to queer people, and that for the first time since people started surveying this poo poo, Americans are more suspicious and afraid of queer people this year than last year and that the trend of our eventual acceptance into society at large now seems to be reversing itself and I just want to escape all that and watch sci-fi and not be reminded of it.

Take all of that away, and I am still allowed to not like a thing I saw on TV. You don't need to talk me out of not liking it.

And I'm getting clicks by posting on Something Awful? Do you know how insane you sound? That everybody who disagrees with you is doing it for money? I don't argue with people like you to change you. There is no changing you. I argue with you because people are witnessing it, and your lovely opinion about why it's okay to kill all the gay people on TV and in movies shouldn't go unanswered for all of them. It is exhausting, frustrating, and nobody's idea of a good time, and I'm sure as poo poo not doing it for clicks.

Y'know how this also could've gone?

"Bury your gays is a thing and Star Trek did it and I hated it." "Huh. Fair enough."

And then right now I could be talking about things I like about The Orville instead.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Brawnfire posted:

Does it work that way? Does old music become classical?
I mean, people are calling Weezer classic rock now, so yes.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Farmer Crack-rear end posted:

He made an oblique reference on Twitter to the fact that he sexually harassed a writer off of his TV show, said writer called him out on it and told him to loving own up to what he did, he petulantly refused and insisted that she go through the emotional trial of recounting the story before he accepted (or, potentially rejected!) her account of events.
I watched this whole thing unfold and almost the opposite of everything you said happened.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

muscles like this! posted:

Just a reminder that this is a thread for a comedy TV show, not exactly the place for politics.
First of all, this show is Star Trek with the serial number filed off. Second, Star Trek has always been political. Third, ignoring crises is more political than talking about them and silencing those who would talk about them even more so.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Red Dwarf, maybe? Doctor Who?

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Son of Sam-I-Am posted:

lol, don't make me laugh. The new Doctor Who very nearly made me retroactively dislike the original, and I loved the original.
I respect that you feel this way, but you have to realize it's a minority opinion, right? Doctor Who has never been more popular than during the reboot.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Nichael posted:

Did Bortus' kid age super fast or something?
We don't know how quickly Moklans mature, and I suspect the writers want to get to the Bortus and Klyden made the wrong choice for their kid's gender without waiting for twelve years.

Lotta' gross dudes bein' gross in this episode and the proper response to "you requisitioned a shuttle to be a peeping loving tom at best and stalking at worst" is "I'm reporting you to the authorities."

Seems society still has an "oh, boys will be boys" attitude toward loving horrifying behaviors, and I don't doubt that's because Seth is one of those dudes who's on the right side of so many things so he's got a blind spot for that stuff.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

The stalking for love trope is incredibly pervasive in fiction and it gives comfort to those who are engaging in a horrifying practice.

Driving by somebody's house and seeing a dude's car in their driveway is often shown in media, yes, as a gag, as is ducking your head down when your ex sees you.

Shows, including this one, act as if this is somehow cute at best, or benign at worse, but in real life, it is the act of an obsessive demonstrating a profound lack of respect for their ex's autonomy.

It tells your ex that not only are they not entitled to a life without you, but that you are not entitled to feel safe in your own home. This is incredibly common and does not become funny because it's common or regularly portrayed in media. In fact, it being portrayed as cute in media convinces these people that they're Lloyd Dobler. This entitlement to other people, taken to its extreme, ends in murder.

Stranger Things even did the stalking for love thing this season.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Mantis42 posted:

Yea maybe but those tropes resonate because people really are obsessive about people they have emotions for, since that is what love is by definition. Doing a driveby is honestly less bad than what most people will do as teenagers and young adults at one point or another. The joke is is that the Captain should know better and is acting childish. Because its a comedy and you can do things in comedy that aren't appropriate in real life.
Nope. If a horrifying thing is less horrifying than another thing, it doesn't become okay, even if a lot of people have done it or it's played for laughs. I'm the first person to argue that portraying a thing isn't condoning a thing. I loves me some Always Sunny. But the response the show itself had, and the response you've had, are the same:

It's entirely understandable and everybody's done it, but the captain should know better ha ha.

It isn't understandable. Not everybody's done it. Abusers do it. Much like the casual rape episode last season, this was gross and wrong and bad and not all jokes are created equal.

I don't take exception to the thing happening. I take exception to the way it was treated after the fact.

You don't need to defend a show we all like when it does a bad thing. Nobody's saying it's a bad show. It just did a bad thing.

Cockmaster posted:

I couldn't help but notice that the empty quarters where they replicated their booze (which would have likely gone several more days before anyone else set foot in it) would have been a far more discreet place to drink it than a holodeck which would likely be used several times every day.
They had simulator time scheduled, as per their alibi. What's funny is that they could've been drinking in the woods, or in the foothills of Grabthar VII, but they sat in an empty simulator instead.

And while this is probably because this is a bottle episode and you wanna' keep the budget low, it worked as a solid gag.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Accretionist posted:

I think a lot of this is in the tradition of sitcom buffoonery. You're supposed to laugh at it as bad.
Do you understand that treating horrifying behavior as "oh, you," or "boys will be boys" has effects beyond your personal laughter?

Again, the gag was fine. It's the lack of consequences and the reasonable character telling the target of the behavior that it was no big deal I take issue with.

Do you see the difference between these two things?

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Jazerus posted:

ed is a dumb jerk who is extremely bad at all forms of socialization other than starship captaining, and who would be working at space mcdonalds right now if his ex-wife hadn't intervened out of a mixture of pity and respect for his abilities as a captain. his prejudices, lame behavior, and even lamer jokes are not endorsed by the show just because he's played by macfarlane
Yes, and the gang from Always Sunny are terrible alcoholics who are so blinded by their bullshit that it's hilarious to watch them being terrible even they do things ten times worse than this. Do you see the difference between that, and my problem with this?

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Quincyh posted:

Yes, I know it's just this episode, but pushing this kind of behaviour - eh, there's nothing I can add here that hasn't been said already. I just wish TV would stop doing the whole "oh ho ho these boys eh". We're not supposed to think what he's doing is okay, but we are supposed to empathise with him, and I have trouble empathising with someone who is refusing to listen to a drat word his ex says and basically does some light stalking. In combination with all the other stuff the men did and the joke about how saying "calm down" would totally set off any woman because lol, and I just found it irritating.
:same:

And I just wish I could raise my issues with these things without getting a bunch of poo poo for hating fun. I love offensive humor. I don't love shows telling society that being awful is good.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

I started this. I want to point out that I love this show, and this episode. Can I please also point out that treating stalking as a harmless gag is bad without pages of bullshit?

I would very much like to not be having this conversation anymore.

LividLiquid fucked around with this message at 10:58 on Jan 3, 2019

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

I bet replicated BBQ suuuuuuuucks.

Also putting ground beef in chili ruins it. Sausage, ham and chicken, yo. Or steak.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Beachcomber posted:

I watch all tv with captions and they say He.
Captions are done by remote workers making less than minimum wage.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

TheScott2K posted:

It's a shame they didn't name her Chris Devin
Is this an anagram for something?

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

White supremacists have been sneaking that gesture into photos for the last few years to signal to other white supremacists that they're out there.

It's debatable whether it started sincerely or as a hoax, since it's just the OK hand sign, but as these things happen, it's been adopted sincerely.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Gynovore posted:

And yeah, it's generally accepted that Jeri Ryan was brought in for her Space Boobs.
The weirdest quirk of American history is that Jeri Ryan's Space Boobs are responsible for Barack Obama becoming president.

I'm not even joking. That's a thing that happened. Not single-handedly, mind you, but without Jeri Ryan and her Space Boobs, there is no President Barack Obama.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Mercer was really highly-regarded before his divorce, and the crew of The Orville aren't all supposed to be known fuckups. Just Malloy.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Iron Crowned posted:

While I have not personally timed it, 10.6 minutes per hour doesn't sound right. There's a reason that your average hour show is only 42 minutes when drop the ads. I'm guessing that's for paid advertisements, and not say advertisements for other Fox programs, station IDs, or local advertisements and they're still running 18 minutes of ad breaks.

EDIT:

There's no way in hell they can turn a profit with 2 minutes of ads per hour without some trickery, like giving you half a show and forcing you to buy it on some Fox streaming app.
If they can prove that people are more likely to watch the ads if there aren't eighteen loving minutes of them every hour, they can charge a lot more for them. Advertisers know everybody mutes the sound or fast-forwards through time-shifted stuff.

Taear posted:

That's absolutely insane.
Only sort of. Neilsen ratings determine how much they can charge for ads, so ratings determine how much money a show makes them.

Now the ratings themselves? That's a whole other ball of wax.
Terry Crews said Idiocracy got completely dicked over by Fox because they got permission to use all these real brands and then made them all look like poo poo.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

I have a feeling Isaac lied about naming himself after Newton and probably named himself after Asimov.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Snow Cone Capone posted:

Stations of the Crossfit
Seth Rollins?

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Just Chamber posted:

I havent read this thread since the new episode, but i just paused this episode to post here because holy poo poo the fact Ed is like "hey i wont date your younger self (who is really into me and dosent know all my baggage seeing as she's known me for one date) if you say you'll be with me again" is really loving lovely my god.
Sometimes this show is really tone-deaf.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Jazerus posted:

you are not supposed to think that ed is acting reasonably when he says that

like it's pretty clear at this point that the show is very deliberate in showing that ed is really pushy about getting back together, spying on her dates, etc.

ed is tone-deaf, the show isn't
The tone-deaf part isn't that Ed is portrayed as being wrong, it's that the consequences for things like stalking/spying on your ex are never severe enough and he never learns why what he does is wrong.

He's her superior officer, to boot. It's tone-deaf as gently caress. They did an episode whose plot centered around Rob Lowe and rape and played it for laughs. They clearly don't think everything through.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

The Lord Bude posted:

I think you'll find that DS9 had the best opening credits of all the Treks. More importantly, it was the only one that evolved thematically along with the show.
This is a great take, though I still think if Voyager had a good show to go along with its opening titles, it'd be a contender too.

But DS9's theme starting out lonely and somber and then kicking up a notch once the station became really important and Sisko started taking an active role in sector-wide politics was really cool.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Snow Cone Capone posted:

Agreed, but Bortus addresses this head-on in one of the episodes - it's understandable that Klyden has a lot of culture shock, but he's been presented with endless opportunities to learn and integrate with the crew and has denied or rebuffed them all.
Why's it on him to assimilate and not the crew?

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Iron Crowned posted:

I find it amusing that Fox Sunday nights are 2.5 zombie series with a revolving door for the 4th.

Also :lol: that they seem to be attempting to make The Moodys a holiday tradition
What's the .5?

mllaneza posted:

It's even better than Lower Decks, but by a significantly narrower margin - LDS is a legit good show.
What's LDS?

I'm very out of the loop, evidently.

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LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Iron Crowned posted:

Bob's Burgers, I haven't watched it in a few years but I hear it's still alright.
Yeah, it's still quite good. My favorite animated comedy still.

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