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EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
Seems interesting.

100 million locations to get maps from seems a bit huge (then again it is a universe) so I hope you start small and then scale it up because it's rather easy to get tired of the sheer size of things when what you mainly want to do is follow some breadcrumbs, since those are typically big 'SOMETHING INTERESTING IS HERE' beacons.

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EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Elentor posted:

Yeah, I'm not thinking purely of numbers at this point. 100m locations seem huge but I want to concentrate on a smaller experience, and you'll end up being taken to some places more than others. So think of 100m quadrants as a 10k x 10k tile map rather than a vast infinite universe. There are 2D MMOs that fall within that range.

That's a lot more digestible than what I thought you were going for because yeah, having each quadrant be a tile makes a lot more sense. The way you described it in the OP had me thinking that the Quadrant was the smallest tile map containing the individual tiles that you actually 'walked' around on.

Also having the random encounter table essentially be shmup layouts but with backgrounds relevant to what you're actually walking around sounds neat :v:

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
gently caress Quaternions, every time I think of a 3d game idea I run into them and it's like 'THIS IS YOUR BRICK WALL ONLY THE BRICKS ARE MADE OF EVEN MORE BRICKS THAT ROTATE AND TRANSLATE ON A PLANE OF DO NOT PASS'

EponymousMrYar fucked around with this message at 23:56 on Aug 24, 2017

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Elentor posted:

Do you think I should have gone into more detail about it? Or separated better the low level from the high level stuff. The main thrust of the chapter indeed is the lower level stuff but I think it was worth the mention that it's not just the lower level stuff, and that it can be arbitrarily modified.

One thing you should say more on is why entropy is important to the RNG. You mention it (and low/high entropy) but you don't cliffnote why it's important (or why high entropy is good and low entropy is bad.)

RNG protection totally deserves a spot though because a lot of procedural content games have a problem of leaning too heavily on the RNG, forgetting the lesson of Murphy's law (if something bad can happen, it will) and it's first corollary (just because something bad happened doesn't mean something worse won't.)

I spent 8 real life hours in FFXIV trying for an RNG drop once :suicide: (Atma farm in it's first iteration. Freaking Atma of the Ram.)
Good thing they learned from that!

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
Playing with AI behaviors is fun for the crazy things that happen when you throw stuff at the wall to see if it sticks (like the Unholy abomination shown.)


Elentor posted:

Here's something unrelated, but pretty neat:

https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1998012

A bug on Path of Exile's procedural level generation rendered the entire map unwalkable because it reversed the walkable with the unwalkable areas. Pretty short, but nice read.

This reminds me of my first ever programming snafu (that I found hilarious:) a basic 'underline all instances of a string from another static string' program in C++, only because I forgot a ; I ended up replacing the stuff to be underlined with just the underlines.

Those mistakes never stop happening, even when it takes a particular edge case to trigger an oversight :allears:

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
Oh boy, bugs tied to one thing despite not actually being referenced!

You should see if vertical ships have the same problem (having them come in from the side for example.)

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
3: Improve Ship Generator.

The more you look at it, the better it'll be (and the more bugs you'll squash along the way!)

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
Random crazy 80s/90s tech name suggestions I pulled out of my head just now (mostly to fuel the 'throw something out and see if it sticks' mode of thought):
Macrotech,
Particle Solutions (Partisol?) :argh:
Electromite (Electron Dynamite :v:)
DynAccel (Dynamic Acceleration) Could also go with Acceldyne or Acedyne.
Gravible (Gravity Variable :v:)
Omnidyne (taken) Omnisol (taken) Omnimite (All dynamite :black101: )

Also it makes thematic sense for the Blood Tribe to be out in the weird with their gimmick. 'If it bleeds we can kill it' indeed!

CrazySalamander posted:

I think it would be better word choice to say "Your sky is dead" instead of "The sky is dead" because the latter sounds like an empty starless sky. Interesting concepts though!

Or 'That sky is dead.'

EponymousMrYar fucked around with this message at 03:11 on Oct 26, 2017

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Elentor posted:

These are pretty good names. When you say taken, do you mean the other ones are actually unused?
Yeah, I did a quick google to make sure that said thought-up name wasn't actually the name of a company in use.

Macrotech and Particle Solutions are also taken by that metric (being the first ones I forgot to check :v:)

Electromite and Dynaccel are a bit iffy. Electromite could use a few more permutations (Tromite? Maybe. Dynetron? Dangit taken :argh:)
Acceldyne and Acedyne are fine although Acedyne might be someone's name?

Gravible and Omnimite are indeed unused.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
Meanwhile, I've totally taken some of your ideas about organization and getting ideas down coherently for my own projects.

Spreadsheets. What a novel idea :thumbsup:

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Elentor posted:

Some games are almost entirely played through the interface. Some games are just interfaces. On RPG games, the interface hooks up to a huge amount of elements from the internal combat mechanism.

Since my game has such a heavy amount of RPG elements, I quickly found out that to be the case. As soon as I started working on the interface my thought was "holy moly, there's a lot of things missing". Some of which is simple stuff, like Item Icons. I just needed to write a hook for it on the database, make a few default icons, 2 minutes of code and done.

I'm going through this just on a conceptual 'obviously I want this which means I'm going to have to have these variables and they're going to have to do this this and this' level at the moment. All of those nice intuitive things that seem like they'd be pretty simple can actually be kind of a pain.

It is helping me figure out some things for combat mechanics and formulas at least!

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

FractalSandwich posted:

What kind of game are you making where you don't pre-design or persist any data about these areas at all, including a single int32 to remember them by, but still want to go back to them later?

A lot of games that followed the Procedural Generation hype relied overly much on it, to the point where most of their pre-design was 'set up some rules and let the game build itself.'

Very few of those games actually stuck to the landing and got out of Early Access hell because they had thought farther than 'procedural generate EVERYTHING!'

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

biosterous posted:

I'd like to maybe see some colour randomization, just to see what garish combinations the generator could come up with. And who knows, you might stumble into a nice new colour scheme for one of the factions!

At least on a conceptual level. You'd probably get a whole lot of crazy eyesores but some of them could be just crazy enough to work!

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
Regarding distinction between panels, the second example is probably the best but the biggest eye-glazing issue is that the foreground and background colors blend in a bit. Maybe have the beige header and footer follow the item rarity colors?

Regarding fluff the 'general description' followed by 'personal account' is perfectly fine, not only does it develop the universe fluff it also develops the main character a bit too. You can stick all sorts of hints in there, from past dealings to 'behind the scenes' mentions to irritable snark.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
Ahhhh hahahaha.

Fix one thing, break two others :suicide:

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
Custom animations on a model and the polish added just make me want to scream "IT'S ALIIIIIVE!"

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
Being mostly Game Design stuff is something that limits audience participation because it's one thing to talk about and dissect game design from a finished product (in addition to 'man when I played this this thing happened and it was wicked,) it's another to watch it in action and see a game come together from that.

Feldherren posted:

I dabble in game design, but you've actually produced something so that puts you quite ahead of me. Unless I see something obvious to point out, I generally think you know better what you're doing than I do; it's your game, after all. So far it's all been pretty interesting to me, and the problem-solving is something I can appreciate both as a programmer in my actual job and regarding that dabbling of mine.

That doesn't stop me from throwing out comments just to try and keep things moving :v:
Although I'm also learning from what Elentor's posting. It's about time for me to buckle down and really look at Blender to make some prototype assets to drop into Unity.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
My gut says there's probably some delay happening with it, maybe with drawing. Might be because something wigs out when having to draw so many bullets. Try amping up the +projectile to something inane for test purposes and see what happens.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
My own idea-factory for new stuff is getting tied up in my own planning, so I'll just throw some flavorful descriptions onto the pile.

W Machine Gun
Description: An incredibly fast-firing machine gun that shoots gravity-compacted detritus as it's projectiles. Popular among the Independants for how utterly inexpensive it is. You don't remember what the W stands for, just that it was long, perforated with crass adjectives and pretty high on the list of problems every Settler has to deal with.

Ostensibly this weapon relies on a supply of ammunition but you've never heard of anyone actually running out of it. At all. You do know many stations are happy to see a spacer with this equipped as they say it allows them an opportunity to offload their unwanted excess. The exact mechanisms of this still escape you however, despite records on your computer which say that you've made such arrangements with many stations in the past.

Matchfire Laser
Description: This laser is little more than an emitter connected directly to the ship's capacitors. Very powerful, but very inefficient. The more energy it has to draw from, the hotter the beam runs. Spacers love how the beam changes color depending on how much juice is in their capacitor.

You remember that the invention of this weapon was based on a popular colonial saying that goes something like this: 'Where there's smoke, there's fire. Where there's fire, there's a match. Where there's a match, there's someone trying to burn down your house and steal your land. So fight fire with fire and light that sucker up.'

Settler's Beer/Ale/Stout
General Description: There is no better example of the Settler's ingenuity than in what they drink. With hard lives and entirely too much work to do every Settler enjoys a home-brewed drink at the end of the day. And if for some reason they can't drink everything that they've brewed they made sure that it'd still be able to do something useful for them.

Beer Description:
Settler's Beer is best enjoyed cold from a chilled bottle, never on ice. Drinker's say that it's flavor peaks when you can swirl the liquid and see a lump of it start to gel together in the middle. When kept cold for too long, the resulting gel is capable of freezing starship hull plating into a brittle mess. The cryogenically frozen case you have is centuries past it's drink by date.

Ale Description:
Settler's Ale is best enjoyed in a tall glass on cold days. Constant swirling of the mixture is preferred in order to keep it together and control the intense burn one feels as it travels down their throat and into their belly. When fully separated and the heavier liquid is exposed to light the resulting thermal reaction is capable of burning through starship-grade structural materials. You make sure to check the integrity of the ages-old bottles you have regularly, in the dark, by touch. Can't be too careful.

Stout Description:
Settler's Stout is an unusual drink first discovered when one colonial somehow managed to distill some dark matter into his brew. Reports say that it has a very inscrutable yet pleasant flavor and that heavy drinkers eventually have their teeth, gums, tongue, esophagus and in exceptional cases, the inner lining of their stomach turn black in appearance. On every single bottle there is a bright, very noticeable warning label that says 'Do Not Expose To Hard Vacuum' accompanied by the standard vacuum-reactive hazard symbol. You can't forget the last idiot who thought that was a joke, no matter how hard you try.

EponymousMrYar fucked around with this message at 01:20 on Feb 12, 2018

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
You'd think that between coding and making assets you'd have a 50/50 workload of each.
When really, 25-33% is going to be coding and the rest is going to be making your assets, polishing them until they shine and look nice and make people go 'that looks/feels nice.'

Hooray for recovery and progress though!

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
When you first mentioned Tilesets I thought this might have been coming.

Starcraft is a pretty good case study on tilesets.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

TooMuchAbstraction posted:

Tyrian and its imitators usually make items resell for the same price you bought them for. Thus you never "lose" money, and your money effectively becomes your power cap / experience level. Between missions you can sell old gear and buy new gear, change your ship around, etc. and figure out what the best loadout is for the amount of money you currently have, without having to worry about wasting anything.

That's the route I'd go with. If you want to be really kind, you can also let players replay old missions so they can grind for money if they want to, but the game should be balanced on the assumption that they don't do this. Like, assume that the player will get 75% of the money in each level, and balance the level difficulty around the kinds of loadouts they can get with that much money. Obviously this is tricky when so much of the game is procedurally-generated; you might need to vary that 75% heuristic based on how much of an outlier a given level is, or put in other bodges to try to keep your estimations on track. But the basic concept should be sound.

If you want to have rare drops, you can make them sell for trivial cash, and give the player an inventory they can store items in, in addition to the slots they can equip items to. That way you can still have the "magic" of "oh cool, I found this weird rare item!" without forcing the player to have to decide whether to use or sell it.

This is generally my opinion too. It sounds right for the style of game this is shaping up to be where everything is based on scavenging ships/items from what you fight and what you get is what you faced in the level.

Another thing to help mitigate the procgen: the stage itself gives an item on it's first completion. Like one of those utility items you mentioned or a specific ship or a specific weapon so you will have a baseline of 'ok I know the player has access to these, so they should be able to handle this etc.'

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
:siren: SPACE POLICE :siren:

Cheese it it's the fuzz!

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
Truly the Sky is dead: The universe went from blood red to color vomit :magical:

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

KillHour posted:

You need to write an AI that writes all the code for your AI.

Don't let the AI self iterate. Not only will you create Skynet, you'll also create an exponential occurrence of bugs that you'd have to fix.

300 AI patterns seems a bit excessive for a shmup though. Then again you kind of need that many if that's the amount of different weapons that'll be firing at you...

Usual shmup's only have a few AI patterns since they typically have static weaponry, with the big variance being in how they're placed on a stage.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
Add an S^S rank.

Are you a bad enough dude to achieve S Squared Rank!?

(No you are not it is a joke rank and is actually the lowest rank because of an overflow error and as such requires you to utterly fail everything ever.)

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
As someone who's trying to make assets for games without much artistic skill, this stuff is good.

Also obligatory 'YOU'VE GONE MAD WITH SHADERS' post too.

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EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
There is good stuff here.

It is well worth waiting for.

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