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maskenfreiheit
Dec 30, 2004


So Amazon Prime has The Sopranos, and I just watched the series finale.

What's the deal? Is Tony dead?

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Vakal
May 11, 2008


He is now.

Ein cooler Typ
Nov 26, 2013

by FactsAreUseless


Why is Meadow so bad at parking

maskenfreiheit
Dec 30, 2004


Ein cooler Typ posted:

Why is Meadow so bad at parking

Not falling for that one no sir

</Paulie voice>


Vakal posted:

He is now.

Nice

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?



maskenfreiheit posted:

What's the deal? Is Tony dead?

I'll still argue to my dying day that the point is that we don't know and never will know. Our journey along with Tony basically paralleled Melfi's, we were safely able to ride along and root for him and enjoy his crimes and infidelities a step removed, and then it was over and we no longer had that privileged insight into his life. Maybe that guy in the Members Only jacket stepped out of the bathroom and killed him? Maybe he went home and lived another 30 years on top of the rickety ship of the modern day Mafia? Maybe he was killed a day, a week, a month, a year later? Maybe he had a heart attack at dinner and fell down dead at the table? Was hit by a car several weeks down the line? Got taken out by some new rising Captain?

The point is, I'd argue, that we don't know, and that just because as viewers we knew the show was ending didn't mean we got to see Tony get what he "deserved" after rooting for him to succeed over the preceding seasons for our own entertainment.

I still love this show. It's clunky by comparison to modern television and feels like it was largely put together on the fly after Nancy Marchand died, but it stands the test of time.

Escobarbarian
Jun 18, 2004




Grimey Drawer

The Sopranos is the best show of all time. I've ever seen a show that seems to truly understand human nature as much, that has as much 'emotional intelligence', as this one.

And yeah the setup of the final shot is clearly meant to indicate that Tony could have died in that booth, but not showing it for sure is the entire point. Basically the big Tony dies blog post guy got everything right except his ultimate conclusion.

Pedro De Heredia
May 30, 2006


The ending kind of mirrors the scene of Tony saying "I get it!" in the desert (we never know what he 'got' and he forgets about it soon afterwards).

An answer (an ending, Tony's death) is almost there, but we can't quite grasp it.

Jose Oquendo
Jun 20, 2004

At the end of 2018, a study was published by London Metropolitan University showing that certain bacteria, normally present only in intestinal tracts or feces, were found on McDonald's self-service screens.




Jerusalem posted:

I'll still argue to my dying day that the point is that we don't know and never will know. Our journey along with Tony basically paralleled Melfi's, we were safely able to ride along and root for him and enjoy his crimes and infidelities a step removed, and then it was over and we no longer had that privileged insight into his life. Maybe that guy in the Members Only jacket stepped out of the bathroom and killed him? Maybe he went home and lived another 30 years on top of the rickety ship of the modern day Mafia? Maybe he was killed a day, a week, a month, a year later? Maybe he had a heart attack at dinner and fell down dead at the table? Was hit by a car several weeks down the line? Got taken out by some new rising Captain?

The point is, I'd argue, that we don't know, and that just because as viewers we knew the show was ending didn't mean we got to see Tony get what he "deserved" after rooting for him to succeed over the preceding seasons for our own entertainment.

I still love this show. It's clunky by comparison to modern television and feels like it was largely put together on the fly after Nancy Marchand died, but it stands the test of time.

This 1000000%


Some of it clunky but it's still great. Some people point to OZ as the start of the 'prestige drama' and they may be right. But I think it was Sopranos that really figured out how to put it all together and make it all work and started it all.

edit: Is "Don't Stop Believing" still the most purchased song on iTunes?

double edit: Gilbert Gottfriend had Dominic Chianese (Uncle Junior) on his podcast and it's a great, great interview. If you like the Sopranos, check it out. He talks about Marchand and Gandolfini. He's also a talented musician and he did a song for the show. It was beautiful.

Jose Oquendo fucked around with this message at 13:20 on Sep 1, 2017

Elephanthead
Sep 11, 2008




Toilet Rascal

Journey breaks up.

stev
Jan 22, 2013

Please be excited.





It's one of those series where even the seasons people say were bad are still really, really loving good. I can't think of an episode that is actually bad, just ones that are less perfect.

Pedro De Heredia posted:

The ending kind of mirrors the scene of Tony saying "I get it!" in the desert (we never know what he 'got' and he forgets about it soon afterwards).

Huh. I always thought he said 'I did it', as some sort of cathartic drug induced confessional for the Chris thing.

stev fucked around with this message at 16:58 on Sep 1, 2017

Escobarbarian
Jun 18, 2004




Grimey Drawer

Nope!

evobatman
Jul 30, 2006

it means nothing, but says everything!

Pillbug

What I didn't like about the ending is that in the last few seconds you're pulled out of the engaging story about a mafia boss that goes to therapy, and you're pulled into David Chases story about being boss of a TV show. The Sopranos probably had thousands of camera, acting, set design and writing tricks and techniques to make it good, but all of them contributed to the story without being about the technique itself. Suddenly a great TV series ends on a trick that barely belongs in first year of film school.

Elephanthead
Sep 11, 2008




Toilet Rascal

You know how when your getting fired for sure and you just gently caress off the last few weeks? Welp.

Harold Stassen
Jan 24, 2016

by Fluffdaddy


I hated the ending. I resent having to play Schrodinger's Mobster every time I talk about the show irl

Escobarbarian
Jun 18, 2004




Grimey Drawer

cool thanks for sharing

TheBizzness
Oct 5, 2004

Reign on me.


I loved the ending in real time. I thought it was loving perfect, though everyone I know hated it.

And while you are all correct that we will never really know what happened, I believe that he died.

Professor Shark
May 22, 2012



I liked it better when I thought it ended after John gets arrested and Tony has to flee through a field, then talks on his phone a bunch with his lawyer and learns that this might be a way to muscle in on NY, then arrives home and the story ends with Domestic Tony.

I liked that ending, not... whatever that last season was.

Escobarbarian
Jun 18, 2004




Grimey Drawer

a fantastic piece of television (outside of a couple dull arcs in the first half)?

frenton
Aug 15, 2005

devil soup


TheBizzness posted:

I loved the ending in real time. I thought it was loving perfect, though everyone I know hated it.

And while you are all correct that we will never really know what happened, I believe that he died.

I agree with this 100 percent. It's one of my favorite endings of any TV show and I like to think that Tony died. It's been a long time since I've seen it so I might be mis-remembering but I recall this scene where Chris and someone else are sitting in a car discussing what they think it's like to die and they say something like "I think you never see it coming. It just turns to black and that's it." It's that scene that makes the ending so perfect for me so if I'm remembering it wrong please don't correct me.

edit: oh it's actually Bobby Bacala and Tony sitting in a boat where this conversation happens.

frenton fucked around with this message at 05:57 on Sep 8, 2017

stev
Jan 22, 2013

Please be excited.





Escobarbarian posted:

a fantastic piece of television (outside of a couple dull arcs in the first half)?

The coma arc and the Vito thing were great.

Escobarbarian
Jun 18, 2004




Grimey Drawer

I fuckin love the coma arc, it was mainly the Vito thing. Which I personally don't hate, but I guess I can see why people do, even if the way it ends makes up for it.

Solice Kirsk
Jun 1, 2004

.


Watching Vito try to do a days work just to realize 30 minutes had gone by was pretty amusing.

maskenfreiheit
Dec 30, 2004


Solice Kirsk posted:

Watching Vito try to do a days work just to realize 30 minutes had gone by was pretty amusing.

while all while having a near pornographic inner monologue about his lunch

maskenfreiheit
Dec 30, 2004


personally couldn't suspend disbelief that vito would be able to snag a hot fireman hotcake maker

R-Type
Oct 10, 2005

by FactsAreUseless


maskenfreiheit posted:

personally couldn't suspend disbelief that vito would be able to snag a hot fireman hotcake maker

He still got his johnnycakes tho

tapine
Sep 3, 2017

by FactsAreUseless


Vito's whole escapade was hilarious. I see the Sopranos as a huge satire making fun of these guys and their idiot beliefs and it's extremely effective at lampooning all of their prejudices, including their homophobia. Vito shooting that guy at his mailbox and then trying to drive away, shouting "Fuckin' cocksucking oval office!" while his car decouples from the other guy's, lmao.

banned from Starbucks
Jul 18, 2004






Jerusalem posted:

It's clunky by comparison to modern television and feels like it was largely put together on the fly after Nancy Marchand died,

I agree 100% with everything except for this. I think The Sopranos blows away stuff like Mad Men or Breaking Bad or whatever other shows that came after that people cream themselves over. Out of the entire run I can think of exactly 1 episode that made me think "wtf was the point of that?" which was the Columbus episode, and even still theres half a dozen scenes (montel williams, opening scene, white indian chief dinner, ending car scene) that are hilarious and better than 90% of todays "golden age" poo poo.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?



I'm actually talking more about the technical aspects - their transitions and cuts feel kinda primitive and there is still a bit of a sense that audiences used to network drama weren't going to get basic subtleties (like the parallels between Meadow and Tracee) so they would ram it down their throats. To be fair, that's still a problem a lot of dramas have nowadays and sometimes it feels justified that people just aren't going to get things unless it's laid out explicitly.

In regards to the Nancy Marchand stuff, the first few episodes of season 3 feel disjointed, like the writers were struggling to find a storyline. Things only really feel like they start coming together once Ralphie and Jackie start coming to the fore. Not that the episodes are bad, just that it mostly feels like disconnected scenes being strung together. Though the joke of the FBI spending all that time setting up that lamp only for Meadow to take it away is a pretty great shaggy dog story.

Escobarbarian
Jun 18, 2004




Grimey Drawer

I would definitely argue that season 3 has the weakest overall arc. The 3-4 great one-off episodes (Livia's death, Employee of the Month, University, Pine Barrens) could all absolutely make it into a top 10 eps of the show list, though.

Solice Kirsk
Jun 1, 2004

.


Let's not forget that one really really weird scene sweep where Carm goes slow mo then it Star Wars sweeps to another scene. The hell was up with that?

Malcolm Excellent
May 20, 2007




Buglord

Eoooowww, bring me some gabbagool you wise rear end!

etalian
Mar 20, 2006



It's a good documentary on life in North Jersey.

You're breaking my balls!

maskenfreiheit
Dec 30, 2004


My favorite character is the ziti

Solice Kirsk
Jun 1, 2004

.


Listening to them try to pronounce Italian words makes my skin crawl.


Manigot!

Kurtofan
Feb 16, 2011

hon hon hon


how's tony, how's tony, how's tony

banned from Starbucks
Jul 18, 2004






I like the scenes that have closeup shots of tonys face as he busts a nut into some random whore

Kurtofan
Feb 16, 2011

hon hon hon


banned from Starbucks posted:

I like the scenes that have closeup shots of tonys face as he busts a nut into some random whore

the gabagool shoots

Magic Hate Ball
May 6, 2007

ha ha ha!
you've already paid for this


The point is that these people will never live a settled, secure life. They will always be checking over their shoulders for oblivion.

Malcolm Excellent
May 20, 2007




Buglord

Kurtofan posted:

how's tony, how's tony, how's tony

I think you're looking for the twin peaks thread

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Harold Stassen
Jan 24, 2016

by Fluffdaddy


Solice Kirsk posted:

Let's not forget that one really really weird scene sweep where Carm goes slow mo then it Star Wars sweeps to another scene. The hell was up with that?

According to the director that was an error

But like, isn't there a way to reverse that kind of error or catch it in time? :shrug:

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