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SunshineDanceParty
Feb 7, 2006

That man has the largest penis I have ever seen. I actually don't even know if he has mumps, forgot to look. I was distracted - by the largest penis I have ever seen


I don't know why anyone cares about Asuka. Emma's going to win the belt and have the Iconic Duo help her defend it till Wrestlemanina.

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The_Rob
Feb 1, 2007

musicals are garbage


SamuraiFoochs posted:

I get mad because I prefer 50 50 booking than booking they put time into only to loving suck, just later. See also the entire Roman Reigns push.

See the difference is that Asuka is actually over and people like her.

Sugar Blaster
Dec 14, 2004

All ears, all eyes, all the time!

what is ember moon's character supposed to even be?

SamuraiFoochs
Jan 16, 2007



Grimey Drawer

VJeff posted:

Foochs is right. We need to give Asuka the Roman Reigns push.

No, dumbass, my point is it'd be fine if I thought they'd wait to have someone genuinely awesome dethrone Asuka on the main roster and make it a big deal. They won't. Just like how having Goldberg squash Brock eliminated ANY level of mystique Roman beating Brock for the title would've had left, yet WWE is still stubborn enough to keep that the plan because WWE booking sucks. If WWE had any ability to book competently I'd agree but the issue is 95% of the time, they have exactly the wrong mixture of not striking while the iron is hot and adjusting the booking and then the other half of the time hotshotting so badly that they gently caress up the long term plan but try to do a version of it anyway.

They did it with Brock and Roman. They did it with Bayley and Charlotte. And they're going to do it with Asuka where either they immediately bury her mystique or we find ourselves in the Brock hellscape where no one beats her for years because of the circular logic loop of no one being right for it because they haven't been pushed as such.

Cavauro
Jan 9, 2008

andey...


too much name calling is going on around these parts. pee-yew

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Anybody remotely interesting is mad in some way or another.


I can certainly admire and respect the opinions regarding a champion losing before leaving a promotion/brand etc, and using that as a way of getting somebody staying behind over. I can't argue with that idea, and I agree it's almost always the right thing to do. There's just one problem in this case.....


NOBODY CAN BEAT ASUKA!

DarkstarIV
Apr 6, 2010

Ms. Intensity


To be honest, I'm fine with Asuka going undefeated for a very long time, because unlike Brock or Roman her character work is actually great/interesting. I mean its main roster booking so I fully expect them to gently caress it up, but I think comparing Asuka to Roman or Brock is a bit unfair, considering she's significantly better when it comes to charisma/character work, while at least Roman has looked really loving terrible lately, character/charisma wise.

DarkstarIV fucked around with this message at Sep 7, 2017 around 03:05

Big Coffin Hunter
Aug 13, 2005



good thing nxt isn't another promotion and she's still in wwe

VJeff
Jun 2, 2011

#HEKNOWS
#SCOOPS
#IGNOREMYPOSTS


Jerusalem posted:

I can certainly admire and respect the opinions regarding a champion losing before leaving a promotion/brand etc, and using that as a way of getting somebody staying behind over. I can't argue with that idea, and I agree it's almost always the right thing to do. There's just one problem in this case.....


NOBODY IS READY FOR ASUKA!

Fixed that for you, my dude.

And this is basically how I feel. Going out on your back is a time honored tradition, but Asuka is special and the NXT -> Main Roster trip isn't the same as going from one territory to another in my eyes because Asuka staying unbeaten keeps her special and unique on the main roster.

Although I'm pretty sure Foochs' point that WWE will inevitably gently caress all of this up is a pretty salient one. Nakamura was unbeaten on the main roster for four and a half months until SummerSlam.

DarkstarIV posted:

To be honest, I'm fine with Asuka going undefeated for a very long time, because unlike Brock or Roman her character work is actually great/interesting. I mean its main roster booking so I fully expect them to gently caress it up, but I think comparing Asuka to Roman or Brock is a bit unfair, considering she's significantly better when it comes to charisma/character work, while at least Roman has looked really loving terrible lately, character/charisma wise.

I actually thought Roman was becoming more confident and a better talker, but dear sweet fancy jesus, his material is more awful than it's ever been (yes, worse than sufferin' succotash and tater tots) and his cool-unaffected-douchebag demeanor has just led to him getting super outclassed by dudes with actual presence like Joe, Brock, Miz and Cena.

VJeff fucked around with this message at Sep 7, 2017 around 03:08

SamuraiFoochs
Jan 16, 2007



Grimey Drawer

I think part of my problem is because of how many parallels this has with Brock and Brock has been a massive drain on the product for years IMO, admittedly largely because he's linked inexorably to Roman in a way that sucks, is bad, prevents freshness in the main event, and does nothing for the product from either a business or an entertainment standpoint. So I'm really wary.

piss tape israel
Apr 23, 2010



Big Coffin Hunter posted:

good thing nxt isn't another promotion and she's still in wwe
i bet if you told hunter this he would throw a toddler tantrum

That DICK!
Sep 28, 2010

clonfroggio





Chris James 2 posted:

I'm consistent with my belief that if someone retires or exits a promotion or show they should do so with a loss, even/especially if it means a title changes hands in the process

You want to see a good exit, watch what just happened with the Big Show

I dunno I feel like I usually agree with that but no one stood out in NXT enough to warrant beating Asuka IMO. I think vacating the title is actually best for the other women overall, since only one of them could benefit from beating Asuka. This way people get an opportunity to stand out cause it's anyone's game

I hope they don't just do MYC winner v. Ember Moon though. They shouldn't have another tournament but a couple qualifying matches to decide who will face MYC winner would give some underdeveloped folk some time to shine

That DICK!
Sep 28, 2010

clonfroggio





Apologize to the other poster for calling him the D Word Fooches.

SunshineDanceParty
Feb 7, 2006

That man has the largest penis I have ever seen. I actually don't even know if he has mumps, forgot to look. I was distracted - by the largest penis I have ever seen


SamuraiFoochs posted:

I think part of my problem is because of how many parallels this has with Brock and Brock has been a massive drain on the product for years IMO, admittedly largely because he's linked inexorably to Roman in a way that sucks, is bad, prevents freshness in the main event, and does nothing for the product from either a business or an entertainment standpoint. So I'm really wary.

I totally understand that concern, and it's a worry I have with Ronda Rousey coming near WWE. But I think Asuka's really cool sooooo

Chris James 2
Aug 9, 2012

plz remember that it was ~ME~ who told you that everything you like is actually really not good, because I knew all along.


Big Coffin Hunter posted:

good thing nxt isn't another promotion and she's still in wwe

Did you miss my "or show" or is that why you didn't quote my post

Professor Funk posted:

Asuka is going to drop her first match to Bayley at Wrestlemania 34 you idiots

This but to Nia and at Roadblock End of the Line or whatever its equivalent is this year, maybe Clash of Champions?

SamuraiFoochs
Jan 16, 2007



Grimey Drawer

That DICK! posted:

Apologize to the other poster for calling him the D Word Fooches.

I do find it hilarious how the one time I don't defend WWE's decision making everyone else tells me that it is in fact the right trajectory.

But fine. Sorry VJeff, you are not a dumbass. You either completely missed my initial point because I didn't make it clear enough or you did catch my point and were being a bit disingenuous. I'm guessing it's the former.

Raskolnikov38
Mar 3, 2007

We were somewhere around Manila when the drugs began to take hold



SunshineDanceParty posted:

I don't know why anyone cares about Asuka. Emma's going to win the belt and have the Iconic Duo help her defend it till Wrestlemanina.

a pity vince hates Emma, a stable of Australian women would own

Chris James 2
Aug 9, 2012

plz remember that it was ~ME~ who told you that everything you like is actually really not good, because I knew all along.


I know it won't be that short (Clash of the Champions being 3 months away and all) but the longest unbeaten streak on the main roster was literally Nia with 4 months. Joe didn't even last that long. Even if Asuka doesn't come up until next month, Mania will still be 6 months away, and I'm just not at all optimistic they'll be that patient to give it away even as a Mania moment

SunshineDanceParty
Feb 7, 2006

That man has the largest penis I have ever seen. I actually don't even know if he has mumps, forgot to look. I was distracted - by the largest penis I have ever seen


Raskolnikov38 posted:

a pity vince hates Emma, a stable of Australian women would own

It really would. They'd be a way more entertaining version of Jinder and the Singh Brothers.

That DICK!
Sep 28, 2010

clonfroggio





SamuraiFoochs posted:

I do find it hilarious how the one time I don't defend WWE's decision making everyone else tells me that it is in fact the right trajectory.

But fine. Sorry VJeff, you are not a dumbass. You either completely missed my initial point because I didn't make it clear enough or you did catch my point and were being a bit disingenuous. I'm guessing it's the former.

A broken clocks wrong 86398 times a day

tweet my meat
Oct 2, 2013


SunshineDanceParty posted:

It really would. They'd be a way more entertaining version of Jinder and the Singh Brothers.

Just imagine the whole "I will now speak to my people, in my language" bit with them

VJeff
Jun 2, 2011

#HEKNOWS
#SCOOPS
#IGNOREMYPOSTS


SamuraiFoochs posted:

I do find it hilarious how the one time I don't defend WWE's decision making everyone else tells me that it is in fact the right trajectory.

But fine. Sorry VJeff, you are not a dumbass. You either completely missed my initial point because I didn't make it clear enough or you did catch my point and were being a bit disingenuous. I'm guessing it's the former.

I was just joking with the Asuka/Roman Reigns comment, yeah. We've touched on this a few times before -- I get your point about why Asuka should've lost to Ember, I understand it, I just disagree. You compared her to Brock, but I think an important distinction is Asuka would at least be around doing stuff regularly even if the stuff she was doing was cutting angry promos in Japanese and kicking the hell out of everybody.

Having said that, given what's happened to everybody else who came up from NXT, there's absolutely no reason to be optimistic, either, so you'll probably get the last bitter "I told you so."

ShakeZula
Jun 17, 2003

Nobody move and nobody gets hurt.


The best full-circle storytelling move would be to have Asuka come up to Raw and win the belt, defend it against everybody, and then drop it to a returning Bayley at WM. This won't happen, but it would put a nice bow on years of character work for both of them.

abraham linksys
Sep 6, 2010



I don't know what's funnier: how mad people are about WWE making a sensible booking decision for once, or how mad they'll be when Shayna wins the MYC, which is also the obvious and best move

ShakeZula posted:

The best full-circle storytelling move would be to have Asuka come up to Raw and win the belt, defend it against everybody, and then drop it to a returning Bayley at WM. This won't happen, but it would put a nice bow on years of character work for both of them.

extremely for this if they manage to rehab Bayley by then

Big Coffin Hunter
Aug 13, 2005



Chris James 2 posted:

Did you miss my "or show" or is that why you didn't quote my post

i wasn't talking specifically too you, just the whole idea. and "meh" on the show part for me it's closer to a champion changing shows

Chris James 2
Aug 9, 2012

plz remember that it was ~ME~ who told you that everything you like is actually really not good, because I knew all along.


abraham linksys posted:

extremely for this if they manage to rehab Bayley by then

Has there been any word on how much longer she's supposed to be out

SamuraiFoochs
Jan 16, 2007



Grimey Drawer

abraham linksys posted:

I don't know what's funnier: how mad people are about WWE making a sensible booking decision for once, or how mad they'll be when Shayna wins the MYC, which is also the obvious and best move


extremely for this if they manage to rehab Bayley by then

My problem is less them making this booking decision and more that I have literally no faith that they'll tell a cogent, effective, or enjoyable story coming out of it.

Example: if it would've just gotten the goddamn coronation of Roman out of the way, I wish they'd have had him gone over Brock clean at Mania 31, even though it'd have gone over like a wet fart. What has happened since has moved from a wet fart to violent food poisoning that has gone on for basically 2 and a half years and if Roman/Brock remains the plan for Mania 34, it will have essentially put the product on hold for THREE YEARS for something that almost no one wanted to begin with and yet they somehow want it less and less as time goes on.

Also another example of WWE doing something literally exactly wrong: Tozawa/Neville.

Good News: WWE had an effective dominant heel champ and a face the crowd wanted to see dethrone him.

Bad News: They had the face win it on the go-home Raw instead of Summerslam.

Good News: That's at least better, theoretically, than them finishing some major storyline on a pre-show no one watches.

Bad News: They hotshotted the title back to the heel on the aforementioned pre-show for literally no goddamn reason and undermined everyone involved AND missed a golden chance to freshen up the cruisers.

Good News: They did something to freshen up the division rather than running Neville/Tozawa until the heat death of the universe.

Bad News: It's loving Neville/Enzo.

Marquis de Pyro
Sep 25, 2006

Evil Prevails

SamuraiFoochs posted:

I think part of my problem is because of how many parallels this has with Brock and Brock has been a massive drain on the product for years IMO, admittedly largely because he's linked inexorably to Roman in a way that sucks, is bad, prevents freshness in the main event, and does nothing for the product from either a business or an entertainment standpoint. So I'm really wary.

When they let Brock do fun stuff he rules. The Goldberg matches were good, the 4 way match was good. Just let him go nuts and throw people around in crazy fast paced brawls.

I'm not denying Brock gets lazy in matches he doesn't care about, but it's not hard to book him in a way that he isn't boring. There's nothing bad about being booked as a monster who can rarely if ever be beaten, look at Braun (other than Roman of course lol). It's just a matter of doing it halfway competently.

DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

They've built Brock up so effectively as a dude who squashes everyone that on the occasions when someone just beats the crap out of him (Goldberg, Braun) it comes across as something *really* special.

abraham linksys
Sep 6, 2010



SamuraiFoochs posted:

My problem is less them making this booking decision and more that I have literally no faith that they'll tell a cogent, effective, or enjoyable story coming out of it.

oh I completely agree with this (and also your criticisms of Neville/Tozawa, which is one of the reasons I'm switching my Wednesday night wrestling time from 205 back to NXT). I just want them to at least theoretically set themselves up for success, whereas I think having Asuka drop to Ember would have been a really bad move. Like, for Asuka to get over on the main roster, her best chance is to go in with the undefeated gimmick. I understand why you're wary of that gimmick, and I don't think she can or should keep it for longer than past Wrestlemania 34. But just as importantly, while I don't think the crowd would outright reject Ember winning in Brooklyn (though they would have in Orlando), it would be extremely hard for Ember to carry a feud with, like, any heel woman currently in NXT. And WWE totally understand that, and it's very canny booking on their part to have Asuka vacate and set Ember up to feud with incoming heels in a lower-stakes environment, presumedly only re-entering the main event picture after a heel champion has been established (which is why I think Shayna should win ).

I understand why people conceptually want wrestlers to put over their peers on their way up, I really do! But I think people arguing for it in this specific case are not taking into account both the importance of Asuka and the current state of the NXT women's division. There was nothing to gain from Ember winning at TakeOver and a lot to lose.

SamuraiFoochs
Jan 16, 2007



Grimey Drawer

DeathChicken posted:

They've built Brock up so effectively as a dude who squashes everyone that on the occasions when someone just beats the crap out of him (Goldberg, Braun) it comes across as something *really* special.

Agreed! Except the part where we're expected to forget about all those awesome rear end-whoopings and go banana for a lukewarm Roman win in New Orleans because IT'S ROMAN DAMMIT.

VJeff
Jun 2, 2011

#HEKNOWS
#SCOOPS
#IGNOREMYPOSTS


DeathChicken posted:

They've built Brock up so effectively as a dude who squashes everyone that on the occasions when someone just beats the crap out of him (Goldberg, Braun) it comes across as something *really* special.

Doesn't hurt that Brock is like, lowkey the best seller in the company when he wants to be.

At this point I hope he bumps like a madman for Braun and whoever else he faces at Survivor Series and the Rumble and then just totally sleepwalks through his match with Roman.

Codependent Poster
Oct 20, 2003



Asuka should stay undefeated until one of the MYC girls come up to beat her. Kairi would be the most obvious choice, but Dakota would be a good underdog too.

AsInHowe
Jan 11, 2007

Goal, assist, fight.

ozymandius1024 posted:

I'm thinking about going to Hell in a Cell in Detroit and I was wondering if anyone had any advice about where to sit and how long I should wait to buy tickets (I remember people talking about how Battleground really struggled to sell)

I just toured the arena yesterday.

Really not a bad seat in the place.

DangerDummy!
Jul 6, 2009


Asuka should never lose. She should be the next Moolah, pimping and all. Suck it, nerds.

Gonz
Dec 22, 2009

Jesus, did I say that? Or just think it? Was I talking? Did they hear me?


AsInHowe posted:

I just toured the arena yesterday.

Really not a bad seat in the place.

I saw a Freep Press video of the soft opening the other day, and that LED ceiling looks nuts. I hope they utilize that for the HIAC intros.

I need to fly back there this winter and catch a Wings and/or Pistons game.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aeb2MwAU96I

VJeff
Jun 2, 2011

#HEKNOWS
#SCOOPS
#IGNOREMYPOSTS


I'm gonna loving miss Hell in a Cell inside the LCA 'cause I gotta go to a wedding. Man, if Nakamura wins the championship, I'll be so freakin' bummed out.

Seams
Feb 3, 2005


with JBL gone who is gonna yell WELCOME TO THE BIG LEAGUES, KID when asuka gets pinned by i dunno alicia fox

AsInHowe
Jan 11, 2007

Goal, assist, fight.

Gonz posted:

I saw a Freep Press video of the soft opening the other day, and that LED ceiling looks nuts. I hope they utilize that for the HIAC intros.

I need to fly back there this winter and catch a Wings and/or Pistons game.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aeb2MwAU96I

The LED ceiling was legitimately amazing.

It's going to be the best goal celebration in the NHL, and is fully customizable. Entrance ceilings are definitely in play.

Also, if you want to watch but don't want a ticket, the plaza outside will show all events live.

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WadeBartender
Aug 18, 2013


people who defend bad booking because its beneficial to people they like are the best kind of wrestling fans

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