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RBA-Wintrow
Nov 4, 2009




If he believes hard enough in his invisible Wyvern it keeps existing!
Logic? Orks don't need it!




Eddy and Stephen from accounting. Don't mention the teeth, they're British.

RBA-Wintrow fucked around with this message at Feb 18, 2018 around 20:39

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Kanos
Sep 6, 2006

was there a time when speedwagon didn't get trolled

I wanted to play Cataph's Southern Realms to experience an empire-esque army in a radically different start. The stuff it offers is really cool. Unfortunately, using it requires Crysnos's unlocker to play, and Crysnos's unlocker subfragmenting every faction into a billion tiny factions and adding a bunch of active rogue armies adds like 50% to my turn times in ME which makes me not want to play.

Captain Oblivious
Oct 12, 2007

Could people please stop fighting the avatar war over my avatar. I really appreciate people being nice about it but I'm feeling crappier that people are wasting money because someone is an asshole than I am about the avatar in the first place.


Nephthys posted:

Hand of the Gods is (I think) the strongest missile ability in the game if it all hits and is pure fire damage. It was a very strong ability before but against Tomb Kings its ridiculously effective. TK's might need some way to deal with fire damage, it can screw them so hard. The ability itself is actually pretty tricky to use well in most cases, it just happens that all the TK's are weak against fire.

Kroq'Gar is pretty overpowered though. Lizardmen in general are probably the most powerful faction atm and can be total cancer to fight against.

On this note, any tips for making the most of Lizardmen? Iím in a Kroq-Gar ME campaign and currently using stacks that tend to have something like two Terradon Fireleechers, two Stegadons, two Revivification Crystals to support the hard as nails Saurus and Temple Guard frontline and then a couple Carnosaurs. Should I be making more of an effort to include Kroxigors or cavalry? Blessed Horned Ones look pretty good but for the most part Lizard cavalry didnít stand out to me.

uber_stoat
Jan 21, 2001



Ammanas posted:

those screenshots are gorgeous. It's kind of a shame most of the games beauty is lost, zoomed out micromanaging battles

that's what slow mo replays are for, the screenshot porn.

Twigand Berries
Sep 7, 2008
A MY LITTLE PONY AVATAR WAS HERE

Captain Oblivious posted:

On this note, any tips for making the most of Lizardmen? Iím in a Kroq-Gar ME campaign and currently using stacks that tend to have something like two Terradon Fireleechers, two Stegadons, two Revivification Crystals to support the hard as nails Saurus and Temple Guard frontline and then a couple Carnosaurs. Should I be making more of an effort to include Kroxigors or cavalry? Blessed Horned Ones look pretty good but for the most part Lizard cavalry didnít stand out to me.

Kroxigors perform fantastic. I've been largely "meh" about lizardmen cavalry, but I'm also micro lazy.

Martout
Aug 8, 2007

None so deprived


any update on when the norsca update will come to ME?

Hunt11
Jul 24, 2013


Lizardmen cavalry is all about being an early alternative to Carnasaurs in dealing with large targets.

Scrub-Niggurath
Nov 27, 2007



Grimey Drawer

If you conquer enough gold mines and have a lord with the mark of the god of reduced upkeep you can get cold one and even horned one riders to cost less gold per turn than a saurus unit, so they make a cheap end game deathstack

albany academy
Mar 6, 2013

I can't see shit!

Your lord, other heroes, minimum 15 lazer dinos.

Motherfucker
Jul 16, 2011



kroxigors kinda suck but huge dinosaurs loving rock.


My standard army Mazdamundi, a few temple guards, a couple of shielded regular saurus followed by fuckloads of fire bola terradons carnasaurs, solar engines and maybe even an ancient whatever the triceratops with the infantry ripping poison gattling gun is.

Gejnor
Mar 14, 2005



Kanos posted:

I wanted to play Cataph's Southern Realms to experience an empire-esque army in a radically different start. The stuff it offers is really cool. Unfortunately, using it requires Crysnos's unlocker to play, and Crysnos's unlocker subfragmenting every faction into a billion tiny factions and adding a bunch of active rogue armies adds like 50% to my turn times in ME which makes me not want to play.

Yeeeepp, its quite annoying.

But don't worry, he intends to add MORE FACTIONS.

drgnvale
Apr 30, 2004

A sword is not cutlery!

Genjor, are you still planning on doing a beastmen mod? I've been holding off on playing them but I'm really getting a hankering for some minotaur bowling...

Edgar Allen Ho
Apr 3, 2017



Gejnor posted:

Yeeeepp, its quite annoying.

But don't worry, he intends to add MORE FACTIONS.

ahhhh such immersions

Gejnor
Mar 14, 2005



I sort of have one already, but its a personal mod.

Its nothing too crazy:

I made the technologies you unlock with money do more, they will offer more research speed bonus (+50% instead of +20%), give some upkeep reduction (-5% per tech so a total of -25% if you research them all) and also give some growth (+2 per skill, a total of +10 in the end)

I fixed the tech that gives replenishment to work at all times, just like WoC

Malagor gets some buffs, a melee tree and his unique skills do more things like give winds of magic reductions to some of his spells, gives him armour aaand more winds reserves.

The upkeep building gives a bit more reduction in both ranks (-30/60% upkeep), i wanted to make Beastmen able to go the WoC route of nearly self-sufficent hordes if they put in the effort for it basically.

Oh and Harpies benefit from the skill that boosts your wardogs/giants/monstrous infantry as well.


Its a rather small mod and ive not published it, if you want i can put up the packfile here for people to try out.

Senor Dog
Jul 5, 2006



Grimey Drawer

I like kroxigors a lot they do their job well and look awesome doing it

Motherfucker
Jul 16, 2011



Senor Dog posted:

I like kroxigors a lot they do their job well and look awesome doing it

what job is that though?

I can never find a way to fold them into my lizardman army that wouldn't be better served by more lasers.

Kanos
Sep 6, 2006

was there a time when speedwagon didn't get trolled

Gejnor posted:

Yeeeepp, its quite annoying.

But don't worry, he intends to add MORE FACTIONS.

It's super annoying because he's the only real faction unlocker game in town. I don't begrudge people wanting to play with the stuff the unlocker+ adds, I just don't want any of that poo poo but if I want any faction unlocks I'm required to put up with it.

Motherfucker
Jul 16, 2011



I really wanna like the tomb kings but the skeletons make skaven look compotent by comparison and you don't even get cannons to go with your cannon fodder like skavens do.

Kanos
Sep 6, 2006

was there a time when speedwagon didn't get trolled

You get giant egyptian robots, catapults that shoot magical skulls that scream at people, and the ark of the covenant instead.

drgnvale
Apr 30, 2004

A sword is not cutlery!

Gejnor posted:

I sort of have one already, but its a personal mod.

Its nothing too crazy:

I made the technologies you unlock with money do more, they will offer more research speed bonus (+50% instead of +20%), give some upkeep reduction (-5% per tech so a total of -25% if you research them all) and also give some growth (+2 per skill, a total of +10 in the end)

I fixed the tech that gives replenishment to work at all times, just like WoC

Malagor gets some buffs, a melee tree and his unique skills do more things like give winds of magic reductions to some of his spells, gives him armour aaand more winds reserves.

The upkeep building gives a bit more reduction in both ranks (-30/60% upkeep), i wanted to make Beastmen able to go the WoC route of nearly self-sufficent hordes if they put in the effort for it basically.

Oh and Harpies benefit from the skill that boosts your wardogs/giants/monstrous infantry as well.


Its a rather small mod and ive not published it, if you want i can put up the packfile here for people to try out.

Sure, I'd love to play with it. Mostly I'd like the replenishment fixes because otherwise there's so much downtime between ME turns and not doing much while you wait for your dudes to slowly heal back up. The other changes sound fun, and I'll probably also use a mod that gives Khazrak vanguard like the old LL mod used to.

Motherfucker
Jul 16, 2011



Kanos posted:

You get giant egyptian robots, catapults that shoot magical skulls that scream at people, and the ark of the covenant instead.

I did like the ark of the covenant but the problem is I've never been able to get into the swing of things with them without my entire and only army getting loving dunked by the dwarves or empire because skeletons suck so loving bad.

What do you do to make TK fun I guess, Like the aha moment for my skaven was 'Always have a servitor army of skavenslaves accompany every army' whats the trick to TKs

Hunt11
Jul 24, 2013


Tomb Guard are decent units. Chariots when you get the hang of them can and have enough in an army can shatter enemy lines. Ushabti are just a blender for infantry and GB Ushabit wreck large units. To top it all off, the top tier constructs are complete monsters.

Motherfucker
Jul 16, 2011



Hunt11 posted:

Tomb Guard are decent units. Chariots when you get the hang of them can and have enough in an army can shatter enemy lines. Ushabti are just a blender for infantry and GB Ushabit wreck large units. To top it all off, the top tier constructs are complete monsters.

eech, not a cavalry fan. Too much micro with the added FUN of them randomly forgetting orders and charging into a forest to get banged in the bushes by a pack of generic rear end in a top hat spearmen.

Captain Oblivious
Oct 12, 2007

Could people please stop fighting the avatar war over my avatar. I really appreciate people being nice about it but I'm feeling crappier that people are wasting money because someone is an asshole than I am about the avatar in the first place.


Motherfucker posted:

kroxigors kinda suck but huge dinosaurs loving rock.


My standard army Mazdamundi, a few temple guards, a couple of shielded regular saurus followed by fuckloads of fire bola terradons carnasaurs, solar engines and maybe even an ancient whatever the triceratops with the infantry ripping poison gattling gun is.

I mostly remember people saying at launch that Ancient Stegadons were outperformed by the regular non-Feral Stegadons. Is that not still true? Did they get buffed?

albany academy
Mar 6, 2013

I can't see shit!

TKs are about big cats, big dogs, big bugs, and big dudes shooting lasers out of their eyes.

Gejnor
Mar 14, 2005



drgnvale posted:

Sure, I'd love to play with it. Mostly I'd like the replenishment fixes because otherwise there's so much downtime between ME turns and not doing much while you wait for your dudes to slowly heal back up. The other changes sound fun, and I'll probably also use a mod that gives Khazrak vanguard like the old LL mod used to.

Alrite heres a link for the packfile: https://www.dropbox.com/s/bck6g7n8c...stmen.pack?dl=0

Just put that sucker in the data folder of your Warhams 2 install and enable it in the modmanager and you're good to go!

Third World Reggin
May 19, 2008



Gejnor posted:

I sort of have one already, but its a personal mod.

Its nothing too crazy:

I made the technologies you unlock with money do more, they will offer more research speed bonus (+50% instead of +20%), give some upkeep reduction (-5% per tech so a total of -25% if you research them all) and also give some growth (+2 per skill, a total of +10 in the end)

I fixed the tech that gives replenishment to work at all times, just like WoC

Malagor gets some buffs, a melee tree and his unique skills do more things like give winds of magic reductions to some of his spells, gives him armour aaand more winds reserves.

The upkeep building gives a bit more reduction in both ranks (-30/60% upkeep), i wanted to make Beastmen able to go the WoC route of nearly self-sufficent hordes if they put in the effort for it basically.

Oh and Harpies benefit from the skill that boosts your wardogs/giants/monstrous infantry as well.


Its a rather small mod and ive not published it, if you want i can put up the packfile here for people to try out.

I've always found the problem to be not enough horde growth to get the units that are fun which is why I would love for them to work like black arks where you only need to unlock the first building with population.

But I don't like beastmen enough to go figure out how to mod that and if I even could.

Edgar Allen Ho
Apr 3, 2017



Motherfucker posted:

I did like the ark of the covenant but the problem is I've never been able to get into the swing of things with them without my entire and only army getting loving dunked by the dwarves or empire because skeletons suck so loving bad.

What do you do to make TK fun I guess, Like the aha moment for my skaven was 'Always have a servitor army of skavenslaves accompany every army' whats the trick to TKs

tbh you might just suck at Tomb Kings, their early game battles can literally be won by lord + monster standing and fighting whole stacks even if every single skellington die

Captain Oblivious
Oct 12, 2007

Could people please stop fighting the avatar war over my avatar. I really appreciate people being nice about it but I'm feeling crappier that people are wasting money because someone is an asshole than I am about the avatar in the first place.


Motherfucker posted:

eech, not a cavalry fan. Too much micro with the added FUN of them randomly forgetting orders and charging into a forest to get banged in the bushes by a pack of generic rear end in a top hat spearmen.

You probably will never like TK then because early/mid game TK is all about getting hundreds upon hundreds upon hundreds of kills with just a couple chariots and a big rear end cat.

Your chaff skeleton literally just exist to tarpit poo poo long enough for it to be obliterated by arrows, chariots, and <whatever big monster you started with>

botany
Apr 27, 2013

there was a man of double deed
and nandynandynandy need,
and when he rode he was a horse
and when he walked he was a porse

Captain Oblivious posted:

You probably will never like TK then because early/mid game TK is all about getting hundreds upon hundreds upon hundreds of kills with just a couple chariots and a big rear end cat.

Your chaff skeleton literally just exist to tarpit poo poo long enough for it to be obliterated by arrows, chariots, and <whatever big monster you started with>

if you're playing settra. other TK leaders don't need chariots at all.

Motherfucker
Jul 16, 2011



Captain Oblivious posted:

I mostly remember people saying at launch that Ancient Stegadons were outperformed by the regular non-Feral Stegadons. Is that not still true? Did they get buffed?

Ancient stegadons are anti-infantry powerhouses that shoot and fight at the same time for a negligible downturn in melee damage. 'outperformed' depends on context but its favorite place to be is ripping up soldiers by the score. Plus even from the overhead view every time it fires it WILL leave multiple troops dead as all loving getout in a big arc. Its more deadly than a flamethrower.

Against a chaff heavy army it will always rek, fighting someone with big monsters like that one weirdo dark elf who fields a loving million hydras you're better off with more solar engines. Its the MIDDLE stegadon with the big crossbow I have trouble finding a place for since solar engines blast big boys harder than them and ancient stegs obviously do better with troops.

Edgar Allen Ho posted:

tbh you might just suck at Tomb Kings, their early game battles can literally be won by lord + monster standing and fighting whole stacks even if every single skellington die

This is a distinct possibility. I prefer skaven or lizards.

drgnvale
Apr 30, 2004

A sword is not cutlery!

Gejnor posted:

Alrite heres a link for the packfile: https://www.dropbox.com/s/bck6g7n8c...stmen.pack?dl=0

Just put that sucker in the data folder of your Warhams 2 install and enable it in the modmanager and you're good to go!

Thanks! Do you know of any dependencies you might have? With just that packfile selected, the game hangs at the loading screen. I'd also happily take hints/pointers to troubleshooting guides since it's about time I figure out how modding for TW works.

drgnvale fucked around with this message at Feb 19, 2018 around 00:35

Kanos
Sep 6, 2006

was there a time when speedwagon didn't get trolled

Motherfucker posted:

I did like the ark of the covenant but the problem is I've never been able to get into the swing of things with them without my entire and only army getting loving dunked by the dwarves or empire because skeletons suck so loving bad.

What do you do to make TK fun I guess, Like the aha moment for my skaven was 'Always have a servitor army of skavenslaves accompany every army' whats the trick to TKs

TK are the most hammer and anvil army in the entire game. Your skeletons will never, ever accomplish anything besides holding the enemy in place; the hammer needs to come from somewhere else.

In the early game, your best option for this are chariots. The chariot building is tier 1, cheap as dirt, and gives reasonable unit cap for them. TK Chariots are more than good enough to run over opposing tier 1 infantry and mow down enemy missile troops, and their tissue paper durability doesn't matter much because you don't need to care if you lose them as long as they get damage done; they're free and one turn recruit so you can be recklessly suicidal with them. Skeleton Archers also punch very hard for how many of them you can get per building and including several units of them is a great way to deal with lightly armored enemy infantry and cav. In addition, each TK lord comes with some bonus units that you can crutch on hard to make your early expansion easier. Settra's Warsphinx is the strongest and can almost singlehandedly solo the savage orcs you start at war with. Khatep's Hierotitan is unbeatable if you bring some chariots to mow down darkshards. Arkhan's Tomb Scorpion isn't as deadly as the Warsphinx or the Hierotitan, but is hugely disruptive and can shut down significant sections of an enemy army on its own. Khalida's stalkers and necropolis knights are the weakest of the starting units, but Khalida adds huge power to her archers to compensate as well as easily being the strongest TK combat lord(until Settra gets his kitty/chariot and Arkhan gets his chariot).

As the game progresses, your primary goal should always be expanding your army cap and unlocking hero slots. Since everything the TK produce is completely free, additional stacks are powerful and you can ram your hero cap at all times for no penalty. Stat boosts on units are nice and the heralds are good retinue units, but they're seriously unimportant compared to making GBS threads out another free stack. Even if your unit caps for non-poo poo units are all full, a second stack can still be crammed full of free skeletons to assist a real army. As far as building strategies go, you're going to want to prioritize making GBS threads out as many Ushabti buildings as possible. Ushabti unlock at tier 3, meaning they come substantially earlier than the other constructs and most importantly this means you can build Ushabti buildings in minor settlements, allowing you to get a really beefy number of them. This is good because Ushabti are your most useful and reliable construct. A front line of skeleton chaff backed by Ushabti will win duels with basically any infantry there is.

It's also important to internalize that it doesn't matter if every single loving skeleton in your army gets annihilated as long as you win and don't lose your lord/heroes, since it's all free. poo poo, it doesn't even matter if you lose more elite units as long as you have the infrastructure in place to recruit new ones.

Kanos fucked around with this message at Feb 19, 2018 around 00:25

Motherfucker
Jul 16, 2011



Kanos posted:

TK are the most hammer and anvil army in the entire game. Your skeletons will never, ever accomplish anything besides holding the enemy in place; the hammer needs to come from somewhere else.


This is some good poo poo. I dunno why it never occurred to me that no upkeep means no reason to be conservative with the size of my army.

Kanos
Sep 6, 2006

was there a time when speedwagon didn't get trolled

Motherfucker posted:

This is some good poo poo. I dunno why it never occurred to me that no upkeep means no reason to be conservative with the size of my army.

The faction's mechanics require approaching the game in a different way than every other faction, so it takes some adjustment to play them.

Another big tip with TKs is to remember that you can utilize global recruitment at the same time you're using local recruitment, and since the faction has no gold costs for units you don't pay the normal doubled recruit costs for using global recruitment. This lets you fill new armies substantially faster as well as replenish armies that have lost tons of chaff much faster.

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Edgar Allen Ho
Apr 3, 2017



Motherfucker posted:

This is some good poo poo. I dunno why it never occurred to me that no upkeep means no reason to be conservative with the size of my army.

It is weird to get your head around coming from "regular" total war factions tbh. I did 3 or 4 false starts before I realized that there is literally no downside to fielding as many 20 stacks as you can even if they are all godawful skeletons.

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