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zeal posted:the romans maintained a way cooler, more effective, and infinitely more stylish empire than this loving dumpster fire. even the dog days of the western empire managed to produce people like flavius aetius Idk dude, the Romans had guys like Brutus and Caligula. Having a couple crazy dudes is just a part of empire.
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Oct 15, 2017 07:12
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R. Mute posted:dan carlin especially so
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Oct 15, 2017 08:29
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Dreddout posted:Idk dude, the Romans had guys like Brutus and Caligula. But Brutus says that Caesar was ambitious, and Brutus is an honorable man!
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Oct 15, 2017 16:07
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Yandat posted:they gave up all their weapons to the Romans after surrendering and then were all slaughtered while wielding half baked spears the romans stole all their technology from Carthage aqueduct standardized ship building etc bunch of barbarians on the other hand their public baths were responsible for building social cohesion by having a public space where nobles and commoners could meet and gently caress naked while the Carthaginians relied on tributary and mercenary troops and had no public spaces which means they had bad morale and lost because of their (((mercantile ))) like nature
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Oct 15, 2017 23:29
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Top City Homo posted:which means they had bad morale and lost because of their (((mercantile ))) like nature The first punic war ended with the Carthagian's mercenary army laying siege to their capital over a dispute over payment, a complete self own
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Oct 16, 2017 01:40
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Brother Friendship posted:The first punic war ended with the Carthagian's mercenary army laying siege to their capital over a dispute over payment, a complete self own hannibal was the only dude who learned not to rely on mercenaries
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Oct 16, 2017 02:27
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A Buttery Pastry posted:Because he compares Mexican immigration to the barbarian invasions? the barbarians were right tho
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Oct 16, 2017 02:32
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Top City Homo posted:hannibal was the only dude who learned not to rely on mercenaries Oh yeah, the guy who used thousands of Gallic and Iberian mercenaries.
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Oct 16, 2017 07:50
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R. Mute posted:they're both bad Dan Carlin is okay, I think he usually tells a pretty fun story as long as you appreciate he only picks the least reliable sources possible. So stay away from his politics podcast cause the dude knows absolutely gently caress all about America's sordid past,it's kinda strange. "Imagine if... America invaded Mexico" Uhhh...
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Oct 16, 2017 12:19
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"it's hard to imagine folks... Try to imagine... A belligerent world empire that considers themselves the peak of civilisation but to everyone else they're just murderers... Imaginr the empire has been in almost a constant state of war for 50 years" Uhhhh
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Oct 16, 2017 12:22
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Uh anyway, Rome, they were alright, bunch of fascists though And Carthage was a huge oval office move
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Oct 16, 2017 12:23
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R. Mute posted:they're both bad It's middlebrow history tbh I think he's done a much better job with revolutions though.
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Oct 16, 2017 15:14
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Yandat posted:best Rome podcast is Fall of Rome with Patrick Wyman His new one is pretty good
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Oct 16, 2017 15:29
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Brother Friendship posted:The first punic war ended with the Carthagian's mercenary army laying siege to their capital over a dispute over payment, a complete self own isnt it a credible theory that the "ostrogoths" were unpaid roman soldiers?
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Oct 17, 2017 12:58
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LegoPirateNinja posted:isnt it a credible theory that the "ostrogoths" were unpaid roman soldiers? They were the army because at that point the Roman legions were either dead from the civil wars, plague or were understrength because the rich were hiding their serfs from the draft.
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Oct 17, 2017 13:05
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sullat posted:Oh yeah, the guy who used thousands of Gallic and Iberian mercenaries. they were not mercenaries but tributaries or treaty bound vassals get your CK2 ancient rome mod up to date schlub 
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Oct 17, 2017 19:21
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Top City Homo posted:they were not mercenaries but tributaries or treaty bound vassals do you actually think that? cause it's highly inaccurate. the vast majority of hannibal barca's troops at any given time in the second punic war were gallic, iberian and numidiani mercenaries. the latin allies were much more important in providing supply and shelter than in offering actual troops against the romans, while the macedonians never arrived.
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Oct 17, 2017 19:36
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History is cool because we lost so much of it imo
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Oct 17, 2017 21:41
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zeal posted:do you actually think that? cause it's highly inaccurate. the vast majority of hannibal barca's troops at any given time in the second punic war were gallic, iberian and numidiani mercenaries. the latin allies were much more important in providing supply and shelter than in offering actual troops against the romans, while the macedonians never arrived. Hannibal had mercenaries namely the Balearic slingers, CeltiIberians, and Lusitanians but the majority of his men were either allied auxiliaries, allies or conscripts. The Celtic tribes were virtually all allies. Hannibal concluded a series of treaties with different tribes and they provided him with troops and supplies. The Libyan troops in Hannibal's army's were either conscripted from the Libyan cities Carthage controlled or some of them might have been allied contingents if Carthage had a treaty with a Libyan city. The Numidians were allied troops that had long been vassals of Carthage and their chieftains and princes served as the unit's commanders. Most Spanish troops were either conscripted from Carthaginian controlled Spain or obtained through alliances from surrounding tribes. Hannibal did have mercenaries, namely the Balearic slingers, CeltiIberians, and Lusitanians. Illyrians were probably hired. The southern Italians were either allied contingents, conscripts, or volunteers. Play total war more 
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Oct 17, 2017 22:14
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Top City Homo posted:Play total war more https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAlMaVYIzqw
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Oct 17, 2017 23:13
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Lawman 0 posted:History is cool because we lost so much of it imo we don't even know like 1% of ancient history lmao poo poo like rome sacking carthage and then reinventing history and murdering everyone who said otherwise and burning all their poo poo happened on a pretty much regular basis...it should put in perspective what will happen to our own civilization when the time comes
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Oct 18, 2017 02:01
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Lawman 0 posted:History is cool because we lost so much of it imo Some of it should stay lost. If I find any Neo-Platonist works, I will burn them with extreme prejudice
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Oct 18, 2017 02:18
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spartacus was cool
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Oct 18, 2017 14:46
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Brother Friendship posted:we don't even know like 1% of ancient history lmao I hope we can read those burnt scrolls we found
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Oct 18, 2017 15:00
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lmao if you aren't etching your own version of history into the foundations of your house so future archeologists think that you were the king of kings and you invented everything from toilets to space ships *frowns at re-sale value*
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Oct 18, 2017 15:12
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got any sevens posted:spartacus was cool Holy poo poo Kirk Douglas is still alive.
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Oct 18, 2017 20:24
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Captain_Maclaine posted:Holy poo poo Kirk Douglas is still alive. I wonder if he and his son will go the same day like Carrie/Debbie
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Oct 18, 2017 22:13
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Captain_Maclaine posted:Holy poo poo Kirk Douglas is still alive.
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Oct 18, 2017 22:15
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BrutalistMcDonalds posted:what the gently caress I know!
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Oct 18, 2017 22:48
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LegoPirateNinja posted:isnt it a credible theory that the "ostrogoths" were unpaid roman soldiers? the 'barbarians' tribes were originally paid as mercenaries, entire tribal groups would function more or less as mercenaries commanded by their king. then the empire fell apart for various reasons and the kings (often heavily romanized) realized they were the ones who were really in charge. at one point, after the empire had been divided in half, the eastern emperor Zeno ordered the king of the Visigoths, theodoric the great, to invade italy and kill and replace odacer, who himself had ruled italy as a client of Zeno before betraying him and backing one of the Emperor's rivals
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Oct 18, 2017 23:52
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Fallen Hamprince posted:the 'barbarians' tribes were originally paid as mercenaries, entire tribal groups would function more or less as mercenaries commanded by their king. then the empire fell apart for various reasons and the kings (often heavily romanized) realized they were the ones who were really in charge.
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Oct 19, 2017 03:03
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Yandat posted:Caesar was like a competent Trump; a generation later after the mishaps of the original post, Caesar used the popular dissatisfaction of the Senate to overthrow the old guard. The Republic continued, but only in name from then on. The Senate still exercised power, but only in an advisory role and never over leadership. i would argue that the senate still exercised their power over leadership at least once
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Oct 19, 2017 03:14
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Venuz Patrol posted:i would argue that the senate still exercised their power over leadership at least once you might be right, what are you referring to?
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Oct 19, 2017 04:28
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Yandat posted:you might be right, what are you referring to? Probably that little something that went down on 15 March.
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Oct 19, 2017 04:32
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oh lol
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Oct 19, 2017 04:32
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the senate did choose Nerva, the guy who adopted Trajan who succeeded him. As well as Balbinus and Pupienus, but those two were murdered after three months of emperorship, during the tumultuous year of the six emperors during the third century crisis.
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Oct 19, 2017 13:28
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i only recently learned what a varangian was. basically the eastern roman empire started hiring vikings because they were giant smelly murderers too dumb to fear death, so many vikings in fact that the home countries in scandinavia had to disinherit any men who went to Constantinople because like 70% of the male population kept leaving as soon as they could, plenty of people still did though because it was insanely more advanced, rich and presumably fun than hanging out in a frozen wasteland eating buried fish iirc one of the early texts describing a viking coming back from his time in Constantinople has the local women absolutely fawning over this guys fancy red cloak and bejewelled sword, as well as a dagger since back then carrying a sword AND dagger at once meant you were class as hell thats one of the reasons the ancient world owns imo, you could sail for a few weeks and end up in a city practically 1000 years in the future as far as vikings were concerned
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Oct 19, 2017 22:52
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scandinavians were great personal guards because they were hedonists who didn't give a gently caress about politics aside from who was giving them money to gently caress and drink. native romans would get Ideas About Running The Empire
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Oct 19, 2017 23:09
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the varangians were also famous for Never Betraying their Emperor, except for the times they did
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Oct 19, 2017 23:11
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Falukorv posted:the senate did choose Nerva, the guy who adopted Trajan who succeeded him. As well as Balbinus and Pupienus, but those two were murdered after three months of emperorship, during the tumultuous year of the six emperors during the third century crisis. there's also the weird little interregnum several decades later after aurelian was assassinated in the camp, after he finished putting down the breakaway empires of the third century but before diocletian reorganized things, where the generals and the senate went back and forth several times, the generals trying to defer the selection of a new emperor to the senate, the senate deferring to the generals, such that the empire went without an emperor for several months because neither side was willing to unilaterally support a new leader and risk another civil war (after decades of civil war)
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Oct 19, 2017 23:23
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