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Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




I can understand using real spit in a film. I can't understand or come up with an innocent reason as to why the performing actor was pushed aside so the director himself could spit on the actress.

And I wound up reading everything that was in quotations to negotiate my way around the padded drivel. Oh, hey, her five year-old showed up in PJs and eating a raw cucumber. How... relevant.

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Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




Well, I mean... Everybody knew she was 13 and seeing as how this isn't France...

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




I'm just trying to figure out what kind of masterful spin one puts on "had sex with a 13 year-old" to make someone think, "Oh, well that's not so bad."

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




I love The Pianist and think the world will be a better place when Polanski's dead. I don't see why anyone has to reconcile one with the other.
It's like saying Ted Bundy was cool to do what he did because he also worked at a suicide hotline and saved a 2 year-old from drowning. poo poo people can do a good thing and still be poo poo people.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




Perestroika posted:

Depending on who's talking, it seems to boil down to fragility and/or whataboutism. For the former, the issue is dudes being used to viewing dating/flirting as basically a game just for men. The man gets to have fun and can do pretty much whatever he likes, while the woman more or less has to sit there and take it. It's ingrained to them that the mere idea that they should check themselves and consider the woman's feelings seems completely outrageous to them. They actually do realise that this isn't a good look, so they exaggerate like crazy to make it objectively seem as unreasonable as they subjectively feel it is.

These dudes also love binary logic. Either they can always comment on, touch or treat a woman sexually or women are just all hysterical rape-callers and even eye-contact is vorboten. There's no in-between because this switch don't have a dimmer.

Likewise, they like to think of their approach to sex in equal binary. There's goon quote somewhere along the lines of, "Women aren't vending machines. You don't put nice tokens in and sex comes out." Repeal nice tokens with... attention tokens? "I Want" tokens? and the sentiment stands.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




I hate to say it, but I think you guys are being way too optimistic about getting a just end to Spacey. We're still having to fight the "Hey, this is an actual problem" battle. Real repercussions are still a ways off. Jeffrey Jones never saw prison time and still acts on screen and stage (small roles, but the point stands), Polanski is enjoying life in France and got an Oscar, Jimmy Saville was aggressively covered for until his death... I will be sincerely shocked if Weinstein receives actual prison time.

At the end of the day, these are still rich, powerful men in a world run by rich, powerful men.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




DC Murderverse posted:

Weinstein is gonna get the Bernie Madoff treatment, he'll be the one locked up as a "warning" to others and a signal that we don't completely not care, but also will be the only guy who gets as severe a treatment as he does

That was my second thought, yeah. But I'm still going to be surprised if it's anything past probation.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




So I'm not part of SAG, but I am part of a sister guild here in LA. I know personally of several people passed over for work because they didn't clear background checks. I had a background check when began work for a major studio.

So yes, the claim that a studio isn't allowed to do background checks is complete bullshit.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




Alan Smithee posted:

Yours has always been a de facto exception. They did one on me for one day of set work

But not for Dan Schneider of course

Dan Schneider's background check would still come up clean today.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




French law has some astounding blind spots that give great benefits to sexual predators. Like the whole no legal age of consent thing and not searching for missing adults. It's no wonder Polaski's doing just lovely.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.





Ted Bundy worked at a suicide hotline! He saved a two year-end from drowning! Won't somebody consider that?! :qq:

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




I can buy a billionaire sex trafficker with a private sex jet to a private sex island patronized by the world's most powerful and wealthy politicians, businessmen, and celebrities, but a conspiracy to kill that sex trafficker? That's lunatic talk! Conspiracies are the stuff of movies!

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




chitoryu12 posted:

You seem to think the world works like a thriller TV show.

Did you miss the billionaire rape island conspiracy part or...?

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




chitoryu12 posted:

And? That doesn't suddenly turn the US prison system into a hyper-competent Judge Dredd isocube complex. Epstein making it through his time in prison without a single issue would be more unusual.

So do you think assassinations don't happen or that this case isn't high profile enough for assassination to have happened? I've been struggling to understand why the idea of Epstein being murdered is such an outlandish idea when he was such a liability for the world's most rich and powerful.

I'm also curious as to why his autopsy is requiring "further information" and had to be overseen by Dr. Baden, an absolute legend in forensic pathology. And why it's being investigated by the FBI if it being a suicide is so apparent.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




Additionally, here's a source stating the FBI is investigating the death.

quote:

The U.S. Bureau of Prisons confirmed in a statement Saturday that the FBI would investigate the suicide of the financier, who is accused of sexually abusing and trafficking underage girls.

Unless the U.S. Bureau of Prisons isn't credible, I dunno.

Edit: Also screaming from his cell, I guess, but here's a choice quote:

quote:

In an interview with our West Palm Beach affiliate WPEC, a former Florida corrections worker said Epstein was "treated like a celebrity" during his 13-month stint in a county jail after he pleaded guilty in 2008 to charges of soliciting a minor for prostitution. She claims his cell was regularly left unlocked and she saw him move freely through the dormitory area – sometimes completely naked – without repercussions.

Das Boo fucked around with this message at 13:05 on Aug 13, 2019

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




chitoryu12 posted:

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/08/12/nyregion/epstein-barr.html

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/17/us/prisons-safety-substitute-guards.html?module=inline

The New York Times has been reporting for the past year on federal prisons having the exact kind of staff problems that are being reported in Epstein's death now. It's just nobody cared until a high profile criminal died under them.

I'm not sure how this refutes my point or proves yours when I was responding to your claim you couldn't find credible proof the FBI was investigating his death. Which is also in the first article you listed.

I guess it lends credibility to the idea that the site was compromised, but that just kinda strengthens both our stances?

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




chitoryu12 posted:

I couldn't initially find any info when I did a search, only that there was a Justice Department inquiry being opened (which would be completely expected if someone committed suicide in what's supposed to be a top notch prison because, surprise, the Trump administration is incompetent and cutting funding and staffing!). But there's a really big loving difference between "A year of reporting on federal prison problems turned out to be correct and nobody paid attention until a guy offed himself" and "Someone assassinated a high profile prisoner and every single witness was removed or bribed into perfect silence."

One doesn't negate the other at all, and context counts in this situation. The guy in question had been running a sex scandal that involved the world's wealthiest and most powerful with a million pages of evidence planned for his trial and was in a facility that either had one suicide in the last 20 years or none since it opened in 1975 (I've read both). He got a sweetheart deal a decade prior, served a minimal sentence in luxury and returned to running his sex ring thereafter. He was on suicide watch for a still unexplained incident two weeks ago and someone signed off on him being removed from it. Procedures failed, a mystery person was a guard on his watch, he was I guess given bedsheets that a previous inmate stated could in no way be used for self-harm, and his death is currently being investigated by the FBI with an autopsy requiring further information. That's a big pile of context.

And he's certainly high profile enough to be assassinated. I listed articles in my initial post on the matter where people were assassinated for far less. This really isn't just "a guy."

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




Macdeo Lurjtux posted:

Baden being involved probably doesn’t mean anything, the dude is an absolute starfucker and habitually pulls strings to get his name attached to any high profile case in the tri-state area.

He was requested by Epstein's representatives, which is not really the party I'd figure requesting him.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




chitoryu12 posted:

especially when there's a lot of reason to think it wasn't an assassination.

Can you elaborate?

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




Real quick, 'cause I gotta get ready for work.

1. Existent failures were utilized either way, so this doesn't support or deny his cause of death.

2. The evidence being seized is what was left behind. What he could disclose, or further evidence he could provide is now lost.

3. The previous sweetheart deal was made in what seems to be violation of the law. So why do you think the justice system's beyond repair but would work as promised here?

4. So... I could use this to say such a narcissist wouldn't see himself beat just yet. Doesn't prove much.

He was at the center of a billionaire sex island conspiracy, so conspiracy is already on the table. It happened. Assassination would just be a continuation of what has already been revealed to be a conspiracy.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




Julius CSAR posted:

I'm absolutely loving the language used in this article. All articles about these people should be this blunt.

I don't know if I've ever read such utter contempt and disgust in an article about an interview. That's a pure bit of writing.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




Hi, I worked on the Zim movie and can confirm this from veteran coworkers.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




The intent's what matters. My mom has some pictures somewhere of me taking a bath in the sink and grinning at the camera because it was cute. Little kids running around naked on the beach is cute because they're so happy and carefree. A nude body in and of itself isn't sexual until someone assigns sex to it.

A kid forced to remove his clothes while sobbing and afraid has intent behind it.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




mycot posted:

It must be rough for hacks when the only choice of material is "is black" and "was sexually abused"

Like in an "alcoholic at a bar" way?

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




Coincidentally, the frontal lobe finishes developing around 25 and they nope out.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




I resent being anyone's headboard notch, which I'm led to believe was the entire purpose of his Pussy Posse. That's the sort of poo poo that has transformed attractive guys to repugnant guys for me. And I don't mean metaphorically; it's kinda bizarre in it's severity, like I am baffled how I once considered that attractive.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




Give Jeopardy to Andy Richter.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




She sighed breastfully.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




King Vidiot posted:

I was done with Norm MacDonald the instant I read about the joke he made at the expense of Brandon Teena after his death. It wasn't even "gallows humor" it was just straight up "I think a trans man dying after being raped is funny".


loving poo poo, you weren't kidding. He just states the incident then literally says, "They all deserved to die." I was expecting a really gross joke, but there wasn't even a loving joke. Jesus.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




CPL593H posted:

But all this poo poo coming out about him changes that entirely and even if that wasn't an issue to me and I could just say "Separate the art from the artist." I would never try and shout down a woman who said they thought he was a piece of poo poo and they're irritated at seeing people all over shouting how awesome he was from the mountain tops.

I think this summarizes my feelings on it pretty well. It's a personal decision for everyone how much bad they're willing to put up with in any given thing, and it's real lovely to try and scream people down because their line got crossed sooner.

From what I've seen these women have been voicing their experiences, not tearing anyone down for enjoying MacDonald. All the tearing is coming from the other side because, "Don't you dare spoil my enjoyment of this thing!" Which... if you can only enjoy the immaculate, I guess that's on you.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




He was very likely victimized by virtue of being a child actor. It takes a parent stepping in hard to prevent it and unfortunately, the kind of people who allow their children to go into acting tend to be the kind ready to sacrifice their own children.

There are exceptions, of course, but nowhere near as many as you'd loving hope.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




So not based on hard numbers, but just personal experience: Sexual abuse doesn't necessarily result in a sexual abuser, but it does seem more likely to result in an abuser, be it physical/emotional/psychological/etc. The opposite seems true too. I'm curious how those numbers would look if you widened the net a bit? (I mean, it would still be impossible to verify, but)

Like picking an example from my experiences, it went from generation to generation as sexual abuser > emotional abuser > physical abuser > sexual abuser. My guess is that each person is latching onto whatever means of control they can most easily exploit.

Of course, not excusing it. One of my parents was a cycle breaker, their siblings were not.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




Ok Comboomer posted:

https://www.jasoncolavito.com/blog/...ulative-fiction

(Jason Colavito is a cool pseudoscience/pseudoarchaeology debunker—he’s not my original source for learning about the time the History Channel based an entire season of a show called Hunting Hitler around a photo of Moe, but this blog entry was the first best thing that popped up when I googled it)

Dang, everybody needs to leave Moe alone.

Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.





Tarantino posted:

Like, before me, the person foot fetishism was defined by was Luis Buñuel, another film director. And Hitchcock was accused of it, and Sofia Coppola has been accused of it.

I don't know about Buñuel and Coppola, but referring to Hitchcock was not the best defense here.

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Das Boo
Jun 9, 2011

There was a GHOST here. It's gone now.




After years of concern that I am a broken, humorless creature, I continue to be rewarded for not liking stand-up.

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