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 quote:Four years ago, researchers from Evanston’s NorthShore University HealthSystem and other scientific organizations announced they had used brain scans to detect the hallmark of chronic traumatic encephalopathy, or CTE, in ex-NFL players while they were still alive — a technique that promised to spur more accurate diagnoses, and possibly new treatments. quote:In a paper published last week in the journal Neurosurgery, Bailes and other researchers reported that one of the former players who underwent a scan had his brain examined after he died — and sure enough, the tissue revealed he had been suffering from CTE. quote:The paper does not name the ex-NFL player, but based on the description of his age, playing career and post-football life, it appears to be Fred McNeill, a former linebacker for the Minnesota Vikings who died in 2015. http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/ct-met-concussions-cte-confirmed-in-living-person-20171115-story.html If this research holds up with other patients, seems like a way to actually pull people who need to be pulled. There was a real sports several years ago where some doctors had theorized that the brain could flush some amount of tau by itself-- so if that is also true, now you have a protocol much like say, radiation dosing, where once you hit a limit you're done. Whether that comes to fruition or not remains to be seen I guess.
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Nov 16, 2017 04:41
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Hope the panthers win it all this year because this could be the potential end as we know it of the nfl
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Nov 16, 2017 04:59
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Qwijib0 posted:If this research holds up with other patients, seems like a way to actually pull people who need to be pulled. these will mostly be high school and college players. RIP the NFL.
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Nov 16, 2017 05:32
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If scan data correlates to certain positions played (probably not difficult), you could introduce rule changes to give protection to those positions. It would still mean major changes, but could be something like getting rid of the 3 point stance or relaxing holding rules to make it more effective than bashing your head into a guy.
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Nov 16, 2017 06:15
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CTE scares the gently caress out of me because I think I have it. Its prob me just being a hypochondriac.
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Nov 16, 2017 13:02
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You could just hire an offensive line like my team has they never make contact with any defenders.
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Nov 16, 2017 13:09
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I might be wrong but hasn't poo poo like this been proven for wrestlers in the past (Benoit etc). I doubt this will be the downfall of the NFL. They will just force a load of changes if it proves to be an epidemic.
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Nov 16, 2017 13:13
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CyberPingu posted:I might be wrong but hasn't poo poo like this been proven for wrestlers in the past (Benoit etc). I doubt this will be the downfall of the NFL. They will just force a load of changes if it proves to be an epidemic. The downfall of the NFL is when this information becoming more and more public, and is read by parents. The league won't cease to exist but the sport as a whole is going to see a significant drop in youth participation, which then means less players in the NFL's free minor league.
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Nov 16, 2017 13:30
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CyberPingu posted:I might be wrong but hasn't poo poo like this been proven for wrestlers in the past (Benoit etc). I doubt this will be the downfall of the NFL. They will just force a load of changes if it proves to be an epidemic. The NFL exists because it can turnover almost its entire workforce with highly skilled cheap players every 3 years or so. This will end that. The product will become unwatchable. Just think about how bad the NFL is this year. Also there's going to be substantial litigation over all of this. Roger probably wants 50 mil a year just for his connections on capitol hill.
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Nov 16, 2017 13:32
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Yeah I guess they would need to reform everything from grassroots up in order to realistically enact decent change to make it not a horrific bloodsport.
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Nov 16, 2017 13:37
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Serious question here—do other nations see similar prevalence of CTE in Rugby? I've read lots of opinions that removing helmets makes players more conscious of how they're tackling (ie too afraid to go helmet to helmet at full speed) but I've never seen anything definitive on CTE rates in other contact sports. Obviously this isn't the highest priority, I just wonder if there's any evidence that football as a sport is salvageable or if this will dismantle all contact sports eventually.
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Nov 16, 2017 13:38
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Rugby is seeing it more but due to players not torpedoing themselves head first into each other it happens a lot less.
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Nov 16, 2017 13:39
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DJExile posted:The downfall of the NFL is when this information becoming more and more public, and is read by parents. The league won't cease to exist but the sport as a whole is going to see a significant drop in youth participation, which then means less players in the NFL's free minor league. Yes, children of the poor will consider the chance of brain injury and decide living in abject poverty while being hunted by the police is really not that bad.
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Nov 16, 2017 13:56
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Drilling people in the head and spearing are routinely not called as fouls, and pretty much never result in meaningful punishment. You still see tons of plays where a guy gets their brains scrambled and they're like WELL ACTUALLY HE ~TECHNICALLY~ WASN'T DEFENSELESS SO which is bullshit if the goal is actually, you know, reducing brain trauma. Concussion protocol is blatantly bypassed like every loving week, in front of everybody on live TV. Football as we recognize it is probably still real bad for the brains, but the league's efforts to do anything about it are visibly fraudulent. There needs to be a blanket ban on blows to the head, anywhere on the field, that is actually enforced. Targeting needs to be an automatic ejection and suspension. Spearing (which has been illegal for loving decades but is almost never called for some reason) needs to be enforced so people stop using their heads to hit people. Make them loving tackle basically.
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Nov 16, 2017 14:08
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I'm glad football is going to fail soon so I don't have to watch the Miami Dolphins anymore.
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Nov 16, 2017 14:26
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Ehud posted:I'm glad football is going to fail soon so I don't have to watch the Miami Dolphins anymore. The end of Redskins football and Dan Snyder's ownership would be a net positive for society.
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Nov 16, 2017 15:10
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If I was a team owner I'd trying to sell so loving hard
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Nov 16, 2017 15:54
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So realistically what happens here - massive lawsuit and a lockout, and then scabs are hired who sign waivers that prevent the owners from being sued?
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Nov 16, 2017 15:59
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If I had to guess this is going to impact high school and college sooner than the NFL. Legislators are going to propose banning it from public institutions and you're going to see conservatives adopt keeping football as part of their platform.
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Nov 16, 2017 16:14
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Cash Monet posted:If I had to guess this is going to impact high school and college sooner than the NFL. Legislators are going to propose banning it from public institutions and you're going to see conservatives adopt keeping football as part of their platform. "You have to go to private high schools and private colleges if you want to play football" Can totally see that
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Nov 16, 2017 16:20
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EugeneJ posted:"You have to go to private high schools and private colleges if you want to play football" So NCAA without Bama, OSU, PSU... but with USC and Miami. Works for me.
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Nov 16, 2017 16:59
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This stupid country has Nazi sympathizing right wing garbagemen who are apologists for an Alabama pedo candidate in control of like 3/5 of the states in the union, so I'm skeptical that anything big comes of this.
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Nov 16, 2017 17:01
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Hopefully soon a procedure comes from this that can quickly and reasonably affordably determine if a player has CTE. Once that exists, first a bunch of current NFL players would likely do it to determine if they want to continue to play or not. After that occurs for a bit, if it becomes non-invasive enough, I'd expect to see it show up at the combine, which is when the real danger to the sport hits.
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Nov 16, 2017 17:11
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sean10mm posted:This stupid country has Nazi sympathizing right wing garbagemen who are apologists for an Alabama pedo candidate in control of like 3/5 of the states in the union, so I'm skeptical that anything big comes of this. Yeah but this affects your own child specifically. You can scream till your blue in the face it should stay as it is but if you dont let your kid play the sport it doesnt matter, itll die anyway.
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Nov 16, 2017 17:17
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Are you familiar with football dads? The turn against tackle football will eventually happen, but it's gonna take a looooong time to change the minds of all the crazy parents out there.
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Nov 16, 2017 17:18
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Elephanthead posted:Yes, children of the poor will consider the chance of brain injury and decide living in abject poverty while being hunted by the police is really not that bad. That is what boxing has become, and it might take a century for football to become a minor sport as it did boxing but it's not impossible
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Nov 16, 2017 17:23
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I'm interested to see more extensive tests are done with soccer players, as there's suggestions heading can lead to CTE. Now I'm thinking about football rules that could be implemented to help reduce head hits. Penalties assessed to those that lead with the head seem to be the logical choice, but so far most penalties seem to be slanted towards defenses. Would there be any rules that penalize offenses for putting themselves in positions where they can suffer head trauma?
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Nov 16, 2017 17:25
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Android Apocalypse posted:I'm interested to see more extensive tests are done with soccer players, as there's suggestions heading can lead to CTE. The soccer thing is more due to when the football was basically a bowling ball wrapped in leather. Nowadays the balls are so light that unless you are heading it with the crown of your head you are usually ok
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Nov 16, 2017 17:26
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Remember these guys? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65FiMgJ4pCc
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Nov 16, 2017 17:27
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I never watched the show but I remember the commercials for that.  The thing that strikes me is how all the kids on offense go head first into their opponents. That right there makes me wonder how you'd change rules to de-incentivize this behavior.
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Nov 16, 2017 17:33
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Android Apocalypse posted:I never watched the show but I remember the commercials for that. Any helmet to helmet shot is an immediate ejection and 2 game suspension.
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Nov 16, 2017 17:36
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0:14 in the kid lowers his head into the defense and initiates the head-to-head contact. Does that mean the kid with the ball is the one ejected?
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Nov 16, 2017 17:45
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So why did Eli want to get tested?
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Nov 16, 2017 17:50
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Mel Mudkiper posted:So why did Eli want to get tested? Do you really need to ask that?
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Nov 16, 2017 17:50
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CyberPingu posted:The soccer thing is more due to when the football was basically a bowling ball wrapped in leather. Nowadays the balls are so light that unless you are heading it with the crown of your head you are usually ok except for youth soccer. quote:The issue of allowing headers in youth-soccer has been extensively discussed over recent years. In 2011, a study presented at the annual meeting of the Radiological Society of North America found youth-athletes who head soccer balls had brain abnormalities similar to those found in patients with traumatic brain injuries. In his 2012 book, "Concussions and Our Kids," Dr. Robert Cantu recommended prohibiting youth-soccer players under the age of 14 from performing headers, too. Research still not 100% conclusive but evidence points to heading being risky behaviour http://blogs.edweek.org/edweek/schooled_in_sports/2015/07/hbo_real_sports_puts_youth-soccer_headers_under_the_microscope.html
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Nov 16, 2017 17:50
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Qwijib0 posted:except for youth soccer. Yeah there's a few youth leagues around here that don't allow heading the ball until like junior high age.
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Nov 16, 2017 17:52
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Qwijib0 posted:except for youth soccer. Ah yeah, thats a good point.
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Nov 16, 2017 17:52
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Well at least we have a wise and great president who can step in and unfuck this sport before things get too bad
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Nov 16, 2017 18:58
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The main problem isn't going to be parents forcing their kids to play or Republicans arguing against strict regulation of public educational institutions; it's going to be from the liability incurred by high schools and colleges. a few high profile multi-million dollar class actions against LSU or some Texas public high school and these places are going to stop their football programs. you can't force a minor to waive their right to a safe educational environment in the same way you theoretically could with NFL players (although I don't even know how that would hold up in higher courts)
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Nov 16, 2017 23:34
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I've never understood the whole can't test for CTE on the living nonsense considering amyloid plaque PET scans have been a thing for a long time now, and commercially available almost a decade ago. While they are almost universally marketed toward alzheimers/dementia so they can milk the medicare cow, I've been surprised the CTE craze has never brought a researcher in to look at this. Also I'm really mad I can't get a job doing these neato PET scans.
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Nov 16, 2017 23:56
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