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Shame Boy
Mar 2, 2010

THE HORROR
THE HORROR



fishmech posted:

sa as a whole is pretty dang trans so its one part that. but also this particular subforum has less maga chuds than some others on this site so it can be easier to see people say it rather than just disappear or never mention it.

even with pretty lovely mods all over the forums for the past nearly 18 years its still been a hell of a lot more moderation/protection of a lot of kinds of people than you would get on any sort of prominent discussion site, and often still is. which says a lot more about the internet than sa?

SA's got some weird visibility these days though, like one of my trans friends is of the opinion that the site is a 4chan-level cesspool because the only people she ever encounters in the wild who openly talk about SA are from GBS or FYAD or other cesspools and are actively hostile to her

she also used to have an account here like a goddamn decade ago so that's probably at least part of it but she's definitely gotten harassed by people from SA as recently as this year :sigh:

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The MUMPSorceress
Jan 6, 2012


^SHTPSTS

Gary’s Answer

cis autodrag posted:

I've posted about this off and on in the terrible programmers thread, but I will write a giant effort post about this when I'm not on a phone. Obviously it's an issue I care a lot about and there's a lot I can say without giving away anything proprietary to Epic (and actually I think they're making some mistakes on the subject because a cis woman who took one gender studies class in college is the vp they put on charge of the project.)

I started writing this and it's like a couple pages long already and I need to sleep now, so it may take me a couple days to have something postable. I'm composing it in onenote if that gives you an idea of how seriously im approaching it.

The MUMPSorceress
Jan 6, 2012


^SHTPSTS

Gary’s Answer

END ME SCOOB posted:

Yeah it's this one, I can't think of a single subforum I've hung out in here without its own trans cabal. LP was probably close to 40/60 trans/cis at one point if you only counted the thread starters.

you should be working on your sword of truth thread. for shame (you're awesome never change)

Krakox
Oct 9, 2012
It's really nice to find trans folks who are insanely good at your field of industry, like Martine Rothblatt or Fran Blanche or Rebecca Heineman

Being hardware means there's not eleven million job opportunities like software but it's still nice

spankmeister
Jun 15, 2008






On that note I really like Micah Elizabeth Scott.

secretly best girl
Mar 27, 2007

FILL MY MOUTH WITH A COCK OR I WON'T SHUT UP ABOUT ANIME FOR HOURS

cis autodrag posted:

you should be working on your sword of truth thread. for shame (you're awesome never change)

I am right now. The problem is my process on such is lovely, especially if I do the reading in the field, because it means I'm taking initial notes on paper in my christ-forsaken handwriting and then have to decipher and transcribe, then transcribe the novel, then edit for tags and clean it up...

Anyway I'm doing step 2 now while Seth Meyers talks to Ice-T.

atomicthumbs
Dec 26, 2010


We're in the business of extending man's senses.
im bi op

atomicthumbs
Dec 26, 2010


We're in the business of extending man's senses.
Gboard autocorrect wanted me to say "im hi op" instead. Great machine learning.

secretly best girl
Mar 27, 2007

FILL MY MOUTH WITH A COCK OR I WON'T SHUT UP ABOUT ANIME FOR HOURS

atomicthumbs posted:

Gboard autocorrect wanted me to say "im hi op" instead. Great machine learning.

SwiftKey has been loving with me all week but in the opposite fashion (which is why I don't take notes on the phone...) If it wasn't turning "hottie" into "hogtie" it's "if it kills me" into "if it jills me" and suddenly I'm queerer than ever

atomicthumbs
Dec 26, 2010


We're in the business of extending man's senses.
horny on main -> horny in main()

evil_bunnY
Apr 2, 2003

cis autodrag posted:

So on a more serous note, I wanted to talk about the stereotype that trans people are drawn to tech. Anecdotally, there do seem to be more trans people in tech than in the wider population, but my thinking is that the truth is that there's just more out trans people.
Also maybe, not being trans when studying to get into tech fields and transitioning later, so they experience less of what makes women run away screaming?

also:

Sagebrush posted:

anyway this is an interesting topic to me but i don't wanna be another heterosexual male occupying lgbt space so if this isn't cool tell me so and i will go away

DONT THREAD ON ME
Oct 1, 2002

by Nyc_Tattoo
Floss Finder
hello yosfriends

Sagebrush posted:

anyway this is a topic i care about but i don't wanna be another heterosexual male occupying lgbt space so i will go away

GameCube
Nov 21, 2006

my Gender Neutral Spouse is gonna be starting hormones soon, so here i am, in this thread.

Shaggar
Apr 26, 2006
Nap Ghost

cis autodrag posted:

I started writing this and it's like a couple pages long already and I need to sleep now, so it may take me a couple days to have something postable. I'm composing it in onenote if that gives you an idea of how seriously im approaching it.

cool. even if i don't ever end up taking advantage of it maybe someone else will but either way it would be helpful advice

Silver Alicorn
Mar 30, 2008

The Game is Never Over

evil_bunnY posted:

Also maybe, not being trans when studying to get into tech fields and transitioning later, so they experience less of what makes women run away screaming?


I sorta like this theory

vodkat
Jun 30, 2012



cannot legally be sold as vodka
In terms of why you get more trans people in tech I think, as other posters have said, much of it might be down to issues of visibility. That said I know of some ongoing research into promotion in elite professions that posits that people from more working class backgrounds who mange to get into professional jobs still don't get promoted as fast as their more middle/upper class counterparts. For example, you might get a job as a high paid lawyer but your not going to be made partner unless your wearing the right kind of suits, talking in the right kind of way etc, something that comes naturally for those from money background and can be a weird exclusionary code for those who come from poorer backgrounds. But in tech you don't really get this too much as you get in and rise to the top (or very near it) on purely technical skills alone which might minimise the opportunities for subtle but pervasive forms of discrimination. Maybe there is something similar happening here in tech with trans people? idk really but I thought this might be part of why you see more openly trans people in tech.

Shame Boy
Mar 2, 2010

THE HORROR
THE HORROR



i was gonna write up a long and mostly speculative reply to vodkat's post but near the end i realized a much more simple explanation:

tech is one of the very few high-paying-right-out-of-college fields still accessible to the middle class. transitioning can be prohibitively expensive - for example my wife delayed doing it until we both got better jobs and could afford it. on top of this, if you live in one of the garbage states, someone living paycheck to paycheck is gonna be much less likely to want to risk getting fired for coming out as trans than someone with an emergency fund whose skills are in active demand.

The MUMPSorceress
Jan 6, 2012


^SHTPSTS

Gary’s Answer

ate all the Oreos posted:

i was gonna write up a long and mostly speculative reply to vodkat's post but near the end i realized a much more simple explanation:

tech is one of the very few high-paying-right-out-of-college fields still accessible to the middle class. transitioning can be prohibitively expensive - for example my wife delayed doing it until we both got better jobs and could afford it. on top of this, if you live in one of the garbage states, someone living paycheck to paycheck is gonna be much less likely to want to risk getting fired for coming out as trans than someone with an emergency fund whose skills are in active demand.

This too. Hormones are cheap but getting them prescribed can mean traveling to find a doctor if you live in a lovely place.

Hell, even for someone like me surgeries are crazy expenses and I'm going on a 2 year surgery binge now that I finally have insurance that follows the standards of care and will pay for them.

GameCube
Nov 21, 2006

vodkat posted:

you get in and rise to the top (or very near it) on purely technical skills alone which might minimise the opportunities for subtle but pervasive forms of discrimination

lol, if only

vodkat
Jun 30, 2012



cannot legally be sold as vodka

ate all the Oreos posted:

i was gonna write up a long and mostly speculative reply to vodkat's post but near the end i realized a much more simple explanation:

Yea I would agree, my post was very speculative too, I just know someone who is doing similar research and I thought there might be similar factors at play for trans people too. Like everyone else has said this isn't the main factor, but I was more thinking that you might be able to afford to transition from a higher paying job, but transitioning might put you out of that job etc creating a bit of catch-22.


GameCube posted:

lol, if only

also this

Luigi Thirty
Apr 30, 2006

Emergency confection port.

I was out on twitter before anything else

I was lucky in that a yosposter who knew I was a feeeemale hooked me up with a C-level from the twitter Lisp community who got me hired at my current job so it was never an issue

ultravoices
May 10, 2004

You are about to embark on a great journey. Are you ready, my friend?
i'm a gay and that's okay.
visibility is important and a political act.
come out come out wherever you are.

KOTEX GOD OF BLOOD
Jul 7, 2012

unfortunately its not that easy for a lot of people under their circumstances

ultravoices
May 10, 2004

You are about to embark on a great journey. Are you ready, my friend?

Dongslayer. posted:

whats it called when you beat it to your gender about a fifth of the time

i would name us all the children of alan and sophie.

for some people their identity and desires are a bright and shining beacon
burning through the night, there is no path but the one

for other people it is a foghorn on a misty october morning
you hear it in the distance, its sound carrying over the hills

i wish we had ten thousand words for love
like the eskimos supposedly had ten thousand words for snow

it was politically expedient for the community to insist that human sexuality was much more the former than the latter. this was the only way that we could explain to society at large that our lives had meaning and value and didn't just need to be jesused.

i think that we've gotten to a space now where we can acknowledge that desire for a lot of people is a much more slippery and intermittent and changeable thing. there are way way more young people who identify as queer these days than as gay or lesbian.

ultravoices
May 10, 2004

You are about to embark on a great journey. Are you ready, my friend?

KOTEX GOD OF BLOOD posted:

unfortunately its not that easy for a lot of people under their circumstances

which is why it is incumbent upon us who do have that privlidge to be loud and obnoxious about it, even now.

Janitor Prime
Jan 22, 2004

PC LOAD LETTER

What da fuck does that mean

Fun Shoe
that makes sense, I always thought that it was some sort of self obsession

Im still learning

skimothy milkerson
Nov 19, 2006

awww poo poo this thread :hellyeah:

aardvaard
Mar 4, 2013

you belong in the bog of eternal stench

hey y'all im bi. maybe other things but gosh who knows.

spankmeister
Jun 15, 2008






I'm a white male cishet stemlord and I love you all

A Pinball Wizard
Mar 23, 2005

I know every trick, no freak's gonna beat my hands

College Slice
re: trans people in tech, you're a lot less likely to encounter some mouth breathing redneck in tech than in say, retail. If you do encounter a redneck and something bad happens employment wise you're a lot more likely to be able to do something about it as a sysadmin making a deece six figgies than a shelf stocker making low 5 figgies. my work experience has been entirely in retail and tech which colors this opinion but it def seems like a factor to me.

ultravoices
May 10, 2004

You are about to embark on a great journey. Are you ready, my friend?

Janitor Prime posted:

that makes sense, I always thought that it was some sort of self obsession

Im still learning

the personal is the political! the heteropatriarchy isn't going to crush itself.

The MUMPSorceress
Jan 6, 2012


^SHTPSTS

Gary’s Answer

A Pinball Wizard posted:

re: trans people in tech, you're a lot less likely to encounter some mouth breathing redneck in tech than in say, retail. If you do encounter a redneck and something bad happens employment wise you're a lot more likely to be able to do something about it as a sysadmin making a deece six figgies than a shelf stocker making low 5 figgies. my work experience has been entirely in retail and tech which colors this opinion but it def seems like a factor to me.

Agree. Also back when I lived in Madison I'd have hillbillies follow me to the bathroom in target. Now they I'm in a more techish area they content themselves with just giving me mean looks in the aisles.

Don't fool yourself into thinking people like you any better as a trans person in liberal areas. They just know they can get away with less harassment.

Stymie
Jan 9, 2001

by LITERALLY AN ADMIN
i'd be perfectly fine with chasing all cishet white male techlords out of the industry entirely and preferably into the sea

ultravoices
May 10, 2004

You are about to embark on a great journey. Are you ready, my friend?

cis autodrag posted:

Agree. Also back when I lived in Madison I'd have hillbillies follow me to the bathroom in target. Now they I'm in a more techish area they content themselves with just giving me mean looks in the aisles.

Don't fool yourself into thinking people like you any better as a trans person in liberal areas. They just know they can get away with less harassment.

we like to stereotype all the assholes and facists as hillbillies, because we have the liberal fallacy that education leads to leftist ideals.

one glance at the hn's of the world will reveal that there are just as many nice polite educated people who would cheer marching us all off to the death camps.

The MUMPSorceress
Jan 6, 2012


^SHTPSTS

Gary’s Answer

ultravoices posted:

we like to stereotype all the assholes and facists as hillbillies, because we have the liberal fallacy that education leads to leftist ideals.

one glance at the hn's of the world will reveal that there are just as many nice polite educated people who would cheer marching us all off to the death camps.

Worse than that, not all strains of leftism are compatible with queer identities. There's plenty of tankies and strict Marxists out there who see being gay or trans as a silly diversion of the unoccupied bourgeoisie mind.

The MUMPSorceress
Jan 6, 2012


^SHTPSTS

Gary’s Answer
Not to mention all the 2nd wave feminists who somehow still wield power on academia.

ultravoices
May 10, 2004

You are about to embark on a great journey. Are you ready, my friend?

cis autodrag posted:

Worse than that, not all strains of leftism are compatible with queer identities. There's plenty of tankies and strict Marxists out there who see being gay or trans as a silly diversion of the unoccupied bourgeoisie mind.

let's all exhibit decadent bourgeois behavior by not blowin'' heavy loads in vaginas, tngzh.

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011
it's been frustrating for me that a lot of people seem to think of Validity being the problem rather than access to actual resources. there's a dozen support groups i could be in at a moment's notice where i live, but the doctors that are considered reliable are all booked out months in advance

i get that not everyone's a doctor and they want to help out however they can, but it still weighed kinda heavy on me when i was trying to get The Process started

Shame Boy
Mar 2, 2010

THE HORROR
THE HORROR



Venuz Patrol posted:

it's been frustrating for me that a lot of people seem to think of Validity being the problem rather than access to actual resources. there's a dozen support groups i could be in at a moment's notice where i live, but the doctors that are considered reliable are all booked out months in advance

i get that not everyone's a doctor and they want to help out however they can, but it still weighed kinda heavy on me when i was trying to get The Process started

my wife was lucky enough to get a pretty good doctor (after a 5 month waiting list :v:) who was fine for about a year, but he was old as heck and finally retired due to failing health. he transferred all his patients to this other lady who, two days before a scheduled appointment where my wife needed a prescription refill, sent us a letter saying basically "i'm not doing trans HRT find someone else"

thanks rear end in a top hat

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Shame Boy
Mar 2, 2010

THE HORROR
THE HORROR



as a result of that we had to go to this LGBT resource clinic, which is pretty nice - the signup forms had fields for 'what do you want to be called' and 'what do you identify as', and all the nurses used her correct name and gender and stuff and did everything right... except the actual doctor who used her dead name and male pronouns. buddy you do this for a living how do you get that wrong

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