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Correct me if I misunderstood, but that injunction means forever, right? The hospital will never replace them, and has no motivation to, right?
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Jan 22, 2022 19:00
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ikanreed posted:Correct me if I misunderstood, but that injunction means forever, right? Injunction means temporary. Usually it means the judge is maintaining the now-existing status quo until he can take a preliminary look at the situation and come to an informed decision. Like it takes a day or two for the lawyers to put the contracts in front of him or her, and those contacts probably say at will, but also maybe include a non compete, and also maybe patients at the old hospital are literally going to die of the entire ICU staff quits at once. I don't know what the circumstances of this lawsuit are, but I do know that while reporters try their best to describe lawsuits accurately they do not capture the nuance, so who knows the real situation. Feel free to ask in the legal questions thread in A/T too!
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Jan 22, 2022 19:07
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BigHead posted:Injunction means temporary. Usually it means the judge is maintaining the now-existing status quo until he can take a preliminary look at the situation and come to an informed decision. So in this case there was a preliminary hearing, with a more formal hearing set for Monday. In this case the judge has granted the injunction and said that the parties have until Friday to come to some sort of agreement, otherwise that injuction will last until Monday's hearing. So while it's very possible that this is a sign of things to come it's also the judge maintaining the status quo like you've said. quote:Outagamie County Circuit Court Judge Mark McGinnis granted ThedaCare's request and held an initial hearing Friday morning. The case will get a longer hearing at 10 a.m. Monday. E: Had until Friday, I guess. Today is Saturday, isn't it? christmas boots has issued a correction as of 19:26 on Jan 22, 2022 |
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Jan 22, 2022 19:19
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BigHead posted:Injunction means temporary. Usually it means the judge is maintaining the now-existing status quo until he can take a preliminary look at the situation and come to an informed decision. You should read. It's not the ICU, and they didn't quit "at once." quote:In the complaint, ThedaCare attorneys wrote that the organization found out Dec. 21 that four interventional radiology technicians had accepted offers with Ascension, and learned Dec. 29 that two nurses planned to make the same move. On Jan. 7, they learned one additional nurse planned to quit and work at Ascension. I get why the judge is setting the injunction, because it's a very time-sensitive thing, and I would be okay with it if there were a snowball's chance in hell the judge would tee up a seven-figure fine for the neo-feudalists for filing a bullshit lawsuit, but that's not what's going to happen. Basically, what's happening is this: quote:The funniest thing is they can’t stop the employees from leaving their old employer, just prevent them from starting at the new. So the former employer is just making sure nobody can get care (and also, I assume the real reason they’re doing it, prevent the other hospital from considering applications from their existing staff in the future as too much of a headache) However, odds are the people need their salaries, so they probably can't just quit for 90 days while the poo poo hospital staffs up, unfortunately. I'm hoping these people aren't unionized, because if they are their union should be pitching a loving fit.
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Jan 22, 2022 19:46
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Wisconsin is a "right-to-work" state lmao
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Jan 22, 2022 19:59
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Cup Runneth Over posted:Wisconsin is a "right-to-work" state lmao A common mistake, but this isn't a right-to-work issue, it's at-will employment. Which IIRC is every state except Montana for some weird reason.
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Jan 22, 2022 20:21
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love that the terms for "workers are hosed" are always vague and don't tell you the quoted part.
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Jan 22, 2022 21:28
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Ham Equity posted:They don't have a contract, because this is America, employees don't get contracts, that would require consideration. A I will say that you know you've made it in capitalism if you ever do get a job that has an employment contract.
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Jan 23, 2022 00:17
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Contracts are super common in the game industry, even for low-level emoyees! Because it allows companies to exploit you easier by working you as hard as a regular employee but not provide any benefits, and often much worse pay.
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Jan 23, 2022 01:01
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BigHead posted:
I have no clue whyd id want to ask a bunch of people who can only beep boop thier way to legality and never consider the morality of what they do anything
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Jan 23, 2022 02:44
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CodfishCartographer posted:Contracts are super common in the game industry, even for low-level emoyees! why do you hate the marketplace of ideas
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Jan 23, 2022 02:48
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CodfishCartographer posted:Contracts are super common in the game industry, even for low-level emoyees! contracts are also not unusual in medicine, as are non-competes (outside of california, where non-competes aren't really a thing) it's p normal for physicians to have contracts with notice requirements for quitting of like half a year, for example in new orleans, ochsner is notorious for enforcing non-competes on their staff, and they are as abusive as you can imagine it's a really lovely industry in a lot of ways for workers, my main gripe is that medicine has one of the largest gendered wage gaps (~30%)
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Jan 23, 2022 03:02
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There is a poster on reddit who claims to be one of the workers, and they say that the four who were set to start monday are absolutely not going back to thedacare.
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Jan 23, 2022 03:35
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Lemniscate Blue posted:A common mistake, but this isn't a right-to-work issue, it's at-will employment. Which IIRC is every state except Montana for some weird reason. I'm aware it's not a right-to-work issue, because the employees in question have no right to work. Hence the "lmao."
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Jan 23, 2022 04:31
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Who is Judge Mark McGinnis that he would do something so bullshit? Turns out he's a massive loving chud who got tossed out of truancy court for mocking disabled kids and unilaterally tossing black kids into care without informing their parents. quote:Last month the school board suspended the truancy court for the remainder of the school year after an investigation into complaints a judge, Mark McGinnis, bullied, mocked and belittled students, particular students with mental health issues, and sometimes threatened them with shelter care. Imagine your kid has to go to bullshit court for running late to school and the judge puts them into a care home and you have no idea where they are because the judge refuses to tell you.
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Jan 23, 2022 13:25
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https://twitter.com/CBSSunday/status/1485266433164595206
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Jan 24, 2022 13:49
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Oh good, we're on to the enlisting children stage of societal collapse. Very cool.
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Jan 24, 2022 14:16
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wow how #inspirational !
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Jan 24, 2022 19:43
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DR FRASIER KRANG posted:love that the terms for "workers are hosed" are always vague and don't tell you the quoted part. Look this is a "freedom of Liberty for employment opportunity and innovation state" and that's great for workers* *Who can be ground into nutrient paste at any time for any or no reason to feed other workers or even just to be thrown in the trash who loving cares they are workers
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Jan 24, 2022 19:53
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Megillah Gorilla posted:Who is Judge Mark McGinnis that he would do something so bullshit? lol truancy court. It was always clear it was never about the missed time and just about grinding up kids for the fun of it. Why would you lock a kid who's 5 mins late out and deny them the class? Now they're definitely not going to get an education and they've learned that skipping entirely is the better idea.
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Jan 24, 2022 20:51
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Skippy McPants posted:Oh good, we're on to the enlisting children stage of societal collapse. Very cool. the biden administration is mulling over lowering the age to drive a big-rear end 18 wheeler from 21 to 18 so yea i'd say so
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Jan 24, 2022 21:04
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Judge McGinnis did dismiss the injunction in the end, the nurses can go work at the other place starting tomorrow. We don't know a TON of details because the judge no longer lets people use phones in his court room lmao. Thedacare says they're still gonna sue ascension for poaching their employees though.
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Jan 25, 2022 00:40
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30.5 Days posted:Judge McGinnis did dismiss the injunction in the end, the nurses can go work at the other place starting tomorrow. We don't know a TON of details because the judge no longer lets people use phones in his court room lmao. Seems like a great way to have nobody work for you in the future but I guess I don't have capitalism brain
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Jan 25, 2022 01:17
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tokin opposition posted:Seems like a great way to have nobody work for you in the future but I guess I don't have capitalism brain
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Jan 25, 2022 01:30
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I kind of figured that the judge's injunction was more of a "it's 3:00 on Friday, nobody do anything until I've had time to read". But the plaintiff hospital definitely filed the suit on the last possible Friday for the reason of being petty assholes
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Jan 25, 2022 03:22
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This judge has a history of doing horrible things on a Friday just to make people suffer over the weekend. Like when he was a truancy judge, as I mentioned above, and would send (Black) kids into care homes if they came before him on a Friday and then not tell the parents where their own children were until court reconvened on the Monday. Judges pretty much have 100% discretion as to when they see cases and, given the judge's history, I see no reason to assume it wasn't simply cruelty.
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Jan 25, 2022 08:14
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Megillah Gorilla posted:Like when he was a truancy judge, as I mentioned above, and would send (Black) kids into care homes if they came before him on a Friday and then not tell the parents where their own children were until court reconvened on the Monday. seems like America might be bad
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Jan 25, 2022 13:29
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Yeah, I think even making them seem like reasonable people by explaining how it *could* be used pretty much flies in the face of.... loving everything and everybody that has lead us to this moment. The worst possible interpretation is the one to give the ruling class. Why? Because gently caress em.
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Jan 25, 2022 21:06
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Ham Equity posted:95% of people will never hear about this, but all of the people who do healthcare recruiting in the area will. And when the company is run into the ground, management just moves onto the next cushy job with nary a loving word about it.
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Jan 25, 2022 21:09
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Gene Hackman Fan posted:And when the company is run into the ground, management just moves onto the next cushy job with nary a loving word about it. Oh, the company will be fine. They'll keep underpaying, and the other hospitals in the area will just know better than to make offers to their employees.
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Jan 25, 2022 21:33
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Gene Hackman Fan posted:And when the company is run into the ground, management just moves onto the next cushy job with nary a loving word about it. they might tip off their friend at Bain Capital or some such
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Jan 25, 2022 22:01
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Well hate to interrupt your doom party but the judge held a hearing on Monday and cancelled the injunction. The employees are starting their new job now.
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Jan 26, 2022 19:25
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Megillah Gorilla posted:Imagine your kid has to go to bullshit court for running late to school and the judge puts them into a care home and you have no idea where they are because the judge refuses to tell you. The only thing I never quite fully understand when learning about these kinds of assholes is how they don't end up gunned down in broad daylight more often.
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Jan 26, 2022 22:19
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exmachina posted:Well hate to interrupt your doom party but the judge held a hearing on Monday and cancelled the injunction. The employees are starting their new job now. capitalism is safe for another day.
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Jan 26, 2022 22:42
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exmachina posted:Well hate to interrupt your doom party but the judge held a hearing on Monday and cancelled the injunction. The employees are starting their new job now. Yes, clearly that was the entire problem and not the system that allowed (a) a known rear end in a top hat to stay on the bench to make this kind of ruling, (b) a corporate lawyer with too much free time to file an injunction, and (c) the idea that workers could be prevented from taking their labor elsewhere despite at-will employment not being immediately laughed out because of (a) and (b). That was what was wrong the whole time. Good job, gumshoe, you've fuckin cracked it wide open.
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Jan 26, 2022 23:00
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exmachina posted:Well hate to interrupt your doom party but the judge held a hearing on Monday and cancelled the injunction. The employees are starting their new job now. I'm not cancelling this guillotine order.
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Jan 27, 2022 13:11
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exmachina posted:Well hate to interrupt your doom party but the judge held a hearing on Monday and cancelled the injunction. The employees are starting their new job now. They're not doing the suit, the judge just for the temporary injunction, and did so without any sort of sanction. They're going to continue to sue, and almost certainly not gave any sort of task consequences for it. Even if they lose, it's mission accomplished for getting other area employers to not hire their employees.
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Jan 27, 2022 18:17
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Ham Equity posted:They're not doing the suit, the judge just for the temporary injunction, and did so without any sort of sanction. They're going to continue to sue, and almost certainly not gave any sort of task consequences for it. Even if they lose, it's mission accomplished for getting other area employers to not hire their employees. Yeah that’s my sense to. Although somebody pointed out it also sends a message to their current employees “we’re going to make this a hassle for you if you try to go, babe, let’s just pretend you didn’t think about to leaving me”
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Jan 27, 2022 18:49
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Orange Devil posted:The only thing I never quite fully understand when learning about these kinds of assholes is how they don't end up gunned down in broad daylight more often. Despite how bad things are, they haven't degraded in the aggregate enough for random people to start attacking agents of the state.
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Jan 28, 2022 02:14
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ate poo poo on live tv posted:Despite how bad things are, they haven't degraded in the aggregate enough for random people to start attacking agents of the state. That and the vast majority of people just aren't violent. Most people don't want to physically hurt other people even when wronged especially considering the permanent life ruining consequences for it. Even when going postal was at its peak it was still pretty rare. Wait a few days and get your kids back, or go to prison for life? Tough choice.
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Jan 28, 2022 08:29
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