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FMguru posted:yeah in my experience "contract to hire" jobs often never quite get around to the "to hire" part. worse, its hard as an employee to know if a CtH position is an actually a gateway to a full time offer, or if they were planning to string you along the whole time, until you actually work at the job for a few months and figure out the lay of the land
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Jul 6, 2018 16:14
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So I'm about to start looking for something new in earnest, and this time I'd like to do it right. In the past I've farted around random job boards, or gotten recommendations from friends, and ended up interviewing and accepting the first thing that seemed decent. This time around I wanna do it like a real professional and feel like I have several good choices to chose from. I know the REAL right way to do this is to have been interviewing the entire time I've been employed, and have several standing offers blah blah blah, but I haven't done that. I get LinkedIn spam like everyone else and the first step is to get back to people that had interesting opportunities and see if they're still available... past that, is it just farting around job boards? Talking to third party recruiters? (I know they have a terrible reputation but is it worth it if I have a really specific thing I'm interested in?). I'm in Seattle and have been programming for about 10 years, mostly geographic information systems and more recently big data stuff. Are there any meetups in the area worth going to to network? I go to PuPPy stuff sometimes and I'll continue doing that (Puget Sound Python meetup)
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Jul 6, 2018 16:30
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NoneMoreNegative posted:we do ‘probationary’ periods for new starters - gives new hires six months to their first proper evaluation and if they’re not measuring up contract says we can let them go. ok it’s a bit longer than ‘a month or two at most’ but it still gives you a written-down ‘out’ that you can’t really lawyer against. This is how it generally works in some countries with legally mandated job security (that is, if you're a full time permanent employee, as long as you show up to work and at least try to do your job, it's borderline impossible to fire you - you can get laid off if the company is downsizing, though). For the first six months as a full time employee, the contract is close to how it works in the US - two weeks notice from the employer, no formal notice legally needed from the employee. After those six months though the company needs to decide if they want to get rid of you, and if they don't, the contract automatically converts from a probationary one to a permanent one.
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Jul 6, 2018 16:38
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i won’t speak to anything else but it’s not true that 100% of thirty-party recruiters are terrible. only 95% are. a good heuristic is to only talk to recruiters who initially volunteer the company they’re pitching. ones that do that know that they have something of value to offer besides just knowing that a position is open.
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Jul 6, 2018 16:40
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TheFluff posted:This is how it generally works in some countries with legally mandated job security (that is, if you're a full time permanent employee, as long as you show up to work and at least try to do your job, it's borderline impossible to fire you - you can get laid off if the company is downsizing, though). For the first six months as a full time employee, the contract is close to how it works in the US - two weeks notice from the employer, no formal notice legally needed from the employee. After those six months though the company needs to decide if they want to get rid of you, and if they don't, the contract automatically converts from a probationary one to a permanent one. I think this is also how a university i worked at works... After 6 months probationary period the ability to fire someone has to come from your boss's boss and is apparently pretty hard to get.
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Jul 6, 2018 16:40
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Rex-Goliath posted:This is the correct way to do it but it also assumes that you have the leverage to make that demand
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Jul 6, 2018 16:41
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Bad hiring practices lead to not just hiring people who are objectively terrible, but people who are just about good enough to hold down the job but not much more. These people are the worst. It's near impossible to get rid of them without downsizing, they have no ambition and do as little as possible, and when they eventually get given the responsibility to interview they'll likely hire that really terrible guy to shore up their own position in the company. It's really easy to give up on the unicorn hunt if you're small because there really just aren't enough good candidates, but if you haven't had the posting up for at least a few months, you shouldn't compromise on the quality of the people you hire, IMHO.
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Jul 6, 2018 17:17
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Peeny Cheez posted:A man-animal with leverage over the company? That'll be the day! 
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Jul 6, 2018 17:19
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Jul 6, 2018 17:31
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Kilometres Davis posted:Just did one of those "programming" puzzles that was a mix of figuring out poo poo was in base64, sql injections, fixing bugs, etc to get the next answer. One of the steps was to send a hex value via PATCH to a url. on one hand i understand how this filters for people who can integrate their knowledge into an end-to-end creative process but otoh it sets a bar that very few companies can afford to set if they want to fill positions
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Jul 6, 2018 17:59
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Gazpacho posted:it sets a bar that very few companies can afford to set if they want to fill positions I just don't see the quality of any product comparable to the wishes companies want of engineers, Elon's SpaceX is probably the only exception.
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Jul 6, 2018 18:30
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if you don’t understand the impact a couple bad hires can have on a team, then you should consider yourself lucky. they are almost always a greater negative than a good hire is positive and tend to be much more persistent as well
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Jul 6, 2018 19:49
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MrMoo posted:I just don't see the quality of any product comparable to the wishes companies want of engineers, Elon's SpaceX is probably the only exception. MrMoo posted:I just don't see the quality of any product comparable to the wishes companies want of engineers, Elon's SpaceX is probably the only exception. 🤔
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Jul 6, 2018 20:42
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idk why that double quoted but 🤔
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Jul 6, 2018 20:42
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I've read what you quoted several times and still can't understand it. And not in a "Lol, Plong Busk" way, like: I can't parse what he's saying/trying to say?
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Jul 6, 2018 20:44
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It means I'm applying for the wrong jobs. The interviewers ask questions and non-simple programming tests that appear beyond the skill set of the existing teams, and if you could achieve 100% pass rate on the tests and were a member of the team, the product that the team creates should be significantly better than what it actually is.
MrMoo fucked around with this message at 21:37 on Jul 6, 2018 |
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Jul 6, 2018 21:26
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Ploft-shell crab posted:if you don’t understand the impact a couple bad hires can have on a team, then you should consider yourself lucky. they are almost always a greater negative than a good hire is positive and tend to be much more persistent as well and before that i was the bad hire
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Jul 6, 2018 21:53
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Gazpacho posted:i dreamed that there was another layoff and i was the only one left, and when i tried to quit the company wouldn't let me. i spoke to the HR pawns but they didn't hear me, so I grabbed one and tried to sit her back down to process me but she just kept walking. the global boss insisted that he needed me for a project (do not ask what the project is!)
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Jul 6, 2018 21:59
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the talent deficit posted:you had two open spots and you lost two additional employees in six months and you think your hiring practices were to blame? a) former team b)  i'm the talent deficit and i've never heard of regular attrition. case in point, i was one of the two to leave for a better opportunity on another team. the other was the manager who realized he wanted to go back to being an ic and wanted to go elsewhere to do it.
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Jul 6, 2018 22:00
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My team has 5 open headcount now and I am wondering if anyone has a Hydra they can refer
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Jul 6, 2018 22:45
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Gazpacho posted:today's my last day and the underlined part kinda happened. i sent e-mails to a few different people trying to get my exit interview appointment but still didn't have one, finally a guy who was leaving the same day had to use his exit interview to set up mine did you need that exit interview?
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Jul 7, 2018 01:27
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ShadowHawk posted:My team has 5 open headcount now and I am wondering if anyone has a Hydra they can refer
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Jul 7, 2018 03:52
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ConanTheLibrarian posted:did you need that exit interview? Gazpacho fucked around with this message at 04:17 on Jul 7, 2018 |
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Jul 7, 2018 04:12
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ShadowHawk posted:My team has 5 open headcount now and I am wondering if anyone has a Hydra they can refer 
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Jul 7, 2018 07:37
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Gazpacho posted:yes, to record that i had turned over company property. and to get the details on my health insurance continuation Esh. Health insurance / employer relationships are the worst. Edit: I have a friend thinking of re-patriating to the US, and I keep trying to tell him that this sort of thing is something he needs to expect.
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Jul 7, 2018 07:39
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TimWinter posted:Edit: I have a friend thinking of re-patriating to the US, and I keep trying to tell him that this sort of thing is something he needs to expect. Literally why would someone think this was a good idea, in the year 20-goddamn-18?
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Jul 7, 2018 14:24
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Schadenboner posted:Literally why would someone think this was a good idea, in the year 20-goddamn-18? maybe he's in the uk
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Jul 7, 2018 19:27
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Fiedler posted:maybe he's in the uk even then, there are so many commonwealth countries that have a reasonably healthy society combined with an easy work visa process
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Jul 7, 2018 20:06
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if he’s an American citizen with a work permit in the UK that doesn’t help him right?
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Jul 7, 2018 20:07
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the uk is an absolutely terrible place to live
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Jul 7, 2018 20:56
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Sapozhnik posted:the uk is an absolutely terrible place to live It would be fine if the tech salaries weren't such utter horse poo poo
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Jul 8, 2018 01:26
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TheFluff posted:This is how it generally works in some countries with legally mandated job security (that is, if you're a full time permanent employee, as long as you show up to work and at least try to do your job, it's borderline impossible to fire you - you can get laid off if the company is downsizing, though). For the first six months as a full time employee, the contract is close to how it works in the US - two weeks notice from the employer, no formal notice legally needed from the employee. After those six months though the company needs to decide if they want to get rid of you, and if they don't, the contract automatically converts from a probationary one to a permanent one. My country has this and it mostly works as it's supposed to. 4-6 months trial period, during which you have the same benefits as permanent employees but either side can terminate the contract for pretty much any reason with minimal notice. If you can't figure out whether someone's good in 6 months, maybe it's you that's bad. e: of course software companies here still do grueling months-long recruitment processes, because it's trendy or some poo poo Double Bill fucked around with this message at 12:31 on Jul 9, 2018 |
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Jul 9, 2018 12:25
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just got back on Saturday from my four-month self-arranged “sabbatical” studying Chinese in Taiwan and a job might already be in the works. my team leader from my last job referred me to a nearby industrial design shop that’s desperately looking for firmware developers to replace their only one who is retiring. I don’t think they’re planning on doing a technical interview (thank god) since they know my old team leader well and trust his referral. they want me to come in tomorrow to hear about their project. if they give a good offer and the work is interesting I’ll probably take the job. is it a dumb idea to jump for the first place that seems interested? I’m feeling happy/guilty/lucky that I might not have to search very hard. also, it sounds like I might be doing the firmware all on my own with no mentoring (and i never got any at my first job either. i could use some mentoring because I have little exposure doing stuff like automated testing, more advanced version control, and build automation) but job hunting sucks and the people seem nice. i think I can teach myself a lot but there are limits, obviously, and I won’t learn idiomatic uses as easily on my own. I’ll post again when I learn more thanks for reading, I’ll gladly take any feedback and I’ll to remember to ask the questions in the op when I see them tomorrow.
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Jul 10, 2018 02:02
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qhat posted:It would be fine if the tech salaries weren't such utter horse poo poo it's not just tech salaries, the UK is a low wage dystopia. You have to work in finance and come from the upper class, otherwise you are utterly hosed.
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Jul 10, 2018 12:25
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I guess I got past the first stage of fb interview. speaking to the recruiter was so overwhelmingly intimidating
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Jul 10, 2018 12:34
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Media Bloodbath posted:it's not just tech salaries, the UK is a low wage dystopia. "it's not so bad, most jobs start out low then you get a 100% wage increase when you've stayed a year and proven you're loyal" actual quote from a friend of mine doing some sort of marketing communication in london living in a 1 room flat with her boyfriend
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Jul 10, 2018 12:47
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Why is there so much PHP?
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Jul 10, 2018 14:38
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ADINSX posted:So I'm about to start looking for something new in earnest, and this time I'd like to do it right. In the past I've farted around random job boards, or gotten recommendations from friends, and ended up interviewing and accepting the first thing that seemed decent. This time around I wanna do it like a real professional and feel like I have several good choices to chose from. I sort of have the same question/seeking guidance on this. I've been working @ the same place for 10 years, advancing from a non-technical role to a team lead w/ architecture responsibilities - we've been through some expansions & reorgs that have made work far less meaningful and productive than it once was and I don't think I can continue to struggle knowing what once was anymore. So, looking to get started on the job hunt...but I don't really know where to start.
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Jul 10, 2018 14:45
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FormatAmerica posted:I sort of have the same question/seeking guidance on this. I'm still following up on some linkedin spam, one of them looks pretty good. I also got linkedin premium (Its free for the first month, just have to remember to cancel) and have been using their jobs section (which seems pretty nice), but no response from the couple I sent out so far. I'm taking my time with it though, I don't wanna lateral move into another lovely job, for once I'd like something good (lol not gonna happen)
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Jul 10, 2018 15:28
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FormatAmerica posted:I sort of have the same question/seeking guidance on this. find every coworker you liked that has gone on to another job and see if they're hiring
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Jul 10, 2018 15:31
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