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JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...
you still gently caress up serial at like ~3%

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JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

raminasi posted:

i have always found this harder to put into practice than i'd expected, it's definitely a skill to practice. like in this example i'm imagining a candidate flat-out saying "i don't know" and shrugging. is it better to move on or try to feed them something to prompt them? and if so, what?

at one big place I worked we had pre-defined hints. like the wrap up would be "got thru hints 1/2 on their own, but needed to be given hint 3 and ran w/ it". still think that's extreme for most things, but if you're routinely getting stuck like this it can be good to hash out an expected progression

have you run a coworker thru the questions? spring it on them, no prep, just get a good level-set of how good a job you're doing presenting the problem and managing expectations

like if you get a candidate in the room and your fizz buzz "just write curly braces on a whiteboard" is met with a blank stare and "i don't know" you're not screening well enough


side note, but im a lil shocked y'all didn't see who posted the mebibyte question and know exactly how it'd go lol

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

Ciaphas posted:

oof, second tech interview (different company :toot:) didn't go so hot--seems i stumble hard when my coding is being directly observed, missed a really obvious solution to a problem we were working on with the old tic-tac-toe saw

in my interview for current job at a FAANG, doing a really simple RLE encoder on a whiteboard, my big check was if (c = last_char){

for 5 minutes it sat there on the whiteboard, the silliest little mistake of = instead of ==, while we hashed out other problems in the code, until i noticed it


especially if you haven't sat on the other side of the table, EVERYONE stumbles live. it's fine. don't beat yourself up, don't stress that they're reaching the "wrong" conclusions about you

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

pointsofdata posted:

Does that sort of mistake matter at all though on a whiteboard test?
i mean, i got the job? 'matter' how. the interviewers had noticed and were relieved when i corrected it without them prompting

my typical process as an interviewer for whiteboard coding is giving the problem statement, waiting for a first pass solution or getting stuck, then jumping in and either hinting to get them un-stuck, suggesting test cases that the code doesn't handle, or if it's 100% spot-on extending the problem

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

Notorious b.s.d. posted:

people itt talking about what a background check firm “needs” to provide fundamentally don’t get it

the employer is the paying customer, not the applicant. the background check people will provide anything and everything asked for, including your past aliases. your privacy is irrelevant and they don’t care how uncomfortable it is — you ain’t the one paying the bill.

most companies really only care about salary history and any relevant crimes (e.g. wire fraud, hacking charges, embezzlement) but they will dig up everything in that process

in other countries this poo poo is handled by government bureaus, to avoid the privacy nightmare, but this is the USA, so instead every employer rummages through your private life for fun



p.s. my last two (2) jobs, their background check firms demanded my freaking tax returns. that is public info in many countries but sensitive as hell in the u.s.

boy howdy was I pissed about it, but what was I gonna do? walk, after accepting an offer and resigning my prior job?

they have got you by the short and curlies and they know it

as fun as it is to watch you blow right past an is/ought nuance with condescension right before talking about yet another unique pratfall only specific to your history,

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...


VikingofRock posted:

I'm coming to this straight out of academia (physics doctorate), so I'm not totally sure what to expect.

make everything an analogy to physics, they love that poo poo

Symbolic Butt posted:

he tried his best to savage the process

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

Ciaphas posted:

caught myself going super technical on a phone screen with an HR person instead of a dev, whoops

I've really got to work on expounding myself to folks who don't do software dev directly, makes it hard to answer "why should we hire you" type queries
that's a big part of transitioning to a senior dev

understanding the business value of the technical work you provide, being able to talk about it in the abstract without getting hung up on minor implementation details

you *do* this all the time, like a PM is just a casual who wants to know how far your PoE character is but doesn't need the precise % of your cold resist even if that's your #1 priority

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...
talking to the computers is the easy part y'all

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...
you skip lunch?

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

Notorious b.s.d. posted:

a for-profite stable
personally a fan of andrew calder's earlier works but to each their own

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

gonadic io posted:

i'm so bad at lying

recruiter asked for my current salary, and I was like "oh around X-Y" where X was suitably inflated

them: "no whats the number?"
me: "uhhhh. um. the number? *pause*. X?"

gently caress its not even a lie, just answer the question you want to talk about

"salary is unrepresentative of my total compensation and rather than get bogged down comparing health plans and RSU's, we should just discuss tcomp"

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

Captain Foo posted:

does caffeine count?

a yosposter literally dosed me post-lunch with this stuff

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...
so y'all are saying that NYC companies absolutely refuse to match what CA enshrined in law? still don't understand the attitude some folks cop when they're getting clowned like that

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

Notorious b.s.d. posted:

i'm not an idiot

i have tried to negotiate these things. unsuccessfully. several times.

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

Flat Daddy posted:

apple will be bigly expanding in my city

austin tho?

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

Penisface posted:

beggars can't be choosers though

... there's a whole subreddit tho

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

Ciaphas posted:

honest but nice
hmm,

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...
e: answered

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

FMguru posted:

the only thing worse than having a job is not having a job

and, for my sins, they gave me one

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

Woodstock posted:

Is there a noticeable difference in available opportunities or $$$ with either? They both seem like a step up from where I am now.

who cares, come do low level embedded work w/ me out on the west coast

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...
y'all some choosy beggars itt

ive had phone screens where there was obviously another person in the room who had the answers, I've interviewed 15y+ software architects who couldn't write a function signature

a PR out in space has zero connection to the resource walking in the door. the only time i actually looked at a candidate's GitHub it was filled with lovely C++ "katas" that whiffed on the rule-of-3, if I was making a determination on that alone it would've been a "no"

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

Arcsech posted:

I kinda suspect they are actually harmful to your chances in tech because “lol what businessy idiot writes a cover letter”

CL's are a jouer-le-jou thing, there's nobody out there dumping on them like this, but occasionally your resume will land in some old-schoolers hands and not having one is a rejection. they're not hard to write, and you'll use the same info to regurgitate happy facts about the company at a later stage anyway

you don't have to, but idk if you get to Not do it and simultaneously whine about not having a job v0v

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

ADINSX posted:

how do i get on yosslack??
which one

iospace posted:

I actually had someone say "thanks but no thanks" for my inability to remember CS 101 terms but would certainly recognize them if given examples.
yes? someone was probably offering a job, not a seat in class?

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

mekkanare posted:

Interviewer asked me how my current job makes sure current practices when designing software are best and I had nothing for him. Sorry dude, if it compiles and doesn't mung up the rest of the system somehow it's probably going in. I liked the part where he mentioned how there would be very little legacy code to deal with, and I wanted to mention that last week a coworker found code still in use that invovled checking for people born before 1900.

"I'm sorry, it was my understanding that i was a candidate for this position was based on my skills and experience and anything proprietary to my current company was not the impetus for this interview, is that not the case?"

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

ShadowHawk posted:

systems engineer and doesn't even...
im curious how you're imagining these interviews going, ive interviewed for this role or something sharing the title

it did not include any

ShadowHawk posted:

traditional coding tests or CS quizzes

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...
nbsd are you actually asking for, or are even pretending to be open to, advice? or just loudly half-bragging about your search

i can't even recall you helping anyone else out, just talkin poo poo about everyone on both sides of every historical event that's been brought up for no reason

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...
idk its like a interposer that watches for DDoS or other common exploits and shuts things down if they're fishy

that's the pitch at least

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...
why do folks hire pentesters instead of just ramping up a whole persistent red team with salaries and benefits

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

Blinkz0rz posted:

i'm gonna keep believing it sorta works because my salary
same

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

Notorious b.s.d. posted:

parliament is crippled by some combination of cupidity and cynicism
:swoon:

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

Ciaphas posted:

i don't want nor feel qualified to call it mine
you've already spent more time agonizing over this pleasantry than the sum total of persons asking you consider your answer

"i've been working on CRUD apps that feed into $CLASSIFIED"
"well, my background is in the MIC, but due to some recent changes and self-searching i want to move into the broader software community"

christ my business card had "digital systems engineer" when i conned folks into letting me write software

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

bob dobbs is dead posted:

I went to plutocrat school and my parents are just upper middle class

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...
the one thing i haven't seen mentioned about PIPs is: dont sign

you'll be pressured to, but the only thing you really *need* to do is sign to acknowledge receiving the document, make it clear that's what you're doing

im sure you can dredge up a michealochurch about why this is the best course of action

graduated 2005, 178+10, rsu/espp mean my W2 comes in at ~280

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

iospace posted:

I'm curious as to your reasoning to why not sign?
i have none, this fella does
http://sasamat.xen.prgmr.com/michaelochurch/wp/2012/12/24/never-sign-a-pip-heres-why/

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...
y'all have never heard of a "fall guy"??

they're not useless, they're getting yelled at. presumably the yelling meeting is happening whether or not we hire anyone to specifically go endure it, might as well sucker someone who can't easily find something else

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

ADINSX posted:

I've worked at lots of companies that have gotten by just fine without anyone being yelled at, especially not someone who's sole job it is to be yelled at.
i bet you've never even rented a face job white guy to pretend to be an investor

what's that? your employment history isn't representative of every culture on the planet wow who could have known oh my stars

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

ADINSX posted:

lol yikes. Except the point of the "white guy investor" is obvious, they think that's going to impress someone so they hire him to sit in meetings and thoughtfully take off his glasses or something. But sure ok I'll try and be more open minded and respectful of the valued cultural practice of *checks notes* hiring someone for no other purpose than to abuse them.
i wasn't asking for "respect" or justifying the practice, just pointing out that maybe, just maybe, something actually exists that you haven't personally experienced and would find less than ideal? that maybe the poster can be taken at their word and given relevant advice to the situation instead of just writing it off as categorically impossible?

im sorry that you find this insinuation so personally insulting. super weird that no job category or classification has ever happened without you being personally appraised of it's existence beforehand, but i guess you're the expert

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

Piano Maniac posted:

I have bad news - I ran through the company papers with my wife and man, she was not pleased.
Apparently it's a common scheme in Japan where they take obviously unqualified staff as IT people, throw them at large corps to get yelled at.
Guess who's the unqualified piece of rear end - that's me.

God, I just want a good loving job here. Just because I made a few bad mistakes in the past of getting a
lovely low-end jobs way up until I am 27 doesn't mean I am doomed to mediocrity and working in the loving service industry.
Let me use my sperg brain damnnnnnnnnnnnnnn

hey, it turns out this literally never happens because ADINSX doesn't think your second-hand description makes sense as a role long term, so you should definitely ignore your wife's opinion and go for the job!!

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

KidDynamite posted:

What am I even supposed to do there?

can u expand what you mean here

"how do i get past a garbage hardcoded screen?" you figure out their game and dumb down your answers, get your resume to someone inside beyond the filter, or stop caring and move on numbers-game style

you're not going to have this teachable moment where you explain why the crude filter sucks and is bad fit for purpose, the person giving it likely doesn't care that much even if you broke out of the script

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JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

Feisty-Cadaver posted:

judge them on poo poo they are actually going to do in their role
great idea!

ok i checked and its a bunch of proprietary garbage, and for Some Reason i can't get candidates to sign extensive NDA's for a white boarding session??

wait wait what if we just focus on some questions that have this property:

Feisty-Cadaver posted:

should a non-garbage programmer know how to do that? of course.

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