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Cinara
Jul 15, 2007


Man Ascension mode starts getting brutal, on 5 now for Silent and even though they are only small buffs to monsters even a couple damage extra per attack is painful. Elites and bosses are super scary unless you have a deck that excels at single target or defense and multi monster normal encounters can get out of hand quickly.

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IronSaber
Feb 24, 2009

oh yes oh god yes form the head FORM THE HEAD unghhhh...

Thought I had a thing going with getting the Vajira artifact, Limit Break, and some Heavy Blades. Couldn't get them to draw soon enough, died to the City boss.

Huzzah!
Sep 14, 2007

too chill to win

Yay, I finally got a win with the Silent. And it was rather clown shoes starting with trading the starting relic for a boss relic and getting snecko eye. After that, I only picked cards that cost 2 or more, with the exception of one flying knee. the other I got from transforming a stab. At the end, the deck was like 2 chokes, 2 flying knees, 2 leg sweeps, 2 of that deal 15 draw 2 next turn, a pair of multi hit cards, 2 bullet times, a nightmare and like a pair of block and stabs. The monsters just melted away. To top it all off, I also got Gambling Chip and that combos so well with snecko eye.

drat this game is sweet.

GreyjoyBastard
Mar 28, 2010

I've made a huge mistake.

also got my first win, i leaned pretty heavily into curse relics so it was pretty janky but fairly effective

until I blundered into the Divine Fountain halfway through act 3 which cleared all of my like nine curse cards and suddenly I was throwing shivs everywhere and drawing more cards and getting block and strength from the number of attacks and two-rounded The Awakened in the boss fight once it, you know, awoke

i got the "kill a boss while taking no damage" on the final boss fight

edit: also getting the "you are now a vampire, lol" event on a Silent with a reasonable amount of defensiveness is pretty hilarious

GreyjoyBastard fucked around with this message at Jan 28, 2018 around 08:08

KataraniSword
Apr 22, 2008

but at least I don't have
a MLP or MSPA avatar.
I am my own man.

please knock Mom! posted:

The silent relic is made for trading in tho

I still don't like trading in the Silent relic because landing on the Calling Bell really, really hurts Silent, they don't have much of a good way of dealing with Curses like Ironchad does.

And then you get Normality/Pain/Regret and your run is ruined before it even starts and you either have to go whale-less or try to struggle through with your pre-gimped deck.

Why yes, this is a heap of salt from exactly that happening five minutes ago.

Chin Strap
Nov 24, 2002

I failed my TFLC Toxx, but I no longer need a double chin strap

Pillbug

Am I crazy or has the latest patch started not showing relic descriptions on the loot screen? Beat the first boss and didn't get any tooltips when hovering over relics, had to pick one blind.

Beasteh
Feb 12, 2012

I'M QUESTIONING MY EXISTENCE AND THIS IDIOT JUST WANTS TO PEE OFF A WALL


Are you playing the beta or 'live early access' version?

Either way you can submit a bug report

Jedit
Dec 10, 2011

Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014
Proudly supporting Lowtax's medical care 2018


Just got my first Silent victory. Didn't save the deck, but it was a fast cycling Poison Power deck with no attacks other than Neutralise, one Poisoned Stab and an Endless Agony I got from transforming my last three Strikes. Quad Fumes by the end, but what mostly carried it was Dexterity, that card which gives 1 Block whenever you play a card (upgraded to make it Innate), and double Blur. Only notable relics were the Bag of Preparation, which meant I started every fight with nine cards and was almost certain to get a Fumes, and the Anchor to make sure I could play things without dying. Final boss was Time Eater; he purged my poison once at around 50 stacks, but I was naturally applying 10 per turn and had a second Catalyst to finish it.

GreyjoyBastard
Mar 28, 2010

I've made a huge mistake.

turns out that the magic flower (healing is 50% more effective during combat) buffs the fighter hero's after-combat heal

i was bummed about drawing it for my whale gift (sacrificed half my current health) and now i am not

or at least, less so

SSJ_naruto_2003
Oct 12, 2012



Look for vampire squad.

Beasteh
Feb 12, 2012

I'M QUESTIONING MY EXISTENCE AND THIS IDIOT JUST WANTS TO PEE OFF A WALL


Ironclad makes very good use of the bites if you're building him defensively (you should be)

Barricade up and just turtle while healing to full every fight (remove 1-2 bites tho)

Apotheosis/Armaments+ makes the bites a whole lot better

IAmThatIs
Nov 17, 2014


Yo Ascension mode is haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaard. I have runs that on normal difficulty would be absolutely broken feel balanced

Sloober
Apr 1, 2011


Beasteh posted:

Ironclad makes very good use of the bites if you're building him defensively (you should be)

Barricade up and just turtle while healing to full every fight (remove 1-2 bites tho)

Apotheosis/Armaments+ makes the bites a whole lot better

Apotheosis makes every deck better

GreyjoyBastard
Mar 28, 2010

I've made a huge mistake.

SSJ_naruto_2003 posted:

Look for vampire squad.

never found it, had a pretty janky deck that nevertheless carried me to the final boss but couldn't outrace the scaling damage of the Geometry Abominations

that card that exhausts a card to draw 2-3 cards is pretty good even when you don't have an infinite combo ready to roll

Sloober posted:

Apotheosis makes every deck better

i'm seriously considering keeping 200g or whatever in the bank under normal circumstances just in case it comes up in the shop because holy poo poo

foutre
Sep 4, 2011

RIP ZEEZ


I just had two shiv-spam Silent runs end on Time Keeper as the final boss. Got it to sub 100 each time, but the '12 spells and you're done' was just too much. Someday I'll get a Silent win, god willing...

Cinara
Jul 15, 2007


Yea, my last two attempts at ascension 5 on Silent have ended at Time Keeper, he just shuts down so many of the potential Silent builds.

Stallion Cabana
Feb 14, 2012
1; Get into Grad School

2; Become better at playing Tabletop, both as a player and as a GM/ST/W/E

3; Get rid of this goddamn avatar.



The 'have 3 or less cards in your deck, hand, and graveyard' achievement seems to trigger at 4, not three. Unless it means each, but it says Combined.

Tank Ironclad is just so good if you get Barricade and Impervious. Not seen in this deck is that it also has a Combust and an Offering, with three upgraded Ruptures and an Apotheosis.

Note: after saying that I lost because I got against Donu and Deca and Barricade was at the bottom of my deck with no armor around it, even going in with full HP. Sometimes you can just get RNG'd. Glad I got those achievements because I'd have been salty for losing.

Stallion Cabana fucked around with this message at Jan 29, 2018 around 05:27

LifeLynx
Feb 27, 2001

Dang so this is like looking over his shoulder in real-time

Grimey Drawer

The game isn't as responsive as I'd like on a Windows 10 tablet (Yoga 720). Lots of things require double-tapping, and there's sometime a delay when dragging a card's targeting arrow that makes me target the wrong thing or use the wrong card. I'm sure it'll get ironed out.

Has anyone else noticed that save and quit doesn't quite save? I have to redo rooms a lot of the time. Wondering if it's because of the Steam Cloud, but I switch between my desktop and laptop a lot.

ZiegeDame
Aug 21, 2005

YUKIMURAAAA!


Stallion Cabana posted:

Note: after saying that I lost because I got against Donu and Deca and Barricade was at the bottom of my deck with no armor around it, even going in with full HP. Sometimes you can just get RNG'd. Glad I got those achievements because I'd have been salty for losing.

Ask me about the run I had where I got a Barricade early then dug up a Bottled Tornado. Turns out an Innate Barricade is pretty fuckin' nuts, especially when you get the Anchor. Before I thought I'd prefer if Barricade's upgrade gave innate rather than -1 cost. Now I'm not sure if that's a good idea.

Verviticus
Mar 13, 2006

Security? Please escort the fan in section 106, row 16, seat 1 out of the building right now and bar him from coming here again!


sometimes snake eye is fun

KataraniSword
Apr 22, 2008

but at least I don't have
a MLP or MSPA avatar.
I am my own man.

Sloober posted:

Apotheosis makes every deck better

Apotheosis means you don't need to waste campfire time honing up your attacking/defending skills if you don't want to, just a few powers you're absolutely not going to be willing to wait until after Apotheosis to play. (Footwork, Demon Form, Barricade, and Apotheosis itself are the big ones I'm thinking of.)

Which means if you've got a Girya/Shovel/Peace Pipe you can just go to town. Alternately, you can be more liberal with your healing, or reprioritize campfires as less necessary.

foutre posted:

I just had two shiv-spam Silent runs end on Time Keeper as the final boss. Got it to sub 100 each time, but the '12 spells and you're done' was just too much. Someday I'll get a Silent win, god willing...

I've gotten Time Keeper 7 out of the last 8 runs I've done. I'm seriously starting to hate that loving snail.

At least poison-spam Silent has SOME options against Time Keeper, since Fumes will still do its work even if the rear end in a top hat clears it halfway through the fight.

Alternately, you could build up poison until the next turn or two will drop it to half health, and then cram a Catalyst or three in its face.


EDIT:


Sometimes the RNG just flips you the bird. (This was on a shiv build, so it was basically either a dead relic or actively detrimental. I've never seen a build where I go "OH BOY, ORRERY".)

KataraniSword fucked around with this message at Jan 29, 2018 around 09:35

Walh Hara
May 11, 2012


I'm a lot more consistent with Th Silent compared to the Ironclad.

With the Silent every build has the same core (backflips, flying knees, deflect, piercing wail and some card draw stuff) and tons of cards that are good no matter your strategy (terror, footwork, afterimage, escape plan, glass knife, die die die, alchemize, adrenaline, etc). It's perfectly fine and recommended to take a lot of cards, in my current win streak I almost always won with 30+ cards. For damage (win condition), you have a plenty of different tricks: shivs + accuracy, 0 power attacks + finisher/thousand cuts/envenom, outmaneuver + flying knees + skewer, multiple ways to abuse poison, etc. Most of these builds can easily be combined though, just never start taking poison skills before you have noxious/catalyst. There are some gimmick builds as well, but they require certain relics to be very effective.

The ironclad on the other hand has a lot more extremely strong gimmicks. Perfected strike, searing blow, limit break, evolve, barricade, dark embrace, rupture, etc can all result in extremely strong decks if you build around them. The difficult part is that cards that are good in one deck might be worthless in another, especially since many of these gimmicks require a thin deck. Before you decide on your gimmick it's extremely tough to know which cards to pick up, as there aren't that many universal pick. If you're lucky and find good cards for some gimmick the game is really easy (much easier than a typical Silent run), but if you don't have an obvious gimmick (or found one too late) the game is more difficult compared to a standard Silent deck.

That said, Ironclad is probably still better in ascension mode simply because he has much higher potential and is less countered by the time eater.

KataraniSword posted:

EDIT:


Sometimes the RNG just flips you the bird. (This was on a shiv build, so it was basically either a dead relic or actively detrimental. I've never seen a build where I go "OH BOY, ORRERY".)

The RNG is maybe compensating for you already having 3 ridiculous relics. Ice Cone could easily be a boss relic and The Silent can (and should) very easily abuse mummified hand.

Beasteh
Feb 12, 2012

I'M QUESTIONING MY EXISTENCE AND THIS IDIOT JUST WANTS TO PEE OFF A WALL


Orrery is good actually because it reads 'add 2-3 good cards your deck is missing, possibly more'

Astrolabe is a bit more random but it turns your strikes into possibly good cards, and they are always upgraded

KataraniSword
Apr 22, 2008

but at least I don't have
a MLP or MSPA avatar.
I am my own man.

Beasteh posted:

Orrery is good actually because it reads 'add 2-3 good cards your deck is missing, possibly more'

The problem with Orrery is that you have to take all five, and very rarely will all five be good, even for Silent. Which means more removal you have to do to slim your deck down. I've just never at all had it help a run. Maybe if it and the Ice Cream swapped places, I'd be more generous, but then you could get into awkward situations where an event/shovel just shoves a relic in your hands without you being able to turn it down and surprise now your ten-card rapidcycle deck now gets a full extra hand bloating it.

Walh Hara posted:

I'm a lot more consistent with Th Silent compared to the Ironclad.

The Silent has a lot more cards that are "always grab", and a lot less priority on keeping deck size thin. Between Backflip and Acrobatics, you can generate a lot of deck cycling, and past that, defense is always welcome for a Silent deck.

The problem is that there's a lot more counters for card spam than single power plays. There's a few things that can hard counter almost any Silent deck (Time Eater comes to mind immediately, but the Big Red Guy on floor 1 also bears a mention), but nothing that really counters "build up hundreds of defense with Barricade" or "get a bajillion Strength with Demon Form/Limit Break", which is followed by Body Slam or really just about any basic attack, respectively. Admittedly, status abuse hurts smaller decks a lot more, but Ironclad has a build to work around that, too.

EDIT: Okay, so, uh. Tip to anybody reading this: The beta and stable build store their saves in separate directories. If you've been playing a while and switch from one to the other, you might want to copy them over.

KataraniSword fucked around with this message at Jan 29, 2018 around 11:55

Huzzah!
Sep 14, 2007

too chill to win

KataraniSword posted:

The problem with Orrery is that you have to take all five, and very rarely will all five be good, even for Silent. Which means more removal you have to do to slim your deck down. I've just never at all had it help a run. Maybe if it and the Ice Cream swapped places, I'd be more generous, but then you could get into awkward situations where an event/shovel just shoves a relic in your hands without you being able to turn it down and surprise now your ten-card rapidcycle deck now gets a full extra hand bloating it.

I don't know about before, but I got it in a recent run and you don't have to take all 5 cards from the Orrey.

Walh Hara
May 11, 2012


Yes, Orrey simply gives you 5 times a "pick 1 out of 3 cards" event, and you can skip as you want.

Beasteh
Feb 12, 2012

I'M QUESTIONING MY EXISTENCE AND THIS IDIOT JUST WANTS TO PEE OFF A WALL


You can skip the Orrery choices, just leave them on the table and back out of a selection

KataraniSword
Apr 22, 2008

but at least I don't have
a MLP or MSPA avatar.
I am my own man.

Beasteh posted:

You can skip the Orrery choices, just leave them on the table and back out of a selection

I don't remember it working like that before, I remember it locking me into getting all five cards. Either they changed something or I missed the "skip" button.

Minrad
Sep 26, 2007

I will never forget your smiles. I feel like I saved the world today. Just feeling like that is enough for me.



Nah you can definitely skip it. I used it to get 8 hp with singing bowl before lol

IcePhoenix
Sep 18, 2005

you're a flower. you're also a rainbow and a river. you are the manifestation of all perfection and i want to i don't fucking know, but you are fucking perfect


Stallion Cabana posted:



The 'have 3 or less cards in your deck, hand, and graveyard' achievement seems to trigger at 4, not three. Unless it means each, but it says Combined.

Tank Ironclad is just so good if you get Barricade and Impervious. Not seen in this deck is that it also has a Combust and an Offering, with three upgraded Ruptures and an Apotheosis.

Note: after saying that I lost because I got against Donu and Deca and Barricade was at the bottom of my deck with no armor around it, even going in with full HP. Sometimes you can just get RNG'd. Glad I got those achievements because I'd have been salty for losing.

You have 31 cards in your deck but only four total in your hand, draw, and discard. What? How did you get so many powers/exhaust that fast?

Jedit
Dec 10, 2011

Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014
Proudly supporting Lowtax's medical care 2018


IcePhoenix posted:

You have 31 cards in your deck but only four total in your hand, draw, and discard. What? How did you get so many powers/exhaust that fast?

There are several Ironclad cards which exhaust your entire hand.

IronSaber
Feb 24, 2009

oh yes oh god yes form the head FORM THE HEAD unghhhh...

I love having Flex and Limit Break+. You can just buff yourself as many times as you want, since you play Flex, get the Strength, then keep some Strength after Buff expires after the turn after playing Limit Break.

please knock Mom!
Nov 9, 2011

Goddomme Jan!



Up to ascension level four now. It's definitely loving hard, and I'm not sure this is the kind of difficulty I enjoy.

Stallion Cabana
Feb 14, 2012
1; Get into Grad School

2; Become better at playing Tabletop, both as a player and as a GM/ST/W/E

3; Get rid of this goddamn avatar.

IcePhoenix posted:

You have 31 cards in your deck but only four total in your hand, draw, and discard. What? How did you get so many powers/exhaust that fast?

I had an upgraded True Grit from Apothesis; that's the card in my discard pile that you can't see.

I was specifically farming the 'have 100 Strength' 'have 999 block' and 'have 3 or less cards total' achievements in this fight; because the slimes constantly respawned I could knock them down to one left, then just turtle while they regrew.

I had a bunch of powers as well as exhaust cards, so I used them, then just used True Grit to slowly thin my deck over and over again until it got down to this point. They couldn't hurt me so I was perfectly safe to play it slowly.

This probably took around 40 or 50 turns. If you look at my Block and Strength, you can see I have 999 block and 999 strength; both are as high as they go, and I got it just by playing Entrench and Limit Break over and over again.

Stallion Cabana fucked around with this message at Jan 29, 2018 around 20:01

IcePhoenix
Sep 18, 2005

you're a flower. you're also a rainbow and a river. you are the manifestation of all perfection and i want to i don't fucking know, but you are fucking perfect


Stallion Cabana posted:

I had an upgraded True Grit from Apothesis; that's the card in my discard pile that you can't see.

I was specifically farming the 'have 100 Strength' 'have 999 block' and 'have 3 or less cards total' achievements in this fight; because the slimes constantly respawned I could knock them down to one left, then just turtle while they regrew.

I had a bunch of powers as well as exhaust cards, so I used them, then just used True Grit to slowly thin my deck over and over again until it got down to this point. They couldn't hurt me so I was perfectly safe to play it slowly.

This probably took around 40 or 50 turns. If you look at my Block and Strength, you can see I have 999 block and 999 strength; both are as high as they go, and I got it just by playing Entrench and Limit Break over and over again.

That's hilarious.

Cinara
Jul 15, 2007


Awakened One is such a joke, I had 9 power cards in my deck and played every single one of them turn 1 and still beat him without taking damage. The only deck that has any issues with him is SUPER low damage decks that might get attritioned by the 10 regen, but I have never gotten to the final boss with a deck that bad.

On to Ascension 6!

Minrad
Sep 26, 2007

I will never forget your smiles. I feel like I saved the world today. Just feeling like that is enough for me.



please knock Mom! posted:

Up to ascension level four now. It's definitely loving hard, and I'm not sure this is the kind of difficulty I enjoy.

I like the increased elite count, not so much the number increases on everything else, cuz yeah: it does get a lot harder

Lately I've been enjoying searing blow decks. Feels kinda memey but it's also hilarious when you can one shot every mob by the second half of floor 2 and up.

Stallion Cabana
Feb 14, 2012
1; Get into Grad School

2; Become better at playing Tabletop, both as a player and as a GM/ST/W/E

3; Get rid of this goddamn avatar.

Can you explain how you get a Searing Blow deck to work?

I assume things like Armaments, small deck counts, and keeping HP high so you don't have to rest at campfires are the major focuses?

Minrad
Sep 26, 2007

I will never forget your smiles. I feel like I saved the world today. Just feeling like that is enough for me.



Yep, that's exactly it. Trim the strikes and block up until searing blow lands in hand again. Armaments is too rng but the skill that clones attacks could be good if you get list thin enough (like 8 or less, or around 10 with some card draw effects)

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Beasteh
Feb 12, 2012

I'M QUESTIONING MY EXISTENCE AND THIS IDIOT JUST WANTS TO PEE OFF A WALL


Had a pretty cool small cycle heavy powers based Silent deck with bird faced urn healing me to full every fight

Predator > adrenaline > outmaneuver with tactician and a bunch of discard effects to cheat energy every turn

Of course the last boss was Time Eater

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