|
So I'm most of the way through the game and I feel like I should have unlocked more tweaks and tweak slots at this point. I've only got three slots even though I collected a bunch of schematics, and it hasn't let me craft anything outside of the first six or so, even though there's space in the collection screen for eight more. Is my game bugged or am I just missing something major here?
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2018 02:33
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 18, 2024 22:18 |
|
|
kidcoelacanth posted:So I'm most of the way through the game and I feel like I should have unlocked more tweaks and tweak slots at this point. I've only got three slots even though I collected a bunch of schematics, and it hasn't let me craft anything outside of the first six or so, even though there's space in the collection screen for eight more. Is my game bugged or am I just missing something major here? There's only the three slots that's it. And I expect you just haven't found the schematics for the rest of the tweaks.
|
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2018 02:39
|
|
|
I don't think I've seen a new one on the crafting menu since Breathless and I've definitely picked up schematics since then vOv e: That aside I really dig the hell out of this game and now to go back to banging my head against this gauntlet in the impact zone.
|
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2018 02:41
|
|
|
The schematic might have just had duplicates for previous ones. You can equip multiple of the same tweak for stacking bonuses.
|
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2018 02:42
|
|
|
Okay I beat it. Really loved this game, it was a bit obtuse at times but every time I figured out a boss or puzzle it was super satisfying. This game might have the most expressive pixel art I've ever seen, Robin's a pretty drat well realized character despite never talking because of it. Mina is just wonderful and fun and Black's story was a hell of a thing. Good game imo
|
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2018 03:37
|
|
|
good game, but great story
|
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2018 03:44
|
|
|
SirSamVimes posted:good game, but great story Hell,  Also, the tag team boss fight in the pirate base with Mina was my favorite boss of the game solely for the way the character you're not playing as leans against the wall as they wait for a tag.
|
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2018 03:46
|
|
|
kidcoelacanth posted:Hell, also the fact that you're defeating the boss through the power of HIGH FIVES and FRIENDSHIP
|
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2018 03:51
|
|
|
The part where most of the unique tweaks don't show up until later (or rely on doing semi-obtuse sidequests) was kind of a bummer, I'll admit. Though I don't know for sure when some of them were more accessible given that I ended up missing most of the unique ones until postgame. Not that many of them are all that useful. Bomb detonation would be a useful speedrun tool maybe, just to save a second every time there's a bomb block to move. Blast radius probably wouldn't matter. Double jump was hella fun to run around with, and wavey beam was great. The secret finder was literally the last secret I found so, lol.
|
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2018 04:10
|
|
|
The story of the game was engrossing enough that I've been dwelling on it for the past couple of days and a theory popped into my head that's probably not the real explanation but was fun to contemplate. Spoilers for the entire game follow: Do we know for certain that birdman is actually a villain here? We know that Ivory is essentially holding the planet together and when fully extracted things disintegrate; it's implied that's why the larger moon is fractured in the sky, when it was mined for too much Ivory. We also know that extensive mining of Ivory from the planet itself is hastening it's destruction, and that the higher-ups of One Concern already had plans to bug out well before Royal accelerated the process. The planet is some kind of larger machine and it's implied that the humans we see in the game arrived on the planet from external ships. We don't know specifically what the purpose of the planet machine IS, but it's not that big of a stretch to assume that it's either managing or producing ivory, or needs ivory in order to do whatever it's supposed to be doing, like every other piece of technology humans had developed there. So maybe from the Birdman's perspective the latter half of the game plays out roughly as: intercepting a transmission from the omega controller once Royal has blasted it into space along the lines of "poo poo'S hosed AND I AM NONFUNCTIONAL SEND HELP", flies to the planet-machine, detects dangerously low Ivory levels, is drawn to a strange hairless monkey on the smaller moon, and after losing interest in him dives into the planet to start fixing it. Because he is a mechanic, right? And mechanics fix things. The birdman brings up a fuel gauge right before the last boss fight but since we can't understand him is he saying "my ship needs to be refuelled" or is he saying "the ivory keeping the planet together is dangerously low, dumbass"? It's not like the gauge he brings up is attached to his ship in any way, it comes right out of the ground. He flips through a few pages trying to figure out how to translate complex technical documents for a planet machine before deciding gently caress it, I'll just kill the hairless monkey like I did the other one on the moon, but this time it doesn't go well for him. Imagine his last prolonged screeching as something like "FINE, YOU PRIMITIVE, MINE ALL THE IVORY AND BLOW UP THE PLANET YOU'RE STANDING ON THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU DEAL WITH AMATEURS-" and then his ship falls on his head. It'd be a very Nier/Nier Automata conclusion to be killing the one person who could fix everything.
|
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2018 04:15
|
|
|
He probably wants to refuel his ship from the planet, but considering that harvesting ivory is what's resulting in the planet's destruction I'm pretty sure he's just trying to get what little he can before the planet goes altogether. Just before Robin confronts him, you can see white stuff flowing through tubes into the Starworm. Side note: I just wanna say the animation of the birb emphatically pointing at the ivory guage, squawking angrily, then shuffling frustratedly through his notes is perfect. Also, I think that the fact that the Chemico Contra is now doing their experiments openly means that there's hope for the society moving towards other forms of energy instead of blindly harvesting ivory, especially now that the effects of ivory harvesting are more public knowledge and have been clearly seen. SirSamVimes fucked around with this message at 04:21 on Jan 28, 2018 |
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2018 04:19
|
|
|
I think that the planet was basically a gigantic fuel reserve for his worm ship. He probably exists and lives on a time scale much longer than humans, at some point Darland and another suit were talking about the kind of time frame they had on the planet and they said something like it was originally 50 years but now might be down to 13? So I think when their predecessors found this place and knew enough about it to know when the worm would be back and were trying to get as much ivory and then skedaddle before he did. I'm not entirely sure why it ended up turning into a whole religious cult thing, at first I thought that was purely a smokescreen by the people behind the scenes, but maybe they ended up buying into their own propaganda? Anyway yeah I think Royal loving up the Omega controller signaled him that something was up with his fuel reserve/factory whatever and he headed back which is what sent the Concern into a complete panic. They'd basically completely hosed up his machine and ran out of time to get away before he came back.
|
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2018 04:46
|
|
|
I dunno, I think the idea that the bird's just there to refuel is kind of at odds with one of the throughlines of the game, which is that mechanics fix things. The bird fights with a wrench, which suggests to me that it's a mechanic, and with the planet apparently being a machine, that suggests to me it's there to try to fix the machine; albeit that it doesn't give a poo poo about the humans living on it.
|
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2018 04:53
|
|
|
Reveilled posted:I dunno, I think the idea that the bird's just there to refuel is kind of at odds with one of the throughlines of the game, which is that mechanics fix things. The bird fights with a wrench, which suggests to me that it's a mechanic, and with the planet apparently being a machine, that suggests to me it's there to try to fix the machine; albeit that it doesn't give a poo poo about the humans living on it. Well I'm not saying he wouldn't want to fix it, it's his ivory source. But the Concern seem to think they've hosed it up beyond repair and it's safe to say a bunch of people living on his machine and stealing its fuel is not the way it was intended to function.
|
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2018 04:59
|
|
|
So of all the achievements can you get 10 in a normal playthrough and 1 in the ng+ mode?
|
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2018 05:21
|
|
|
Yeah the only cheevo you can't get on your first playthrough is the one for beating it on challenge mode.
|
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2018 06:31
|
|
|
Man oh man the secret bosses are extremely good. edit: Here's an interesting discovery. If you max out Mina's hidden friendship meter through dialogue, she fights alongside you in the final boss. This was discovered in a speedrun which got the correct answers due to the fact that skipping cutscenes gives you random answers. I'm guessing the reason this had yet to be seen normally is everyone says Royal is "a friend" instead of "noone". SirSamVimes fucked around with this message at 10:46 on Jan 28, 2018 |
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2018 09:38
|
|
|
Wait, does she still get back together with Samba? Because there are mild implications there. also im not sure who wouldn't dunk royal the little poo poo
|
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2018 14:16
|
|
|
lol I'm missing one chest and it's not on the map
|
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2018 15:29
|
|
|
Regy Rusty posted:at first I thought that was purely a smokescreen by the people behind the scenes, but maybe they ended up buying into their own propaganda? There is that part where Black talked about lies become doctrine after a long enough time frame. She meant it derisively against the Isi then but most dialogue in the game is kinda designed to reflect a larger theme and it fits with the One Concern pretty well, too. Really Pants posted:lol I'm missing one chest and it's not on the map Going from personal experience I assume it's either (spoilering it in case people don't like map spoilers or whatever) in the first area of the game, the screen to the left of Robin's house. If you jump up into the ceiling where the bombable rocks were you can find a secret room. Or it's in the snow mountain region, in the bottom-most room that's filled with water. If you just hug the bottom of the room you will eventually find an opening that leads to a different room. edit: SirSamVimes posted:edit: Here's an interesting discovery. Man, that just makes me wonder what happens if you manage to max out Royal's friendship meter instead. Still feels pretty unlikely you can save him but I would have considered it unlikely you can get Mina to join you against the final boss, too. I doubt maxing out friendship would Elro would do a lot given his personality, but I did notice in one run that nightmare Elro was covered in sunflowers and not a cartoon duck fucked around with this message at 16:11 on Jan 28, 2018 |
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2018 16:05
|
|
|
a cartoon duck posted:Going from personal experience I assume it's either (spoilering it in case people don't like map spoilers or whatever) in the first area of the game, the screen to the left of Robin's house. If you jump up into the ceiling where the bombable rocks were you can find a secret room. Or it's in the snow mountain region, in the bottom-most room that's filled with water. If you just hug the bottom of the room you will eventually find an opening that leads to a different room. No, it's somewhere in the Shard Wastelands.  Sleuth goes off at this location, but I can't find any secrets even though the room's pretty small. What am I missing? e: found it  
Hwurmp fucked around with this message at 16:41 on Jan 28, 2018 |
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2018 16:26
|
|
|
SirSamVimes posted:Man oh man the secret bosses are extremely good. I oddly didn't see this and I was telling Royal to gently caress off at literally every opportunity after A. he was implied to be a pissy jealous manbaby who betrayed the Isi because they could make round leaves and he could only do square ones, and B. his "help" after that point consisted of "oh, my underlings aren't listening to me? oh well, not much I can do, cuff 'em I guess" it was pretty funny having the multiple interactions in the mountain with him involving him asking "can I come with you yet" and the response option of "No!" having more exclaimation points each time "But I'm literally Jesus, did you change your mind yet?" "No!!!" "oh..." Also I don't know if he was P3 or P4 of the nightmare fight, but whoever P4 was literally did nothing as far as I could tell-- I hit it like twice with my gun and the phase was over. So I guess if it was him he just felt so poo poo about everything that he literally did nothing. Regarding the ending, I assumed mechanic who was sent to scrap this hosed-up out-of-power planet whose natives were literally sucking it dry way faster than it should have ever been. - The fact that the spaceworm had the same blue eye thing going on, the fact that they seem to have all died with the death of the space worm, and their use case as "controllers" all says "integrated system used to hijack local fauna and moderate excessive ivory usage if something starts burning it too fast" to me. The use of the psyche-hack dealie as a method of fauna pacification, and the bird mechanic summoning local fauna using the controllers as well, all says that this is something that was set up to work that way and not just some rear end in a top hat showing up out of nowhere trying to suck some gas out of the tank. - Additionally, everyone knew the space worm was a thing (a lot of the mother statues and background artwork involves stylized worms that look very close to what showed up), and apparently knew that when it shows up it's either possible or likely that it'll destroy the planet if the ivory supplies are low (since they were making comments about excessive ivory usage decreasing the amount of time they had left in a very final, preordained kind of manner, even in the non-religious research notes). From that, it's probably safe to assume that A. they've seen it more than once before but it didn't gently caress up a planet every time (because they explicitly tied the low ivory levels to the planet being destroyed by it), and B. They know the correlation between "low ivory levels" and "space worm showing up to gently caress everyone up" probably because that's what happened to the moon. Also all things considered, who wants to bet the ivory infused death-slurry that you found under the transcendence room was being used as a fuel source for the rocket. Can't let all those ivory-infused melted bodies go to waste! Also also, endgame thoughts in no particular order: - I was appreciative of the fact that even if Robin's fairly stoic with a couple brief exceptions, most of your party members actually do react in a normal-if-hosed-up way to the hosed up poo poo going on. Royal continually pumping himself up by "you don't think much of me but I'm going over your head" only to have it shattered for good when he finally hit the top of the chain of command was...rough. - But Robin's reaction of "home, bed. Wait, you have something to say? 'I can do what I want?' Yeah no loving poo poo it's not like I wasn't doing that already, gently caress off, goodnight" was  - Elro's gameplay segment was significantly better than I was expecting when I first took control of him, so props on that one. - Elro may have been an rear end for a lot of the game but I still felt like a bit of a heel walking out the door that last time.  - The tower was easily the worst part of the game imho. - I only just realized, was the dude we saw getting mindfucked/suiciding in the tower the one who kidnapped the kid? At that point I was expecting "scouts from the rest of the human race showed up on our planet of human/tech hybrids and got confused as gently caress about how people were managing to survive" and promptly stuck it in the back of my mind expecting that to be the reveal, whoops. - I really hope Black is actually dead and doesn't show up in Iconoclasts 2 as an absolutely batshit insane stationary ivory tree screaming psychically 24/7 or some poo poo. - I really want to know how that whole moon base thing was going to work with like 6 people total, at least half of which being sterile ivory transcendents
|
|
#
?
Jan 29, 2018 01:33
|
|
|
ending stuff: Did I miss an explanation for how One Concern knew about the Starworm? Is it just that their distant ancestors had hosed with Captain Birb in the past, and paid the price?
|
|
#
?
Jan 29, 2018 01:37
|
|
|
Really Pants posted:ending stuff: Did I miss an explanation for how One Concern knew about the Starworm? Is it just that their distant ancestors had hosed with Captain Birb in the past, and paid the price? If they ever stated it outright I missed it, although I'm debating doing another playthrough now that I know the backstory. My first guess would be It showed up to salvage the moon that was mined out and a religion sprung up around the ineffable, unapproachable thing between then and now My second guess is a lot more completely wild speculation, but: - We know the planet is partially, if not completely, artificial - We know at some point in the past humans were seeded in multiple locations using colony ships - We know the Isi revere theirs and regard the whole "picking it apart for study" as a horrible taboo - We know One Concern picked theirs apart for research So the wild speculation backstory could be: - At some point in the past, Humans either constructed or had constructed for them artificial planets that came with a limited fuel source and control mechanisms for wide-scale terraforming. - At some point after humans landed on this particular world, some amount of information was lost or forgotten, but One Concern had access to at least somewhat more of it than Isi because they picked their colony ship apart for that information. - If we accept the bird mechanic is basically the tech crew for the artifical planets, then they could have just literally had something in their shipboard docs along the lines of "because of the limited fuel source for these planets, if/when you run low you should migrate back to your colony ship and GTFO because the salvage crew is going to show up at some point and we can't refuel a goddamn planet"
|
|
#
?
Jan 29, 2018 01:49
|
|
|
Ursine Catastrophe posted:- I really want to know how that whole moon base thing was going to work with like 6 people total, at least half of which being sterile ivory transcendents Some of the government officials in the tower were discussing how according to schedule they will be finished with preparations in 13 years, while the planet would have roughly 50 years left. Assumably construction of the moonbase was still underway and when Royal reduced the planet's lifeline from 50 years to 5 days Mother just went "gently caress it, me and five other people can leave, gently caress the rest". Really Pants posted:ending stuff: Did I miss an explanation for how One Concern knew about the Starworm? Is it just that their distant ancestors had hosed with Captain Birb in the past, and paid the price? In that same conversation between government officials one of them mentions that the Starworm is just an observer, and the other nervously replies they only He's just an observer because he circles around the planet every so often. My guess is that the bird mechanic regularly checks on the planet to make sure everything is fine, and since the big controller was locked under a mountain and couldn't send the low ivory warning signal He figured nothing's wrong and just goes back to wherever He hangs out. As for how much direct contact they actually had with the Starworm, I don't think it's ever explicitly stated anywhere but I doubt they had any. At most I assume it was possibly used for propaganda purposes, and over time, as Black put it "if you leave a lie to fester for generations it becomes unwritten law".
|
|
#
?
Jan 29, 2018 02:08
|
|
|
a cartoon duck posted:Some of the government officials in the tower were discussing how according to schedule they will be finished with preparations in 13 years, while the planet would have roughly 50 years left. Assumably construction of the moonbase was still underway and when Royal reduced the planet's lifeline from 50 years to 5 days Mother just went "gently caress it, me and five other people can leave, gently caress the rest". Or maybe there was a lot of other beds in the complex, and that area was just for important officials.
|
|
#
?
Jan 29, 2018 04:04
|
|
|
Yeah, there are a bunch of doors to other areas, and even a ladder going down you can't access, so the facility is a lot larger than the hallway + viewing chamber we get to see.
|
|
#
?
Jan 29, 2018 04:34
|
|
|
It was a bit of a trip starting up Celeste right after beating Iconoclasts, playing as a character named Madeline right after the reveal that Black's name is Madelyn.
|
|
#
?
Jan 29, 2018 06:47
|
|
|
The amount of spoiler tags in this thread are downright terrifying y'all. I just got back to the intro zones. Game good. Sounds like 10 hours for core plot? I'm at 2-3ish, so that seems reasonable. I'm going to be 100%ing it for sure. I hope the game keeps track of where all the chests I haven't found are yet, namely because it's such a cave heavy game. I like the more puzzely focus then most Metroidvanias. I'm not just getting tools to get into areas, I'm getting tools to solve puzzles. Combat itself tends to just be another puzzle. Good change of pace for the genre.
|
|
#
?
Jan 29, 2018 23:59
|
|
|
Rookersh posted:The amount of spoiler tags in this thread are downright terrifying y'all. It's because this game's story goes places and it's fun to discuss some of the places it goes. You're in for a ride, friend.
|
|
#
?
Jan 30, 2018 00:01
|
|
|
Re: talk choices; Actually, come to think of it I remember a friend mentioning that Robin flipped the gently caress out once she landed over Royal, while in my game she just kinda sat there and stared off into space until Mina got her. I guess that the Royal break, friend probably was nice to the twerp and I guess my Robin was a cold hearted thug.Rookersh posted:The amount of spoiler tags in this thread are downright terrifying y'all. Ten hours is a good rough estimate for the first run, though there's a metroid-like ending screen for three and a half hours or less. Just, uh. Know that when you get into a place with elevators it gets better again. After.
|
|
#
?
Jan 30, 2018 00:11
|
|
|
They really need to let you call elevators there.
|
|
#
?
Jan 30, 2018 01:13
|
|
|
This game is very fun. I really didn't expect it to turn out this way from the early cheerfulness of the first few stages. Am I the only one disappointed we didn't get to fight Chrome? Instead he just gets offed in a cutscene. I found most of the agents likable. They have their own goals within the organization. Black wants to keep the status quo while Chrome wanted to help mankind even if his plan was wrong. I assume he's the strongest of the agents since he has a title and all so its a little disappointing we never really saw what his powers were. Also I really disliked Elro and Royal in the game. Like Elro, we saved your butt this many times why are you still whining about going home. We can handle this. I know he just lost his wife and kid but still please be reasonable. Royal on the other hand is just a giant brat. He gets betrayed multiple times and still refuses to believe they don't like him anymore. Its his birthright to rule and everyone must like/respect him forever. What is up with the gun you find on the cartographer's ship? Its similar to the one you see in the tower that makes people sad or have hallucinations. That said, the starworm, the almighty one, also uses the same depression/hallucination beam on Royal and Robin. Was that ever explained anywhere or did I just miss it. Were the One Concern just reverse engineering the beam that the starworm used the last time he visited or something? I never found any secret bosses or 100% the game so I should probably replay this on challenge mode and do all that too. I really wish there would be a sequel to the game since we were barely able to see the newly awakened agents. But I heard this game took the dev like 10 years to make and he didn't want to do another big project again so thats not going to happen.
|
|
#
?
Jan 30, 2018 01:41
|
|
|
Velveteen posted:What is up with the gun you find on the cartographer's ship? Its similar to the one you see in the tower that makes people sad or have hallucinations. That said, the starworm, the almighty one, also uses the same depression/hallucination beam on Royal and Robin. Was that ever explained anywhere or did I just miss it. Were the One Concern just reverse engineering the beam that the starworm used the last time he visited or something? The depression beam is Starworm tech initially. I would assume the One Concern, while reverse-engineering and co-opting as much tech as they can, is experimenting with those guns and using them to mess up the people who stray out of line, like the pupil in the Tower. Most people can't fight through it like Robin does at the end; Royal doesn't pull through, the kid in the Tower offs himself (or tries to), etc. The cartographer has one and it's heavily implied he's using it to mess up the minds of those two helpers of his. One of his diary entries he talks about being worried about them regaining their ability to care and/or revolt against just obeying his instructions at every turn, more or less. Also, I'm not sure I'd recommend trying the secret bosses in Challenge mode. They get pretty hectic and the whole gimmick of Challenge mode is that you only have 1 HP + extra hits from those tweaks that stop a hit of damage. You can certainly do it if you want, but it might be a pain.
|
|
#
?
Jan 30, 2018 01:55
|
|
|
I am stuck and feel like a doof? I'm in the woods and am being told to find a way underground. My path leads to this big puzzle room with a single wrench socket floating in midair, and two boxes needed to wrench it. Box 1 was the Lightning Box I brought over from the other side. That was easy. The other box is this purple Box in a small cave. I can't pick it up since I can't jump on it. I've thoroughly checked the rest of the puzzle room. Hint on what I'm missing?
|
|
#
?
Jan 30, 2018 02:15
|
|
|
Rookersh posted:I am stuck and feel like a doof? If you don't yet know how to get that box, you don't need that to turn that socket.
|
|
#
?
Jan 30, 2018 02:17
|
|
|
Rookersh posted:I am stuck and feel like a doof? That box & nut are for much, much later. Right now you should focus on reaching the west exit.
|
|
#
?
Jan 30, 2018 02:20
|
|
|
Boy does this game start getting weird.
|
|
#
?
Jan 30, 2018 06:02
|
|
|
Rookersh posted:Boy does this game start getting weird. SirSamVimes posted:It's because this game's story goes places and it's fun to discuss some of the places it goes. You're in for a ride, friend.
|
|
#
?
Jan 30, 2018 07:10
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 18, 2024 22:18 |
|
|
I'm stuck, lads. I'm in Mina's underwater town thing. I beat that Agent, he turned into an ivory tree, and I am going around defeating soldiers. The counter says I have 2 left, but I feel like I am physically barricaded. I'm sort of in the upper left quadrant of the map and the only "exit" i can find is to drop down 2 platforms but the platform right above the bottom of the screen (effectively allowing me to drop into the room below/screen below) won't register a drop-jump. I crouch and jump and I just end up jumping. Is this not the way? Is something bugged? Thanks!
|
|
#
?
Jan 30, 2018 18:16
|
|