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AsInHowe
Jan 11, 2007

Goal, assist, fight.

DC Murderverse posted:

the E:60 special that aired this morning has clips from videos that Nassar made about treating athletes and they were deeply disturbing given the context we now have, but before all this happened he was just like a cool doctor dude who spent all his time prodding the pelvises of teenage girls

Who Michigan State couldn't stop giving adulation to.

Talking with some people close to the situation, he was not unanimously approved by the hiring committee, and some people were overruled to give him his position.

They also wanted to give him some distinguished Spartan helmet on the field during a football game.

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Nissin Cup Nudist
Sep 3, 2011



AsInHowe posted:

Is Michigan State going to reform their university and fix their problems, or worry more about sports rivalry bullshit?

https://twitter.com/ChadLivengood/s...619580716945408

Do universities typically hire presidents without advanced degrees?

elentar
Aug 26, 2002

Congratulations! Your bonsai is dead!

Grimey Drawer

Nissin Cup Nudist posted:

Do universities typically hire presidents without advanced degrees?

There’s a growing trend to hire people as college presidents who are perceived to have been successful in public service or especially in business who do not have more than a BA or sometimes any college degree at all.

Often (though not always) these will have grandiose ideas about “disrupting” the university in some way that is highly unworkable, as could be seen by anyone with even the faintest experience of higher-ed administration or even just anything beyond hazy frat-days nostalgia.

swickles
Aug 21, 2006

I guess that I don't need that though
Now you're just some QB that I used to know


Nissin Cup Nudist posted:

Do universities typically hire presidents without advanced degrees?

I don't know if he has an advanced degree, but Youngstown State hired Jim Tressel, who was a big name. In a role whose largest responsibility is to keep the money flowing, then fame often outweighs experience or education.

iospace
Apr 20, 2020




Fun Shoe

swickles posted:

I don't know if he has an advanced degree, but Youngstown State hired Jim Tressel, who was a big name. In a role whose largest responsibility is to keep the money flowing, then fame often outweighs experience or education.

He has a Masters from Akron.

AsInHowe
Jan 11, 2007

Goal, assist, fight.

https://twitter.com/brendatracy24/s...779156787277824

Henchman of Santa
Aug 21, 2010



For anyone who doesn't know, Brenda Tracy was raped by Oregon State players in the early 2000s and now goes around the country working with coaches and their teams (including Mike Riley recently) on how not to be a rapist/perpetuate surprise sex culture.

I could definitely buy that Izzo doesn't know how bad it is considering he keeps putting his foot in his mouth. His public takes on the whole situation have been very much what I would expect from a well-meaning aging rich guy who lives in a bubble.

AsInHowe
Jan 11, 2007

Goal, assist, fight.

Henchman of Santa posted:

For anyone who doesn't know, Brenda Tracy was raped by Oregon State players in the early 2000s and now goes around the country working with coaches and their teams (including Mike Riley recently) on how not to be a rapist/perpetuate surprise sex culture.

I could definitely buy that Izzo doesn't know how bad it is considering he keeps putting his foot in his mouth. His public takes on the whole situation have been very much what I would expect from a well-meaning aging rich guy who lives in a bubble.

https://twitter.com/brendatracy24/s...786081222520832

https://www.theringer.com/features/...ll-surprise sex-culture

Henchman of Santa
Aug 21, 2010



Do you believe the NCAA would pull the trigger on that if they wouldn't do it to Penn State?

EDIT: though if Emmert really knew about Nassar maybe the NCAA will be very different soon enough!

Henchman of Santa fucked around with this message at Jan 29, 2018 around 03:05

I would blow Dane Cook
Dec 26, 2008


Henchman of Santa posted:

Do you believe the NCAA would pull the trigger on that if they wouldn't do it to Penn State?

EDIT: though if Emmert really knew about Nassar maybe the NCAA will be very different soon enough!

Maybe if they are caught paying players.

General Dog
Apr 26, 2008



I stand firm in my belief that the best thing the NCAA can do is stay in its lane and keep its nose out of this. They can't even do the things that are within their purview, like academic scandals right, how the hell are they supposed to navigate something like this?

swickles
Aug 21, 2006

I guess that I don't need that though
Now you're just some QB that I used to know


General Dog posted:

I stand firm in my belief that the best thing the NCAA can do is stay in its lane and keep its nose out of this. They can't even do the things that are within their purview, like academic scandals right, how the hell are they supposed to navigate something like this?

I agree. Let the legal system, which has subpoena power, uncover all the facts alongside good journalism and then make a decision. An NCAA investigation is toothless and nothing more than grandstanding, especially since Emmert was informed about this 8 years ago.

General Dog
Apr 26, 2008



When people debate what the NCAA response should be to something like this, it reminds me of Dave Chappelle's bit about MTV feeling the need to get Ja Rule's thoughts about the 9/11 attacks.

edit: or better yet, this Spencer Hall piece he wrote about NCAA sanctions against PSU pretty much sums up my feelings on the matter.

quote:

What would I have the NCAA do here? Absolutely poo poo-nothing. After all, it's what they do most of the time. Ideally, I'd like them to evaporate overnight, and simply cease to exist. That will not happen, so I would instead like them to admit what they're doing: stabbing a corpse, and then demanding some public recognition of their ersatz bravery. I would like them to admit they are seizing a horrific moment in time to advance their own fartgassy agenda, and then demanding credit for it. They will burn an effigy after the courts have already done the hard work of humanity.

They will not do any of this. The NCAA's punishments serve no purpose, solve no problems, and prevent nothing. They represent an organization desperate for relevance seizing the moment to poach some kind of sinister power-up from this moment. They will -- and did -- suggest the "children" are the reason for the reach, and do so without openly guffawing or flinching from the shame a normal, moral person would feel at that moment. They will use the word "culture" to defend what they do, mostly because using that word allows you to make up whatever you like without evidence, justification, or data.

General Dog fucked around with this message at Jan 29, 2018 around 03:49

Charlz Guybon
Nov 16, 2010



Agreed. Until a couple of major programs get a 5 year death penalty nothing will change.

General Dog
Apr 26, 2008



I'm sure it will be an incredible deterrent, just like the literal death penalty.

Lockback
Sep 2, 2006

All days are nights to see till I see thee; and nights bright days when dreams do show me thee.


We'll need to be extra careful to cover this up now.

Korranus
Jan 8, 2001



swickles posted:

Let the legal system, which has subpoena power, uncover all the facts alongside good journalism and then make a decision.

Sure worked for Flint.

ElwoodCuse
Jan 11, 2004

we're puttin' the band back together

General Dog posted:

I'm sure it will be an incredible deterrent, just like the literal death penalty.

SMU getting the death penalty was an incredible deterrent, it guaranteed the NCAA would never give it to anyone again

AsInHowe
Jan 11, 2007

Goal, assist, fight.

Mike Valenti is calling ESPN's piece a "hit job" and is attacking the MSU social worker for being mean to Dantonio and Izzo.

And now claiming that the criticism is just coming from Michigan fans.

C411
Jun 22, 2004
STUPID
DICK


How did Mike Valenti react to them not wanting to hire a Michigan Man as their next president to fix these problems?

AsInHowe
Jan 11, 2007

Goal, assist, fight.

C411 posted:

How did Mike Valenti react to them not wanting to hire a Michigan Man as their next president to fix these problems?

I don't think that topic came up.

Anals of History
Jul 29, 2003



AsInHowe posted:

Mike Valenti is calling ESPN's piece a "hit job" and is attacking the MSU social worker for being mean to Dantonio and Izzo.

And now claiming that the criticism is just coming from Michigan fans.

I've seen a bunch of fans online go after the social worker for what I thought were even-handed comments. Generally, the fanbase has only brought knives out once there were real threats to the big sports.

I'm ready for MSU football and basketball death penalties, and largely ready just to stop paying attention to college sports.

Sky Shadowing
Feb 13, 2012

At least we're not the Thalmor (yet)


I'm going to side with Valenti here and point out that there is a burden of proof when you go at people that so far the article doesn't quite meet. The Payne and Appling story went all the way to the Ingham County Prosecutor, who not only said there was not enough to press charges, but that there was no crime. Dantonio dropped his nuts on the table for ESPN to smash with the hammer of proof, believing they don't have anything concrete. Dunning, the prosecutor at the time (not his assistant who was the woman hired at MSU) allegedly had a reputation for going after MSU athletes. Appling and Payne was investigated by the MSUPD, which is not a university-run police department. In addition the feds and the state already investigated MSU's Title IX investigation of Appling and Payne and concluded MSU was slow to investigate but the investigation was properly done.

The only really new revelation that has State fans looking sideways is the second allegation against Travis Walton and the two unnamed basketball players.

I'm not saying Dantonio and Izzo are innocent. What we allowed to happen with Nassar was unforgivably monstrous, and we deserve every bit of scrutiny and suspicion. But we're going to get gone over with a fine-tooth comb, multiple fine tooth combs, in fact. If either of them are guilty of any coverup, get the gently caress off my campus, but I'm going to wait for the investigations to determine it.

In truth, I think we all know the most likely scenario for this to happen is for there to be merely "no proof" of any breaking of protocol by Dantonio or Izzo, but they're not going to be completely exonerated. They'll keep their jobs, but people will forever more taint their names. No guilt, but no vindication. Nothing solid, but dark clouds over them for the rest of their careers.

jit bull transpile
Jan 6, 2012

f $o(^PUPFRIENDS(friend)) q:friend="" d
. d snuggle^PUPROUTINES(^PUPFRIENDS(friend))

Gary’s Answer

Sky Shadowing posted:

I'm going to side with Valenti here and point out that there is a burden of proof when you go at people that so far the article doesn't quite meet. The Payne and Appling story went all the way to the Ingham County Prosecutor, who not only said there was not enough to press charges, but that there was no crime. Dantonio dropped his nuts on the table for ESPN to smash with the hammer of proof, believing they don't have anything concrete. Dunning, the prosecutor at the time (not his assistant who was the woman hired at MSU) allegedly had a reputation for going after MSU athletes. Appling and Payne was investigated by the MSUPD, which is not a university-run police department. In addition the feds and the state already investigated MSU's Title IX investigation of Appling and Payne and concluded MSU was slow to investigate but the investigation was properly done.

The only really new revelation that has State fans looking sideways is the second allegation against Travis Walton and the two unnamed basketball players.

I'm not saying Dantonio and Izzo are innocent. What we allowed to happen with Nassar was unforgivably monstrous, and we deserve every bit of scrutiny and suspicion. But we're going to get gone over with a fine-tooth comb, multiple fine tooth combs, in fact. If either of them are guilty of any coverup, get the gently caress off my campus, but I'm going to wait for the investigations to determine it.

In truth, I think we all know the most likely scenario for this to happen is for there to be merely "no proof" of any breaking of protocol by Dantonio or Izzo, but they're not going to be completely exonerated. They'll keep their jobs, but people will forever more taint their names. No guilt, but no vindication. Nothing solid, but dark clouds over them for the rest of their careers.

Theyre guilty by virtue of participating in a culture of looking the other way. It doesn't matter if they themselves committed a crime, the university and athletic leadership as a whole are guilty of at best willful ignorance and at worst deliberately enabling rapists.

General Dog
Apr 26, 2008



Sky Shadowing posted:

I'm going to side with Valenti here and point out that there is a burden of proof when you go at people that so far the article doesn't quite meet. The Payne and Appling story went all the way to the Ingham County Prosecutor, who not only said there was not enough to press charges, but that there was no crime. Dantonio dropped his nuts on the table for ESPN to smash with the hammer of proof, believing they don't have anything concrete. Dunning, the prosecutor at the time (not his assistant who was the woman hired at MSU) allegedly had a reputation for going after MSU athletes. Appling and Payne was investigated by the MSUPD, which is not a university-run police department. In addition the feds and the state already investigated MSU's Title IX investigation of Appling and Payne and concluded MSU was slow to investigate but the investigation was properly done.

I think it would be appropriate at this point for everyone to keep their nuts put away

Anals of History
Jul 29, 2003



John Engler, former MI Gov, is going to be interim President for MSU. His enduring legacy in the state was in almost completely dismantling social services. I'm sure he'll do a great job supporting the Title IX office.

DJExile
Jun 27, 2007

If loving you is binturong, I don't want to binturight.

Acting interim pres Bill Beekman says they'll have a new AD today or tomorrow, so says Jonathan Oosting of the Detroit News.


If that's the case, that'd be shockingly fast, unless they're really saying they'll just name an interim.

GobiasIndustries
Dec 14, 2007



Lipstick Apathy

Anals of History posted:

John Engler, former MI Gov, is going to be interim President for MSU. His enduring legacy in the state was in almost completely dismantling social services. I'm sure he'll do a great job supporting the Title IX office.

not even gonna bother with the whole 'maybe they'll find someone actually good' thing because lol that is a loving terrible pick.

fast cars loose anus
Mar 2, 2007

Your 2017 World Series MVP


Pillbug

While not directly related to MSU, Gov Abbott ordered an investigation into Karolyi Ranch today

Jack's Flow
Jun 6, 2003

Once in a sycamore I was glad
all at the top, and I sang.


I remember reading about Simone Biles two years ago, and even back then (in what was supposed to be a positive story) the Karolyis sounded like awful people. Simone Biles is the best in the world in what she does, but I still felt sorry for all the girls after reading that piece.

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/...st-in-the-world

PotatoJudge
May 22, 2004

Tell me about the rabbits, George

The treatment at the Karoli and Geddert gyms is one reason why Nassar was able to do what he did. The coaches would break down the gymnasts mentally and physically and Nassar would be there with a kind work and forbidden candy / food. Nassar used it to build trust.

Geddert should be the next to fall: https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...ert/1064093001/

Henchman of Santa
Aug 21, 2010


https://twitter.com/JustinHinkley/s...706562217979905

EvanTH
Apr 24, 2004

i like to express my inner pain by being really boring on the phone
or just when i'm kickin it
that's me though
i'm kind of oddddddd

Jack's Flow posted:

I remember reading about Simone Biles two years ago, and even back then (in what was supposed to be a positive story) the Karolyis sounded like awful people. Simone Biles is the best in the world in what she does, but I still felt sorry for all the girls after reading that piece.

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/...st-in-the-world

lol lovin' the red flags every few sentences

quote:

She compares the process of getting into shape for competition as “repeatedly convincing yourself you aren’t going to die.”

quote:

“I think you’re sweet, but if you screw with her mind I will kill you. You can screw with her mind after the Olympics, but not before. I’ve got enough to deal with.”

etc

DJExile
Jun 27, 2007

If loving you is binturong, I don't want to binturight.

quote:

Michigan State: Deputy AD Greg Ianni will be named interim AD, according to Chris Solari of the Detroit Free Press. Mark Hollis’s last day on the job is today.

AsInHowe
Jan 11, 2007

Goal, assist, fight.

This is great stuff.

http://mgoblog.com/content/looking-...y-aftermath-msu

AsInHowe fucked around with this message at Jan 31, 2018 around 23:31

General Dog
Apr 26, 2008



Couldn't they just get somebody with no ties to the situation and a little less baggage, like Ian McCaw or the Tennessee guy?

I would blow Dane Cook
Dec 26, 2008


Police decided not to send the report to prosecutors after Nassar told them the technique he used required touching those areas and provided them with a Power Point presentation to detail the technique, which “had been published in medical journals and training tapes.”

“I informed Mrs. (redacted) that we would be closing the case with no prosecution being sought, due to the facts presented to me by Dr. Nassar,” Detective Andrew McCready wrote.

sportsgenius86
Jun 17, 2008

THE STREAK IS OVER


https://www.elevenwarriors.com/coll...him-immediately

I thought this was an interesting take that is 100% accurate and drives home the absurdity of all this.

quote:

If Nassar had been unlawfully exploiting Michigan State trademarks for, say, an unlicensed t-shirt business the university would have hammered him within hours of its discovery. It wouldn't have even mattered if it was successful or not - if Nassar had used green and white, printed GO GREEN GO WHITE or SPARTANS WILL or any of the numerous, often dubious marks MSU holds to promote his own interests away from the clinic he would have immediately received a cease and desist order from university lawyers.

That's what places like Michigan State look for. It's a daily whack-a-mole game for them. Here is a short list of the crimes Michigan State recently discovered and immediately put a stop to:

A Short's Brewing Company poster with "Sparty On" on it

A picture on Twitter showing Sparty holding a can of Xyience Energy Drink.

A children's baseball team in Texas that had a Spartan helmet as a team logo

In 2015 Michigan State issued 1,334 takedown requests for material it deemed in violation of its trademarks. That's not the total number, either - that's just Facebook photos. By the way, Ohio State is at least as aggressive as MSU in this regard. It's a shared priority among organizations of size and wealth. There are people deputized within these places to be on the watch for this type of wrongdoing and take action.

GobiasIndustries
Dec 14, 2007



Lipstick Apathy


Just want to say it’s good that at least someone other than Nassar is getting off on this scandal.

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iospace
Apr 20, 2020




Fun Shoe

sportsgenius86 posted:

https://www.elevenwarriors.com/coll...him-immediately

I thought this was an interesting take that is 100% accurate and drives home the absurdity of all this.

The problem with trademarks is that if one doesn't defend it, it could easily be considered no longer trademarked. Not saying I'm defending the aggressiveness, but that's why they do it.

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