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I don't suppose there's a track listing for the S9 OST? And I guess we'll have to wait another three years for the S10 tunes
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Mar 30, 2018 07:58
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Vinylshadow posted:I don't suppose there's a track listing for the S9 OST? Here you are! The special track from Heaven Sent is ‘The Shepherd’s Boy’.
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Mar 30, 2018 12:27
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Is there normally such a delay for the soundtracks? Or is it licensing shenanigans?
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Mar 30, 2018 12:58
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Pesky Splinter posted:Is there normally such a delay for the soundtracks? Or is it licensing shenanigans? Licensing. It moved from one parent publisher to another (yet it still all goes through Silva Screen as the actual publisher).
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Mar 30, 2018 13:05
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Pesky Splinter posted:Is there normally such a delay for the soundtracks? Or is it licensing shenanigans? Edit: See above.
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Mar 30, 2018 13:05
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Thanks you two, just was curious. 
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Mar 30, 2018 13:28
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I watched Shada for the first time last night (the latest version). It was great, despite already knowing a lot of the plot from Dirk Gently. I hadn’t realised there was as much footage as there is, I had assumed it was like the other reconstructed stories, which are largely unwatchable IMO. But no Shada is extremely watchable and the animation does the job ok.
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Mar 30, 2018 13:39
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marktheando posted:I watched Shada for the first time last night (the latest version). It was great, despite already knowing a lot of the plot from Dirk Gently. I hadn’t realised there was as much footage as there is, I had assumed it was like the other reconstructed stories, which are largely unwatchable IMO. But no Shada is extremely watchable and the animation does the job ok. Well, Shada's case is a little different from other reconstructions, in that they filmed most of it but had to stop filming because of a strike. So on the one hand, there aren't any vaults that anyone has to go searching for to get the rest of the footage, but on the other hand, they'll never find the rest of the footage.
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Mar 30, 2018 14:33
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Holy poo poo Bicyclops I've just noticed your new AV. That's amazing  "Carrot juice!?"
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Mar 30, 2018 15:17
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Thanks! I kept trying to get more of Colin and less of the clown car in, but I finally decided it was good enough. We'll see how long I can hang onto it.
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Mar 30, 2018 15:20
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marktheando posted:I watched Shada for the first time last night (the latest version). It was great, despite already knowing a lot of the plot from Dirk Gently. I hadn’t realised there was as much footage as there is, I had assumed it was like the other reconstructed stories, which are largely unwatchable IMO. But no Shada is extremely watchable and the animation does the job ok. Release the Levine cut, Beeb! 
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Mar 30, 2018 15:28
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Listening to "Invaders From Mars." I love how silly it is. I wish they'd gotten Maurice LaMarche to play Welles, though, because whoever they have playing him is terrible.
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Mar 30, 2018 15:58
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egon_beeblebrox posted:Listening to "Invaders From Mars." I love how silly it is. I wish they'd gotten Maurice LaMarche to play Welles, though, because whoever they have playing him is terrible. Big Finish just can't nail American accents.
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Mar 30, 2018 18:00
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Which is always weird considering the number of North American actors living in the UK.
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Mar 30, 2018 18:02
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CobiWann posted:Big Finish just can't nail American accents. I love when they talk about it in any behind the scenes thing, because they're always like "But he's actually American!" and it turns out that, no, they're Canadian-born, acted in America for awhile and then moved to London like 20 years ago.
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Mar 30, 2018 18:03
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Wheat Loaf posted:Release the Levine cut, Beeb! Levine can release it anytime he wants. Maybe not for sale, but then again, he told the people working on it that it wasn't going to be available commercially/
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Mar 30, 2018 19:43
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 Someone asked for a Series 9 cover with "the correct logo" on it (made by Mortadelo) HQ Alt:  Does seem weird to have an OST with another time period's logo on it The_Doctor posted:Here you are! The special track from Heaven Sent is ‘The Shepherd’s Boy’. Strange - not a lot of tracks from The Witch's Familiar on there Or did it use previously released music...?
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Mar 30, 2018 20:47
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Clara's Diner had better be the rocker version of her theme.
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Mar 30, 2018 22:02
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Mar 31, 2018 17:09
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EGGS! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVwXa4MnJDs Doctor Zero fucked around with this message at 21:31 on Mar 31, 2018 |
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Mar 31, 2018 21:29
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BBC: Mr. Moffat, we appreciate you doing a quick Easter one-shot with Mr. Capaldi, but how did you get it on the air without us knowing about it? Moffat: This is the first I'm hearing of it 
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Mar 31, 2018 21:52
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I'm only just now realizing that this is foreshadowing. And pretty clever foreshadowing, too.
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Mar 31, 2018 23:22
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eggs-stir-mix-bake
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Mar 31, 2018 23:24
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DoctorWhat posted:eggs-stir-mix-bake 
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Apr 1, 2018 02:21
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Why couldn't Amy Pond get pregnant? Because her eggs terminate!
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Apr 1, 2018 02:39
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World Enough and Time is a very different beast to Heaven Sent and Utopia, but both of those episodes are what I think of when I try to draw a parallel with other revival stories. Utopia wasn't actually all that great a story but it's remembered as being brilliant almost entirely because of the utterly astonishing ending, as Martha and kindly old Professor Yana both figure out the significance of his fob watch. Watching Derek Jacobi's performance instantly snap from kindly old eccentric to cruelly bemused monster remains to this day one of my favorite memories of Doctor Who. Heaven Sent IS a great story, one that absolutely nails the landing on top of being wonderfully atmospheric and a tour de force of acting from Peter Capaldi who carries the episode almost entirely on his own. But it also wraps up with a tie-in of the running plotline of the season, which wasn't particularly well received, and feels like a bit of a letdown to know we were going back to business as usual after something so unique and compelling. This episode manages an interesting mixture of both of these. The atmosphere and concepts are extremely compelling and the episode revels in them with dark shadows, creepy voices, claustrophobic and spooky sets (contrasted with bright and shiny ones) and yes even the return of Moffat's favorite old staple of unsettling repeated phrases. But there's also some outright silliness and one character in particular who comes across as contrived and "exposes" the writing in how much of a "character" he is made out to be... until something truly remarkable happens and throws everything into an entirely new context. Like with the Yana reveal, it was heavily telegraphed for many fans both via spoilers AND the show's own previews, but the execution was still masterfully done and for those of us who did NOT grasp what was happening until far too late... oh my God it's so loving good.   The episodes does NOT start well. It opens with the Doctor emerging into a snowy landscape alone, body glowing with regeneration energy and looked completely dismayed. By this point, the fakeouts of regenerations has become rote and dull, an accusation aimed (often unfairly) at Moffat who apparently never found a trick he didn't think was worth repeating multiple times. Even with the knowledge of Capaldi's time in the role ending, I doubt anybody was overly intrigued with this opening, if only because most assumed that Moffat would end up subverting it into something else (at this point, doing a straightforward story would probably be considered a subversion of his usual subversions). Cutting back to a different time, a flyby of a HUGE spaceship couldn't help but bring to mind the opening of comedy tv series Red Dwarf, a comparison which would end up being surprisingly apt. On the tiny bridge of this huge ship, the TARDIS lands and Missy emerges with a grumpy Bill and Nardole. Even this potentially intriguing shift of the norm feels wasted, as Missy's lines feel contrived to make a meta joke about both the Doctor's usual characterization AND the tired old "Doctor Who is his name?" joke. At this point in the episode, I wasn't feeling particularly enamored with what I was seeing even though the NEXT ON... trailer had gotten me pumped up. Happily, almost immediately from this point things REALLY pick up in incredible ways. You could say they kick things off with a bang:  Beyond the shock value of seeing Bill with a giant hole blown in her torso, this is where the storytelling begins to shine. The Doctor brought Missy onboard to give her a trial run under his observation, to test out her apparent "humanization" as she has begun demonstrating more compassion and empathy. Bill and Nardole were to act as her companions, and we get a wonderful flashback to the Doctor pushing this idea on Bill and the gentle, sweet relationship they've developed over the season. The playful teasing and joking about the dangers of what they do and ESPECIALLY of Missy, all brought into sharp relief by the knowledge that she was going to her death. This is the Doctor's failure, doubly so because it wasn't Missy who got Bill killed, it was the Doctor. He was the one who sent her out there with Missy despite her reservations. He was the one who stepped out and attempted to talk down the terrified surviving crewmember of the spaceship, never taking the multiple chances to disarm him (and Missy would have easily killed him) because he assumed (of course) he could appeal to the man's better nature only to see his panic cause him to pull the trigger. This is his fault, his guilt, and when the horrifying and creepy bandaged hospital patients with IVs stagger out of the lifts and carry Bill away for "repairs", he immediately seizes at any opportunity, no matter how small, to make up for it. Leaving Bill a psychic message to wait for him, he immediately sets his mind to phase one of that plan, which is to get past the terrified gun-toting crewmember and down to the bottom decks where the bandaged patients came from. This is an extremely dense episode, it packs in a tremendous amount of information and plays around with some wonderfully weird sci-fi concepts but manages a pace that lets it all breathe and develop naturally. Take the bandaged "patients". They should in no way be scary, it's some dudes in hospital gowns and bandages who can't even support their own weight without an IV pole. But they're utterly terrifying, communicating via typing electronic messages but also completely cryptic. They only communicate insofar as is required to achieve their goals. Without faces or voices, they are frighteningly blank and inhuman. The only information we have to work from is their brief visual appearance and the garbled info available from a terrified crewmember who doesn't actually have much in the way of information. Thanks to the NEXT ON... preview most viewers knew what was going on, but even with that information (or without it) they're effective and creepy "monsters" that could probably have easily carried an entire episode themselves, but didn't need to. Then there is the ship itself. 400 miles long, it is gigantic which creates its own set of interesting issues to play with (the lifts, for example, have to move at enormous speeds to traverse the length of the ship) which are compounded by the unique situation it has found itself in. An empty colony ship with only 50 crew, its course took it directly towards a black hole and their attempts to escape that have only been partially successful. Because of the wonders of time dilation from the enormous gravity pull of the Black Hole, the closer part of the ship to the event horizon has been accelerating away for 2 days now... but at the far end of the ship, it has been roughly 1000 years. The ship is now shown to be teeming with life when it is supposed to be empty, because the crew that went down to keep the engines running have been down there for generations and bred thousands of descendents. Some of those descendents have returned to grab other members of the crew, till the only non-human crewmember was left, apparently ignored and unwanted. This too could easily have carried the entire episode itself, but didn't need to. The concept of the Doctor having to get to Bill when she exists in a section of time running much faster than for himself, and the knowledge that every second delayed was potentially days or weeks for her. Conversely the concept of Bill knowing the Doctor is coming and able to watch him, but him moving at a glacial pace and having to make a life for herself in the meantime. What a great conundrum for the characters. That too could have carried the entire episode itself, but didn't need to.   Because all these concepts and subplots wrap together and flow smoothly in a wonderfully atmospheric episode that is both dense but also gives everything time to breathe. Nothing feels rushed, even when the Doctor is rushing, thanks to the clever playing around with the relative speed of time. The Doctor's exposition is even smoothly tied into the story as a diversionary tactic to get past the crewman with the gun, all observed by Bill and newfound friend Mr. Razor who treat it like their favorite soap opera even though it is moving so slowly they never explicitly see a frame change. As she waits for the Doctor, time passes, but every time her resolve wavers that psychic message from the Doctor reminds her to wait, to hold on. Even that recurring element will have a glorious payoff at the climax of the episode. Because Bill has been "repaired", her destroyed heart and lungs replaced by bulky machinery jury-rigged by the "doctor" who runs the hospital. Over 1000 years has taken its toll on this end of the ship, with the engines that power their escape from the black hole becoming increasingly run down. The only hope for the sickly inhabitants of the bottom floor living in the polluted engine-city is to travel higher up the ship, but all previous expeditions have failed to make it past floor 500. The trip to get Bill went straight to the bridge, but that isn't large enough to maintain the population. They need to get to the solar farms that occupy some of the higher levels and produce food, power and clean air, but something is stopping them. So to survive they must be stronger. They must survive you see, they must. One criticism that could be thrown at this episode is how clear the "twist" is, especially if you watched the NEXT ON... trailer from the previous week. But even knowing what is coming, the story is so effectively and compellingly told that it feels churlish to complain. The body horror of the patients is wonderfully realized, as Bill's own horror and refusal to look at her "repair" demonstrates. But even better comes when Bill overhears the word "Pain!" repeated over and over by an electronic voice, and discovers a room full of "repaired" patients. A nurse arrives and takes care of the problem, and to Bill's horror she discovers the way the staff deal with their patients pain is... to turn down the volume on their voices so they can't be heard. Turning up another volume knob, she is shocked to hear a patient begging to die. Repeating one of the more effective elements from the hit-and-miss Cybermen 2-parter from season 2 of the revival, we get to hear what these "stronger" and "better" beings actually feels when it isn't being suppressed. The mindset of the "medical" team is made all the more horrifying by their indifference, not just the nurse's callous attitude but in the doctor's horrible solution - a device that doesn't prevent the pain but suppresses emotion so the patient stops caring about it. The "stronger" subjects are living in torment that isn't just psychological but physical as well. This isn't something to aspire to or desire, and it speaks to the desperation of this bottom floor society that they feel this method is in any way acceptable. Because they're Cybermen, of course. As the line is so gloriously put at the end of the episode, this isn't an exodus, it's a genesis. Not a replacement origin story for Mondas and The Tenth Planet, but a tangent, a parallel side-origin where the crew of a colony ship that had been intended to ferry tens of thousands of Mondasians from their doomed planet ended up suffering the same fate as the passengers they never picked up. Even if you knew the reveal was coming, even if you didn't but figured it out early on because all the signs were there, it's done so loving well. Best of all is that these really are the Mondasian Cybermen - not just with the (modern take on the) original costumes, but with the sing-song voices that when done right are so creepy. Plus there is the extra added twist that really hits home hard, as Bill spends the entire episode biding her time and listening to the Doctor's psychic message to wait... and when he finally arrives it is just a little too late, because she has already been "saved" Cyberman: Bill. Potts. Doctor: Yes, Bill Potts, can you find her? Cyberman: Accessing.... Bill Potts. Locating... Bill Potts. I am... Bill Potts.  The cruelty of the reveal is stunning, and at first it feels like it is a writer's cruelty, that Moffat has done this. Yes he did, of course, because he is the writer, but there is a purpose to the cruelty beyond the simple laziness of the oft-maligned "fridging" of a female character. Because of the character of Mr. Razor, the cruelty makes a horrible kind of sense. But only AFTER the context is applied, and when it is it turns this from a great episode to an excellent one. Because the first time I watched this episode, I really disliked Razor's character. It felt just a little too twee, too forced, a poor attempt at a comedy relief/wacky character to offset the tension which was so badly misjudged that it spoiled the mood. I even heard him referred to as Pound Shop Zathras which absolutely cracked me up. His bad costume, silly accent, odd way of talking etc were all so blatantly calculated to be quirky that I just rolled my eyes and tried to concentrate on how good everything around him was. Then the reveal came and with it a fresh context that made all those same things feel absolutely perfect, spot on and necessary. It will surely go down in the history of the show as one of those great moments, and what makes it even better is that even knowing the actor was supposed to be in the episode, even though Moffat had actually already done this exact thing before in Dark Water with the same character... the moment hit me exactly the same as Jacobi's reveal in Utopia, as I figured out what was happening JUST before it happened and that made it hit twice as hard.  They even put in a little crash zoom, like a relic from the RTD era  Because OF COURSE the Master would do all these things, of course he would. To befriend somebody and live and work side by side with them for years, offering hope and companionship simply to gently caress them over at the very last second just for shits and giggles (and to gently caress with the Doctor, of course)? Well OF COURSE the Master would do that. Especially THIS Master, who hasn't had the benefit of close to 100 years imprisoned in a vault as the Doctor attempts to teach them empathy. This is the Master who gloated about having an excuse to kill Chantho; the Master who played pop music over giant loudspeakers as he rained down death and destruction from an invading alien force on the earth; the Master who kept the Doctor prisoner for a year purely so he could show off the despoiling of the planet Earth while running his own dictator's breakfast radio show. Yes Missy is that same Master, but with the benefit of who knows how many extra decades or centuries of perspective. She did cruel and disgusting things for her own amusement too (never forget that look on her face when she revealed herself in Dark Water, or trying to get the Doctor kill Clara while she was imprisoned inside a Dalek shell) but for whatever reason she has been starting to demonstrate growth. Which makes her and the previous Master's conversation all the more interesting. Because he recognized who she was, but she was so busy doing what the Doctor asked her to that she didn't pick up who he was beneath the disguise. She has no memory of this encounter despite being a later incarnation, and the Master's cavalier,"I'm very worried about my future" demonstrates that there is a distinct difference between them, or at least there appears to be. John Simm is an excellent actor, and he threw himself with gusto into the part of the Master during the RTD era, but he never really got a truly great episode all to himself. Too often it was played up too much, too campy, too cartoonish, which undercut those excellent moments when he actually got serious or dramatic. Here, in this episode we see a more restrained take that doesn't in any way detract from his gleefully assholish persona. Yes he's only there briefly out of disguise, but he dominates with his presence. Look how quickly he seems to undo all of the Doctor's hardwork with Missy, and his pleasure in revealing himself to the Doctor to revel in his discovery of Bill's fate. The edit of the episode is nicely done too, with the parallel stories of the Doctor discovering Bill and Missy discovering the Master. Yes it is a bit much to end with the zoom in to show Bill's face beneath the mask and the shot of the tear coming out of the Cyberman's face, but her electronic sing-song voice proclaiming,"I waited. I waited. I waited for you" as the Doctor stares in horror at her and the two Masters is just heartbreaking. Here is the Doctor defeated, the Doctor at a loss for words, having failed in his one great charge: to keep Bill alive. He joked he couldn't promise that but he could promise to do his best, and we see here his best wasn't good enough.  As the penultimate episode of the (regular) season it is a doozy of a cliffhanger, and a far more effective hook than that regeneration tease at the start of the episode. Structurally this episode is excellent, the atmosphere is beautifully executed and the multi-layered threads of the plot are weaved together with expertise. It is probably my favorite Moffat written episode of the season, as the old master pulled it all together yet again. Yes he reused some well-worn tricks, and yes his efforts at meta-comedy often just come across as smug... but when the man delivers he REALLY delivers. With only two episodes left in his run on the show (and Capaldi's), this was a fine reminder of just what he was capable of when he really put his mind to it. It is why for all the many issues that cropped up during his time in charge, I will miss him being part of Doctor Who. Jerusalem fucked around with this message at 11:39 on Apr 6, 2018 |
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Apr 1, 2018 12:59
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Sorry for the double-post, there's a problem with the forum at the moment not allowing long posts over a certain length being posted 
Jerusalem fucked around with this message at 11:39 on Apr 6, 2018 |
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Apr 1, 2018 13:00
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World Enough and Time was easily my favorite episode of the season, as much for concept as impact. There's not much to say that you didn't on the amazing setting, and the way they handled the Patients and Mr. Razor... But something that strikes me that you didn't mention is that they somehow managed to make Bill's fate at the end of the episode both extremely preordained, and still a surprise. Basically every part of her story in the hospital is telling you what's going to happen, you know from the previews that the Cybermen are going to appear, and the only thing you've got to assure you that she'll get saved is the Doctor's (thin) promise that he'll save her. You know what the monster at the end of this book is. ...But you don't expect them to go through with it, to let that happen. It's not an in-show assurance that's keeping that true, you know the Doctor's word doesn't count for much. But surely, Moffat doesn't have the guts to do that, right? He just wouldn't.
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Apr 1, 2018 13:34
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Hahaha “pound store Zathras”. At some point during the episode I looked at my wife and said, “Not the one .... not the one”
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Apr 1, 2018 13:40
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Yeah I just kind of ran with the assumption that the Doctor would save her, and the interesting part would be how to deal with the giant machine sticking out of her torso. I actually assumed that would be used as the reason for her not to continue traveling with him or something. Because in almost all cases the companion/major character is saved just before the bad thing can happen. That's what makes the Master's actions so horrifying, because he waited until the last possible second before he manipulated her into the conversion room, just to make it as fresh and tragic for the Doctor as possible. Ending with her proclaiming she waited for him really is a gut punch.
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Apr 1, 2018 13:43
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I remember thinking the Mr Razor disguise was a bit of a plot hole, since if the Master disguised himself purely for Bill's benefit surely the other people at the hospital would be confused at this hairy hunchback appearing out of nowhere to help out around the place. Of course an elevator ride from the other end of the ship would probably take a few months from his perspective, but then would he really bother going to that much effort to disguise himself from someone who was a child when he was prime minister and would probably not even recognise him? Well whatever, doing pointlessly intricate stuff is kind of the Master's deal I guess. Moffat clearing up the deal with the disguise at the beginning of the next episode without actually referring to it is one of my favourite bits of his writing, though overall I think it's one if his weaker finales
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Apr 1, 2018 14:01
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It's subtle enough that I don't know if it was even intentional but a harmless black woman being shot by a panicking blue man was a neat and timely bit of satire.
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Apr 1, 2018 14:19
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A Dalek's idea of an April Fool's Joke: https://twitter.com/BarnabyEdwards/status/980343984710090752
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Apr 1, 2018 14:58
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I enjoy that in Last of the Time Lords the Master sighs 'I don't know who I'd be without that noise' and the answer turns out to be 'a hilarious rear end in a top hat like usual, but with a bit more focus'. I can't express how much I adore Simm's Master. He's such a dick. 
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Apr 1, 2018 15:14
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2house2fly posted:I remember thinking the Mr Razor disguise was a bit of a plot hole, since if the Master disguised himself purely for Bill's benefit surely the other people at the hospital would be confused at this hairy hunchback appearing out of nowhere to help out around the place. Of course an elevator ride from the other end of the ship would probably take a few months from his perspective, but then would he really bother going to that much effort to disguise himself from someone who was a child when he was prime minister and would probably not even recognise him? Well whatever, doing pointlessly intricate stuff is kind of the Master's deal I guess. Do you really not know what any of the prime minister's from before you were an adult look like?
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Apr 1, 2018 15:24
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HopperUK posted:I enjoy that in Last of the Time Lords the Master sighs 'I don't know who I'd be without that noise' and the answer turns out to be 'a hilarious rear end in a top hat like usual, but with a bit more focus'. I can't express how much I adore Simm's Master. He's such a dick. Dude straight up murders himself just to get the last word in an argument... with himself 
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Apr 1, 2018 15:40
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SiKboy posted:Do you really not know what any of the prime minister's from before you were an adult look like? Sure but if I was at the other end of the universe possibly thousands of years away from "now" and saw someone who looked a bit like John Major my reaction would probably just be to think "blimey, that bloke looks like John Major, that's weird"
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Apr 1, 2018 15:49
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2house2fly posted:Sure but if I was at the other end of the universe possibly thousands of years away from "now" and saw someone who looked a bit like John Major my reaction would probably just be to think "blimey, that bloke looks like John Major, that's weird" Even if John Major were mostly famous for murdering the President? Dude's face would be one of the most famous in the world.
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Apr 1, 2018 16:18
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I suppose Bill might remember that time she and everyone else on Earth turned into John Major for a day and a night
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Apr 1, 2018 16:59
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Wasn't it a big plot point from season five that everybody on Earth forgot about the stuff that happened during the RTD years?
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Apr 1, 2018 17:02
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