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2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

Just one season would mean sacrificing Last Christmas or Heaven Sent/Hell Bent. Not worth it. Let's just have more Capaldi instead

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2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

The Doctor didn't have the means to break all the laws of time and space with Donna and Amy in the same way he did with Clara. It's like saying "Oh so he can clone himself in the series 4 finale but not in the series 2 one what bullshit"

When River died he said "time can be rewritten" and she specifically said she didn't want him to.

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

Two dead Claras and a third alive one is already plenty impossible

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

I've seen people heap praise on series 9 in some corners of the net and I don't get it at all. By the time the zygon episodes came around I was relieved at how politically iffy they were because Christ at least there was something about them that was interesting.

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

CommonShore posted:

I enjoy this scene but I'm completely baffled by it from a narrative standpoint.

Well you see, at some point among his first three incarnations the Doctor met up with this museum curator, and evidently they got on so well the Doctor took on his face. The Curator knows a bit about Time Lord regeneration and assumed the Eleventh Doctor, who looked younger, was in fact a younger version of the man he'd met

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

"I've been put on trial by the high council of the Time Lords for committing a terrible crime."

"Oh God."

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

I think the Papal Mainframe is a 51st Century thing, and the Doctor being on Trenzalore for roughly 800 years ("twelve hundred and something" the episode before, "over two thousand" the episode after) means it was probably around the year 5800/5900 when he regenerated. Let's do what Moffat would do and say 6000 because it sounds cool

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

To be to honest I'd give the War Doctor's regeneration to the 23rd of November 2013. He was in the Present Day right before regenerating, and while the date wasn't established in the episode itself, Moffat likes to have the date in the adventure match the date of broadcast

remusclaw posted:

If they were going to do that, maybe they actually should have had the finale of the season set on Mondas and actually led up to the Christmas special rather than having a parallel but separate Cyberman story?

"They" weren't going to do that.

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

Rirse posted:

Watched the "Monk Trilogy", which was a pretty get set of episodes, but the finale was a bit disappointing since it felt like a mixture of the finale with Master taking over the world and Martha being the one person left (Master even in this episode!) and the Silence second parter with them going after a foe who in control of all. Probably was hoping Missy would been a wild card that the Monks didn't count on in the simulation who defeated them since they are in her way instead of "love conquerors all" ending.

This is probably the most positive review I've read of the third monk episode

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

I sort of dimly remember watching The End Of The World and the one with the farting aliens. Oh, I definitely watched the Simon Pegg one because I was a big fan of Simon Pegg, and then the Empty Child ones. It wasn't until series 4 that I really followed the show though

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

The_Doctor posted:

Because Doctor Who isnít the Thick of It, that was a different role. Itís like being being mad Gandalf didnít bust out his magnetic powers.

Uhhh that would have ruled

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

I think most people probably wouldn't care either way, to be honest

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

If nothing else, Extremis had a fairly bold premise for a children's show. There's been plenty of episodes where people confront death, but it's rare to have an episode where people are forced to confront the meaninglessness of their own existence. Of course, leave it up to the Doctor to find hope in hopelessness and make even his non-existence meaningful. One Moffat trope I never tired of was his theme of blurring the fourth wall and having stories about stories. This is almost a culmination of that idea, as the fictional simulated Doctor reaches out of the page to help the real one, the story making its influence felt in the real world(not unlike the novel In The Angels Take Manhattan, one of the kind of neat things about that episode)

You do kind of have to ignore the fact that the resolution of this episode does not influence the following episodes at all. Jerusalem is correct that this is better thought of as a one-off episode rather than part one of a trilogy. The last great Moffat episode...

2house2fly fucked around with this message at Mar 7, 2018 around 01:31

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

It seems a lot like there were three unrelated episode ideas that were folded into one story arc and handled by three different writers. It could probably have actually worked, if they didn't get that terrible writer whose name I forget to write part 3

E: Toby Whithouse, that's the one

https://twitter.com/PhilSandifer/st...8300787712?s=19

2house2fly fucked around with this message at Mar 10, 2018 around 23:13

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

Astroman posted:

I take it Sandifer has finely tuned his opinion that "Nu-Who is the only valid continuation of the original series" to "RTD-Who is the only valid continuation to the original series."

Can't to hear his increasingly Lawrence Milesesque hot takes on Chibnall-Whittaker Who.

From reading his blogs he's a Moffat superfan and iirc described series 8 and 9 as a "golden age" of the show, with the Peter Harness episodes as his favourites. Hard bloke to pin down

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

In retrospect I think Matt Smith is my favourite Doctor. Capaldi's great and probably had at least as many good episodes, but I guess I prefer the lighter tone of the Smith years

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

"How old are you?"
"Ah, I don't know. I lose track. Twelve hundred and something, I think. Unless I'm lying. I can't remember if I'm lying about my age, that's how old I am."

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

That poor guy. I bet he'd been waiting for that moment for all his life. Oh lord.

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

Heck, he was introduced by perving on Rose's arse.

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

https://youtu.be/tp_Fw5oDMao#t=19m30s

2house2fly fucked around with this message at Mar 15, 2018 around 23:39

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

As we've been able to confirm since, Moffat just likes it when people don't die

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

Kind of fitting of them to get Davison to be the one who speaks no evil

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

Man, Niles would make a decent companion

FRASIER: I don't like the colour.

NILES: [spluttering] of your kidneys?!

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

I remember thinking the Mr Razor disguise was a bit of a plot hole, since if the Master disguised himself purely for Bill's benefit surely the other people at the hospital would be confused at this hairy hunchback appearing out of nowhere to help out around the place. Of course an elevator ride from the other end of the ship would probably take a few months from his perspective, but then would he really bother going to that much effort to disguise himself from someone who was a child when he was prime minister and would probably not even recognise him? Well whatever, doing pointlessly intricate stuff is kind of the Master's deal I guess.

Moffat clearing up the deal with the disguise at the beginning of the next episode without actually referring to it is one of my favourite bits of his writing, though overall I think it's one if his weaker finales

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

SiKboy posted:

Do you really not know what any of the prime minister's from before you were an adult look like?

Sure but if I was at the other end of the universe possibly thousands of years away from "now" and saw someone who looked a bit like John Major my reaction would probably just be to think "blimey, that bloke looks like John Major, that's weird"

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

I suppose Bill might remember that time she and everyone else on Earth turned into John Major for a day and a night

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

I tend to think the show's approach to continuity is "when something like a Dalek invasion happens people try to get back to normal and forget it ever happened". A pessimistic read would be this from Lovecraft

quote:

The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents. We live on a placid island of ignorance in the midst of black seas of infinity, and it was not meant that we should voyage far. The sciences, each straining in its own direction, have hitherto harmed us little; but some day the piecing together of dissociated knowledge will open up such terrifying vistas of reality, and of our frightful position therein, that we shall either go mad from the revelation or flee from the deadly light into the peace and safety of a new dark age.

But I kind of prefer the way it was put in a pretty wretched Doctor Who episode

quote:

If you remembered how things felt, you'd have stopped having wars. And stopped having babies.

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

Is that a reference to Capaldi even though at that time the Doctor was still destined to die on Trenzalore?? Who do I have to call up and go absolutely mental at to get this changed?

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

I kind of intuitively figured stuff from outside the castle (or specific room) doesn't reset. The previous Doctor's skull is still on the floor of the teleporter room for ages because it can't reset until the foreign matter is removed. The Doctor takes the skull out and the room resets. So the diamond wall is another "outside" thing

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

I didn't think much of Broadchurch really, but it did have quite strong theming and I liked the use of repeated phrases as call backs("how could you not have known" or whatever) which are both things I came to expect from Doctor Who during the Moffat years, so I suppose that's as promising a start as any

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

Seems like the best way to do multi-Doctor stories would be to do it over again for each one. So for Day Of The Doctor you'd play it right before Rose, then between Waters Of Mars and End Of Time, then a third time in its original spot. Oh no but then all the previous ones come in for one scene and there's a Capaldi cameo, to say nothing of the Curator

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

It's so endearing both that Capaldi would say that, and that Moffat would immediately burst into laughter upon hearing it. I don't like to infer behind-the-scenes relationships, but I can't help but feel that on some level Capaldi said it because he knew Moffat would get it

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

The_Doctor posted:

None, probably.

"Would you be interested in recording a D&D session in character for twenty thousand pounds?"

"Uh... well I don't have that much on me, how soon would you need it?"

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

I thought he had it sorted once Capaldi came on board. No more split seasons, one episode after the other twelve weeks in a row, writing obviously not affected by behind-the-scenes clusterfucks... then there was no series in 2016 for some reason. The madman did it again

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

It's on the lower tier of Moffat episodes, but it's got some fun gags and I liked the villains

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

The_Doctor posted:

I think so. I thought it was bad, even by Christmas specialsí poor standards. The Doctor just lets a man die, wandering off to make jokes and consume snacks.

That guy was like a billionaire captain of industry, so not considering him particularly worthy of rescue might be an insight into Moffat's politics

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

I liked Husbands right up until the fun capers stopped and it started getting sappy

2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

Spatula City posted:

gently caress, watching those clips reminds me how much I love The Husbands of River Song. I think it's honestly her best story, and one of the best of Capaldi's run. For all Moffat bungled payoff for many of his running plotlines, he manages to bring River's story entirely full circle in a way that almost makes up for all the gently caress-ups. When I watch Silence in the Library/Forest of the Dead again, it's just going to be that much harder. but this is sort of what Moffat likes to do - brutally put his characters through the ringer, but not without meaning, and not without some measure of happiness.
I think this is what people miss when they look at Moffat - he's not a heartless bastard. The kneejerk "it's a copout" to both Clara and Bill's endings is lazy, and for that matter betrays a certain kind of bloodlust. and for all people accuse Moffat of being sexist (and he has had missteps), leaving it at Clara dead and Bill cyberconverted would be worse, rendering them as only, in the end, tragedies that happened to the Doctor. Instead, while the Doctor gets them into the nightmare situations, ultimately Clara and Bill come out of it transcended. Twelve didn't create tragedies, ultimately. He generated two more Doctors!
I mean, I say this as someone who is really, really not a huge fan of killing characters off for drama, and thinks the emphasis on it among certain fans is beyond grotesque.

the ghost of Earthshock needs purging.

Well said. I love things like Clara's ending, and never got the fan demand for her to just be dead. Where's the fun in that? Moffat's on record as saying that his vision of Doctor Who is a big-hearted show where love wins in the end. He also had a quite lovely quote some years back, about how heroes in fiction are a mirror of what we aspire to, and he liked that with Doctor Who they gave this hero a screwdriver to fix things and the superpower of having an extra heart

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2house2fly
Nov 14, 2012

You did a super job wrapping things up! And I'm not just saying that because I have to!

Ha I just remembered Moffat said one of the Doctor's children was the president

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