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Merk: do you really think it's a good idea to lynch the claimed tracker a day after you say you successfully protected me and that you can't target the same person on consecutive nights? I mean given that there is very likely going to be 2 kills tonight, I am almost certainly going to die because I'm a direct threat to both scum and the SK. Even if scum have a roleblocker to control me, the SK is probably extremely worried about me.
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Feb 20, 2018 18:28
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TMMadman posted:Merk: do you really think it's a good idea to lynch the claimed tracker a day after you say you successfully protected me and that you can't target the same person on consecutive nights? I don't care about trying to game the scum or any other non-town party kills. That usually leads to mistakes. I find scum. I lynch scum.
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Feb 20, 2018 18:30
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You still haven't explained why you claimed in a way that makes any sense at all from a town perspective.
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Feb 20, 2018 18:35
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I just realized this. You also made me claim that I can't target the same person two nights in a row, which is information that only helps scum. Cool cool.
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Feb 20, 2018 18:42
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merk posted:Yes, it successfully led a lynch on scum. Feb 16, 2018 3:08 PM Moatillata posted:I say that with the utmost care respect and admiration Feb 16, 2018 4:44 PM merk posted:Sorry Ecco Moat's post and yours are separated only by about 90 minutes. If there were, like, 5+ pages of rambling posts to read through I'd be more inclined to believe you. But, since you were the one who pushed the case in TWEWY using the breadcrumb, I find it hard to believe that in the ~1 page of posts you had to read post-flip, you didn't pick it up. The only thing saving you is the doc claim. You yourself point out that your play has been scummy. I think the claim is fake, and making it at -1 was a last-ditch effort to save yourself. Also, while TMM's role isn't confirmed, voting out the claimed tracker is something I'd expect from scum/SK rather than a town doc. ##vote merk
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Feb 20, 2018 18:42
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merk posted:I just realized this. You also made me claim that I can't target the same person two nights in a row, which is information that only helps scum. Cool cool. Wouldn't that info make you more likely to believe TMM is town? It's not a universal restriction in games, and in fact is quite odd. What would be the point in restricting scum that way? The SK is probably going to kill every night, so restricting a scum tracker that way doesn't make a whole lot of sense.
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Feb 20, 2018 18:45
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merk posted:You still haven't explained why you claimed in a way that makes any sense at all from a town perspective. Town wins by sharing information. I would have liked to have 2 tracks, but I still likely would have claimed today anyway. And if, as it seemed likely to happen, I got to -2 fairly quickly I would have probably claimed at that point. And then of course you'd be saying that I was only making that claim then to try and save myself.
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Feb 20, 2018 19:06
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The way I see it is that we started the day with likely 3 non town in a group of 10 people. My claim turns that into 3 non town in group of 8 people. Sure, there is still the possibility that Monathin is a scum who didn't move on N1, but that's an issue that is best dealt with in the future. And, of course, you can always choose not to believe my claim and continue looking at the whole group of 10, but I personally don't think that's a wise course of action. At some point during the game, you have to start trusting people. This is also kind of why I'm still suspicious of merk. It feels like he's making a lot of 'trust me' type posts but he isn't actually willing to trust anyone else. That is just something that doesn't sit right with me because if someone isn't willing to show some trust then why should others turn around and trust that person?
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Feb 20, 2018 19:21
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Tobbs Gnawed posted:Feb 16, 2018 3:08 PM Ok, good luck!
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Feb 20, 2018 20:22
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merk posted:Yes, it successfully led a lynch on scum. You're admitting it was "a THIN skim" and didn't think you should maybe reread a little before posting a bunch on day 3? merk posted:I don't care about trying to game the scum or any other non-town party kills. That usually leads to mistakes. I find scum. I lynch scum. Completely not true, you've tried gambits before, I'd call that "gaming the scum" merk posted:I just realized this. You also made me claim that I can't target the same person two nights in a row, which is information that only helps scum. Cool cool. Because it's IMPOSSIBLE to say something like "I'd rather not specify that right now" or something? Merk what the gently caress, nobody broke into your house and typed a post on your computer while you looked on in horror. merk posted:Here's a case on me. Go hog wild.  oh good, you cased yourself, welp pack it up everybody he cased himself, that means he can't be scum.Don't want to get too close to hammer since deadline is tomorrow night, but merk is not convincing me to not vote for him
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Feb 20, 2018 20:44
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TMMadman posted:Town wins by sharing information. I would have liked to have 2 tracks, but I still likely would have claimed today anyway. And if, as it seemed likely to happen, I got to -2 fairly quickly I would have probably claimed at that point. Everyone should read this post as the sole justification that TMM made to explain why he claimed out of the blue. If you believe this is coming from a town alignment, please read it again.
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Feb 20, 2018 20:45
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Xad posted:You're admitting it was "a THIN skim" and didn't think you should maybe reread a little before posting a bunch on day 3? I did read before I started posting on d3.
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Feb 20, 2018 20:45
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Xad posted:You're admitting it was "a THIN skim" and didn't think you should maybe reread a little before posting a bunch on day 3? This post is coming from someone who believed or fake believed whole heartedly that I was scum before thinking about what to type. I'm leaning towards fake believing.
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Feb 20, 2018 20:47
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Scum tell training: Make it look like you're debating internally about a player's alignment before posting. Xad, your post shows you had a preconceived conclusion which more often than not happens from a scum player trying to make it look like they're scum hunting rather than actually scum hunting.
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Feb 20, 2018 20:48
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Merk, tell me what you think about Asphyious, Tobbs and Lupus. They were votes 5/6/7 on Ecco at the end of D1. PMom/AA was the 8th vote but I think he's likely to be town. Monathin was the 4th vote but I tracked him nowhere on N1. Again, it's possible that he's scum who just didn't move on N1, but I think he's more likely to be town.
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Feb 20, 2018 20:49
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TMMadman posted:Merk, tell me what you think about Asphyious, Tobbs and Lupus. They were votes 5/6/7 on Ecco at the end of D1. PMom/AA was the 8th vote but I think he's likely to be town. I think Lupus is town. That's the only other read I have.
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Feb 20, 2018 20:51
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merk posted:Everyone should read this post as the sole justification that TMM made to explain why he claimed out of the blue. If you believe this is coming from a town alignment, please read it again. Are you saying that I shouldn't have said anything and let myself get lynched? You are supposed to be a better player than this merk. So this is either a disappointing effort by you or your scum.
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Feb 20, 2018 20:53
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While I will agree with merks points about aggressiveness in the game, I don't believe that merk is being genuine about his reaction to how it all unfolded. I will say that I'm not going to vote the claimed doctor when there is no other player actively contesting the claim, but I still don't feel good about merk. That said, maybe I'm alone, but I still feel like lupus has been contributing artificial reads, and that their early game suspicion of MMT was bussing.
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Feb 20, 2018 20:55
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TMMadman posted:Are you saying that I shouldn't have said anything and let myself get lynched? How many votes did you have when you made the claim? You were more worried about getting in front of potential votes against you than actually hunting scum. That's my point. That's "scummind" (Lumpentm)
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Feb 20, 2018 21:00
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merk posted:How many votes did you have when you made the claim? You were more worried about getting in front of potential votes against you than actually hunting scum. That's my point. That's "scummind" (Lumpentm) It doesn't matter how many votes I had on me. I always try to claim on my terms and that was a good time to do it. And saying that a tracker claim is going to stop votes from piling up on me is ludicrous. A tracker claim is not the same as a cop/doctor claim. My problem here is that the more you complain about the claim the more I think you're scum who is pissed off because you thought I'd be an easy lynch target today.
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Feb 20, 2018 21:13
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TMMadman posted:Are you saying that I shouldn't have said anything and let myself get lynched? TMMadman posted:It doesn't matter how many votes I had on me. I always try to claim on my terms and that was a good time to do it. You are contradicting yourself about why you claimed. Was it to avoid a lynch or would a Tracker claim do nothing to stop a lynch?
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Feb 20, 2018 21:16
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TMMadman posted:My problem here is that the more you complain about the claim the more I think you're scum who is pissed off because you thought I'd be an easy lynch target today. You weren't even on my radar until you claimed. This is hilarious.
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Feb 20, 2018 21:17
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It's good that you keep focusing on this instead of reading Tobbs/asphixious, two people you just said you don't have a read on.
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Feb 20, 2018 21:24
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TMMadman posted:It's good that you keep focusing on this instead of reading Tobbs/asphixious, two people you just said you don't have a read on. It's because I think you're scum. I don't have to have an opinion about every player.
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Feb 20, 2018 21:58
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TMMadman posted:##vote Tobbs What's the case?
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Feb 20, 2018 22:05
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merk posted:It's because I think you're scum. I don't have to have an opinion about every player. Well, even if you believe that I'm scum, there would still likely be 2 other non town players out there and I'd be real interested to hear who you think they are. I'm assuming one of them is Xad, but who else?
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Feb 20, 2018 22:06
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TMMadman posted:Well, even if you believe that I'm scum, there would still likely be 2 other non town players out there and I'd be real interested to hear who you think they are. I'm assuming one of them is Xad, but who else? I will reevaluate after I see a flip. I don't see the point in predicting who is scum based on unknown flips.
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Feb 20, 2018 22:11
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merk posted:I will reevaluate after I see a flip. I don't see the point in predicting who is scum based on unknown flips. In other words, you don't want to make any other reads today because it might look bad if you have to backtrack on them tomorrow.
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Feb 20, 2018 22:19
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Like I said, I don't want to vote the doc. Even though I usually think authoritative posting is kind of scummy, as it allows a thread narrative to be constructed and controlled, it doesn't seem like a reasonable vote unless you absolutely think the claim is a lie. As far as voting tracker goes, yes scum trackers/watchers exist, but again, kind of want to see where the claim goes first and see if anything of use comes of it. I think voting either claimed power roles today would be silly, and I'd much rather look at who is coasting on the momentum of this argument. I'm not saying that either of you are implicitly town, it just doesn't seem like the smart thing to do, yah? I see Xad discrediting the lupus vote and that leaves me conflicted because I think lupus is probably clever scum, but if lupus wasn't scum bussing MMT, then Xad discrediting the vote looks significantly worse. Going to re-read Xad and see if the points raised against them hold up to the AA idiot standard.
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Feb 20, 2018 22:39
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fwiw, I think locking yourself into one read this early in the game is probably bad form.
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Feb 20, 2018 22:39
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Anomalous Amalgam posted:fwiw, I think locking yourself into one read this early in the game is probably bad form. I've given at least three reads today.
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Feb 20, 2018 22:41
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TMMadman posted:In other words, you don't want to make any other reads today because it might look bad if you have to backtrack on them tomorrow. It's not that at all. I don't see why you would spend effort making guesses about alignment in future days that require unknown flips. Here's me talking negatively about that in the last game that I played: https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3846638&userid=37071&perpage=40&pagenumber=8#post481069159
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Feb 20, 2018 22:42
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merk posted:I've given at least three reads today. Correct, I like what you had to say about Xad in particular, but even still, I don't think nuking a claimed PR this early is a good idea. I get there's not even momentum there, but still... And to Tobbs and DB, do you think the doc claim is a lie and worth testing? I don't. At least not yet. Like I said, it is uncontested.
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Feb 20, 2018 22:51
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Anomalous Amalgam posted:Correct, I like what you had to say about Xad in particular, but even still, I don't think nuking a claimed PR this early is a good idea. I get there's not even momentum there, but still... Scum Doctor in a game with an SK is a thing. Scum Tracker is a common thing. We shouldn't hesitate to lynch a claimed PR without a counterclaim in this setup.
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Feb 20, 2018 22:52
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AA, you've posted... not a lot. You have voted only Lupus. What gives? TMM, if you're looking for an SK, this is the player that looks most like one on my read. AA is voting a player that has no chance of getting lynched each day. Laying under the weeds is what I would expect from an SK.
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Feb 20, 2018 22:54
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I can't quote right nis, trying to do some work things But i think xad set up a bus on mmt calling out moat as a patsy, and has since tried to make moat look worse by comparison. Will quote shortly
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Feb 20, 2018 22:57
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Anomalous Amalgam posted:I can't quote right nis, trying to do some work things I thought Moat's aggression d1 was bad, but his absolute certainty that MMT was scum continuing into day 2 made me reconsider, as well as MMT continuing to make weird posts. As for you AA--who DO you think you'd vote for today? I understand not wanting to vote for TMM or merk immediately since they both claimed today, but all you've really done other than that is vote and unvote for lupus
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Feb 20, 2018 23:16
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Anomalous Amalgam posted:Correct, I like what you had to say about Xad in particular, but even still, I don't think nuking a claimed PR this early is a good idea. I get there's not even momentum there, but still... Trackers can have confirmed results, docs cannot. That's assuming there weren't 4 attempted kills last night, as merk claims a success on doc'ing TMM. And like I said, we've already had 2 flipped town power roles, including 1 protective. If anything, doc is the safest fakeclaim. He pulled it out at -1, and he didn't doc Moat, whose cop breadcrumb of  should have been picked up by merk. All of that is apart from his (self-admitted) scummy play.
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Feb 20, 2018 23:36
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LupusAter posted:Might as well. It's been sitting at -2 for a lot of time, I think it reinforces it being a correct vote, you figure scum would've bussed it earlier. ##vote MMT Indeed, you would think they might have. LupusAter posted:I am leaning towards town for Moat, having just played a game where he was scum and was a lot less active D1. MMT feels weirdly overeager, but could be their general play style. Hmmm. Xad posted:Well RIP jokephase I guess ##unvote Xad posted:MMT is TMM backwards And this is why I think you were bussing, because you seem to hedge on mmt as scum but focus on moat heavily and then backpedal. I feel like honestly, both you and lupus could have been scum with MMT. You've tossed shade on one point by lupus today while digging into merk. I'd vote either lup or you
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Feb 20, 2018 23:41
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Anomalous Amalgam posted:Correct, I like what you had to say about Xad in particular, but even still, I don't think nuking a claimed PR this early is a good idea. I get there's not even momentum there, but still... I think merk's claim going uncounterd does give merk town points , but that doesn't mean the real doc isn't out there pending reading/counterclaiming. Who haaven't we heard from since the claim?
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Feb 21, 2018 00:18
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