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Drone_Fragger
May 9, 2007

VOTE
FOR
PEDRO


Also the AI got a lot harder simply because they made it aim for production trargets rather than actively reacting to shortages. So rather than build an alloy plant when it goes into negative alloys per month (which would only happen when grossly over fleet cap) it now aims to have x00 excess alloy production per month, which is determined by the game length and the AI type. Those changes alone made the AI much more challenging, and it will actually build worlds that to some extent could be built by a human player.

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Splicer
Oct 16, 2006

from hell's heart I stab at thee

Gross
https://twitter.com/StellarisMobile...383745472114691
Do unpaid writing work, maybe win a pittance. They're really going for the full lovely mobile game bingo

Aethernet
Jan 28, 2009

This is the Captain...

Our glorious political masters have, in their wisdom, decided to form an alliance with a rag-tag bunch of freedom fighters right when the Federation has us at a tactical disadvantage. Unsurprisingly, this has resulted in the Feds firing on our vessels...

Damn you Huxley!

Grimey Drawer

Literally paying writers in pins.

hobbesmaster
Jan 28, 2008


Splicer posted:

Gross
https://twitter.com/StellarisMobile...383745472114691
Do unpaid writing work, maybe win a pittance. They're really going for the full lovely mobile game bingo

Someone get https://twitter.com/forexposure_txt to retweet it, I don't twitter.

Bofast
Feb 21, 2011



Grimey Drawer

CommunityEdition posted:

Just “finished” my first game in year 2480 in a stalemate with a Contingency that showed a bewildering lack of urgency even after my entire fleet got stuck on the other side of the map by a awakened empire with closed borders and an urgent need to annex the wormhole home. Sorry, but I need to rant:

How is it possible that this game makes me miss the CK2 UI? I get notified every time a slave of my species goes up for auction or a essentially featureless envoy dies and is automatically replaced with an identical featureless “leader”, but not when a colony tips to zero population growth from over crowding? And the overview pane, dear god the overview pane, is there no way to not have everything crammed into one long slider bar list so I have to choose between neglecting my colonies neglecting my fleets? No way to not have the fleet manager scrunch the fleet list itself into a business card grid?

I also didn’t appreciate realizing that the war bars aren’t warscore about 90% through my first war.

That said, I’ve immediately gone on to a double length megacorp run where everyone federates and most of the AI are also megacorps. And there’s some sort of scary Broken Clock system from an events mod that happens to be right next to most of my nicer stuff. I have no idea what it might do if it triggers, but after the (one day per second on fastest) debacle of my first game I’m fully prepared to throw as many systems between it and my home world to other empires as it takes to maybe trigger some sort of “this is something I should react to” flag in the AI. Not that heroic last stands seem to get much other than a sanction for going below half naval cap.

I might try lithoids next.

I agree that the Stellaris UI is a mess. It's also incredibly inconsistent, as if different people with different philosophies or goals made different parts of it without trying to unify it.

Bofast
Feb 21, 2011



Grimey Drawer

Schadenboner posted:

So I might be an omnicidal space fashie lunatic but at least I didn't declare LITERAL loving SPACE WHALES as vermin. Also they passed the capitalist Deregulation thing, and didn't pass the Charter of Workers Rights.

Galactic Senate?

Even if I wasn't going to already murder all of you, I'm sure as hell going to now...

E: Does anyone know why the game is so hilariously bad at auto-designating colony type? It's never even right accidentally. I'm not even asking in a "Lol, Paradox" way either: in a technical sense I would have legitimately thought that this sort of thing (1. figure out what districts are present or under-construction, 2. set that to the colony type) would be p.easy?

My game gets the auto-designated colony types right about 50% of the time, so I don't know.

Bofast
Feb 21, 2011



Grimey Drawer

benzine posted:

Haven't heard of Kerberos in a long time but remember the drama of sots 2, what a shame.

Still, what is the best space 4x game for the thread, excluding Stellaris?

Mine, Distant Worlds

Space Empires IV, especially with the quadrant mod.

Cynic Jester
Apr 11, 2009

Let's put a simile on that face
A dazzling simile
Twinkling like the night sky


Splicer posted:

Gross
https://twitter.com/StellarisMobile...383745472114691
Do unpaid writing work, maybe win a pittance. They're really going for the full lovely mobile game bingo

I was wondering why it wasn't hosted with on the Paradox forums, but looking into it, this seems like it's run entirely by the Nova Empire devs. The contest is hosted on ktplay, a CN mobile game site.

Knightsoul
Dec 19, 2008


Bofast posted:

as if different people with different philosophies or goals made different parts of it without trying to unify it.

I think this sums up really well the fundamental problem of Stellaris as a competent 4x game: it had such promise on the start, but it developed as a mess of devs gaming philosophies.
So much potential wasted......

PittTheElder
Feb 13, 2012

Yes, it's like a lava lamp.



The best Space 4x game is still Alpha Centauri (in that it is a 4x that takes place non on earth).

It's really aged obviously but the writing and world building done there is better than any game I've ever played.

Splicer
Oct 16, 2006

from hell's heart I stab at thee

Knightsoul posted:

I think this sums up really well the fundamental problem of Stellaris as a competent 4x game: it had such promise on the start, but it developed as a mess of devs gaming philosophies.
So much potential wasted......
It's fun reading through a file and seeing wildly different approaches to things. I'm looking at the colony assignments file and the weighting for regular planet districts are weight 0, add 1 in this case, add 3 in the other, add 10 if you're really sure. Meanwhile col_habitat_mining has a starting weight of 5,000

benzine
Oct 21, 2010


PittTheElder posted:

The best Space 4x game is still Alpha Centauri (in that it is a 4x that takes place non on earth).

It's really aged obviously but the writing and world building done there is better than any game I've ever played.

The ability to annhilate your opponent cities and just leave a water filled crater is amazing. Or just buildin boreholes, altering the hills, AC is really the benchmark in civ games. Shame on the "remake"

Saros
Dec 29, 2009

Its almost like we're a Bureaucracy, in space!

I set sail for the Planet of Lab Requisitions!!



benzine posted:

Haven't heard of Kerberos in a long time but remember the drama of sots 2, what a shame.

Still, what is the best space 4x game for the thread, excluding Stellaris?

Mine, Distant Worlds

Stellar Monarch, it sets out to actually remove the tedious micro most 4x get bogged down in and actually plays like you're running an empire rather than micromanaging dozens of planets.

LogisticEarth
Mar 28, 2004

Someone once told me, "Time is a flat circle".


Aethernet posted:

Abuse envoys to get a sugardaddy. Econ hard while ignoring navy. Get to Battleships and then build navy. This approach made my last GA game a cakewalk, until I discovered that a 5x crisis is quite hard.

I've tried this but my wonderful AI federation partners are content to randomly fly their main fleets back and forth between two random systems in their home territory while the enemy wrecks my poo poo. I might bump back down a difficulty level as I'm not into min-maxing.

Relevant Tangent
Nov 18, 2016

Tangentially Relevant



Splicer posted:

Gross
https://twitter.com/StellarisMobile...383745472114691
Do unpaid writing work, maybe win a pittance. They're really going for the full lovely mobile game bingo

Blorgs looking pretty cute though.

Bofast
Feb 21, 2011



Grimey Drawer

PittTheElder posted:

The best Space 4x game is still Alpha Centauri (in that it is a 4x that takes place non on earth).

It's really aged obviously but the writing and world building done there is better than any game I've ever played.

Alpha Centauri was very good, indeed. Starting as the expansion pirate faction and then melting the polar caps to flood everyone's colonies is amusing.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.



benzine posted:

Haven't heard of Kerberos in a long time but remember the drama of sots 2, what a shame.

Still, what is the best space 4x game for the thread, excluding Stellaris?

Mine, Distant Worlds

For me it's the Star Ruler series not because they're especially good but because they let you do especially weird pointless scifi bullshit at nonsensical scales.

SR is AFAIK the only game where you can build an unarmed fighter-class ship too big to fit inside a solar system, sandbag forever by using planetary-thruster engines to send all of your planets into intergalactic space where nobody can find them, then when your fighter runs out of fuel and loses life support its millions of crew slowly die off until the reactor explodes and destroys the entire galaxy.

SR2 is slightly saner except if you make an empire of resource-conserving robots with the 'fling' transportation method (build an accelerator beacon that lets you FTL any owned ship/structure/object as long as you can afford the FTL-energy cost to accelerate it, bigger things/longer distances cost more...) and find one particular type of resource that makes FTL travel cost no energy, you can invade enemy territory by launching ringworlds at them and then diplomatically annexing their homeworld while they struggle to kill off your defense satellites. After only colonizing like 9(?) planets other than the ones you turn into rings.

silentsnack fucked around with this message at 21:39 on May 22, 2020

Captain Invictus
Apr 5, 2005


Clever Betty

thanks to whoever initially linked lathland in the thread, his full playthroughs have been great for background audio while I clean.

his latest video is actually a two-parter, because halfway through the video, and I think only a couple trips into the shroud, he gets End of the Cycle. and takes it. I love that it outright says DO NOT DO THIS, but he did it anyways, completely derailing the plans he had for the run beforehand.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKkoIfpSppk&hd=1

he has it set to 25x crisis strength too, not sure if the shroud avatars are affected by that but the actual crisis can spawn in very soon so I'm sure the second video will be an absolute clusterfuck as he tries to rebuild a tiny empire right as the real crisis shows up. I hope it's the contingency.

benzine
Oct 21, 2010


That shroud avatar should drop at least a relic.

silentsnack posted:

For me it's the Star Ruler series not because they're especially good but because they let you do especially weird pointless scifi bullshit at nonsensical scales.

SR is AFAIK the only game where you can build an unarmed fighter-class ship too big to fit inside a solar system, sandbag forever by using planetary-thruster engines to send all of your planets into intergalactic space where nobody can find them, then when your fighter runs out of fuel and loses life support its millions of crew slowly die off until the reactor explodes and destroys the entire galaxy.

What!? That is amazing.

benzine fucked around with this message at 02:51 on May 23, 2020

Libluini
May 18, 2012

Did I predict the future?


Grimey Drawer

Me, I've always had a soft spot for Operation: Eastside, just because that game is basically 90% SimCity in space with some 4x-parts bolted on.

Sometimes you play dozens of turns, just managing your colonies, until a message from the other space peoples arrives and reminds you that you're playing a 4x.

Also, the game forbids you from colonizing gas giants and all planets that are 100% covered by stuff your lander can't land on, but nothing else. It's amazing that the game allows you to look at a planet that's just a tiny island swimming in a global magma ocean and go "Hmm yeah, that's some nice place for us normal humans to live on!"

Especially as the races you can play as are all pretty similar to each other, just deviating a bit from the Human norm in one or the other direction, so doing this is always a dumb idea. But the game allows it! Put a colony everywhere, go mad trying to keep all your dying colonists alive!

The funniest part however is that you can reasonably well win every game with just a couple well-build planets and then spamming suicide colonies everywhere else. Man, that game was nuts.

Black Pants
Jan 16, 2008

Such comfortable, magical pants!

Lipstick Apathy

benzine posted:

Haven't heard of Kerberos in a long time but remember the drama of sots 2, what a shame.

Still, what is the best space 4x game for the thread, excluding Stellaris?

Mine, Distant Worlds

I will always, always champion Ascendancy. And bring it up any chance I can because it amuses me.

Some highlights:
- Ships designs are made up of a hull which determines how many tiles there are for putting stuff in, and stuff placed in those tiles. But there's no rules whatsoever for what you put in them. You need generators to allow your ship to do things, but other than that you can choose whether or not it has guns, shields, EWar stuff, colonisation units, FTL drives, hell engines at all. Want turrets? Build ships with max guns and no engines, undock them and they'll sit outside their home planet forever.

- Speaking of tiles, planets have a surface grid and space grid. In order to take a planet, you need to move a ship to it and 'dock' it in the space grid. Hoooooowever (I don't remember the specifics now, just that it was possible) you can fill the space grid with stuff that can't be destroyed, making the planet literally incapable of being captured.

- You can play as a race of giant amoeba. They're awesome and have awesome ships. Or you can play as giant eyestalk aliens that can see all the starlanes if you really want. The races are all pretty weird and interesting.

Black Pants fucked around with this message at 12:22 on May 23, 2020

Duodecimal
Dec 27, 2012

Still stupid

Ascendancy had creative aliens but there was 0% AI capability. Other alien planet tile usage was awful and their ship design was worthless too.

But it was the first game I individually named every ship so it also has a special place in my heart.

Huh, also just remembered that Ascendancy was the game that made me upgrade from 4 to 8 mb ram. That cost me $100.

ALSO I still listen to the soundtrack ripped from gamefiles even with the superlow sample rate.

Duodecimal fucked around with this message at 13:38 on May 23, 2020

Schadenboner
Aug 15, 2011

I MEAN, TURN OFF YOURE MONITOR, MIGTH EXPLAIN YOUR BAD POSTS, HOPE THIS HELPS?!

What's the current correct Corvette build? I do Missile with a Railgun (swap for a Disruptor or an Autocannon), 2 Armor (which changes to Armor and Crystal Plate when available) and 1 Shield (which gets upgraded to Psionic when available).

Are my Torpedo Boats actually Potato Boats?

Gort
Aug 18, 2003


Schadenboner posted:

What's the current correct Corvette build? I do Missile with a Railgun (swap for a Disruptor or an Autocannon), 2 Armor (which changes to Armor and Crystal Plate when available) and 1 Shield (which gets upgraded to Psionic when available).

Are my Torpedo Boats actually Potato Boats?



Yeah, missiles aren't good, 'cause nothing pairs well with them. Disruptors pair best, but once you have those you might as well just have three disruptors and forget the missile.

If there was a gun that ignored shields but not armour, that'd pair well, but there isn't.

Schadenboner
Aug 15, 2011

I MEAN, TURN OFF YOURE MONITOR, MIGTH EXPLAIN YOUR BAD POSTS, HOPE THIS HELPS?!

Gort posted:

Yeah, missiles aren't good, 'cause nothing pairs well with them. Disruptors pair best, but once you have those you might as well just have three disruptors and forget the missile.

If there was a gun that ignored shields but not armour, that'd pair well, but there isn't.

Faith and begorra, all aboard the Patrick O'Malley, next stop the fekkin' galactic kahr!

Relevant Tangent
Nov 18, 2016

Tangentially Relevant



Only fight in systems that zero out shields, have those be the natural borders of your empire.

Splicer
Oct 16, 2006

from hell's heart I stab at thee

Duodecimal posted:

Ascendancy had creative aliens but there was 0% AI capability. Other alien planet tile usage was awful and their ship design was worthless too.

But it was the first game I individually named every ship so it also has a special place in my heart.

Huh, also just remembered that Ascendancy was the game that made me upgrade from 4 to 8 mb ram. That cost me $100.

ALSO I still listen to the soundtrack ripped from gamefiles even with the superlow sample rate.
There was an AI patch released that made it less bad, a combination of adding some AI cheats and giving the AI some common sense. I went back to play it again while back and the big problem is QoL stuff interface, like every time I couldn't navigate the vertical tech tree with my scrollwheel felt like I'd stubbed my brain.

Great Beer
Jul 5, 2004



Schadenboner posted:

What's the current correct Corvette build? I do Missile with a Railgun (swap for a Disruptor or an Autocannon), 2 Armor (which changes to Armor and Crystal Plate when available) and 1 Shield (which gets upgraded to Psionic when available).

Are my Torpedo Boats actually Potato Boats?



Ignore everyone else, missile frigates own bones. Pair them with cruisers that have 3x missiles.

More missiles = better than

Black Pants
Jan 16, 2008

Such comfortable, magical pants!

Lipstick Apathy

Splicer posted:

There was an AI patch released that made it less bad, a combination of adding some AI cheats and giving the AI some common sense. I went back to play it again while back and the big problem is QoL stuff interface, like every time I couldn't navigate the vertical tech tree with my scrollwheel felt like I'd stubbed my brain.

Scroll wheel mouses didn't exist back then!

Schadenboner
Aug 15, 2011

I MEAN, TURN OFF YOURE MONITOR, MIGTH EXPLAIN YOUR BAD POSTS, HOPE THIS HELPS?!

Great Beer posted:

Ignore everyone else, missile frigates own bones. Pair them with cruisers that have 3x missiles.

More missiles = better than

See, I've had a really good time with all-Missile builds (also on my defense platforms, although I pair it with a big 'ol railgun which I eventually turn into a Proton Launcher rather than doubling-up) but I wasn't sure if they were actually bad?

Gort
Aug 18, 2003


All ships are bad except battleship-size and larger

Captain Splendid
Jan 7, 2009

Qu'en pense Caffarelli?

Doesn't matter how good your corvettes are if I can wreck them from the other side of the system

Schadenboner
Aug 15, 2011

I MEAN, TURN OFF YOURE MONITOR, MIGTH EXPLAIN YOUR BAD POSTS, HOPE THIS HELPS?!

Am I missing something or are attack craft really crap? They have like a 30 range?

I mean, I build one on every starbase but that's just for commerce protection, on warships I don't see how they're even possibly useful?

Aethernet
Jan 28, 2009

This is the Captain...

Our glorious political masters have, in their wisdom, decided to form an alliance with a rag-tag bunch of freedom fighters right when the Federation has us at a tactical disadvantage. Unsurprisingly, this has resulted in the Feds firing on our vessels...

Damn you Huxley!

Grimey Drawer

Schadenboner posted:

Am I missing something or are attack craft really crap? They have like a 30 range?

I mean, I build one on every starbase but that's just for commerce protection, on warships I don't see how they're even possibly useful?

That's the range of the craft's weapons; strike craft can attack about half the system away. They're good for PD in the battleship era.

Schadenboner
Aug 15, 2011

I MEAN, TURN OFF YOURE MONITOR, MIGTH EXPLAIN YOUR BAD POSTS, HOPE THIS HELPS?!

Aethernet posted:

That's the range of the craft's weapons; strike craft can attack about half the system away. They're good for PD in the battleship era.

How far away do they launch? Should I be all-missiles and strike craft (with disruptors for close-in)? What's the best X-Scale weapon (or should I just put in more strike craft on my BBs)?

Splicer
Oct 16, 2006

from hell's heart I stab at thee

Black Pants posted:

Scroll wheel mouses didn't exist back then!
Trust me I know! I meant the only reason I can't play it today is because of advancements in UX design that I can no longer live without.

Aethernet
Jan 28, 2009

This is the Captain...

Our glorious political masters have, in their wisdom, decided to form an alliance with a rag-tag bunch of freedom fighters right when the Federation has us at a tactical disadvantage. Unsurprisingly, this has resulted in the Feds firing on our vessels...

Damn you Huxley!

Grimey Drawer

Schadenboner posted:

How far away do they launch? Should I be all-missiles and strike craft (with disruptors for close-in)? What's the best X-Scale weapon (or should I just put in more strike craft on my BBs)?

At least 150 range, as that's the range of carrier computers, but they can engage opponents from a very long distance. I find leaning heavily on missiles and strike craft is still less efficient than having lots of Tachyon Beams / Kinetic Artillery, but they're so good at murdering corvettes that I tend to have about a third of my BBs as carriers.

I normally have all-strike craft BBs, but they do synergise well with Arc Emitters if you want to use an X mount.

Schadenboner
Aug 15, 2011

I MEAN, TURN OFF YOURE MONITOR, MIGTH EXPLAIN YOUR BAD POSTS, HOPE THIS HELPS?!

Aethernet posted:

At least 150 range, as that's the range of carrier computers

See I saw that setting but just assumed it was Paradox being potato?

CommunityEdition
May 1, 2009


How did I forget the three tongued rats?

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Schadenboner
Aug 15, 2011

I MEAN, TURN OFF YOURE MONITOR, MIGTH EXPLAIN YOUR BAD POSTS, HOPE THIS HELPS?!

So do Missile/Small Craft for defense platforms or have two models and build Missile/Heavy and Small Craft/Heavy? Or maybe use flak batteries because their Evasion is 0?

E: Are either of the CIWS (flak/laser flak) good?

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