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Fart City posted:IM3 is a movie about PTSD, but Stark comes to terms with his place in the world at the end. The problem is Age Of Ultron then retcons him into being a fear-based reactionary, which Civil War doubles down on. At some point “Tony Stark is afraid of what will come” became the default read on the character. This was always the joke with Stark in particular, like he learns An Important Lesson in each movie and then gets reset because people fall all over themselves for Iron Man 1 Stark. Age of Ultron kinda sorta implies that he was brainwashed by Scarlet Witch into creating Ultron but like, that movie is such a mess. The other joke is like, wow, a movie where Stark has to fight an evil version of his armor designs from his company, how revolutionary.
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Jan 14, 2019 17:42
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Also in IM3 he blows up a bunch of his suits which he had updated to the point of being semi-autonomous drones and at the beginning of Age of Ultron...he's made a bunch more drones. Also also regarding the IM3 -> Ultron -> CW character arc, even if you use the "oh he's been getting more paranoid and desperate for control" logic it makes even less sense that a relatively small incident sends him careening the entire opposite way by CW right into the arms of the government. He doesn't listen to Banner or Cap when they're warning him about Ultron/Vision because he thinks he's the only person possibly smart enough to be in control, then all of a sudden he is deferring to Ross of all people? Oh but only for like half of the movie cause by the end he's right back to disdaining the guy and openly undermining his authority.
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Jan 14, 2019 17:58
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Fart City posted:It’s also pretty lol that Tony Stark spends the first two Iron Man movies bucking the influence of the American government because he believes that he’s the only one who can responsibly tackle the big picture threats, only to completely acquiesce to the government in Civil War after it was revealed that the senator who tried to take the Iron Man technology in Iron Man 2 was a Hydra agent. Neo Rasa posted:Plus they made the accords seem so written in stone even after Stark is basically like huh Cap is right let's sign them and if we disagree with the UN later we'll just not follow them at that point (which the Avengers have already done multiple times to the US government at this point) but it's still treated as this earth shattering change in how things work. The change is that, with the power vacuum left behind by the destruction of Hydra, Stark is spreading to fill the gaps (because at a fundamental level, Stark is Hydra). In Winter Soldier we see Stark Industries scooping up ex-SHIELD employees. In Civil War we see Tony Stark publically presenting himself as acquiescing to the government, but in reality embedding himself within it in a deal that he openly brags to Captain America is subject to revision if it starts to inconvenience him. It feels kinda weird because, despite some of the trappings, it's ultimately not an ideological disagreement but a more practical argument over how a true libertarian superman should respond to government: do you subvert it from within or do you defy it from without.
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Jan 14, 2019 18:29
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Neo Rasa posted:I still think the funnier version of this was how they had to do whole "nothing matters" mirror universe thing with Dr. Strange to explain how Dr. Strange and all associated characters are just being introduced now despite having huge magical battles throughout Midtown. I was kind of surprised by how much those visuals were praised by folks when the movie came out. Like the initial multidimensional trip Tilda Swinton sends him on looked great but the mirror universe stuff was pretty whatever. The Dr. Strange mirror universe was stuff we wanted out of Inception but never really got, because of the limitation of those "folding landscape" effects.
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Jan 14, 2019 19:05
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Neo Rasa posted:I still think the funnier version of this was how they had to do whole "nothing matters" mirror universe thing with Dr. Strange to explain how Dr. Strange and all associated characters are just being introduced now despite having huge magical battles throughout Midtown. I was kind of surprised by how much those visuals were praised by folks when the movie came out. Like the initial multidimensional trip Tilda Swinton sends him on looked great but the mirror universe stuff was pretty whatever. Doctor Strange's visuals are best seen in 3d. Easily one of my favorite MCU movies in 3d.
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Jan 14, 2019 23:17
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Sir Kodiak posted:The change is that, with the power vacuum left behind by the destruction of Hydra, Stark is spreading to fill the gaps (because at a fundamental level, Stark is Hydra). In Winter Soldier we see Stark Industries scooping up ex-SHIELD employees. In Civil War we see Tony Stark publically presenting himself as acquiescing to the government, but in reality embedding himself within it in a deal that he openly brags to Captain America is subject to revision if it starts to inconvenience him. But Man of Steel and BvS is the liberterian ubermench fantasy lol
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Jan 14, 2019 23:26
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Young Freud posted:The Dr. Strange mirror universe was stuff we wanted out of Inception but never really got, because of the limitation of those "folding landscape" effects. But even then, they just run in straight lines through a crazy universe that always lines up perfectly under them. That whole thing is just window dressing for fights and chases that might as well have taken place on an infinite radial plane.
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Jan 15, 2019 03:02
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Snowman_McK posted:But even then, they just run in straight lines through a crazy universe that always lines up perfectly under them. That whole thing is just window dressing for fights and chases that might as well have taken place on an infinite radial plane. well yeah the mirror world is just to protect the real world and the wizards are all terminally uncreative (ie: they all just fight with glowy weapons instead of magic spells and poo poo)
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Jan 16, 2019 15:00
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Snowman_McK posted:But even then, they just run in straight lines through a crazy universe that always lines up perfectly under them. That whole thing is just window dressing for fights and chases that might as well have taken place on an infinite radial plane. I agree completely, I thought that chase was really stupid.
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Jan 16, 2019 15:08
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I remember the time reversing battle using the terrain a lot better, with e.g. that guy getting sealed up in the wall.
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Jan 16, 2019 15:12
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Guy A. Person posted:I remember the time reversing battle using the terrain a lot better, with e.g. that guy getting sealed up in the wall. That was more creative but just felt incomplete. Like they couldn't quite figure out how the scene would work, so they did a quick montage then got back to a more conventional scene for the ending.
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Jan 16, 2019 23:30
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