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sebmojo posted:No it’s not. This project was framed as a goon crowdsourced novel in the OP. chitoryu12 writing this with no goon input is him quitting the project as set up in the OP. It's fine if it's a different thing now, but "we" is right there in the title of this thread. Direct quote: chitoryu12 posted:As we cover each chapter, we'll discuss how we feel it should be written.
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Apr 23, 2018 21:14
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feedmyleg posted:This project was framed as a goon crowdsourced novel in the OP. chitoryu12 writing this with no goon input is him quitting the project as set up in the OP. It's fine if it's a different thing now, but "we" is right there in the title of this thread. Direct quote: And when we reached that point of discussion most of what happened was trolling, arguments over whether or not prose mattered more than the story and characters, people saying the project sucked and shouldn't exist anyway, and you temporarily quitting the thread because I wouldn't go for your idea of completely changing the format of the project. There was very little actual discussion on the contents of the first chapter, extremely little contribution of text (more troll posts were made than actual constructive posts until the thread got moved to CC), and even stated refusals to provide any text because they thought I would just throw everything out. It's becoming kinda clear at this point that even though I want to continue on with the project, it's not happening in the way I intended and the discussion and criticism is probably going to remain the same as it is now. If I were to say something like "Clearly we want very different things out of this book, so I'm going to press on instead of rewriting one chapter over and over to satisfy two or three people", I'd probably get accused of ignoring criticism. Even just saying I was seeking outside opinions was accused of quitting the thread and ignoring criticism! So unless some other people want to actually follow the OP guidelines for contributing text and solid ideas on the progression of the book, this isn't going to continue the same way.
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Apr 23, 2018 21:25
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I don't think you take feedback very well. Nobody here was trolling you, people were giving feedback in good faith and you were choosing to get defensive and ignore it.
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Apr 23, 2018 21:29
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feedmyleg posted:Nobody here was trolling you, people were giving feedback in good faith lol
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Apr 23, 2018 21:34
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feedmyleg posted:I don't think you take feedback very well. Mel spent virtually all of his posts on weird sex stuff until the move to Creative Convention made that actually against the rules.
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Apr 23, 2018 21:37
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chitoryu12 posted:Mel spent virtually all of his posts on weird sex stuff until the move to Creative Convention made that actually against the rules. Eh, I’m not going to rule out weird sex stuff as a valid literary reinterpretation of a work as masturbatory as RPO. Shying away from the dank depths of the goon psyche may be the same option, but I can’t help but be a little curious about what the unshackled imaginations of this forum would do to this book.
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Apr 23, 2018 21:46
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Here's a question Is there anything the main character actually likes? He's memorized everything because that's basically what he's had to do, but does he actually LIKE things? Like think about this game for a moment. The only thing he seems to have taken any effort in is his dumb car, which shows up for about a paragraph before being forgotten entirely. It's the only item that he's gone out of his way to customize and change, to put his own identity into such as he has. Everything else he uses is just whatever the game gives him that he knows because he memorized all of it. Using myself as an example, I'd keep some kind of trinket or something that I had a lot of affection for, maybe something others wouldn't think was that cool but I loved. I'd make it part of my character design maybe, or use it as a weapon if it applied. Like Jason Voorhees' mask or UltraSeven's eyeslugger or whatever. This is a game about incorporating things you love into yourself and your identity, but instead of doing anything with that they just throw around the basic poo poo as is. His character is just him but buff and with hair, or in the movie, him but an anime. Maybe he secretly really likes Rainbow Brite?
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Apr 23, 2018 21:56
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Lex Neville, Mrenda, feedmyleg, and Stuporstar all typed thousands of words of inarguably good-faith advice, and even Mel got serious for a second. There hasn't been any real trolling since the thread was moved to this forum and BravestOfTheLamps was probated. But your standard response to advice was to either argue defensively about it or ask for specific writing samples to use as models, neither of which are useful ways to take critique. If you think that feedmyleg's criticism was too radical to be applicable to your project, that's fine, and you don't have to listen to anybody, him or otherwise, but he's coming from a pretty reasonable place on this.
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Apr 23, 2018 21:59
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i'm writing a comic about the love affair between a recovering street prophet and his three gay mothers
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Apr 24, 2018 00:47
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chitoryu12 posted:I'm getting feedback from other people and locations before posting later drafts here, instead of just relying on 4 guys. Are you getting feedback from our friends on the lunar surface?
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Apr 24, 2018 03:41
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chitoryu12 posted:Mel spent virtually all of his posts on weird sex stuff until the move to Creative Convention made that actually against the rules. I was writing "weird" sex stuff because the thread was two weeks of people being ideas men and no one was actually producing text. I hoped to spur some actual production by producing my own satire of the endeavor. Once you actually started posting text though, my critiques have all been wholly sincere.
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Apr 24, 2018 14:13
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feedmyleg posted:Nobody here was trolling you, people were giving feedback in good faith and you were choosing to get defensive and ignore it. lol. Also, this sort of project inevitably will need one ultimate decisionmaker, and that's chito. Especially when, as even Mel recognized: Mel Mudkiper posted:the thread was two weeks of people being ideas men and no one was actually producing text.
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Apr 24, 2018 17:11
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I guess chito's friends never wrote back
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Apr 29, 2018 00:09
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Can't wait for Mel to eat his words when Cheetos rewrite hits the NYT best sellers list
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Apr 29, 2018 00:23
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He'll just do a find+replace of the names and end up with the nerd equivalent of 50 Shades.
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Apr 29, 2018 02:25
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Hey OP post an update
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May 1, 2018 08:25
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I wouldnt be surprised if OP lets the thread die, it's a fun and ambitious idea but there were a number of Unfortunate Kill-Joys who showed up. I got frustrated reading some of the posts and imagined that OP was feeling at least 10x more frustrated than me at people's seeming unwillingness to make genuine contributions and move the project forward in any meaningful way. OP, i support you and your creativity and i hope you continue to explore every project that excites you! You owe this thread nothing and are not obligated to continue posting here. However, if you do choose to post an update, there are plenty of people who will be glad to see you pursuing this endeavor.
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May 7, 2018 21:12
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baby vassal state posted:I wouldnt be surprised if OP lets the thread die, it's a fun and ambitious idea but there were a number of Unfortunate Kill-Joys who showed up. I got frustrated reading some of the posts and imagined that OP was feeling at least 10x more frustrated than me at people's seeming unwillingness to make genuine contributions and move the project forward in any meaningful way. It strikes me as a bit insincere to chastise us for critiquing writing built around critiquing someone else's writing. The premise was not to have fun, it was to produce something better than the original RPO. All the advice given was in the spirit of that. Like, how dare you suggest our contributions are not genuine just because they are not explicitly positive.
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May 7, 2018 22:30
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How dare she indeed.  Edit: Gitro posted:Hey OP post an update
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May 7, 2018 22:42
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Hmmm blaming the haters is a convenient out for the OP to never bother to post another update again But what if maybe...just maybe, Chito pulls it off, and shows all those haters what he can do! Isn't that a better resolution to the thread?
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May 7, 2018 22:46
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Guy A. Person posted:Hmmm blaming the haters is a convenient out for the OP to never bother to post another update again I genuinely want to see good writing because good writing is a good thing. If chito pulled off some good poo poo I would be happy and congratulate them because I like reading good things
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May 7, 2018 23:21
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I'm still writing at a much slower pace. I've had several different creative projects dividing my attention so I haven't been able to really spend every day working on this "book". But I would be lying if I didn't say that I haven't really been feeling this thread as much as I thought I would. I actually had thoughts of quitting at the very start because of how much trolling the thread, to the point where entire pages were more troll posts and people replying to them than actual content. And as much as I've tried to adjust to the criticism I've gotten, it's not exactly a great environment to write in when the people who are the strongest critics are also ones who poo poo up the thread instead of contributing before it got moved into Creative Convention.Mel Mudkiper posted:The premise was not to have fun Literally everything I do on Something Awful is for fun, buddy.
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May 7, 2018 23:49
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chitoryu12 posted:Literally everything I do on Something Awful is for fun, buddy. Something Awful is work, fucker chitoryu12 posted:. And as much as I've tried to adjust to the criticism I've gotten, it's not exactly a great environment to write in when the people who are the strongest critics are also ones who poo poo up the thread instead of contributing before it got moved into Creative Convention. On the other hand, we are giving you the courtesy of explaining why we have issues with it rather than just going "this sucks, gently caress you" Like, if you want an apology, I am sorry I made joke posts about the ONANSIS. I was trying to motivate people to actually write by egging them on. If my motivation was just to try and destroy the thread, I wouldn't go through the effort of actually laying out my issues and providing suggestions. As soon as you actually started producing text, I gave my honest and direct feedback. Is it negative? Absolutely. Why? Because I don't think its very good. But I am also telling you why its not very good and how it could be better. Mel Mudkiper fucked around with this message at 23:56 on May 7, 2018 |
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May 7, 2018 23:51
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I'd post sections and suck up the critique without argument, just absorbing the ones you agree with and discarding the ones you don't. For what it's worth I think some of your more recent passages are looking decent.
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May 8, 2018 04:34
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I'll post some smaller passages to see how they go. I think the next one will be Wade's first encounter with fame after he gets out of the Tomb of Horrors, because that involves trying to capture the feeling of a panic attack without saying "I had a panic attack and fell over."
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May 8, 2018 13:46
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You should try writing your own novel, or even a short story.
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May 8, 2018 19:47
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Mrenda posted:You should try writing your own novel, or even a short story. I actually did try that! I ended up not being able to finish more than the first few chapters because of time constraints with work and other projects.
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May 8, 2018 22:24
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I apologize for being an "Unfortunate Kill-Joy", but that is a depressing post.
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May 9, 2018 00:17
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Burkion posted:Here's a question Even the car is just the Author's Car, so it's not like the character has any opinion on it at all. It just gets more description because Cline likes it and wanted to throw it in. Mel Mudkiper posted:It strikes me as a bit insincere to chastise us for critiquing writing built around critiquing someone else's writing. There's critique, and there's attempting to badger the OP into giving up on the project in order to suit your distaste for the idea. I'll leave which occurred here as an exercise for the reader. Liquid Communism fucked around with this message at 03:24 on May 11, 2018 |
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May 11, 2018 03:21
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Liquid Communism posted:There's critique, and there's attempting to badger the OP into giving up on the project in order to suit your distaste for the idea. Yeah, this has been another point of contention for me here. Focusing so much effort on trying to figure out how to adjust the writing for people who have criticized even the existence of the project ends up feeling like a lost cause because anything that's not award-winning is probably going to end up failing to impress them. Like if I didn't want criticism, I wouldn't even be attempting to post in a public forum or sending my writing to other people to critique. I'd just write the whole thing in private and then put it up online somewhere demanding praise. But I sort of had this moment of "Wait, why the hell am I writing for people who told me the idea was stupid and just tried to troll the thread instead of contributing at first?"
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May 11, 2018 03:51
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So write it for all the people who keep coming in to encourage you and yell at the "trolls" (and then seem to disappear when there are no trolls to yell at)
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May 11, 2018 04:45
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Why are you writing it "for" anyone? Write it for yourself and then post it for others to read for critique so that you can become a better writer. Most of the "trolls" itt giving critique know very much what they're talking about and probably think dimly about the project because it's obvious you are not a good writer and definitely not up to the task. Why not attempt to write some original works to grow and learn as a writer. Maybe once you have a better idea of what you're doing you can come back to a project like this but atm it just seems like a big waste of time imo
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May 11, 2018 07:04
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Anyway, I just read Pierre Menard, Author of the Quixote and it made me think of this thread 
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May 11, 2018 07:51
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Liquid Communism posted:There's critique, and there's attempting to badger the OP into giving up on the project in order to suit your distaste for the idea. Mel Mudkiper posted:I genuinely want to see good writing because good writing is a good thing. If chito pulled off some good poo poo I would be happy and congratulate them because I like reading good things
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May 11, 2018 12:55
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I had no idea this was happening until it arrived in CC. Then I tried to help. You can take a look at the "Fiction Submission" thread here and see that people are critiquing others work and finding value in the feedback they receive. I have a story there now hoping for some feedback, if you feel up to it. Crits here (and in our counterpart, The Dorkroom) can be tough, but it's better than getting non-committal, bland responses you get if you show it to friends or people in other places. There's a genuine desire to see good writing, and to help people with their writing. If you don't see that and only see people being tough on your work then share it with people who'll give you half-felt encouragement without any desire for you or your story to be its best. Edit: To further push the point, you've received a quality and amount of feedback for your writing in this thread that other authors would kill for. It may not be all gold stars and chocolate biscuits, but there are plenty of writers who have to cajole, plead and trade for critiques of their work at the level of critiques you've received. It's entirely ungrateful. Mrenda fucked around with this message at 13:23 on May 11, 2018 |
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May 11, 2018 13:12
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I find it a bit absurd to think that we would be putting in effort posts to kill a small thread on the smallest subforum on the site. If we wanted to destroy the project we would just ignore it and let it atrophy
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May 11, 2018 15:15
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Since you got to CC you got some pretty solid and serious critique; I think it was maybe on the harsh side, since your most recent work was (e.g.) well above the average thunderdome level, but crit is crit and you should take it and extract what works for you from it.
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May 11, 2018 15:26
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Based on the latest three posts, I think the lovely car analogy might have sounded meaner than I intended for it to do. I for one would love to see new writing, especially if chitoryu12 went and did some of the exercises I suggested. I was genuinely trying to help.
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May 11, 2018 16:33
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Yeah, I’m coming back to this after some private writing time. I’m also going to be out of town a lot this summer (including for a lawsuit on the other side of the country) so it’s been slower going on my side as well.
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May 11, 2018 16:53
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"C'mon you loving piece of poo poo fucker!" Wade shrieked. The excitebike groaned in protest. Wade torqued the little throttle to its limit and the little muffler squirted little pixels of exhaust. Even with the Pit Bull engines assisting, the tiny cycle was pushing the limits of its bytes. The concussive quakes on Wade's tail rumbled closer. An explosion of earth and source code sent Wade rocketing into the sky. The ground opened up below him into a fractured grin. He stared in disbelief as the fissure became smaller and smaller in his HUD. Goddamn he was high. Like "it's a good thing that the OASIS doesn't require an atmosphere" high. He felt his ascent slow as he reached the parabola's apex. Wade was dropping back to the ground at an alarming speed. The physics engine was breaking under the server strain. Suddenly, Donkey Kong's enormous head broke through the crack in the landscape beneath him. Wade screamed as he plummeted towards that gaping maw, his tiny arms and legs flailing fruitlessly. *record scraaaaaaaaaaaaatch* "I'll bet you're wondering how I got in this situation."
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May 17, 2018 01:47
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