|
Well poo poo. FWD boxes are always a bit of a pain to drop out. Guess the price was too good to be true. Take plenty of pics as you disassemble. Best case scenario is stuck/busted forks. No gears working and can't even let the clutch out in neutral would mean two jammed which would be odd but not impossible I guess.
|
#
?
Apr 25, 2018 17:21
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 25, 2024 23:32 |
|
|
Well poo poo, that's too bad.
|
|
#
?
Apr 25, 2018 18:54
|
|
|
drat. Something bad has happened to that transaxle. I'm going to guess it's in the other end of the box and something has gone fubar in the differential. angryrobots fucked around with this message at 19:48 on Apr 25, 2018 |
|
#
?
Apr 25, 2018 19:38
|
|
|
I just went out there to take a look at it. If you jack it up and let the clutch out, the front wheels spin and there's no awful grinding sound. It feels like it's stuck in gear, probably a high gear since you can't drive on it. I can shift to Reverse, 1, 2, 3 and halfway to 4 inside the car. The stick doesn't go back as far in the gate as 2nd or R does. Working the linkage from under the hood, I can very easily (almost no resistance, as per Honda) shift to 1, 2, 3, (I think) 5 - but if I go to 4th I feel a clunk and the linkage doesn't go as far as it would for 2nd. I can't seem to figure out the magic combination of pulling the linkage up just far enough to put it into 6th or Reverse. I got an intermittent VSA light while experimenting but I don't think there is relevance there. The clutch fork is rusty, but I couldn't get an extension in there to pull off the slave cylinder to see if I could actuate the clutch fork by hand. The clutch feels like it is working, however - I can slip it when letting the clutch out and modulate the power that is coming out of the engine. Wishful thinking follows: Something with the reverse arm, maybe? Slung had a lot of trouble putting 4 and 5 fully into gear on the big road trip we did. I didn't notice anything myself (as I am a top-flight, expert race car driver), except that 2nd was really loose side to side and would grind slightly if you wiggled the stick. Knowing Honda as I do, I wonder if the lockout is solenoid-activated and has managed to wedge itself between two states. That's something that only occurred to me on the drive back. If it is solenoid activated, I'm not surprised I couldn't get into 5th or 6th by hand with the car standing still because the ECU was probably like "yeah you meant reverse" and locked me out. I wonder where the linkage and that solenoid are... I bet they're on the outside of the trans somewhere. Honda posted:At a vehicle speed of 12 mph (20 km/h) or more, a signal from the vehicle speed sensor (VSS) activates the reverse lockout solenoid, which pushes the select lock cam B into the locked position. As a result, the select lever cannot rotate to the reverse select position, making it impossible to engage reverse gear. At a vehicle speed of 9 mph (15 km/h) or less, the signal from the VSS is interrupted which turns off the reverse lockout solenoid. The select lock return spring pulls the select lock cam B back, enabling the select lever to move freely so that reverse gear can be selected. I was able to get the shifter fully into fourth with the car jacked up and the tires spinning.  Cold reality: Something inside the trans is el fucko. It feels like the internals are ignoring whatever is going on up at the shifter linkage. Seat Safety Switch fucked around with this message at 20:04 on Apr 25, 2018 |
|
#
?
Apr 25, 2018 19:49
|
|
|
What's the shifter pattern on this box? Just trying to visualize linkage here.
|
|
#
?
Apr 25, 2018 21:59
|
|
|
It's a 6-speed H-pattern. Reverse is down and to the right, on what feels like an additional gate. There is no collar or push-down knob or anything like that.
|
|
#
?
Apr 25, 2018 22:00
|
|
|
Slow process, not because it was difficult, but because I was trying to be careful.   Winchy winchy winchy.  It rolled better when the clutch was to the floor.  Boosh.  I knew that hook anchored to the floor would come in handy.  Underside has some unusual leaks.      The usual kind of damage from being slammed. Otherside seems fine, oddly.  A little weepy. Not bad though.  So I got it up in the air with four hockey pucks as jack spacers.  Started it, left it in neutral and the wheels spin forward at a reasonably high speed, say 30kph at idle, I think. Wasn't looking that closely. It did make some unpleasant grindy noises, but not like it was eating its own gearteeth. Tried to put it in first and she stalled almost immediately after you start letting the clutch out. I didn't try any of the others. That's about as far as I got tonight. Also my stud welder arrived today, I am looking forward to playing with that, but that will have to wait.
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 06:15
|
|
|
Still really curious about this suspiciously clean threaded hole on the trans. Can't find any good pictures, though. It must be something for another car and it's just shielded enough from grit and poo poo to never have gotten all that dirty in 14 years. 
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 06:17
|
|
|
I once unthreaded a plug like that on a manual transmission car, heard a “thunk” noise when I took it out. Refilled the oil, tried to back out of the hoist, no reverse. Or 1st. poo poo. Raised car, realized the drain and “fill” were different (hex vs torx) Turns out the clunk was a shift fork or something not being held in place anymore and falling in. Drove the car with no reverse and a few forward gears missing until I had time to pull the trans and get it reassembled.
|
|
#
?
Apr 28, 2018 04:04
|
|
|
That hole does indeed look pretty clean, but you'd think if something were there recently the top of that would be cleaner that it is, from either the bolt head or a washer.
|
|
#
?
Apr 28, 2018 06:53
|
|
|
Not really, like a lot of bolts in gearboxes don't have a hex head, washer or mating surface. just a stud with a square or allen socket on the end. Like the bottom stud in this pic: That one has a tiny flange but many do not. E: The only way to know for sure is get a service manual. What's the difference between that car and the accord? We didn't get acura here, just the US style accord (made in thailand) and the accord 'euro' made in Japan which is the same body style as yours. Do you know if the US/Thai accord had the same 6spd as the acura/accord euro? I'm asking because I found a download link for the accord. It's legit as I downloaded it and tested on win7/IE - needs IE to work as it's a factory CD style browser SM I can't make sense of it though with the pics I got as it doesn't reference the drive shaft in the exploded diagrams, but if you have an old PC with IE give it a try http://www.mediafire.com/file/8mqpeanbmh7hp9k/Accord_2003_2004_2005_2006.zip Here's a pic from it 
Fo3 fucked around with this message at 09:27 on Apr 28, 2018 |
|
#
?
Apr 28, 2018 08:43
|
|
|
It should be the same as the European Accord, from what I understand. I think the transmission code is ASU5. Thanks for the link. I've already started butchering it so it works in Chrome. Seat Safety Switch fucked around with this message at 15:50 on Apr 28, 2018 |
|
#
?
Apr 28, 2018 15:41
|
|
|
From what I understand, the USA accords were v6s, and this manual only mentions ka20 and ka24, so it must be for the euro version even though the interior pics are different(for stereo). E: I was thinking the hole was #6 in that diagram but I haven't looked at FWD for ages and can't work out which end is the diff. Fo3 fucked around with this message at 16:01 on Apr 28, 2018 |
|
#
?
Apr 28, 2018 15:56
|
|
|
Tempting to think so, but I'm not sure. Here's an exploded diagram of the shift linkage assembly, where the "interlock bolt" is #7. I don't see the weird cross-bolt though. Seat Safety Switch fucked around with this message at 16:02 on Apr 28, 2018 |
|
#
?
Apr 28, 2018 15:59
|
|
|
The empty hole is in the engine block. 
|
|
#
?
Apr 28, 2018 16:01
|
|
|
Yeah, that makes way more sense. I couldn't find that weird nub with the other bolt head coming out of it on the parts diagram. Oh well, good theory, delusional hope. This thing's el fucko, I suspect.
|
|
#
?
Apr 28, 2018 16:02
|
|
|
Seat Safety Switch posted:This thing's el fucko, I suspect. 
|
|
#
?
Apr 28, 2018 16:07
|
|
|
Powershift posted:The empty hole is in the engine block.
|
|
#
?
Apr 28, 2018 16:13
|
|
|
Shrugs/320, let me know if I missed anything here. Shrugs and I tackled the Acura today, as Slung was off drinking coconut martinis on another tropical island paradise. That's not true, he was actually pushing a broken Volkswagen. It's like he never left home at all  We checked the drain plug first, and found only a trickle of suspiciously bronze-y looking gear oil. After topping it up with crap oil we had lying around the shop, no obvious change was noticed in function. However, even after filling it with ~3L of gear oil and popping the drain plug again, there was still only a trickle. Not sure where all this gear oil is going - my best guess is that there is some large cavity in the trans that can't fully drain because the front end is up on stands. I noticed if I let out the clutch in "neutral," allowing the front wheels to spin to about 31km/h, and then jump on the gas to 60km/h and shift really fast and precisely, I could pop the car into 6th gear, where it would happily continue to do what it was doing instead of stalling hard like it did in any other gear. So it's stuck in 6th, and it seems the reverse-lockout solenoid and the lockout arm have somehow caused the problem. Things we ruled out: Shift cables binding - the linkage on top of the trans still does not allow shifting into neutral, even if it "says" it is in neutral. Unplugging the reverse lockout solenoid - this is probably "active low" because it has to work when the car is off, so no difference was observed here Unbolting the reverse lockout solenoid looks extremely difficult, since there's a very tiny gap where a socket could fit. I'm not sure how you're supposed to do it with the trans in the car. It does seem to work. I considered again removing the shift turret and peering down into the trans, but I suspect not much would have been gained and access was at best quite poor. It was decided it's time for the trans to come out. We ended up driving into town, picking up a 36mm socket for the axle and then using the last hour of free time to pop the passenger side axle and intermediate shaft out of the trans. It wasn't too bad, as expected the worst part was removing the ball joint. I was surprised how little is different from my Civic. Next step is to come back to it, some time this week, and pop out the driver-side axle and prepare the rest of the trans to exit the car so we can test it on the bench. I'm not sure exactly how we're going to get it out of here since the overengineered, very thick k-frame seems to be in the way of most obvious methods of egress, and I really don't want to drop the engine and trans together... although maybe we're already most of the way there by the time we start unbolting engine mounts.
|
|
#
?
Apr 30, 2018 04:31
|
|
|
I reaally wish I wasn't in MA. The TDI Jetta would be a good addition to this crowd.
|
|
#
?
Apr 30, 2018 13:32
|
|
|
Edit: actually thinking it over I think if you can disconnect the solenoid wiring that might give you a better idea of if that's causing issues.
Tony quidprano fucked around with this message at 16:22 on Apr 30, 2018 |
|
#
?
Apr 30, 2018 16:08
|
|
|
1500quidporsche posted:Can you get a multimeter on the lockout solenoid and see if it's active/even functioning? Probably worth giving a shot before taking the whole thing out. we did confirm solenoid function. All it does is alternately block the shifter from entering reverse or 6th, and it's definitely still doing that.
|
|
#
?
Apr 30, 2018 16:36
|
|
|
Slung and I threw a couple hours at getting the trans out. We've got it to the really scary point where we start removing subframe bolts and nervously balancing it on a multitude of wonky jacks. How did we get here? Step 1: remove previous owner's terrifyingly corroded HID foglight install. First, remove this battery tray, which is held on by eight bolts and is more robust than my EG's entire unibody.     The previous owner just stuck loose pins into a female Weatherpack connector. Why bother crimping poo poo properly when it can just rust to little bitty pieces like this? All of this poo poo is coming out.  Eat poo poo.  Step 2: remove bumper, because why not?   Now you're street tough. Step 3: Drop that 'zaust.  Never had an exhaust spring bolt come off that easily before. Or at all. Step 3.5: Pull the radiator, even though nobody tells you to. (FOOTAGE MISSING) Step 4: Hook up some crazy loving contraption because Honda won't sell you any of the service tools.  Step 5: Drop a chain down some kind of hosed up combination block ear/trans mount/motor mount.  Plenty of clearance.  Step 6: Break loose all the subframe bolts, then admire the hosed up shibari poo poo you've managed to pull off.  We should be picking up the trans soon.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2018 17:53
|
|
|
Do you know for a fact the Acura uses gear oil for the tranny? I seem to recall some Hondas using motor oil.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2018 18:00
|
|
|
slidebite posted:Do you know for a fact the Acura uses gear oil for the tranny? I seem to recall some Hondas using motor oil. The FSM is extremely clear that it is magic Honda gear oil and not to use conventional engine oil, unlike my EG.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2018 18:01
|
|
|
We got the trans out last night and hooooly gently caress it is wrecked. Like before we even crack into the gearbox itself it looks like a clutch grenaded in there to me. There's a legit hole in the casting. Phone posting but I will add pictures later if I can.
|
|
#
?
May 11, 2018 14:03
|
|
|
Well, if you're gonna fail, fail big!
|
|
#
?
May 11, 2018 14:25
|
|
|
Whelp! Are those transmissions specific to them or are they shared with anything else?
|
|
#
?
May 11, 2018 14:30
|
|
|
slidebite posted:Whelp! Are those transmissions specific to them or are they shared with anything else? 03-06 Accord 6MTs, but we already got a replacement box from a specialist TSX-and-Civics wrecker that lives less than 10 minutes from the shop. And has cats. Based on the new sealant slapped around the middle of the case, and the very shiny bolts holding the case together, I'm guessing that the previous owner blew up the trans, had a mechanic pry open the case in the car, pry-bar the shift forks until it unlocked, and then advised them to immediately dump the car on some sucker.
Seat Safety Switch fucked around with this message at 14:50 on May 11, 2018 |
|
#
?
May 11, 2018 14:48
|
|
|
As promised, more info: Our first indication that the old trans may be el-fucko was this tremendously large chunk of metal floating around in the clutch inspection cover, stuck under a tooth of the flywheel.  The mating surface and metal around the transmission was super thin and cracked as well, which makes me think something else had let go inside the bellhousing before. Let's keep going. I'm not entirely sure where this piece comes from. It looks almost like it's multiple layers, one of the layers is reddish iridescent. Probably important.  Our transmission jack didn't go high enough, so we briefly considered putting it on this workhorse to give it some extra height. Then, I remembered that we can lower the lift as well as raise it. Things were not going well at this point.  At last, after what seemed like unbolting every single fastener in the entire car, the transmission is freed.  Oh boy. That's not, that's not good.  Clutch fork seems unhappy.   So that's where all my gear oil went.  At least the shrapnel-destroyed pressure plate still looks like it's in good shape. Too bad it's going in the trash.  Those bolts and that case sealant look suspiciously new... Call me paranoid, but it sure looks like the previous owner had some dramatic failure with this trans, towed it to a mechanic who opened the case just enough to ghetto-fix it on the car, and then told him to immediately sell it to some sucker. Hi, I'm that sucker. Here is the "new" transmission, fresh from the wrecker (a specialty Civic and Accord shop not even ten minutes from the ranch). Despite its generally ugly appearance, the car it came out of had many fewer miles and was in nicer shape than ours. The yard operator was going to fix up and DD it. Oh well.   We also ganked a fender off said car, which will get stripped and ghetto repainted because the driver-side fender this came with was in fact too thin to save.
|
|
#
?
May 11, 2018 18:19
|
|
|
Some people really suck.
|
|
#
?
May 12, 2018 06:32
|
|
|
Holy poo poo what a day that was. Thanks to numbers matching and switch for coming over to help for drat near 9 or ten hours today.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2018 06:44
|
|
|
I'm like the photojournalist from Apocalypse Now, except I only took some of these photos. First: the old clutch.   Looks a bit glazed but not too bad. Exedy stage 1 "organic." Bidding starts at $25. Pressure plate:  Flywheel:  No real ridges on this, a bit of gunk but not bad. Put a new clutch, flywheel, pilot bearing, PP, TOB, etc into the car. But our pilot bearing puller didn't fit.  This one also didn't fit so we used the business end and ghetto-rigged it to work on the end of a slide hammer. Then it fit. It fit real nice. POP! Off to the glorious new Princess Auto in the North, whose parking lot is already covered in oil from leaky cars despite having only been open ten days. These are my people.  That's better. New trans mount on. The front one had so much overspray on the studs that, while trying to clean them off with a nut, the stud just snapped off. Thanks Westar. Off to the bolt bin we go...  Upper trans mount also replaced. This kept pushing the trans assembly around until we couldn't line up the bottom one. Finally we just unbolted it, pry-barred the trans around and made it fit.  New front and rear motor mounts. We'll do the passenger one when the car's back together.  Subframe goes up...   One of the exhaust bolts snapped off while we were removing it, so we drilled it out and got lucky that it still threaded. By this point my phone was now having weird seizures on autofocus every time the flash went off.  Front and rear trans mounts finally connected.  Subframe go up, sketchy jacking setup go down.  Remind me to plug in the O2 sensor. We need to find where I put the bracket for it.  Numbers Matching came out and was an enormous help. We could not have done it without him. Seat Safety Switch fucked around with this message at 15:51 on May 13, 2018 |
|
#
?
May 13, 2018 15:45
|
|
|
Good work. A trick I learned years ago on removing pilot bearings and bushings is to find a bolt that is a good fit in the ID of bearing. Then, get a grease gun and squirt grease through the bore of the bearing until the cavity behind/around it is filled. Then put the bolt in the bore and give it a couple good whacks with a hammer. You end up making a little hydraulic system which will drive the bearing out - no mechanical puller needed.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2018 17:14
|
|
|
slidebite posted:Good work. Some guys use bread instead of grease for this trick because it's more viscous. Yes, really.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2018 18:52
|
|
|
Boaz MacPhereson posted:Some guys use bread instead of grease for this trick because it's more viscous. Yes, really. Pretty sure Finnegan used Irish spring bar soap on the Blasphemi to do this.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2018 19:01
|
|
|
We discussed doing all those tricks. But princess Auto was a 20 minute drive away, and I really wanted a slush because it was loving 25 degrees outside. Also I had no bread. I think I drank four litres of water/soda/iced tea and I went to take a leak once. Plus I'm forever looking to better equip my shop.
|
|
#
?
May 14, 2018 04:12
|
|
|
We have about a fifteen item to-do list before this thing is back on the road. Some stuff is small (get the radiator back in) and other stuff is going to be a nightmare (chase and remove the previous owner's drug-inspired amplifier harness). Hopefully it's really nice this weekend so we can paint...
|
|
#
?
May 14, 2018 05:07
|
|
|
Slung Blade posted:I really wanted a slush because it was loving 25 degrees outside. Assuming this is celsius, but that's adorable. 25c is downright comfortable.I'm going to be dealing with 37-38c this weekend while helping gf move. It's not even summer yet.  At least both of our cars have decent a/c, and since she's moving within the same apartment complex, the big stuff can just be thrown on my dolly and rolled 2 buildings away to the new place.
|
|
#
?
May 14, 2018 06:34
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 25, 2024 23:32 |
|
|
25C might as well be the surface of the sun to a Canadian after a long cold winter.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2018 00:25
|
|
