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Some Numbers posted:You would not believe the number of Chrono Trigger remixes that exist, especially of some later tracks. And that's probably more because of what I consider a good cover/remix than the sheer number of them (IIRC, the OST is 64 tracks total.)
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Apr 14, 2018 09:34
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 Blind Sally posted:Mystery of the Past  How?!*listens* Oh. That's how. That's actually... pretty good.  All my favorite remixes (and actual in-game tunes) are from later in the game, so I can't post them. I'll have to remember later on though.
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Apr 14, 2018 11:55
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I always loved that Marle is usually this really sweet girl and then you look at her portrait and SHE WILL gently caress YOU UP
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Apr 14, 2018 17:16
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Post more soundtrack remixes later, this is a rabbit hole I didn't realize I wanted to fall down.
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Apr 14, 2018 18:08
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Ultra Spoot posted:I always loved that Marle is usually this really sweet girl and then you look at her portrait and SHE WILL gently caress YOU UP Her victory pose makes it look like she's missing a tooth in her complete bliss of ending someones life.
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Apr 14, 2018 18:20
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Ultra Spoot posted:I always loved that Marle is usually this really sweet girl and then you look at her portrait and SHE WILL gently caress YOU UP And yet Lucca is smiling sweetly in hers but will bash your face in with a hammer and isn't above the occasional evil laugh
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Apr 14, 2018 18:26
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Ultra Spoot posted:I always loved that Marle is usually this really sweet girl and then you look at her portrait and SHE WILL gently caress YOU UP I love Marle's sprites. The jumping victory sprite, or the giant open armed one, they're so over the top and delightful.
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Apr 14, 2018 19:03
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Rabbi Raccoon posted:And yet Lucca is smiling sweetly in hers but will bash your face in with a hammer and isn't above the occasional evil laugh Lucca's evil genius laugh sprite is amazing.
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Apr 14, 2018 19:15
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Some Numbers posted:Lucca's evil genius laugh sprite is amazing. Ain’t it the truth
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Apr 14, 2018 19:42
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Some Numbers posted:Lucca's evil genius laugh sprite is amazing. I used to think that was just her cleaning her glasses but just really poorly conveyed, but no, that’s her doing the Noblewoman’s Laugh with her glasses. Like Luca is straight up Bulma if Bulma was allowed to kick rear end too like her male Dragon Ball counterparts.
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Apr 14, 2018 22:29
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nine-gear crow posted:I used to think that was just her cleaning her glasses but just really poorly conveyed, but no, that’s her doing the Noblewoman’s Laugh with her glasses. Like Luca is straight up Bulma if Bulma was allowed to kick rear end too like her male Dragon Ball counterparts. That's nothing. I thought an upcoming character's victory pose had them pulling out a smiling duck and showing it off for the longest time until my brain recontextualized what was going on. Like 'heck yeah we won! happy duck!'
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Apr 15, 2018 00:55
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EponymousMrYar posted:That's nothing. I thought an upcoming character's victory pose had them pulling out a smiling duck and showing it off for the longest time until my brain recontextualized what was going on. And now I can’t see anything else. And it would fit because nothing about said character makes sense
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Apr 15, 2018 03:06
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EponymousMrYar posted:That's nothing. I thought an upcoming character's victory pose had them pulling out a smiling duck and showing it off for the longest time until my brain recontextualized what was going on. I used to see it as him holding a feather capped beret... which also made no sense since he doesn't wear a hat either. Like this, but blue. 
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Apr 15, 2018 03:35
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It really is remarkable how flexible this game is built considering it is entirely possible for Crono to be at Level 1 at the end of the game.
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Apr 15, 2018 04:54
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This game really does stand up even after almost 25 years. And while the sequel isn't as good (how could it be?) I've always thought that it was wildly underrated. Somehow it actually has an even better soundtrack than this. I appreciate how Lucca is shocked that Crono had an attractive woman hanging around him. I would be too, has Crono ever brushed his hair?
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Apr 15, 2018 04:58
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habeasdorkus posted:I appreciate how Lucca is shocked that Crono had an attractive woman hanging around him. I would be too, has Crono ever brushed his hair? I like how it's totally clear and unambiguous that Lucca and Crono are good friends. Doubly so when the rest of the people around tend to make fun of her for being who she is, but the fact that Crono is her friend also illustrates a lot about his character despite his silence. Part of me wants to know how Crono and Lucca became friends in the first place.
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Apr 15, 2018 05:48
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Rabbi Raccoon posted:And yet Lucca is smiling sweetly in hers but will bash your face in with a hammer and isn't above the occasional evil laugh I'm starting to feel like Marle and Lucca would be villains if it wasn't for Crono's unbearable niceness and willingness to be an anime time hero.
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Apr 15, 2018 11:24
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   So immediately after being thrust out of the mysterious portal, Crono's forced to contend with these guys. Definitely a different breed from the beetles and mushrooms and giant singing robot cats we've dealt with until now.  They're still fodder for Crono, though.  There's no music here, wherever we are.  There's another encounter that pops up here, but no biggie.  No. This gives +2 Power. Can't hurt at this point, honestly.  The last encounter is optional and would essentially involve us being a jerk and ruining these guys' good time. So instead leave and see if we can find Marle.  Longing of the Wind  Huh... This looks familiar, yet very different. Maybe let's start with the town.  So all that townfolk chatter about stuff from 400 years ago? Oddly relevant now. It seems Crono (and hopefully Marle) has jumped back 400 years. Crono surprisingly takes this with stride, though I guess after being the first human being to experience teleportation, time travel is nothing to him.  As you may remember, 600AD had some strife involving a powerful wizard. That doesn't really concern us right now though, our main objective is to find Marle and then, uh... Look, let's just find Marle and hope everything works itself out.    I lost it when the Queen disappeared. I just couldn't keep working on the bell. But now it's back to business as usual! Banta is an anagram of Taban, Lucca's father.    Shop inventories in this game follow the rule of "We sell every character's weapons no matter how nonsensical it may seem for the situation". Good enough for me.  The inn has a good chunk of information and exposition.   No:  Lovely... We NEED more ignorant strangers around here...Yes:  What a lovely guy.  Really, 600AD is filled with some very rude people. I guess it took until the 800's for manners to be invented.  She must be glad to be home!There was an uproar recently about the queen being abducted or whatever, but it seems they found her just before we got here, and in the same mountains Crono came from, no less.  After this conversation, some random straggler pops in.  After buying him a round...  Sake in the original, Cider here because Nintendo.   Thanks! It's about the missing Queen. She disappeared while visiting that cathedral to the west, and... I was sure there was something fishy about that cathedral...Huh... So she disappeared near the western cathedral, yet reappeared in the mountains on the other side of the continent. You've probably deduced things by now, not that there's really many options to exhaust here.   We all thought Magus had grabbed her. Thank goodness she's safe! We also can't explore the Porre area in this era.  Those weird chests are still scattered all over, and we still can't open them.   I'm sure this would've led to the bridge still being out in the modern area had they not bothered to keep it intact instead. But it looks like now they'll be fixing it anyway.  Let's take a break and admire the view. Pretty much everything in Chrono Trigger gets love, but one underrated aspect are its backgrounds. The dark mountains or clouds or whatever painting a dark and gloomy picture, yet there's enough light to give hope for a better future around the corner, one where we get to play Chrono Trigger (or rather, I play it and you guys watch).  Let's go to church. Manoria Cathedral  The sisters here are friendly, yet seem...odd.  We want nothing but world peace... Or a piece of the world, tee, hee... You might like to stick around for the organ recital. It's a real killer! People wouldn't know what to do with themselves in a truly peaceful world! My, what delicious, er... I mean, delightful looking humans! See what I mean? Maybe they should go outside a bit more.  Otherwise, there's nothing worth investigating here, so we're left checking out the castle. First, the forest. Secret of the Forest  The forest has the exact same layout, though the colors lean more brown than green. The Beetles and Hetakes are replaced with Imps and Polies.  I like the slowdown spin Crono has post-Cyclone, so I decided to show it off half-speed. Just one of those things you only really notice when going through game video with a fine-toothed comb.   Otherwise, this forest has a couple "gotcha" moments to keep you on your guard and make you a bit more suspicious about everything. You can find a power tab here, but the other shining object just leads to a battle with Roly Riders.  This guy drops a Shelter and respawns every time you revisit the forest, but another shaking bush triggers an encounter.  Blue Eaglets exist and do things.  Thanks!  Nowhere to go now but Guardia Castle. Courage and Pride  Check out that hair! Where're you from, son? Are you one of Magus's troopers? Hardly! This kid never would have made the cut! Show us your stamp collection, son! Har, har! Now beat it, shrimp!   Finally, someone who isn't immediately a jerk to Crono.  But there's something odd about him!  You refuse to obey my orders?! Forgive me, my lady! Please enter, Sir!  This time, Crono gets free reign of exploring the castle.   First off, the soldiers are of course concerned about the ongoing war against Magus.  Of course, there's all sorts of nasty creatures over on this continent, too.   No: You don't know of Sir Cyrus?! From which land do you come? Or are you simply a fool?Yes: If HE were here, this whole mess with the Queen would never have happened. He and a friend left on a journey 10 years ago. No one has heard from them since.Cyrus still looms heavily over this kingdom even a decade later.   So you're the one who helped the Queen. Talk to the maid if you need to rest. On the other side is the dining hall and kitchen.  What's the scale here, though? 4, 5, 2, what?   A happy ending.  Crono can also eat. He'll do that after he bothers people doing their jobs.    Wait! Maybe you'd know! What's this "Eyes Cream" stuff that Queen Leene wants so badly?Urgh... Apparently it's a crepe that Marle asks for in the Japanese version, but I don't know what pun if any that represents there.  Upon nearing the exit, the Knight Captain and his guard appear.   Oh, Captain! I'm sorry... We're fighting a war out there! Can't you even keep us fed? Hey, I don't have time for this. Just feed my men, okay?  Uh, yikes.    So basically they're two solid guys trying to do their best, yet since they're brothers they always get on each others' nerves. Alright, then.  And considering how much everyone won't shut up about how great Cyrus is, the Knight Captain's in a very difficult spot in particular.   It's hard to imagine this guy as a pacifist.  This is all stupid let's eat some freaking food. https://mp4.mega64.net/ct/03/115.mp4 Now I want to see how they prepare this dish.  Guardia is a long line, indeed.   OK.   But can you tell me what happened? Leene's acting rather odd. And she seems to have lost her coral pin, which is something she guarded with her life... King Guardia XXI is a pretty swell and chill guy. He just gets overshadowed by, well, every other character in this era. Also apparently Crono saved Leene's life...somehow. Look, it got us in here, let's just roll with it, OK?   Also the King and Queen sleep on opposite ends of the tower for whatever reason.  Both towers are pretty high, with a few treasures here and there, including another sealed chest.   The Chancellor is also acting fishy.   Heard a spell turned him into a frog. Do you believe that? I think he's a spy!I... What!?  The Chancellor's a decent man. Why, he goes to the cathedral everyday.That's a lot of fishy stuff that seems to revolve around that cathedral.  Armor upgrade for Crono. Let's check on the Queen. Something ain't right here.   In fact, she looks even younger now than on her wedding day...   Certainly, your Highness.  Uhhhhhhh    It's me! But everyone calls me, Leene!Yep. When Marle popped out of the time portal, everyone assumed she was Leene, and as Marle usually does in an odd situation, she just kinda rolled with it. Far Off Promise  We barely know each other, but somehow, I knew you'd come for me... Yeah, the bond between Crono and Marle is a little slapdash and a tad unrealistic at first, but it's a jRPG so somebody's gotta hook up (plus it works out later). SILENCE   W, what's happening?! It feels like...I'm being torn apart!https://mp4.mega64.net/ct/03/154.mp4 Well...that probably wasn't good.  Yeah, there's the whole "not actually the queen" and "completely disappearing from existance" things that seem a bit off. Just as I thought! She claims she's not Leene! There's something...different about her.  Of course not! Crono's a perfect gentlemen.  Don't worry, I'll show off the other answer with the later Jerk Crono Path.  You and me both. Anyway, Marle's gone now, so...now what? Courage and Pride   Oh, hey Lucca. Wait...Lucca?   I knew I recognized her!  I'll bet they mistook that girl for her ancestor... You see, she's a member of the royal family in OUR time!  Wait... the Princess Nadia? In Japanese it's Marledia, though it'd change based on what you chose to name Marle.   Queen Leene has been kidnapped. As I recall, someone was supposed to have saved her. But history has been changed! Marle looks so much like Leene, that they probably called off their search when she appeared here. But if the real Queen is killed... ...Marle will simply disappear. There might still be time! If we can save Leene, history as we know it should remain unchanged! Hurry! We have to find the real Queen! At this point, Lucca joins the party. Lucca is the gun user, and she has the same damage formula as Marle, meaning she's one of the weaker attackers, though she also has that 20% crit rate. In close range, she attacks with her hammer. The SightScope shows an enemy's HP. It's alright, but there's so many better accessories out there. Battle 1  Let's show off Lucca in battle. I don't have an animation for her hammer attack yet, maybe next update though.  The Roly Rider has quite the interesting attack animation.   These guys give good TP, so Lucca quickly picks up Flame Toss, unlocking her first Double Tech with Crono, Fire Whirl (Flame Toss + Cyclone).  Flame Toss does (LVL + MAG) * 2.4 + RND damage to all enemies in a straight line between Lucca and the target. That means the target matters, since if Lucca targets the enemy closest to her, she may miss out hurting enemies further out! Shockingly enough, Flame Toss is fire-elemental. There's only four elements in this game, Fire, Ice, Lightning/Heaven, and Shadow.  Flame Whirl essentially adds the damage from Cyclone and Flame Toss together, so it's not different from using them independently, except Cyclone will generally hit a lot of more enemies with its AoE effect than Flame Toss will, so it's still handy to use.  We could just search some more, but everything points to the cathedral being suspicious, so next time we'll investigate and hopefully find and save the real Queen Leene!
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Apr 15, 2018 17:03
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Wow, all my times through this game and I never knew how much content was in the mess hall. That's some amazing attention to detail.
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Apr 15, 2018 17:31
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It just occurred to me that Flame Toss' existence implies Lucca is just kinda hauling a flamethrower everywhere
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Apr 15, 2018 17:48
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It's been a while since I've played, so I may be remembering wrong, but i think there is an extra bit of dialogue if you listen to the chancellor through the wall of the King's bedroom.
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Apr 15, 2018 18:04
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The above poster is correct about the Chancellor dialogue. I've been playing through Chrono Trigger a few times recently for documentation purposes. Most recently I've been plowing through the "retranslation" patch that Chrono Compendium put out some ten-odd years back, which is a rewrite of the script that leans heavily on just taking the text from Japanese and putting it in English with no changes or rewriting. It can make things sound quite odd, and if it's okay with Mega, I'd like to share some screenshots I've been taking through the adventure as they become relevant to parts we're exploring here. Nothing too fancy, just some lines that I thought were amusing or strange. Also, I don't know if this is really a spoiler or not, but I want to write it just in case, so there are a lot of people that seem to think that when you take the treasures in Guardia Castle it gets rid of the ones in the 1000 AD version of the castle. This is simply not the case, even though there is one particular area that that mechanic does apply to much much later in the game. So take that free BronzeMail, you're worth it.
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Apr 15, 2018 18:57
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Alxprit posted:I've been playing through Chrono Trigger a few times recently for documentation purposes. Most recently I've been plowing through the "retranslation" patch that Chrono Compendium put out some ten-odd years back, which is a rewrite of the script that leans heavily on just taking the text from Japanese and putting it in English with no changes or rewriting. It can make things sound quite odd, and if it's okay with Mega, I'd like to share some screenshots I've been taking through the adventure as they become relevant to parts we're exploring here. Nothing too fancy, just some lines that I thought were amusing or strange. Go for it!
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Apr 15, 2018 19:44
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Mega64 posted:
I think it's supposed to be ice cream.
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Apr 15, 2018 20:33
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yeah, but what's the pun in Japanese if the original translated word comes out as crepe.
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Apr 15, 2018 20:43
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also i am glad Marle disappeared before potentially being served a bowl of eyeball puree
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Apr 15, 2018 20:44
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Did it have to be a pun? It could just have been the guy saying "what the hell is a crepe?"
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Apr 15, 2018 20:44
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yeah no, i'm not Mega64, but i assume they were musing about whether or not there was supposed to be a pun in the original language there, not that there was any question about the English version making an ice cream joke. the game has a lot of puns otherwise, so it's a good question.
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Apr 15, 2018 20:54
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I love the Power Glove! It's.. Oh. 
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Apr 15, 2018 21:28
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Mega64 posted:Wait... the Princess Nadia? Maybe you should have named her Na.
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Apr 15, 2018 22:48
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I, like many kids on Newgame+ would name her Nadia from the start, which then makes Lucca and Crono come across as very stupid. Also: THAT'S WHAT TOMA IS SUPPOSED TO LOOK LIKE?! REALLY?!
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Apr 15, 2018 23:12
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I definitely thought Toma was a kid. 
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Apr 15, 2018 23:22
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Some Numbers posted:I definitely thought Toma was a kid. I think you're thinking of another character, whom we haven't met yet. Tata is the one that's a kid.
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Apr 15, 2018 23:27
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  If you look closely, there's a strong resemblance. It's just you won't normally notice the mustache on a much smaller sprite in a busier area.
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Apr 15, 2018 23:36
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Mega64 posted:
1. That second queen coughing out a kid is hilarious every time I see it. 2. Marle looking exactly like her ancestor from 400 years ago says worrying things about her genetic diversity.
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Apr 15, 2018 23:40
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Kheldarn posted:I think you're thinking of another character, whom we haven't met yet. Tata is the one that's a kid. No, I'm definitely thinking of Toma, I always figured he was a baby-faced mid 20s, not a grizzled, mustachioed early 40s.
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Apr 15, 2018 23:42
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ajkalan posted:1. That second queen coughing out a kid is hilarious every time I see it. 
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Apr 15, 2018 23:58
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I've done a case study on Chrono Trigger recently for my own game making purposes and yes, there is an absolute ton of detail in the game. For example: the three blue imps here is the first battle in the game that's mandatory. The trigger is on the exit and you can't run away from this particular battle, forcing you to have a taste of the combat because you're out of the easy zone now and encounters are going to grow to be threatening if you don't beat up everything you come across. Another detail that Mega64 didn't mention: when Banta is hammering on the bell, actual 'clanks' and 'clonks' play to reflect that. Everyone being rude to Crono can be explained that they've been fighting a long war, things are bad, times are tough, and then some yahoo with a punk hairdo comes along asking you the most obvious of questions and going on about a 'Millennial Fair' when it hasn't even been a single millennia yet. McNally posted:Did it have to be a pun? It could just have been the guy saying "what the hell is a crepe?" habeasdorkus posted:I, like many kids on Newgame+ would name her Nadia from the start, which then makes Lucca and Crono come across as very stupid. Also: Yup. His mustache sprite can easily be misconstrued as him having a perpetually wide grin due to being a single pixel in height. Except no human has mouth line's drawn on them unless they're yelling or doing something to make it obvious. The Chef's mustache is easier to see as a point of comparison. Bonus: it makes the Chef look perpetually grumpy too, just like he sounds! The little skit after the Princess Nadia reveal is pretty much Time Travel Consequences 101 straight out Back to the Future. One of the neatest details though is that Chrono Trigger plays loose with it's rules of Time Travel because it wants you to have fun. In a standard time travel plot you might think that once Marle disappeared that was it, history was changed and we'd have to do more time travel and avoid paradoxes and stuff while fixing the original blunder etc. Not here. Lucca says there might be time to save the real Queen Leene and save history. Lucca is literally the smartest person in the entire world right now. Are you a bad enough dude to save history? Another thing about Lucca: Her Flame Toss ability is pretty much the only instance of what I like to call the 'short line' AoE marker you use in the game. IE having the target matter for the length of the line. It's a simple thing that makes you pause to think for a second and that's neat. Of note is that there's a lot of incidental dialogue in the castle. This is something to keep in mind going forward.
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Apr 15, 2018 23:59
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I wonder if the Leene's descendant's explanation is a result of Nintendo censorship? Like they were going to show Leene giving birth to a boy and him getting married and then another child appears but Nintendo was worried this was too explicit and would irrevocably corrupt western youth and said no, and ended up with implied incest instead. (Or maybe Guardia's just a matriarchal society but it never comes up and also the males who marry into it are still kings that get to rule like kings)
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Apr 16, 2018 00:09
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Since I got the blessing, here's a couple of things. As a reminder, this is from the literal Japanese retranslation patch of Chrono Trigger released by the Chrono Compendium several years ago. Note that I'm not trying to disparage or say their work is pointless or useless - it's just worth looking at and analyzing like any piece of history. For example, have an example of literally-translated sentence structure. This is pretty hard to parse, even if you can get the general meaning from context I can't really break it down into understandable parts.  Here's something that doesn't come up too much at least in old translations - accents in writing. Japanese has a lot of different ways to write dialogue in a way that you can sort of tell the age, gender, or even creature that's saying it. I believe this line is a way of retranslating a more kiddy tone into something that sort of works in our language. You can see from earlier, the original line just talks normally.  This is a line that I think shows why literal translations aren't always the best - you lose a lot of the flavor and jazz from the writing and it sort of falls flat on its face. That's not to say that the original Japanese was written dryly - it probably wasn't. But translating it without accounting for that, you lose a little something there. I hope you guys found my tiny analyses interesting. I'll be posting more as the game reaches relevant points of the story. I didn't take too many, so they won't be everywhere.
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Apr 16, 2018 00:33
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