The Handmaid's Tale Season Two: Off book and off to the colonies

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > TV IV > The Handmaid's Tale Season Two: Off book and off to the colonies

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

Ardennes posted:

There are other mysteries/questions:

The whole premise falls apart if you think about it even a little bit, and every flashback and elaboration just makes it worse. It would be a lot more believable if they kept the focus entirely on the present and within Gilead and from June's perspective so you weren't constantly reminded that the world was basically normal five years ago and that Gilead's apparent stability makes no sense at all.

# ¿ May 25, 2018 00:12

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# ¿ Apr 25, 2024 07:37

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

blue squares posted:

Fascists also never argue in good faith. Nor do most conservatives.

Most people, most of the time, do not argue in good faith. That's not unique to fascists or conservatives.

# ¿ May 28, 2018 04:07

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

datajugend posted:

one thing that was kinda eh in this episode for me was moira had a fiance, why did it take her two seasons to be worried for her? i cant remember anything about her before it was suddenly a thing this episode, so maybe its on me.

I didn't remember her ever being mentioned before either, and I actually thought Moira was lying about them being engaged. Like, they wouldn't let her look for just a friend so she pretended they'd been engaged. Then she had the photo at the end of the episode it was like "Oh, they actually were engaged? That came out of nowhere."

Open Source Idiom posted:

I'd have understood the purpose of everything if they'd have killed Fred, but they didn't and now I'm lost.

He's effectively dead at the moment but it's temporary so they can bring him back whenever they want. Best of both worlds.

Actually, better than that, because would Serena even have her status and property if Fred died? If they want her to be able to do anything (which they clearly do) then she needs Fred out of the way but still alive. There's potential in him being dead and her losing everything, but that option is still available.

# ¿ May 31, 2018 14:10

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

PostNouveau posted:

I don't know what the point of her letting June know that she's doing what I assume are capital crimes if it's not that she's going to pick June over Gilead.

She's letting June know because she wants her help and she doesn't regard her as any kind of threat. What could June do with this information?

Serena does this all the time. She clearly thinks the rules are for other people and that everyone except her should be happy in their place. It's OK that they're doing this because this is her breaking the rules (for a good reason). It doesn't mean she actually has any sympathy for June or that she'll let her to break any other rules.

# ¿ May 31, 2018 16:37

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

PostNouveau posted:

Turn her in to the authorities for forging orders.

I mean, Fred is super hosed up in the hospital, it's a little unbelievable already that everyone is like "Oh, new orders from Fred, the guy who's been unconscious for several days now? We'll get on these right away!" I don't think it's a hard sell for June to convince people that Fred isn't issuing orders.

If they're not questioning it now, the word of a rebellious handmaid is hardly going to change anything.

# ¿ May 31, 2018 17:08

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

The sick baby really didn't work for me in this episode. The doctors can find nothing medically wrong with it, it's just dying (like Padm�), but as soon as it sees its real mother it's suddenly OK again?

Propaganda Machine posted:

Also, I get it, but Nick could stand to be less of an rear end to that poor teenager. She's doing her best and it's pretty good.

Nick has always been a shithead, it's just more apparent now because he can be more open about it.

esperterra posted:

In S1 they seemed to mostly be going with her not so much being against the society she helped build, but being furious she wasn't the exception to the rule in how women would be treated, since she was so instrumental in helping put it all together.

It's always been very clear that Serena has never thought the rules should apply to her.

Matt Zerella posted:

I love Lydia solely because Dowd is an amazing actress. But yes, the character is awful.

She, at least, seems to truly believe that she's doing the right thing and that it's in everyone's best interests. Like, she doesn't seem to take joy in the suffering of others or want power for power's sake.

precision posted:

The Commander is not a great villain especially after this episode because now he's just a mustache-twirler.

I'm pretty sure his near-death experience has made him more of a fanatic, at least for a while.

Kanine posted:

lol do u think people like tomi lahren or ann coulter have any idea how miserable they would be in their "utopia" either

Absolutely they do. They're arguing in bad faith for an outcome they don't believe will ever come to pass.

veni veni veni posted:

I half expected her to stab fred or something.

Yeah, that internal monologue about women being afraid that men will kill them seemed like it was a lead up to her killing (or at least trying to kill) Fred.

# ¿ Jun 8, 2018 10:14

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

Angrymantium posted:

I never really feel like this show tries to get the viewer to sympathize with Serena so much as it explores how much someone like that would actually hate living in Gilead. She does something horrendous in just about every episode, so any fleeting moment of humanity for her character is tempered with a reminder thar she's basically evil right down to her core, just without the kind of power she thought she'd be wielding.

Yeah, I don't think they ever actually make her sympathetic because every time she suffers some of the consequences of living in this society she created she almost immediately demonstrates that she's still 100% on board with the concept. And even when she's not happy with some aspect of Gilead she still expects everyone else to be.

veni veni veni posted:

That scene was awesome because Fred's coward remark was so nonsensical

It makes sense if he thinks that the Canadians secretly agree with him and are just giving way to public pressure. And really, why were they meeting with him if they really do think Gilead's as terrible as it so obviously is? It's not like they don't know.

The nonsensical bit was, as others have pointed out, the letters making any kind of difference.

PaybackJack posted:

See this kind of stuff was the real cowardice that I disliked in the premise of the show. By portraying Gilead as another place rather than as an actual U.S.A. it becomes easier to disassociate with it. Yeah, it's made up from the ashes of a coup that happened in the U.S. but this episode showed that they still want you to think of the U.S. as this place that wouldn't go for this poo poo.

Even within the show's world, acknowledging "Gilead" as a place distinct from the USA is buying into their framing of the story. They claim that they're a new country because they want to tell the story of how America was weak and sinful and Gilead was born pure and good, but whatever remains of the US government should be pushing the line that Gilead is still part of America, it's just American territory being held by traitors as the southern states were during the first civil war.

# ¿ Jun 16, 2018 12:06

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

Raspberry Jam It In Me posted:

Another thing I noticed was that Gilead's most important asset in the book and S1 were the Handmaid's/fertile women. But since they introduced the plot point that the woman are actually fertile and it's just the men, the entire setting makes no sense.

I didn't read it as it being only men, just that it's known that Gilead solely blames women when it's actually just as often the men. It doesn't make sense either way though. Gilead is actively sabotaging its own efforts to increase its population by not testing men and by abusing fertile women, leading to poor health, suicide, and escape attempts. Every other country should be doing better than Gilead is. If Gilead's most valuable resource is fertile women then Gilead has nothing.

# ¿ Jun 16, 2018 13:08

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

Poppyseed Poundcake posted:

Women should believe the same things I believe.

As a feminist I believe that Scientology is actually good because some Scientologists are women. I think that's how feminism works, right?

# ¿ Jun 17, 2018 16:23

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

Owlbear Camus posted:

This show is good, but will be bad if they try to stretch it to ten seasons. Especially if June doesn't escape soon and it turns into a grimdark gilligans island as someone upthread put it.

If June is still with the Waterfords by the end of this season I'm not going to watch the next one, because it's already dragging and they need to shake up the status quo, not find every possible excuse to return to it.

Timeless Appeal posted:

It's been heavily implied that Fred is sterile which is why Serena had Nick hook up with June and that women aren't the ones who are suffering from infertility.

Most women are infertile. So are most men. I don't think it's been definitively shown whether Serena is capable of having kids but it certainly seems that Fred isn't. Given their wealth and status in the pre-Gilead world though, it seems weird that they apparently don't know themselves. And Serena certainly didn't know about Fred, because otherwise it wouldn't have taken her so long to work out an alternative solution.

# ¿ Jun 22, 2018 13:02

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

Unzip and Attack posted:

Started out hating the season because June very quickly just ended up back where she was last season, started thinking things might pick up, then got let down in the end when the big emotional finale was a rape scene.

It's not over yet.

# ¿ Jun 24, 2018 03:23

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

Owlbear Camus posted:

Just go with it and let yourself buy in. Headcanon that it's the year 2155 or whatever if it helps. Personally I think something not unlike Gilead could come about in another decade or two with radical upheavals to help it along-- but I think a nascent American theocratic state would be more "Southern Baptist" in character.

The problem is that they've shown it as being insanely rapid. It seems to go from indistinguishable from reality to "women aren't allowed bank accounts" to full on theocracy in a matter of weeks. And no one sees any sign of it coming.

Tortuga posted:

Some tips for when you're playing as Offred:

So it wasn't just me who thought this episode felt like a Telltale adventure game?

Crow Jane posted:

She went in through like a side door, and I think the garage door was electric and the power was cut. Or at least that's how I read it.

I'm pretty sure those doors have manual overrides so they can be opened in the event of power failure. It did seem later on when she had the shovel that maybe it was frozen shut, but that certainly wasn't apparent at first, it seemed like she was just trying to open it wrong.

Angrymantium posted:

Despite all that, it's hard to believe how directionless this show manages to be. The colonies went nowhere, Emily got an entire episode before being almost completely forgotten by the writers, and the loving main character spends an episode grimacing in pain and virtually nothing else. This season could be half as long and accomplished just as much, and is only really kept alive by the acting.

Yeah, I really don't think I'll be watching the next season, because absolutely nothing happened in this one. Every time it seems like they're going to shake things up they just go right back to the status quo at the earliest possible opportunity.

# ¿ Jun 28, 2018 12:33

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

Kanish posted:

For a second I though June going through closets and looking for the mans wardrobe meant that she was gonna try and dress like a man to drive around (which I guess would only work if people spotted her in the car from a distance); but then it was clear she was just cold.

The whole time I was thinking "check for men's clothes you idiot". Same with the last escape attempt. Disguise yourself as a man. Especially when it's winter because you can wear a bunch of heavy clothes due to the cold to disguise yourself even more.

Kanish posted:

This also doesnt take into account that a RWD sports car would get absolutely nowhere in 2 feet of snow.

I was also surprised that it even started. How long had it just been sitting there unused?

# ¿ Jun 29, 2018 18:59

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

datajugend posted:

the gilmore girls woman coming to a new "weird" house is the most interesting thing that has happened in this season and its episode 12.

Based on everything else that's happened this season I expect her to be reassigned by the end of the next episode and that guy to never be mentioned again.

veni veni veni posted:

I didn't hate this season, but I've been increasingly less motivated to watch each new episode. It's gonna take a hell of a finale for me to get excited for season 3 in any way. I feel like there is a pretty high chance of me tapping out after this one is over.

# ¿ Jul 6, 2018 11:10

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

Raspberry Jam It In Me posted:

why?

She's named after her father.

BattyKiara posted:

Was that Eden's mother and sister watching her drowning?

Yes.

# ¿ Jul 6, 2018 20:14

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

Raspberry Jam It In Me posted:

What was Eden's plan anyway? Did she seriously think she would be saved by a miracle or was she really ready to die for ~love~?

Probably either. :shrug:

# ¿ Jul 6, 2018 20:15

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

BattyKiara posted:

I guess Nick's future is pretty much hosed now. "No point giving that bloke a new bride, he obviously can't control his woman." "Promotion? Forget it, he couldn't deal with a teenage bride, you think he can command men?" etc.

Or they just put all the blame on the woman and consider him an innocent victim, too virtuous to have suspected what his wife was doing. :shrug:

# ¿ Jul 8, 2018 12:37

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

Well, gently caress this show. This whole season was about six episodes worth of plot stretched over thirteen, with the dumbest possible ending. Just loving garbage. I can't imagine why anyone would watch the next season now.

veni veni veni posted:

Also, I completely involuntarily yelled "get on the fuckin truck!" at the end of tonight's episode. It came from a place of pure rage.

Same. In fact, I was pretty much yelling at the TV from moment she put the photo in the baby's clothes/blanket onward because that's when I knew she was going to go back to Gilead.

# ¿ Jul 12, 2018 13:28

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

Timeless Appeal posted:

Legitimately, I think the hate for the finale is baffling.

The series has constantly dealt with June feeling guilty about the prospect of leaving without her daughter. Her seeing a chance to save Hannah without risking the life of her other child makes a lot of sense and has been telegraphed for a while. It's what makes sense for the character.

This is the third time she's tried to escape only to end up going back for one reason or another. Every time something has happened this season that could have moved the story in an interesting direction it just got dragged straight back to the status quo. We started with June nearly escaping and getting caught at the last minute and ended with June nearly escaping and turning back at the last minute and in between we had June nearly escape but turn back and get caught.

Also this season: A handmaiden carried out a suicide attack, killing and injuring a number of high-ranking Gilead officials. Result? No loving change. Two characters were sent to the colonies but then brought back. Result? No loving change. Serena and Fred continued to be the worst. No loving change. Nick got married and his wife saw compromising material, but then she got herself executed. Result: loving status quo. For all the stuff that happened, nothing actually loving happened!

# ¿ Jul 12, 2018 16:25

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

JazzFlight posted:

I think the writers know they can't just have June tossed back in the Waterford household again to suffer more rapes/beatings/etc., so having her look up with that dark expression as "Burning Down the House" played is their commitment to us.

What, just like they delivered on the promise from the end of season one?

Timeless Appeal posted:

I feel like this criticism is pretty superficial. Things do change. Emily becomes cemented as someone who is willing to murder by going to the colonies. The suicide bombing leads to public hangings that are only stopped by Serena stepping up and cementing her weird relationship with June. It also destroys Nick's hope of changing Gillead through leadership. June's escape at the start of the season is what leads to the Waterford's viewing themselves as being on thin ice for the entirety of the season. June's breakdown is what leads Nick to take lead on the Handmaid's letters.

None of that is actually new. Emily already killed in season one. Serena's relationship with June never evolved at all, June just kept thinking it was about to despite all contrary evidence. Nick is basically non-existent this season, except that he's a real arsehole to his wife - but he's always been poo poo. The Waterfords aren't on thin ice because of anything in particular, that's just how life is in Gilead. Serena occasionally seems to realise that but her belief that the rules don't apply to her always reasserts itself. Even in the final episode she's breaking the rules because she thinks that consequences are for other people. And yeah, having her finger cut off changed her mind, but her mind's been changed the same way before and it never sticks. Nothing changed in this season.

# ¿ Jul 12, 2018 17:37

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

Aqueous Martinis posted:

what's most interesting is anything geopolitical they can come up with. We saw how Mexico and Canada dealt with Gilead, but I want more information on how other countries see it/deal with it. Also, what do the rebel cities look like? Who's there? What are Hawaii and Alaska like? Is what remains of the US military mounting any sort of strike?

The more they show of that the less sense any of it makes.

# ¿ Jul 13, 2018 02:09

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

Sharks Eat Bear posted:

This is dumb. The bombing weakened Gilead leadership. How can you not see the through line between that, the strengthening of the resistance, and the escape of two Handmaids (if not for June�s decision to stay) and a high commander�s baby?

Because tons of people have already gotten out and are living in Canada.

# ¿ Jul 13, 2018 06:06

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

Loucks posted:

does the writing at least get better?

If you don't like season one, season two is just more of that but without any plot progression. I'd advise you not to watch it even if you liked season one.

# ¿ Jul 15, 2018 02:00

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

cocoavalley posted:

Shortly after is when they seize all women's accounts and force them to quit their jobs.

Pretty sure they did that the other way around in the TV show and it made no sense.

# ¿ Jul 16, 2018 13:47

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# ¿ Apr 25, 2024 07:37

Tiggum: Oct 24, 2007; Your life and your quest end here.

Zwabu posted:

I really hope (but am pessimisstic) that the creators have a sense of the necessary pacing for a show this dark and grim, rather than the usual American TV "if it continues to be popular we'll grind seasons out of it until it's utter poo poo and everyone hates it".

Too late.

# ¿ Oct 8, 2018 08:08

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > TV IV > The Handmaid's Tale Season Two: Off book and off to the colonies