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gohmak
Feb 12, 2004
cookies need love


Propaganda Machine posted:

Is KK3 worth watching? The first sequel was okay but it lost enough magic that I never really wanted to watch the last one.

If you didn’t love KK2 then I don’t know what to tell you. KK3 has fat, coked up Ralph Maccio and Terry Silver sooo

gohmak fucked around with this message at May 6, 2018 around 01:18

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Propaganda Machine
Jan 2, 2005

Truthiness!

Daniel's thinly-veiled contempt for his son was an amazing running joke. You can tell that kid is going to ruin some major poo poo in the future.

Rhyno
Mar 22, 2003

Coach Bloodbutt
Default Status: POOPING



X-O posted:

The villain, Terry Silver, is the best thing to ever grace a movie screen.

This a million times! Everyone watch HOLLOW POINT

Martha Stewart Undying
Oct 22, 2012



jaden smith was the best karate kid ever; a show about his character's life afterwards would be a blacker+chinese-er fear and loathing

tao of lmao
Oct 9, 2005


Johnny Lawrence is the best bad teacher since McGuirk.

“Is she hot? Is she hot? Is she hot? Niiice”

DivisionPost
Jun 28, 2006

Nobody likes you.
Everybody hates you.
You're gonna lose.

Smile, you fuck.


Propaganda Machine posted:

Regarding the daughter, we don't see her change over the course of the season, she just reacts to everything happening around her. She only ever hung out with Miguel and her old friend out of necessity. It's nice that she seems to want to go back to karate, but her motivation for those ten seconds of a scene are unknown at this point.

gohmak posted:

she had zero reflection about how she treated miguel by hiding their relationship from her family.

You mean not telling her Dad “By the way, the boy I’m dating happens to be a part of the dojo you have a borderline pathological hatred for?” Yeah, the thing is, Sam did reflect on it. On her way to the party she says out loud “I think he knows I haven’t told my dad about us” in a way that implies she knows she hosed up and that there needs to be a conversation.

Except before she can have that conversation, Miguel has gotten aggressively trashed, and in trying to pick a fight with her ride (who he thinks she’s dating) (because he loving went to her house uninvited to announce himself as her boyfriend without clearing it with her), saw them together, and instantly assumed the worst), he knocks her to the ground. And because she already knows ONE guy who put up a sweet facade and turned out to be an incredible rear end in a top hat...why exactly would she be in a forgiving mood?

Samantha made a bad decision. In a healthy relationship, Miguel would call her on it directly and she’d have a chance to apologize. She never got that chance. Instead, Miguel got mopey around Sam, blamed her for more than her fair share of their problems, and decided the solution was to be the toughest guy in any room just like loving Kyler...but Sam’s the one that needs to reflect on her mistakes. Okay.


You guys realize that part of that whole arc’s point was to indirectly show that Johnny really was a villain in the original movie, right? Remember, even with the unprovoked attacks and Daniel stealing his girl and the illegal kick to the face, there’s still the fact that Johnny got Daniel kicked off the soccer team, or that Johnny treated Ali like an uncooperative dick receptacle when they were on the outs. Johnny ultimately lost Ali because he was an insecure kid seduced into a poisonous worldview by an abusive sensei. It warped him, and even now that he’s somewhat humbled and trying to redeem himself, he’s passing that damage down onto his students, and his star pupil is repeating his mistakes to the letter. Johnny can’t stop that without confronting the problems with his dojo’s core values, promoted and instilled on him by that same abusive sensei.

And here’s the thing: there are positive aspects to the Cobra Kai way! That’s why it’s so seductive! But as Miyagi stressed, it’s about balance. Too much Cobra Kai turns you into an aggressive punk. Too much of the Miyagi-do way of life leaves you wary of and unprepared for the inevitable confrontations life has in store for you. The show does a drat good job of arguing that Johnny and Daniel ultimately counterbalance each other; Daniel even unwittingly lays it out when he tells Johnny “We’re never going to be ‘done.’”

If Sam has issues taking responsibility for herself, it’s a reflection of her father’s passive-aggressive approach to perceived threats, and just like her father, she returns to karate to try and balance herself out. Those “ten seconds” echo Daniel’s own return to karate practice; the way it’s shot is not an accident. That’s a pretty natural arc for a girl who started the show abandoning her core values to fit in with the local mean girl clique.


Samantha LaRusso is a good, well-written character, you guys are just mean.

MiddleOne
Feb 17, 2011



roomforthetuna posted:

Was there anything related to the other films? I got the feeling this was essentially a different timeline from KK2 and KK3. But it might just be that those were super unmemorable movies.

They referenced the insanity of KK3 as the reason for Cobra Kai's lifetime ban.

Propaganda Machine posted:

Is KK3 worth watching? The first sequel was okay but it lost enough magic that I never really wanted to watch the last one.

Watch the Rifftrax, I'd argue it's one of the best they've ever done.

nooneofconsequence
Oct 29, 2012

she had tiny Italian boobs.
Well that's my story.


tao of lmao posted:

Johnny Lawrence is the best bad teacher since McGuirk.

“Is she hot? Is she hot? Is she hot? Niiice”

My doctor said I could be on the spectrum.

I don't know what that is but you should get off.

gohmak
Feb 12, 2004
cookies need love


nooneofconsequence posted:

My doctor said I could be on the spectrum.

I don't know what that is but you should get off.

"I'm gonna teach you the best defence there is. Hyah! More offense."

Mandrel
Sep 24, 2006



DivisionPost posted:

You mean not telling her Dad “By the way, the boy I’m dating happens to be a part of the dojo you have a borderline pathological hatred for?” Yeah, the thing is, Sam did reflect on it. On her way to the party she says out loud “I think he knows I haven’t told my dad about us” in a way that implies she knows she hosed up and that there needs to be a conversation.

Except before she can have that conversation, Miguel has gotten aggressively trashed, and in trying to pick a fight with her ride (who he thinks she’s dating) (because he loving went to her house uninvited to announce himself as her boyfriend without clearing it with her), saw them together, and instantly assumed the worst), he knocks her to the ground. And because she already knows ONE guy who put up a sweet facade and turned out to be an incredible rear end in a top hat...why exactly would she be in a forgiving mood?

Samantha made a bad decision. In a healthy relationship, Miguel would call her on it directly and she’d have a chance to apologize. She never got that chance. Instead, Miguel got mopey around Sam, blamed her for more than her fair share of their problems, and decided the solution was to be the toughest guy in any room just like loving Kyler...but Sam’s the one that needs to reflect on her mistakes. Okay.


You guys realize that part of that whole arc’s point was to indirectly show that Johnny really was a villain in the original movie, right? Remember, even with the unprovoked attacks and Daniel stealing his girl and the illegal kick to the face, there’s still the fact that Johnny got Daniel kicked off the soccer team, or that Johnny treated Ali like an uncooperative dick receptacle when they were on the outs. Johnny ultimately lost Ali because he was an insecure kid seduced into a poisonous worldview by an abusive sensei. It warped him, and even now that he’s somewhat humbled and trying to redeem himself, he’s passing that damage down onto his students, and his star pupil is repeating his mistakes to the letter. Johnny can’t stop that without confronting the problems with his dojo’s core values, promoted and instilled on him by that same abusive sensei.

And here’s the thing: there are positive aspects to the Cobra Kai way! That’s why it’s so seductive! But as Miyagi stressed, it’s about balance. Too much Cobra Kai turns you into an aggressive punk. Too much of the Miyagi-do way of life leaves you wary of and unprepared for the inevitable confrontations life has in store for you. The show does a drat good job of arguing that Johnny and Daniel ultimately counterbalance each other; Daniel even unwittingly lays it out when he tells Johnny “We’re never going to be ‘done.’”

If Sam has issues taking responsibility for herself, it’s a reflection of her father’s passive-aggressive approach to perceived threats, and just like her father, she returns to karate to try and balance herself out. Those “ten seconds” echo Daniel’s own return to karate practice; the way it’s shot is not an accident. That’s a pretty natural arc for a girl who started the show abandoning her core values to fit in with the local mean girl clique.


Samantha LaRusso is a good, well-written character, you guys are just mean.

I don’t think anybody said she wasn’t a good, well-written character. She absolutely is. That dude said she’s an rear end in a top hat. Which she is. But that’s ok, because she’s also a teenager.

The point was not that Johnny was always the villain. The indirect point was that Kreese was the only real villain. The point is that there are no bad students, only bad teachers. Johnny was never a villain, he was a child, and a victim driven down the wrong path by the wrong lessons. He’s realizing that he’s steering Miguel down the same path. Sam is passive, entitled, and lacks responsibility because of the way Daniel has raised and taught her, not as a sensai but as a father. Robbie is a punk because he’s never had any guidance whatsoever, and is desperately seeking it. All of these kids are adrift, flawed, and in need of guidance from a good teacher, and part of the point is that none of them are really villains. Except Yasmin, who can eat poo poo.


All that said, I still find it easy to root for Miguel. Because he’s a kid, his anger comes from a real place of isolation. Not just from “being a nerd,” which we really don’t see him portrayed as, but from being a minority, poor, isolated, his one parent is loving but over protective and frequently gone due to the demands of being a single provider.

We see the discipline and the drive to rise up, and his belief in a broken dude he knows is incredibly flawed and lonely but who he sees the good in regardless. We know he has a good heart, and how hard he’s worked for this. All of that goodwill isn’t undone for me just because he’s a justifiably angry kid, and he comes to make the kind of immature mistakes that angry kids make.

Robbie has his own little journey, but honestly, the dude shows up late in the game and is immediately welcomed into privilege and basically learns karate off screen. It mostly just would’ve been incredibly obnoxious for him to pull out the win and dump yet another unearned victory in Daniel’s lap.


Daniel does suck though. He’s not a villain, but the dude sucks.

Rocksicles
Oct 19, 2012

DAAAAAMN!
Put your glasses back on.


Daniel's wife is great.

Cataffy
Aug 12, 2008


This was fantastic, binged it in a day. Hawk for best original character, the tattoo reveal killed me.

tao of lmao
Oct 9, 2005


Cataffy posted:

This was fantastic, binged it in a day. Hawk for best original character, the tattoo reveal killed me.

His tournament celebration fuckin destroyed me lol.

roomforthetuna
Mar 22, 2005

I don't need to know anything about virii! My CUSTOM PROGRAM keeps me protected! It's not like they'll try to come in through the Internet or something!


Cataffy posted:

This was fantastic, binged it in a day. Hawk for best original character, the tattoo reveal killed me.
The best thing about Hawk was how he's clearly an analogue to one of Johnny's original gang, the one who's always hyper enthusiastic about hurting people like he's overcompensating for something.
Also great is that Johnny's students are significantly worse than his original gang - both the ones in the original who injured Daniel in the competition showed remorse about it, but both the ones in Cobra Kai who injured Miguel would be totally cool with hitting it baby one more time.

etalian
Mar 20, 2006


This show rocks and is basically the real sequel the originals.

gohmak
Feb 12, 2004
cookies need love


Rocksicles posted:

Daniel's wife is great.

"because you BLOW the competition away."

She's great.

HidaO-Win
Jun 5, 2013


Great show, binged and really enjoyed it.

What’s interesting about Johnnys instruction is, as aggressive and destructive as it is, it does a great job of breaking most of the kids out of the depressing situation they find themselves in. Aisha and Hawk are definitely happier as a result of their training and Miguel is arguably so. Now the problem with his training is that there is no balance to it, no force to counter and curb the aggression, something that Johnny seems to realize at the close of the season and will hopefully be the central struggle in season 2, Johnny attempting to develop the other half of the Cobra Kai philosophy, to perfect it away from Kreese.

TARDISman
Oct 28, 2011




This show is the best. There are just some scenes that work on a very deep level for me, mostly Daniel at Miyagi's grave and Johnny and Daniel beginning to reconcile on the test drive for the Challenger. I mean, it means jack poo poo since it goes pear shaped shortly afterwards, but it gives me hope for them working it out next season to unite against Kreese.

Mandrel
Sep 24, 2006



Rocksicles posted:

Daniel's wife is great.

She’s the best. I love that she’s always there to keep poo poo in perspective when it gets too goofy

nooneofconsequence
Oct 29, 2012

she had tiny Italian boobs.
Well that's my story.


The only real problem with the show is it didn't end with Kreese saying "Cobra Kai never dies." That was massively disappointing.

McMadCow
Jan 19, 2005

With our rifles and grenades and some help from God.

I was looking forward to seeing this but I'm totally shocked at how good it was. I hope Zabka gets an Emmy or GG nomination because he absolutely carried that show and he's basically never had a leading role in his entire career.

Solice Kirsk
Jun 1, 2004

.


This show was waaaaaay better than I thought it would be. And I'm glad Ali got away from these two jackasses. I hope she's happy in Colorado.

etalian
Mar 20, 2006


The original Karate Kid is on Amazon Prime video.

motherbox
Jul 19, 2013



This show did exactly what The Last Jedi tried to do and came up just short of. It managed to complicate the original characters while still being true to their portrayal in the original film. I'm not even a huge Karate Kid fan and I absolutely devoured it.

Rhyno
Mar 22, 2003

Coach Bloodbutt
Default Status: POOPING



motherbox posted:

This show did exactly what The Last Jedi tried to do and came up just short of. It managed to complicate the original characters while still being true to their portrayal in the original film. I'm not even a huge Karate Kid fan and I absolutely devoured it.

The show is far better than TLJ.

kickascii
Mar 29, 2010


Cataffy posted:

This was fantastic, binged it in a day. Hawk for best original character, the tattoo reveal killed me.

He flipped the script! The “hawk screech” sound effect to punctuate his moments of triumph killed me every time.

This whole series is so goddamn exceptional, I can’t reccomend it enough.

Trevor Moore predicted this in his latest Comedy Central special, we need more bullies, it was easy to cheer for Miguel, Hawk and the gang.

Cobra Kai really is a badass name for a dojo btw.

kickascii fucked around with this message at May 7, 2018 around 06:16

Rocksicles
Oct 19, 2012

DAAAAAMN!
Put your glasses back on.


Can someone unfuck that title, and show Miyagi-san the respect he deserves.

Mandrel
Sep 24, 2006



Miyagi would be ashamed of the baby back bitch Daniel has become

KTS
Jun 22, 2004

I wax my rocket every day!


Just binged the show and it was fantastic. I didn't even know about it until I clicked the "home" icon in YouTube and was taken to the video. What was a weird coincidence is that I watched The Karate Kid last week (and the remake) when I was scrolling through Netflix looking for something to watch. This was such a great continuation for the characters, and takes a great dive into what made these guys.

Loved some of the jokes and callbacks as well, like in episode 2 with Miguel washing the window and asking Johnny "any particular way you want me to wash these windows?" "Nah I don't give a poo poo" or in episode 7 the training montage with Robbie and the joy on Daniels face when Robbie lashes out at the bullshit chores he's doing

Monglo
Mar 19, 2015


Why are people saying Daniel turned out wrong and betrayed Miyagi's teachings? He's constantly shown as being an upright person with good morals - sure, he left karate long time ago, and self-describes as being overly emotional due to pressures of adulthood - but that's just what makes him a normal human, not some martial arts boyscout as presented in the movie.
I really enjoyed the more realistic study the show goes into - what would events that happened in the Karate Kid do to people on both sides and explores the reasons for how they got into that situation and what would've occurred after. Which I had a lot of fun following.
Really good show. Hope they get to do a second season.

Kazoo Reverb
Dec 3, 2004

by FactsAreUseless


Monglo posted:

Why are people saying Daniel turned out wrong and betrayed Miyagi's teachings? He's constantly shown as being an upright person with good morals - sure, he left karate long time ago, and self-describes as being overly emotional due to pressures of adulthood - but that's just what makes him a normal human, not some martial arts boyscout as presented in the movie.
I really enjoyed the more realistic study the show goes into - what would events that happened in the Karate Kid do to people on both sides and explores the reasons for how they got into that situation and what would've occurred after. Which I had a lot of fun following.
Really good show. Hope they get to do a second season.

Miyagi's number 1 lesson is balance, and Daniel has lost that. The show even addresses it at one point, but by the end he is starting his own dojo not to just spread the philosophy, but to compete with his childhood enemy.

kickascii
Mar 29, 2010


I loved the re-telling of the original movie from Johnny's eyes, which is that he was happily minding his own business when some punk kid from Jersey tried to steal his girlfriend.

DivisionPost
Jun 28, 2006

Nobody likes you.
Everybody hates you.
You're gonna lose.

Smile, you fuck.


Kazoo Reverb posted:

Miyagi's number 1 lesson is balance, and Daniel has lost that. The show even addresses it at one point, but by the end he is starting his own dojo not to just spread the philosophy, but to compete with his childhood enemy.

True, but the show implies that his competitive relationship with Johnny catalyzes the balance in his life, just as he does for Johnny. Daniel trying to uphold the ban on Cobra Kai in the All Valley tournament, that’s a punk move. It tries to shut out that which will always exist so he can go on pretending everything is fine. Daniel confronting the resurgence of Cobra Kai with Miyagi-do is more proactive; yeah, absolutely born out of at least a measure of pettiness, but if he does it right, he’ll spread the philosophy anyway. Plus, by putting himself out there on the front line of this “fight,” he might even be forced to learn something about the positives of the Cobra Kai philosophy, even as he helps combat the negatives of it.

Yeah, those are all “ifs” and “mights,” but we’ve seen that Daniel’s capable of an open mind; beyond that chat at the bar, there’s even that moment where he saw Johnny admonish Hawk, and he had that “Is there something I’m missing” look on his face.

DivisionPost fucked around with this message at May 7, 2018 around 16:35

Spacebump
Dec 23, 2003

Dallas Mavericks: Generations


This show was great but one thing that bugged me was every time Daniel was introduced as a multi-time all Valley champ and everyone kind of ignores Johnny also won multiple times. They should have had a banner from one of his titles.

When Daniel finds himself at the end of the 5th episode is one of the highlights of the series. Such a great moment when his theme starts playing when he is finding his balance

I hope Season 2 has a tournament with Hillary Swank coaching a student and (much less likely) Jaden Smith entering as well.

Spacebump fucked around with this message at May 7, 2018 around 16:40

Croatoan
Jun 24, 2005

Hold the line, I have shitposting to do.


I liked how they had a giant framed picture of Daniel doing the crane kick at the arena which is obviously just some random gym/auditorium they probably rent for the annual event so one would assume that someone has to keep said giant framed poster in their house or garage for 354 days a year. Oh that and the framed portrait of Kreese on a wall.

Solice Kirsk
Jun 1, 2004

.


They don't remember Johnny because he lost touch with karate and was part of a banned dojo. I'm sure if he had ingrained himself into the All Valley Karate Organization like Danny did then they would remember him fondly too, but he didn't. Also the blue and gold mats really did make all the difference.

Rhyno
Mar 22, 2003

Coach Bloodbutt
Default Status: POOPING



Croatoan posted:

I liked how they had a giant framed picture of Daniel doing the crane kick at the arena which is obviously just some random gym/auditorium they probably rent for the annual event so one would assume that someone has to keep said giant framed poster in their house or garage for 354 days a year. Oh that and the framed portrait of Kreese on a wall.

There is a local shared venue that is used for soccer, hockey and other small field indoor sports and they have several display cases full of previous local champions.

TheCenturion
May 3, 2013
HI I LIKE TO GIVE ADVICE ON RELATIONSHIPS

arisu posted:

I'm currently on ep 7 and this show is a lot better than it has any right to be. If you liked the original Karate Kid at all, you should definitely check this out.

This is exactly how I've described it; this show is WAY better than it had ANY right to be, and it's my favourite new show since The Americans. They do an amazing job playing with the dynamics of the original movies, experimenting with the tried and true formula, turing Johnny and Daniel away from black and white morality tropes into flawed and realistic people.

TheCenturion
May 3, 2013
HI I LIKE TO GIVE ADVICE ON RELATIONSHIPS

arisu posted:

Most of the payoff and emotional references factor into just the first film, so if you watch that one you'll get 95% of the stuff. I do recommend checking out the first film before watching this, but if you don't you'll probably still be fine.

You should watch the first three. It ties back into two with the idea of how old rivalries can warp people, the power a corrupt businessman can have over his community, and so on, and also into three, which reinforces the idea that there are no bad students, only bad teachers, and the idea of a basically good idea being warped and perverted, as well as the perils of power without compassion or humility.

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MiddleOne
Feb 17, 2011



Yeah it's not the nostalgia pull that makes this show work at all, it's the fact that the premise and script is solid.

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