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Steve2911
Jan 22, 2013

Please be excited.


Huh, I don't remember noticing it when S4 first came out but Ron Howard is kind of... sucky in the remix? Did they re-record/change a lot of his lines? It sounds like he's struggling to remember the inflections he used to use.

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Timby
Dec 23, 2006

Your mother!


Steve2911 posted:

Huh, I don't remember noticing it when S4 first came out but Ron Howard is kind of... sucky in the remix? Did they re-record/change a lot of his lines? It sounds like he's struggling to remember the inflections he used to use.

Ron Howard is like 64 or 65, the fourth season came out five years ago, and the first season came out literally fifteen years ago. It's not exactly unusual for people's styles to change during that amount of time.

Chairman Capone
Dec 17, 2008



Here's something I've been curious about ever since the original season 4 - is there any reason why Gérard Depardieu was chosen to be Lem's dad, or was that just a random choice? Is he known for having a lot of affairs or something?

Steve2911 posted:

Huh, I don't remember noticing it when S4 first came out but Ron Howard is kind of... sucky in the remix? Did they re-record/change a lot of his lines? It sounds like he's struggling to remember the inflections he used to use.

He re-recorded his lines but that was apparently three years ago. I actually don't think he sounds that different in the new narration, but he did sound off to me in the s5 trailer.

Actually speaking of narration, I just started episode 20 of the remix, and is there a new John Beard narration at the start when he's talking about Cinco?

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

BITCOIN BATMAN

I still don't get the joke about calling Google "Something."

Davros1
Jul 19, 2007

You've got to admit, you are kind of implausible

Google wouldn't grant permission to use their intellectual property

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

BITCOIN BATMAN

Firstly, there's no way you have to get Google's permission to mention googling something on TV, but even if you're right, why not make up a search engine instead of calling it a Something search? What an odd way of dealing with it.

Brother Entropy
Dec 27, 2009

Forreal, call me 'Zelda' in front of my crew again and you're going back in the barrel.



they used google for the sacremende joke back in season 2 or 3, which makes the s4 stuff even weirder

ONE YEAR LATER
Apr 13, 2004

Fry old buddy, it's me, Bender!


Oven Wrangler

Micheal is driving around in a car covered in cameras taking pictures of people and places with no regard to privacy, yet Google was unwilling to let them show the very obvious Google logo and name. And one of the plot lines of the season revolves around the idea of a program that can remove you from social media because of privacy concerns. It's like, one of those ironic things.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

BITCOIN BATMAN

I guess I did get it, and it just didn't land for me so I assumed it was over my head. Not an unfair assumption with this show.

Koirhor
Jan 14, 2008
Ask me about Kolob

Bring back Info Mole!

Sir Lemming
Jan 27, 2009

It's a piece of JUNK!

Watched the first 3 episodes of the remix and I feel like I'm definitely laughing more. I did feel like the India bit wasn't as funny when they only waited like 10 seconds to reveal that Tobias was also going there in parallel, but I guess it's always hard to know for sure if it was actually funnier before, or if it's just different now. It's definitely a tough sell in general, because there's joy to be had rewatching comedy even though you already know all the jokes, but this is sort of new, but not really.

Still, objectively, this seems better. I remember the first few episodes with the sweat lodge and India and stuff being a complete drag.

Also the green screen is SO much more obvious now that I'm watching on a TV instead of a computer monitor.

Escobarbarian
Jun 18, 2004

an idol an idol an idol an idol an idol an idol an idol an idol an idol an idol an idol an idol an idol an idol an idol an idol an idol an idol



That one exterior shot of George Sr. and Oscar in the original sweat lodge is so ridiculously bad lmao

RJWaters2
Dec 16, 2011

It was not not not so great


It looks like an N64 model.

Ingmar terdman
Jul 24, 2006



There's a funny little bit of narration during the Lucille/Lucille 2 seafood trial about Lucille being "obviously green at screening witnesses"

Chairman Capone
Dec 17, 2008



The one that always sticks out for me is Tony Wonder in the background at GOB's wedding.

I finished the remix, which is also the first time I've seen S4 entirely in years. It's funny, maybe a tiny bit is the new narration, but the series seems a lot more 2018 than 2013 - the central plot about a right-wing politician running on a platform to build a wall with Mexico, Lindsey becoming a Hilary lookalike at the end, Jeffrey Tambor playing a guy who essentially transitions at the end (even if... whoops), the other big central plot about a Facebook-analog's privacy concerns, even noticing all the actors who went on to be in Veep stuck out to me... S4 may have been mixed, but it was prescient, I'll give it that.

Tristesse
Feb 23, 2006

Chasing the dream.


I'm a huge fan of the original edit of season 4, I really liked how everything came together as you watched and realized you were seeing the same scenes. I feel like the new edit did lose some of the really hilarious reveals that this approach allowed them to do (for instance the Tobias and Lindsay on the same vacation joke) however the overall flow of the season is much better with the new remix and it flows much much better alongside seasons 1-3. I haven't watched the whole remix yet but that's my initial impression.

Nichael
Mar 30, 2011

SO IT IS WRITTEN


Chairman Capone posted:

The one that always sticks out for me is Tony Wonder in the background at GOB's wedding.

I finished the remix, which is also the first time I've seen S4 entirely in years. It's funny, maybe a tiny bit is the new narration, but the series seems a lot more 2018 than 2013 - the central plot about a right-wing politician running on a platform to build a wall with Mexico, Lindsey becoming a Hilary lookalike at the end, Jeffrey Tambor playing a guy who essentially transitions at the end (even if... whoops), the other big central plot about a Facebook-analog's privacy concerns, even noticing all the actors who went on to be in Veep stuck out to me... S4 may have been mixed, but it was prescient, I'll give it that.

Hurwitz and the show have always had a great understanding of American politics. Season 4 has only gotten more relevant as reality has become Arrested Development.

Chairman Capone
Dec 17, 2008



Bluths for Family of the Year!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pC3HlWL1hU4

Chairman Capone
Dec 17, 2008



So on the latest episode of the podcast How Did This Get Made, one of the advertisements was for a Never-Nude mockumentary starring Tobias that will be coming out May 29.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

BITCOIN BATMAN

Chairman Capone posted:

So on the latest episode of the podcast How Did This Get Made, one of the advertisements was for a Never-Nude mockumentary starring Tobias that will be coming out May 29.
Can this not be a thing? Can this not have happened? I never liked the nevernude joke because at is core, the real crux of the jokes are "aren't marginalized people without public support the worst?" "Aren't mental illnesses wacky?"

Like, straight-up, let's talk about this like never-nudes aren't really a thing, though they are. The entire joke is predicated on disability being funny if it's uncommon and doesn't make sense to the average person.

It's not a good joke.

Anything that's "LOL because people are different from the rest of us" is a lazy-rear end joke.

I love Arrested Development, but it punches down sometimes. You can absolutely joke about anything, but how you do it matters. The punchline of George Sr.'s involuntary transition is, at its core, "isn't it funny that some dudes think they're women? Aren't hormones weird?" There's nothing deeper there. It isn't an exploration of something worth exploring. It's just "haha man becomes woman. Ridiculous."

And the nevernude thing isn't as bad as that, but what makes it funny? What's the joke? The joke is "aren't people with disorders I don't understand hilarious?"

Like Seinfeld with Tim Watley, I'm less offended as a nonbinary person with mental illness than I am as a comedian. It's cheap. It's poo poo. It doesn't do any work. There's no there there. It doesn't deconstruct anything. It just points at difference and laughs.

Again, I still love this show, but not everything it does is perfect.

underage at the vape shop
May 11, 2011


how DARE you laugh at tobias. It is not okay to laugh at anus tarts. They are just different

Nichael
Mar 30, 2011

SO IT IS WRITTEN


The trans George Sr. storyline sucked, in my opinion, and I am pretty sure it's being aborted in season five.

I can see your point about never nudes, but a lot of the jokes in the show are about the various abnormalities of the family. I mean, every other joke about Buster is because of his social anxiety and dependency.

Jose Oquendo
Jun 20, 2004
LUKE SKYWALKER FUCKS REY AND SHE CALLS HIM DADDY


LividLiquid posted:

Can this not be a thing? Can this not have happened? I never liked the nevernude joke because at is core, the real crux of the jokes are "aren't marginalized people without public support the worst?" "Aren't mental illnesses wacky?"

Like, straight-up, let's talk about this like never-nudes aren't really a thing, though they are. The entire joke is predicated on disability being funny if it's uncommon and doesn't make sense to the average person.

It's not a good joke.

Anything that's "LOL because people are different from the rest of us" is a lazy-rear end joke.

I love Arrested Development, but it punches down sometimes. You can absolutely joke about anything, but how you do it matters. The punchline of George Sr.'s involuntary transition is, at its core, "isn't it funny that some dudes think they're women? Aren't hormones weird?" There's nothing deeper there. It isn't an exploration of something worth exploring. It's just "haha man becomes woman. Ridiculous."

And the nevernude thing isn't as bad as that, but what makes it funny? What's the joke? The joke is "aren't people with disorders I don't understand hilarious?"

Like Seinfeld with Tim Watley, I'm less offended as a nonbinary person with mental illness than I am as a comedian. It's cheap. It's poo poo. It doesn't do any work. There's no there there. It doesn't deconstruct anything. It just points at difference and laughs.

Again, I still love this show, but not everything it does is perfect.

Brother Entropy
Dec 27, 2009

Forreal, call me 'Zelda' in front of my crew again and you're going back in the barrel.



the george sr. thing was just a very long 'hey this guy is in transparent' meta bit, like how george michael's story is a whole social network parody just because a lot of people confused jesse eisenburg with michael sera or lindsay ending up with a face-blindness guy because portia de rossi's face looks different from the first 3 seasons because of a nosejob

it wasn't like, particularly funny or anything but i didn't see it as overly mean-spirited, especially compared to 'maeby tricks steve holt(!) into thinking her mom is trans'

Nichael
Mar 30, 2011

SO IT IS WRITTEN


I am 90% sure the George Sr. plot was written before Transparent cast him.

Solice Kirsk
Jun 1, 2004

.


I like the 4th season better now that it was recut in order. I still don't really like it though.

Nichael
Mar 30, 2011

SO IT IS WRITTEN


Solice Kirsk posted:

I like the 4th season better now that it was recut in order. I still don't really like it though.

I liked it when it came out, I like the edit now. It's drat good TV.

If anything, I like it a lot more now, even after liking it a lot when it came out, because season 4 is 2018 as gently caress.

clown shoes
Jul 17, 2004

Nothing but clowns down here.

They explicitly state that maca root reduces testosterone and increases estrogen, which explains George's behavior.

Solice Kirsk
Jun 1, 2004

.


Nichael posted:

I liked it when it came out, I like the edit now. It's drat good TV.

If anything, I like it a lot more now, even after liking it a lot when it came out, because season 4 is 2018 as gently caress.

I don't know why, but I have a feeling you're a big fan of the show.

Nichael
Mar 30, 2011

SO IT IS WRITTEN


Solice Kirsk posted:

I don't know why, but I have a feeling you're a big fan of the show.

I've never seen this show before.

Brother Entropy
Dec 27, 2009

Forreal, call me 'Zelda' in front of my crew again and you're going back in the barrel.



Nichael posted:

I've never seen this show before.

[ron howard-ishly] He had.

clown shoes
Jul 17, 2004

Nothing but clowns down here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eT9Nr-gvC2Q

Nichael
Mar 30, 2011

SO IT IS WRITTEN


This show just makes me happy. My cat passed away on Wednesday and rewatching season 4 was kind of a godsend in taking my mind off how lovely life is. I've felt that way since I first saw it during the New Year's Day 2004 marathon on Fox. The Bluths in all their terribleness have been around me for 15 years.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

BITCOIN BATMAN

Brother Entropy posted:

it wasn't like, particularly funny or anything but i didn't see it as overly mean-spirited, especially compared to 'maeby tricks steve holt(!) into thinking her mom is trans'
Mean-spirited isn't a thing, for the most part. Intent isn't magic, is my position on this. My mom thinks racism was solved in the 60s when we changed some laws. That doesn't make it so. poo poo can be hosed up even if you don't mean it to be. You don't have to have hate in your heart to perpetuate hatred.

clown shoes posted:

They explicitly state that maca root reduces testosterone and increases estrogen, which explains George's behavior.
Firstly, no they don't. They cut this out of the re-do of season four. Secondly, and this is more complicated, you are not your hormones. Men put on estrogen do not become trans women, as was the joke here. Women put on testosterone do not become men. You aren't your hormones. Your gender isn't your hormones.

And the show gets all that wrong. George Sr., a cishet man, is given estrogen through a plant. (The soyboy conundrum.) This isn't a thing.There is no plant that will make you a woman. There are hormones that will help you present outwardly as the woman that you already are, but nothing can make you a woman. That isn't how gender works. And again, my problem isn't just with the joke's science being entirely without basis, it's that the joke, at its core, is "HAHAHAHA TRANS PEOPLE. WHAT IF THE MANLY MAN ATE A THING AND BECAME A WOMAN?! HAHAHAHAHA!" And that's not actually a joke. They're no craft to it.

Nichael
Mar 30, 2011

SO IT IS WRITTEN


I do agree completely that George Sr.'s plot was mostly very bad. I honestly just liked Mary Lynn Rajskub and John Slattery in it.

Brother Entropy
Dec 27, 2009

Forreal, call me 'Zelda' in front of my crew again and you're going back in the barrel.



i just don't really see any hatred in the george sr plot, intentional or not. it's confused and aimless and not really that funny but there's nothing even on the level of the 'shemale' shirt

Nichael
Mar 30, 2011

SO IT IS WRITTEN


There hasn't been a ton for George Sr. to do after season two. Like in three, most of the comedy came from Larry Middleman.

Brother Entropy
Dec 27, 2009

Forreal, call me 'Zelda' in front of my crew again and you're going back in the barrel.



one of my favorite minor 30 rock jokes is when liz talks about playing frederick douglas in a one-woman show and a reviewer describing it as 'too confusing to be offensive' and i think that's basically how i feel about s4 george sr.

clown shoes
Jul 17, 2004

Nothing but clowns down here.

I never thought of George as trans. He was wearing a blouse but that's not any different from him wearing maternity clothes in the attic in season two.

LividLiquid posted:

Firstly, no they don't. They cut this out of the re-do of season four.

It was in the original. Still canon even if they cut it out of the remix.

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Chairman Capone
Dec 17, 2008



Nichael posted:

I am 90% sure the George Sr. plot was written before Transparent cast him.

It definitely was, and probably filmed before it, too, since I think S4 was filmed in 2012.

I did like that in the remake, the final line from the narrator in regards to George is a reference to it.

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