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My methodology is basically "How many people did you genocide or ethnically cleanse" combined with "How much did you existing gently caress up all of the fuckin' world you jackasses". Applying this to 15 historical and modern empires A Computer gave me the following output. #1. British Empire (For like, 8 gorillion genocides and birthing the US, the current Great Satan) #2. Roman Empire (See above) #3. Neo-Assyrian Empire (Absolute Fuckers) #4. Meiji-Showa Imperial Japan (Anime Creating Absolute Fuckers) #5. The Literal Nazis (Literally Nazis) #6. The Spanish Empire (The Entire Columbian Exchange and also sort of by-proxy the US existing) #7. The USA (The Great Satan) #8. Russian Empire (LOL LET'S ETHNICALLY CLEANSE SIBERIA AND CENTRAL ASIA AND ALSO gently caress OVER RUSSIA) #9. French Empire (Fuckin' Over Africa, 1890s-Ongoing) #10. USSR (For making the US go absolutely apeshit for like, 1945-Ongoing) #11. The Mongol Empire (They Liked Killin' A Bit Too Much) #12. The Ottoman Empire (Some hosed Up poo poo on Smaller Scales) #13. Tawantinsuyu (Ethnically Cleansed Chimor) #14. The Aztec Triple Alliance (That whole human sacrifice thing and hosed up tax system that involved human sacrifice poo poo) #15. Shi Huang Di's China (Great Wall and his Palace contain the bodies of thousands who died building poo poo for his rear end) Somehow motherfuckin' Adolf Hitler was punchin' way below his weight with his 1000 year Reich, and the British seized #1 spot from da Romans. I forgot like 500 other fuckers though so this poo poo is open to revision from ya'all.
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May 8, 2018 15:33
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Finally a thread for genocide whataboutism. What about the Tang Dynasty and the An Lushan rebellion? What about Temur?
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May 8, 2018 15:38
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you know the Armenian Genocide started in the Ottoman days, right?
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May 8, 2018 15:40
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Mongols are easy #1, wtf r u smoking
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May 8, 2018 15:40
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rudatron posted:Mongols are easy #1, wtf r u smoking Somehow it seems like Rome was even worse with like, the genocide thing. Somehow. It scared the gently caress out of me when I realized it but like, between the Samnites, Gaul, Judea, Carthage, Campania and their Middle East poo poo, they somehow came out worse. And yeah I totally forgot that about the Armenian Genocide, I was like, thinking that was after the war for some reason. Put them at like, #6.
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May 8, 2018 15:43
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HOW ARE THE ROMANS #2 that's way too loving high, does french colonialism not count now? portugal? spain isn't as bad as Assyria? what?
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May 8, 2018 15:43
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rudatron posted:HOW ARE THE ROMANS #2 *ahem* eurocentrism
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May 8, 2018 15:45
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rudatron posted:HOW ARE THE ROMANS #2 Neo-Assyria did some poo poo that was like, somehow beyond Spain. I am dead serious. Like, genocides on everyone around them, flaying thousands and displaying the skins, mass murder of children in multiple cities sort of poo poo. And yes, the Romans really were that bad. Again, genocide after genocide, against anyone who acted up, including other Latins, inspired a bunch of shitheads in Spain, Britain, France and the US centuries later. They fuckin' sucked and we're still dealing with their bullshit. The French are in there, and yeah, totally forgot Portugal. Also, the only reason the Mongols aren't higher is because once they won a war, they usually just hosed off as long as you paid taxes, whereas like, the British would find a way to engineer a famine on your rear end like India and Ireland got to experience and Rome would usually genocide/ethnically cleanse/enslave you. KiteAuraan has issued a correction as of 15:51 on May 8, 2018 |
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May 8, 2018 15:48
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at last, a working Paradox Interactive tier list though I'd have to say the Mongols are definitely S+ tier
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May 8, 2018 15:53
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the mongols killed about 5 million people when genghis khan was alive (the global pop was only ~500 mill), putting romans above them is nuts. assyria was stuck in one corner of the world. there's absolutely no way they top spain.
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May 8, 2018 15:53
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that feel when the Qing kill 30 million people in the Taiping Rebellion alone and don't even make the list because the OP read a cracked.com article about the Neo-Assyrians 2 years ago.
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May 8, 2018 15:59
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Rhukatah posted:What about the Tang Dynasty and the An Lushan rebellion? Disastrous, but the ~50% of the population death toll is based on simple comparison of before and after census numbers and is definitely not accurate.
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May 8, 2018 16:00
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rudatron posted:the mongols killed about 5 million people when genghis khan was alive (the global pop was only ~500 mill), putting romans above them is nuts. I'll give you Spain, for essentially being Global Neo-Assyria. I cannot cede Rome though. Like, I get that the Mongols killed more, but lookin' at HOW they both ran their empires and like, what they did after a war and how they administered poo poo internally and treated their own citizens, Rome still comes out lookin' shittier. Mongols definitely best KDR though. Also it wasn't a Cracked article, it was reading some books about Southwest Asia in the period and like, actual university level Egypt poo poo where they kept poppin' up being assholes. I'll admit not knowing much about China beyond the Qin and Han.
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May 8, 2018 16:08
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rudatron posted:the mongols killed about 5 million people when genghis khan was alive (the global pop was only ~500 mill), putting romans above them is nuts. Julius Caesar did ~million killed/enslaved in just Gaul. The Roman Empire just straight up had more time to pull poo poo.
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May 8, 2018 16:10
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I liked Age of Empires 1 more than AoE 2 but both games are pretty great.
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May 8, 2018 16:13
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KiteAuraan posted:Also, the only reason the Mongols aren't higher is because once they won a war, they usually just hosed off as long as you paid taxes, whereas like, the British would find a way to engineer a famine on your rear end like India and Ireland got to experience and Rome would usually genocide/ethnically cleanse/enslave you.
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May 8, 2018 16:16
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C-Euro posted:I liked Age of Empires 1 more than AoE 2 but both games are pretty great. This makes you the true historical monster.
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May 8, 2018 16:16
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I think you need to account for time as well op. Nazi germany only existed for 12 years and all the deaths in the european theater should be considered their responsibility.
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May 8, 2018 16:18
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the ottomans should definitely at least be higher than the USSR
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May 8, 2018 16:18
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Stairmaster posted:I think you need to account for time as well op. Nazi germany only existed for 12 years and all the deaths in the european theater should be considered their responsibility. Yeah I should, especially since for Rome, I am counting time as an imperial power, not just when they called themselves an empire, and including the Eastern Empire in poo poo. So they got like, 2000 years to be fuckheads. Everyone else gets like, 500 years tops.
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May 8, 2018 16:19
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Okay, so how are we doing this, is it a) total killed b) total killed relative to the time period c) total killed relative to the time period & place (here, *place* being *areas it could access*) d) total killed, relative to the length of empire e) total killed, relative to the length, time period f) total killed, relative to the length, time period & place if we go a), nazis are top. if we go b) ...I'm not sure. maybe a toss up between nazis and the british. if we go c) maybe romans if we go d) still probably nazis if we go e) mongols if we go f) ...not sure, but I think triple alliance takes it.
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May 8, 2018 16:19
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the vast majority of the deaths attributable to the spanish empire were due to disease responses they neither anticipated nor controlled. the neo-assyrians accomplished their genocides by hand, with iron and bronze, and reinforced their rule with such a severe combination of public cruelty and religious totalitarianism that cyrus the great was able to win whole regions with minimum conflict on the simple promise of "i'll let you organize your own local government and follow your local religion unmodified, i'm not the assyrians"
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May 8, 2018 16:21
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C-Euro posted:I liked Age of Empires 1 more than AoE 2 but both games are pretty great.
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May 8, 2018 16:22
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rudatron posted:Okay, so how are we doing this, is it Nah, not just total killed, but also administrative policies and effects beyond their own borders they have had historically. Who they inspired, who got to exist because of them, poo poo like that. So like, the British Empire leads into the US existing, as well as Mandate Palestine and that shitshow, as well as the India/Pakistan conflict and poo poo, so that gets counted against them, and by inspiring every European empire after them, as well as stamping out people who were doing better things, even if not through killing, Rome runs up their score. Also, there is 0 archaeological evidence that the Triple Alliance killed more than like, at absolute most, 10 million in about 300 years. They amateur hour in KDR and the totals given in history are made up Spanish bullshit to justify their murder rampage. But I am gonna bump the Mongols up like, 10 slots once this poo poo is revised.
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May 8, 2018 16:28
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the neo-assyrians would've really appreciated all the horrible drama the pizarro brothers got up to in the incan imperial palace at cuzco though. demanding royal princesses as concubines and swapping the women between them would only be more neo-assyrian if they'd beheaded manco inca yupanqui and hung the severed skull from the rafters to watch while they went to town on his sister- and cousin-wives
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May 8, 2018 16:29
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wrong answer idiots; number 1 : capitalism
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May 8, 2018 16:38
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rudatron posted:the simple fact that aoe 2 has the mill & farm queueing means ur opinion is objectively wrong Don't get me wrong, AoE 2 is definitely the better game if only for the QoL improvements. I just enjoyed the simplicity of 1 a whole hell of a lot for whatever reason (but gently caress the 50 unit population cap).
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May 8, 2018 16:42
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capitalism isn't an empire it's a disease
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May 8, 2018 16:42
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so if we're including 'influence', then I feel you're still far over-rating the neo-assyrians, because i doubt they were that influential. the same can be said for other bronze age civs.
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May 8, 2018 16:46
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You guys have such a narrow perspective. I nominate one of those Argentine ant super colonies that can span literal thousands of miles. They've probably slaughtered countless more billions of rivals and exterminated more enemy societies than every human empire combined.
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May 8, 2018 16:47
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Helsing posted:You guys have such a narrow perspective. I nominate one of those Argentine ant super colonies that can span literal thousands of miles. They've probably slaughtered countless more billions of rivals and exterminated more enemy societies than every human empire combined. Yeah but like, they probably all just view themselves as one entity anyways so like, they've killed maybe hundreds of other hive-minds, but not like, millions or anything. The real answer is probably some space bastards that we never want to meet.
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May 8, 2018 16:54
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#1 Finno-Ugric Empire #2 Worldwide Gangster Communist Computer God #3 Ancient Slovenian Empire
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May 8, 2018 17:00
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#0 Greater Serbia
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May 8, 2018 17:03
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one thing Frank Herbert never thought to include, not once, was the fact that the Slavic peoples of the former Yugoslavia had in fact survived intact into the tens of thousands of years in the future not once do we get to visit the planet of New Serbia
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May 8, 2018 17:03
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the nazis had to recruit traitors among conquered populations to assist in the mass murdering since they knew that poo poo was hosed up and that it would drive German soldiers mad to be constantly butchering civilians if you ignore the scale of atrocity permitted by industrial technology the nazis were fuckin amateur hour, people used to torture entire cities to death for funsies
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May 8, 2018 17:04
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you forgot the Japanese Empire op also I'd rank the original Age of Empires as number one
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May 8, 2018 17:07
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That Robot posted:you forgot the Japanese Empire op They in there. Meiji-Showa Imperial Japan. The only time that the Emperor really mattered for poo poo and they got up to hardcore imperialism that didn't fail miserably because Toyotomi's son/nephew/whatever was a fuckup and Tokugawa wasn't helping invade Korea (because he was gettin' ready to overthrow Toyotomi). Edit: Also, they were basically assholes that entire time. Like, they didn't just jump China in like, 1930 or some poo poo. Once they got the government settled they invaded China, fought Russia over who got to gently caress up Korea and won and helped the US and Britain gently caress over China a few times. They got busy fuckin' fast. KiteAuraan has issued a correction as of 17:17 on May 8, 2018 |
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May 8, 2018 17:11
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I’m changing my vote to the weather
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May 8, 2018 17:14
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gucci bane posted:I’m changing my vote to the weather the dominion of nature. that's a pretty good one
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May 8, 2018 17:19
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| # ? Apr 24, 2024 12:59 |
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Where's The Maurya Empire?
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May 8, 2018 17:34
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