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Slamburger
Jun 27, 2008



Tired Moritz posted:

AS might be scum goon trying to pull a gambit

I'm just coming back to playing after a long absence, so meta question does AS ever pull this kind of stuff or would this be a first for him?

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Tired Moritz
Mar 25, 2012

wish Lowtax would get tired of YOUR POSTS

(n o i c e)


I need more info about

"if you let me live (don't) i'm pretty sure ecco said that bk and monathin were immune to my paranoia and should visit anytime!"

from AS, thank you.

Slamburger
Jun 27, 2008



Believe him or don't but he said it was a joke, so what more do you want him to add to that?

Moatillata
Dec 13, 2006

Maintain.


Hal knows what he did

CCKeane
Jan 28, 2008

my shit posts don't die, they multiply



Tired Moritz posted:

AS might be scum goon trying to pull a gambit

Always execute scum, that wouldn't affect my play on this matter.

Tired Moritz
Mar 25, 2012

wish Lowtax would get tired of YOUR POSTS

(n o i c e)


i dont get the joke

CCKeane
Jan 28, 2008

my shit posts don't die, they multiply



Tired Moritz posted:

i dont get the joke

What joke?

Hal Incandenza
Feb 12, 2004



Moatillata posted:

Hal knows what he did

Haters gonna hate

Hal Incandenza
Feb 12, 2004



Tired Moritz posted:

i dont get the joke

AS said those two and AS have some history so it was an inside joke for them you donít have to get it

Tired Moritz
Mar 25, 2012

wish Lowtax would get tired of YOUR POSTS

(n o i c e)


well thats rude

Tired Moritz
Mar 25, 2012

wish Lowtax would get tired of YOUR POSTS

(n o i c e)


we should kill AS for having inside jokes

Hal Incandenza
Feb 12, 2004



Tired Moritz posted:

we should kill AS for having inside jokes

Agreed ##vote AS

Hal Incandenza
Feb 12, 2004



Whenever merk arrives he will 100% vote AS until either he or AS is dead so letís just do this and head that off

Monathin
Sep 1, 2011

Kid's gonna have to ask you to clarify.

AGDQ 2018
Awful Block Survivor



CCKeane posted:

I voted you as a goof, but it looks like I made the right call.

Please explain how you think you would be an asset to town.

BK, Mona, what is your response to this?

I think ASoda is a fine player and I get wanting to claim PGO because it's a really tricky role to play around, the main way they're useful as a power role is by trying to get scum to run into them, as has been discussed, which is now out the window. The way they're responding to you feels like towny who knows they got a role that can't be very useful to town.

Slamburger posted:

I think Monathin's behavior is a little weird around the claim. He's mentioned in the claim (which AS later says was just a joke), but he made two separate posts about how he believed the claim. The second post just struck me as too stuck on it.

I believe ASoda's claim because I believe ASoda's claim.

EccoRaven
Aug 15, 2004

there is only one hell:
the one we live in now


I will send out prods tonight to anyone who hasn't posted yet (I think it's just merk and BK rn)

Dick Bastardly
Aug 22, 2012


Hal's push isn't sitting well with me.

Anomalous Amalgam
Feb 13, 2015

"Dangit, Griffith. I'll tell you h'what, that's a Behelit!"


Doctor Rope

Hal Incandenza posted:

Doesn't seem like anyone is claiming to be an asset here. Voting AS is probably right, especially since the PGO can be weaponized by the scum if they have the right roles.

I guess it could be a really sneaky lynch-bomb trick or something

???

Anomalous Amalgam
Feb 13, 2015

"Dangit, Griffith. I'll tell you h'what, that's a Behelit!"


Doctor Rope

Ah nvm

Anomalous Amalgam
Feb 13, 2015

"Dangit, Griffith. I'll tell you h'what, that's a Behelit!"


Doctor Rope

Does ecco use jesters ever?

Hal Incandenza
Feb 12, 2004



Dick Bastardly posted:

Hal's push isn't sitting well with me.

Do you have a better option? (besides me)

AS has boxed us in. Can't investigate. Scum won't kill. Will flip scum. They either stay around as a distraction or we get it over with.

Slamburger
Jun 27, 2008



Dick Bastardly posted:

Hal's push isn't sitting well with me.

Agree. Although I do support getting rid of a claimed Death Miller immediately, I think the pair of Hal's posts seem fishy. Kind of a jokey, but not really, and then "well Merk's gonna do it anyways" seem to be obscuring why he's voting.

Hal Incandenza
Feb 12, 2004



Slamburger posted:

Agree. Although I do support getting rid of a claimed Death Miller immediately, I think the pair of Hal's posts seem fishy. Kind of a jokey, but not really, and then "well Merk's gonna do it anyways" seem to be obscuring why he's voting.

To be fair, when I claimed death miller to try and help out town in League whatever number it was merk did exactly that, so it's not like I am talking out of my rear end here.

Also see the point I just made

Slamburger
Jun 27, 2008



Hal Incandenza posted:

AS has boxed us in. Can't investigate. Scum won't kill. Will flip scum. They either stay around as a distraction or we get it over with.

But I do agree with this 100%. I've never played with a Death Miller, but I would imagine when they do flip its a major town distraction as people debate whether or not he was really scum and it was a gambit or whether it was real. This is a rare case (maybe the only case) where I feel less information/post history/interaction is actually a town benefit just due to the distraction potential.

IllegallySober
Aug 25, 2004

"Winning is great, sure, but if you are really going to do something in life, the secret is learning how to lose. Nobody goes undefeated all the time. If you can pick up after a crushing defeat, and go on to win again, you are going to be a champion someday."
(Wilma Rudolph)



I have a nasty headache today so not sure how much I'll be around today. That said, I'm inclined to buy AS's claim but am unsure of what the best way to deal with that is.

Jonathan Fisk
Sep 6, 2010

Get your umbrella fella cause we blowin hella chedda


I'm not inclined to analyze what's mostly jokesphase on a weekend, but i'll be round later

Slamburger
Jun 27, 2008



Thinking further, having a Death Miller die at some later point gives the scum:

1. Ability to argue gambit/scum whichever way benefits their fake cases with no answer until the game ends.
2. Ability to post non-casework content by trying to "solve" gambit/scum and/or egging on town that will inevitably also be trying to solve that even if its pointless.

So yeah, having a Death Miller survive for any period of time seems like a major pain, so sorry if you're telling the truth and Ecco gave you a bum role AS, but

##unvote
##vote AS

Moatillata
Dec 13, 2006

Maintain.


Tired Moritz posted:

i dont get the joke

Don't sign your posts


Unfortunately now that scum knows AS is a PGO if they have a redirect they essentially get a free extra kill

This saddens me but I will vote her to prevent this, however, I am not gonna vote her atm because I am still holding out hope to murder scum atm

Like Hal who is scum

IllegallySober
Aug 25, 2004

"Winning is great, sure, but if you are really going to do something in life, the secret is learning how to lose. Nobody goes undefeated all the time. If you can pick up after a crushing defeat, and go on to win again, you are going to be a champion someday."
(Wilma Rudolph)



Moatillata posted:

Unfortunately now that scum knows AS is a PGO if they have a redirect they essentially get a free extra kill

This is my bigger concern over the Miller aspect of the claim at this point. Scum still has to pick the right redirect targets but I'd be somewhat shocked if they didn't have a redirector of some kind.

BottleKnight
Sep 1, 2008



Hey friends, sorry about my absence. I've been a little busy with summer classe-

Atomic Soda posted:

moat if we are both town my happiness will be complete but now i've sobered up somewhat you should probably kill me today.

the best and greatest rule with mafia is play to win and i am town but boy howdy i'm also a paranoid gun owner death miller (not sure if my flip is the scum alignment tho)

i am not a good enough player to make this work in towns favour and i don't want cops/docs dying to a misplaced hail of bullets. claiming is a problem also cause if scum have a redirector they just gunna feed townies into my fire, but i think its better than sitting on this info.

please kill me painlessly, and win as town for my sacrifice

if you let me live (don't) i'm pretty sure ecco said that bk and monathin were immune to my paranoia and should visit anytime!

hm.

Monathin
Sep 1, 2011

Kid's gonna have to ask you to clarify.

AGDQ 2018
Awful Block Survivor



BottleKnight posted:

Hey friends, sorry about my absence. I've been a little busy with summer classe-


hm.

Very curious to hear your thoughts, given I've made mine clear.

BottleKnight
Sep 1, 2008



Slamburger posted:

Agree. Although I do support getting rid of a claimed Death Miller immediately, I think the pair of Hal's posts seem fishy. Kind of a jokey, but not really, and then "well Merk's gonna do it anyways" seem to be obscuring why he's voting.

I think I generally agree with this, but also, I think it being AS changes my mind. Mostly because, after being in a masonry with AS last game where I was scum and she was town (aka the things she was saying were more honest than the things I was saying), I think what she said about not being a good enough player (even though she totally is) is honest, and not some sort of scum trap.

Death millers seem like an absolute distraction (I don't remember if I've ever played in a game with one?) but also AS is a good town player who posts good content. She is 100% not the kind of player who would post such a weird-rear end fakeclaim like this immediately out of the gate. If Taste had posted this claim I would be voting him. But from AS it reads as genuine to me.

And yeah, the thing referencing me was a joke, because she joked about vigging me after I won as scum in the last eccogame.

Monathin
Sep 1, 2011

Kid's gonna have to ask you to clarify.

AGDQ 2018
Awful Block Survivor



i vigged atomic soda in DBZ Mafia 2 and as such am owed a death at Asoda's earliest convenience.

BottleKnight
Sep 1, 2008



IllegallySober posted:

I have a nasty headache today so not sure how much I'll be around today. That said, I'm inclined to buy AS's claim but am unsure of what the best way to deal with that is.

Why are you inclined to buy AS's claim? And is your uncertainty of what to do about the claim mostly due to the possibility of a scum redirector?

BottleKnight
Sep 1, 2008



Slamburger posted:

Thinking further, having a Death Miller die at some later point gives the scum:

1. Ability to argue gambit/scum whichever way benefits their fake cases with no answer until the game ends.
2. Ability to post non-casework content by trying to "solve" gambit/scum and/or egging on town that will inevitably also be trying to solve that even if its pointless.

So yeah, having a Death Miller survive for any period of time seems like a major pain, so sorry if you're telling the truth and Ecco gave you a bum role AS, but

##unvote
##vote AS

How is this any different now than later? Couldn't scum still do both of those things if we execute her today? This is a weird amount of WIFOM to me. AS literally posted "you should probably kill me today" when she claimed, I guess I just don't think scum are gonna get a ton of extra traction if she lives longer.

BottleKnight
Sep 1, 2008



Moatillata posted:

I will vote her to prevent this, however, I am not gonna vote her atm because I am still holding out hope to murder scum atm

What Does It Mean

BottleKnight
Sep 1, 2008



Moat I'm pretty much reading that as "I will vote her to prevent this but only if I can join a bandwagon, otherwise let's execute scum" ????

How do I parse that?

BottleKnight
Sep 1, 2008



Anomalous Amalgam posted:

Does ecco use jesters ever?

I kinda glossed over this post but on rereading it it's not ridiculous. It's such an insane claim that I'm leaning towards it either being true or a jester. I just can't imagine a world where scum would go "yes i'm this insane thing and you should probably execute me today" so early in D1.

Slamburger
Jun 27, 2008



BottleKnight posted:

How is this any different now than later? Couldn't scum still do both of those things if we execute her today? This is a weird amount of WIFOM to me. AS literally posted "you should probably kill me today" when she claimed, I guess I just don't think scum are gonna get a ton of extra traction if she lives longer.

My thought process (which might be in the weeds) is: the less content and interaction the better when a Death Miller dies. Suppose AS survives until like Day 3 and then dies, and flips scum. On a normal scum flip, there's a good amount of content and interaction to pick back through in light of the flip. People are inevitably going to be tempted to do this even for a Death Miller. I would argue that's wasted analysis and a potential distraction, but its absolutely going to happen. Compare with a D1 lynch. There's just not too much to go on. Its gonna be some joke votes, some bandwagoning. People are going to talk about it a little on Day 2 move on. It has much less risk of sprouting a jungle of bullshit that scum can hide in.

Hal Incandenza
Feb 12, 2004



I mean maybe if AS was in here dazzling us with reads it might be different but we have heard nothing but the claim and "I'm not good enough to play this role"

Bottom line is the 3 options are:

1 - AS is possibly telling the truth but we won't know until the game is over and it will be a permanent distraction and possibly used against town. Also who would want AS in a LYLO situation?
2 - AS is a jester and leaves the game when dead
3 - Is scum gambitting and we won't know until the game is over

If someone has a great non-AS scum case today, I'm all for looking at that. Otherwise AS is kind of a detriment to town going forward. If I were scum I would want AS around as long as possible after that claim unless I was totally convinced she was a master scum hunter who would break the game open if left alive.

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BottleKnight
Sep 1, 2008



Hal Incandenza posted:

If someone has a great non-AS scum case today, I'm all for looking at that. Otherwise AS is kind of a detriment to town going forward. If I were scum I would want AS around as long as possible after that claim unless I was totally convinced she was a master scum hunter who would break the game open if left alive.

Woah you and moat should hang out, you seem to agree on everything (except whether Hal is scum).

Though admittedly, your and slamís posts are pretty convincing. I like AS and think she is a good town player but both of these roles sheís claimed create unique reasons for executing, even if I believe sheís probably town.

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