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mewse
May 2, 2006

Princess auto had "freeway blaster" horns on sale for $15 so I got one of those and just installed it on the bike because the horn wasn't working. Thankfully the new horn works and it wasn't a problem with the wiring.

HOWEVER, the turn signals aren't blinking properly. I thought it was because I didn't have all four connected (front two are attached to the fairings I took off). I just connected all four and it's still not working. Some kinda relay problem? Any advice appreciated.

I also bought some things they had on sale:

- Snap ring pliers (to do fork seals eventually)
- 17mm socket (to do oil change)
- 4pc tie-down straps.. for if/when I get a trailer to haul this around
- Tappet adjustment wrenches (weren't on sale)

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builds character
Jan 16, 2008

Keep at it.

mewse posted:

Princess auto had "freeway blaster" horns on sale for $15 so I got one of those and just installed it on the bike because the horn wasn't working. Thankfully the new horn works and it wasn't a problem with the wiring.

HOWEVER, the turn signals aren't blinking properly. I thought it was because I didn't have all four connected (front two are attached to the fairings I took off). I just connected all four and it's still not working. Some kinda relay problem? Any advice appreciated.

I also bought some things they had on sale:

- Snap ring pliers (to do fork seals eventually)
- 17mm socket (to do oil change)
- 4pc tie-down straps.. for if/when I get a trailer to haul this around
- Tappet adjustment wrenches (weren't on sale)

Are they LEDs?

mewse
May 2, 2006

builds character posted:

Are they LEDs?

No they're the original bulb type

HenryJLittlefinger
Jan 31, 2010

stomp clap


If all the bulbs are intact, check continuity on the relay.
Or just buy a relay and see if that fixes it. If not, return it.

If one or more of the bulbs are dead, replace them and try again. I think older bike electrical systems are finicky about the total resistance on the system, so if one bulb dies the others won't work properly.

mewse
May 2, 2006

HenryJLittlefinger posted:

If all the bulbs are intact, check continuity on the relay.
Or just buy a relay and see if that fixes it. If not, return it.

If one or more of the bulbs are dead, replace them and try again. I think older bike electrical systems are finicky about the total resistance on the system, so if one bulb dies the others won't work properly.

All the bulbs light up, would the relay be a standard part?

e: hmm looks like the relay is almost as swappable as the horn was, and if I put a new school flasher in there it will improve the reliability anyway. Just gotta find the thing on my bike

mewse fucked around with this message at 20:06 on Jun 21, 2018

builds character
Jan 16, 2008

Keep at it.

mewse posted:

All the bulbs light up, would the relay be a standard part?

e: hmm looks like the relay is almost as swappable as the horn was, and if I put a new school flasher in there it will improve the reliability anyway. Just gotta find the thing on my bike

So the fuse isn't blown?

mewse
May 2, 2006

builds character posted:

So the fuse isn't blown?

I've done a visual inspection on the fuses and they all seem good. The turn signal relay is trying to work it just seems old and bad because it makes this crunchy buzzing noise when it's trying to switch.

Slavvy
Dec 11, 2012

If your battery is good that sounds like a hosed relay, although sometimes taking the bike for a ride seems to give them more encouragement than just trying it sitting still and they sort of 'wake up' and start working.

mewse
May 2, 2006

I found the turn signal relay. It looks corroded to poo poo.




Looks like I can get a replacement for a dollar from aliexpress but I might go with amazon canada for it to show up sooner.

HenryJLittlefinger
Jan 31, 2010

stomp clap


You can probably get a suitable replacement at the auto parts store down the street.

mewse
May 2, 2006

HenryJLittlefinger posted:

You can probably get a suitable replacement at the auto parts store down the street.

Yeah, but I'd have to go outside, and talk to people,

Slide Hammer
May 15, 2009

Doing valve clearances on an EX250 engine? Buy a long 9mm 1/4" drive socket. You will need it for the valves on the exhaust side, because there is no clearance for a standard socket in there. You'll be right up against the head rim.

Edit: Gave wrong size. It's 9mm, not 8mm. The socket I have that did the job was 2" long and it was the perfect length.

Slide Hammer fucked around with this message at 02:58 on Jun 22, 2018

mewse
May 2, 2006

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Q-nqnwXI0k

mewse
May 2, 2006

Old relay vs new relay



Production has begun for my carb sync tool

mewse
May 2, 2006

With the carb sync apparatus ready to go I decided to attack the valve clearances but wasn't able to get the valve cover off. First the coil brackets wouldn't come off the bike, and then the looooong engine top mount bolt seemed to be seized. Stuffed some paper towels in the openings and will return to it later, might borrow my dad's impact gun.

HenryJLittlefinger
Jan 31, 2010

stomp clap


mewse posted:

my dad's impact gun.

Hold up.
Soak it in penetrating oil, tap it firmly with a hammer, wait a day, repeat. Those bolts can break easily, and when they do everything gets worse.

A hand impact driver, one of those things that you hold with your hand and strike with a hammer is often all it takes to break the threads loose, where an impact gun might just twist the head off the bolt.

HenryJLittlefinger fucked around with this message at 04:25 on Jun 30, 2018

mewse
May 2, 2006

HenryJLittlefinger posted:

Hold up.
Soak it in penetrating oil, tap it firmly with a hammer, wait a day, repeat. Those bolts can break easily, and when they do everything gets worse.

A hand impact driver, one of those things that you hold with your hand and strike with a hammer is often all it takes to break the threads loose, where an impact gun might just twist the head off the bolt.

The problem with this one is that it's like a foot long and I think the threads are at the far side, so I was using penetrating oil already but I don't think it was reaching the threads.

I'll see if there's a cheap impact driver around here.

e: looks like princess auto has one for cheap

mewse fucked around with this message at 04:32 on Jun 30, 2018

HenryJLittlefinger
Jan 31, 2010

stomp clap


mewse posted:

The problem with this one is that it's like a foot long and I think the threads are at the far side, so I was using penetrating oil already but I don't think it was reaching the threads.

I'll see if there's a cheap impact driver around here.

e: looks like princess auto has one for cheap

You might only use it a couple times, but I bet on a rebuild you'll find more uses for it than you expect. It's worth in for the irritation of stripped threads and the special kind of fury you feel when you shear a really important (or even just really inconvenient) bolt.

mewse
May 2, 2006

Progress on this has been slow lately.

Impact driver managed to get that long bolt out, and my dad helped me by pulling the radiator forward so that I could get the valve cover off the engine.

After that I discovered it's a loving nightmare to adjust the valves. I'm sure it would be easier if I was more experienced with wrenching but I understand now why the service manual says to remove the radiator.

I ordered the special kawasaki tool to do the adjustments and hopefully that will make it easier. I also bought a very nice socket set and a cheapo torque wrench.

I bought one of those hanging fuel bottle things to run the engine while syncing the carbs, but the drat plastic is cracked and it leaked gas all over the ground when I started filling it, have to return that. Also gotta return the tappet wrenches that are completely useless on this bike.

e: also bought spray paint for the fairings :getin:

DefaultPeanut
Nov 4, 2006
What's not to like?
I'm betting you could tune sync that by ear once you get the carbs sorted out and installed back on the bike. I think it was mentioned before, but replace the valve cover gasket, spark plug hole gaskets and if you are feeling fancy, the valve cover bolt grommets. Awesome bike by the way, a friend did the same thing with a 92 and rode it for 3 years with no problems before going to a EX500.

mewse
May 2, 2006

Pulled the radiator to get easier access to the valves. Had to drain the coolant again which was kind of annoying. Was hoping to re-use it but there's a bunch of crud in the stuff I drained.

Successfully adjusted one intake valve. Started on another one but got too sweaty and decided to pack it in for now.

Put 2 coats of white primer on my test fairing and then a drop of sweat fell from my head right into the middle of the fairing, lol. I blotted it with paper towel but I think I'll wet sand this coat of primer. Top coat will be gloss white.

e: I returned the tappet wrenches and hanging fuel tank, and picked up a 1500lb lift and a rolling stool

ADINSX
Sep 9, 2003

Wanna run with my crew huh? Rule cyberspace and crunch numbers like I do?

mewse posted:

Pulled the radiator to get easier access to the valves. Had to drain the coolant again which was kind of annoying. Was hoping to re-use it but there's a bunch of crud in the stuff I drained.

Successfully adjusted one intake valve. Started on another one but got too sweaty and decided to pack it in for now.

Put 2 coats of white primer on my test fairing and then a drop of sweat fell from my head right into the middle of the fairing, lol. I blotted it with paper towel but I think I'll wet sand this coat of primer. Top coat will be gloss white.

e: I returned the tappet wrenches and hanging fuel tank, and picked up a 1500lb lift and a rolling stool

I don't remember the valve adjustments being particularly hard, but yeah you gotta remove the radiator. Just don't do like me and forget to put clamps back on all the hoses and blow a head gasket when it ran out of coolant :saddowns:

mewse
May 2, 2006

Finished the valve adjustments. Starting bolting stuff back together than that loving top engine mount bolt, the one I had to use the impact driver on, its bolt hole on the radiator bracket won't line up with the hole through the engine. Tried using a ratchet strap to tighten the radiator up to the frame and failed miserably.

Slide Hammer
May 15, 2009

Loosen everything again, then do that bolt first. But don't tighten it down all the way, just get the threads in there. Then do the same for every other bolt. This gives you that crucial fraction of a millimeter of wiggle room.

The fairings are this way too. Get three bolts into the gas tank, fourth one doesn't line up.

P.S. Since you have this older model, I hope that you've read about matching up those fairing-to-gas-tank bolts appropriately. If you use the long ones up top, you can puncture the tank!

mewse
May 2, 2006

Slide Hammer posted:

Loosen everything again, then do that bolt first. But don't tighten it down all the way, just get the threads in there. Then do the same for every other bolt. This gives you that crucial fraction of a millimeter of wiggle room.

The fairings are this way too. Get three bolts into the gas tank, fourth one doesn't line up.

P.S. Since you have this older model, I hope that you've read about matching up those fairing-to-gas-tank bolts appropriately. If you use the long ones up top, you can puncture the tank!

I loosened the four bolts above the coils (2 on each side) but your post made me realize clamping the radiator hose may be what's tugging the bracket downwards. I'll have to check that, thanks. I'll be careful with the fairings, I got a new bolt kit.

mewse
May 2, 2006

Oooook made a lot of progress today. Got that bitch of a bolt back in after loosening the radiator hose clamp. Reconnected all the wiring for junk on to the radiator bracket (coils, horn, ground, temp sensor(?)).

Started great then I realized there was no coolant.

Refilled coolant.

Hooked up carb sync tool, synced carbs. Started up bike again, carbs sucked water into the engine. At this point something happened to the starter, I think the starter relay died. I've ordered a new one.

Also rotated the engine to make sure it wasn't seized and then pulled the spark plugs to dry them with a hair dryer.

What does it mean when an engine is idling really well and then applying some throttle causes it to conk out?

Gonna wait for the new starter relay to show up before more work. Old one was making a sizzling/arcing noise I think.

Slavvy
Dec 11, 2012

It means you're idling pretty lean, opening the throttle adds more air, stalls airflow in the carbs and kills the engine. Quite likely you have a clogged pilot jet or two, or your pilot screw settings are out of whack.

Your earlier post saying the idle sticks really high supports this, quite often the bike won't idle so the PO just turns the idle screw in until it does.

mewse
May 2, 2006

Slavvy posted:

It means you're idling pretty lean, opening the throttle adds more air, stalls airflow in the carbs and kills the engine. Quite likely you have a clogged pilot jet or two, or your pilot screw settings are out of whack.

Your earlier post saying the idle sticks really high supports this, quite often the bike won't idle so the PO just turns the idle screw in until it does.

There are main jets, pilot jets, and idle mix screws right? Or are the idle mix screws also pilot jet screws? Maybe I should just replace the jets, there are new idle mix screws from the carb kits - I gave them 2.5 turns backed out because that's apparently factory.

e: gently caress it, ordered a set of jets

mewse fucked around with this message at 02:26 on Jul 17, 2018

builds character
Jan 16, 2008

Keep at it.

mewse posted:

There are main jets, pilot jets, and idle mix screws right? Or are the idle mix screws also pilot jet screws? Maybe I should just replace the jets, there are new idle mix screws from the carb kits - I gave them 2.5 turns backed out because that's apparently factory.

e: gently caress it, ordered a set of jets

Slavvy
Dec 11, 2012

mewse posted:

There are main jets, pilot jets, and idle mix screws right? Or are the idle mix screws also pilot jet screws? Maybe I should just replace the jets, there are new idle mix screws from the carb kits - I gave them 2.5 turns backed out because that's apparently factory.

e: gently caress it, ordered a set of jets

Pilot jets have tiny holes that clog super easily and make the bike run lean/not run at all at or near idle unless the idle is so far open that the needle is doing the job instead (see the above diagram). Main jet is where the petrol comes out for the majority of the rev range and is governed by the needle exposing more/less of the hole in the middle. At WOT your main jet is going it alone and it all works like a platonic ideal of a carb with one great big ventury sucking petrol straight out of one great big hole in the middle.

Pilot screws control how rich/lean the carb is at or near idle, 2.5 out is within the realm of normality, if it's still no good with new pilots you might have a vacuum leak somewhere or you have some other reason it's running lean. Clean the carbs surgically, preferably with the aid of compressed air, make sure your vacuum diaphragms aren't torn, floats still floating and set to the right height.

mewse
May 2, 2006

Slavvy posted:

Pilot jets have tiny holes that clog super easily and make the bike run lean/not run at all at or near idle unless the idle is so far open that the needle is doing the job instead (see the above diagram). Main jet is where the petrol comes out for the majority of the rev range and is governed by the needle exposing more/less of the hole in the middle. At WOT your main jet is going it alone and it all works like a platonic ideal of a carb with one great big ventury sucking petrol straight out of one great big hole in the middle.

Pilot screws control how rich/lean the carb is at or near idle, 2.5 out is within the realm of normality, if it's still no good with new pilots you might have a vacuum leak somewhere or you have some other reason it's running lean. Clean the carbs surgically, preferably with the aid of compressed air, make sure your vacuum diaphragms aren't torn, floats still floating and set to the right height.

Thanks for the info. I was meticulous with my carb reassembly and I know the diaphragms are ok, but the pilot jets were kinda chewed up and all the jets got discoloured by the cleaning solution my buddy had in his ultrasonic cleaner. I think I maybe should've just hit them with carb cleaner, but whatever I'll just replace them.

mewse
May 2, 2006

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOk7WlJDuWw

Seat Safety Switch
May 27, 2008

MY RELIGION IS THE SMALL BLOCK V8 AND COMMANDMENTS ONE THROUGH TEN ARE NEVER LIFT.

Pillbug
Sounds good, but something's funky.

Will it start right back up after it dies? Can you throttle up real quick and fight through the bog?

Chuck the pilots in a pot (that you don't particularly like) of boiling water and see if that helps. Usually works better than an ultrasonic.

Slavvy
Dec 11, 2012

Seat Safety Switch posted:

Sounds good, but something's funky.

Will it start right back up after it dies? Can you throttle up real quick and fight through the bog?

Chuck the pilots in a pot (that you don't particularly like) of boiling water and see if that helps. Usually works better than an ultrasonic.

This is an A1 protip, have boiled would again. IMO it's on a par with a manual parts washer running expensive fluid. And you can do it anywhere pretty much.

Then just be super ultra sure they're dry before putting poo poo back together :v:

mewse
May 2, 2006

Seat Safety Switch posted:

Sounds good, but something's funky.

Will it start right back up after it dies? Can you throttle up real quick and fight through the bog?

Chuck the pilots in a pot (that you don't particularly like) of boiling water and see if that helps. Usually works better than an ultrasonic.

It starts right back up again and if I let it have some choke then it gives some really good throttle response. I’ll prob try your suggestion with the jets

HenryJLittlefinger
Jan 31, 2010

stomp clap


mewse posted:

It starts right back up again and if I let it have some choke then it gives some really good throttle response. I’ll prob try your suggestion with the jets

If you have an enrichment circuit (supplies the fuel/air mixture with more gas, effectively bypassing the pilot circuit) instead of a choke (chokes off air to mixture), then your symptoms indicate a clogged pilot circuit. Pass a guitar string through the pilot jets and the pilot passages in the carbs themselves and try again.

Slavvy
Dec 11, 2012

Wait mewse are you thinking this thing should run without the choke when it's cold? Cause that's is definitely not the case.

Jonny 290
May 5, 2005



[ASK] me about OS/2 Warp
Motivational pic: saw this streetbeater ninja behind work today. I dig it

mewse
May 2, 2006

Jonny 290 posted:

Motivational pic: saw this streetbeater ninja behind work today. I dig it



That's sick. I wonder if a 88-07 gas tank would mount on my frame.

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mewse
May 2, 2006

Slavvy posted:

Wait mewse are you thinking this thing should run without the choke when it's cold? Cause that's is definitely not the case.

This was probably part of the problem.

I boiled the jets and made sure I could see the pinhole of light in both pilot jets, and reinstalled everything. Let the bike warm up and it seems like it's running ok now. There is still a hesitation leaving idle for a couple revs, I'm not sure what that's about. Maybe I have to sync the carbs again with the engine warm.

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