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Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord
Shadow Hearts is by far my favorite JRPG series so I'm ready to continue on this ride.

CmdrKing posted:

I think they must have made this whole opening as a proof-of-concept sales pitch or something, because a lot of what happens here just doesn't line up with the overall mood and style of the actual game. Of course it's certainly good for getting the player to pay attention out of the gate, so that's useful.
Yeah, it really screams proof-of-concept that they didn't change to fit the rest of the game once they made it. The violence, Yuri's regenerative powers, and even some of the stuff Roger does doesn't really come up again.

NGDBSS posted:

I'm psyched to see Shadow Hearts on the docket so soon after Koudelka. Though man are those cutscene graphics out of place for a PS2 game - they're not that much better than Koudelka had on PS1.
SH1 started development as a PS1 game and its an early PS2 game as well. They also probably didn't have the budget considering SH1 is a lot longer than Koudelka.

WampaPartyEX posted:

These games are absolutely bonkers good, the first two moreso than the third (but the third still a pretty good JRPG despite even fewer people playing it than played Koudelka), and I'm super happy to experience them all over again.
I really wouldn't call FTNW less popular than Koudelka. If anyone knows about Shadow Hearts they probably know about FTNW, Koudelka is the one where even some Shadow Hearts fans may not have heard of it.

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Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

Zagglezig posted:

Funny thing about that. They sounded really familiar and it finally clicked at the head officer's voice that they're all flavors of the voice of Grandpa from Yu-gi-oh. And sure enough, same actress.
Pretty much the entire English VA cast for SH1 were all people that worked for 4Kids, namely on Pokemon.

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 14:28 on Jun 21, 2018

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

Ubiquitous_ posted:

You should post concept art of the Judgment Ring at some point, too. It's an extremely well done piece of art for something you don't get a full picture of in-game, and its design changes between games.

It's so weird that few games adopted this type of battle system after the series concluded, as I've had more fun spinning the Judgment Ring in all three SH games than I have battling in most other RPGs in general.
I know Lost Odyssey uses a similar system because some of the old Nautilus team worked on it after Nautilus broke up after FTNW.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

Leraika posted:

The choice to localize Yuri's name as that instead of Urmanov/Uru was one of the best localization choices ever.
Yup...

Also this part also feels like something they did early on and didn't go back and fix up to fit with the rest of the game because this is is the only time Yuri is an uncomfortably creepy pervert.

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 00:40 on Jun 23, 2018

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord
That actually has spoilers for Covenant so you should probably mark it as such.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

ultrafilter posted:

I don't remember Malice being all that bad. It's something you have to manage, but it's not like you have to really be careful about how many battles you fight between save points or anything like that.
Yeah, its just a mechanic that's just there. It's not really that much of a problem.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord
Covenant and FTNW are mostly better in their treatment of gay characters compared to SH1. There's still some questionable things in Covenant, but the gay characters in 2 and FTNW are more actual characters instead of gay panic style rapists like Meiyuan.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

EagerSleeper posted:

Pretty much my thoughts exactly. 2 tried to add some character to what is normally a gag, but it also doubles down entirely on the gay gag thing in other parts. More wacky, more better??? Eh, not really imo. At least here in this game I could forget about Meiyuan.
The only really sus thing in 2 is that the loser of the Man Tournament Grand Finals has to have sex with the winner. The Magimel Brothers are super flamboyant but the cast treats them as normal and everyone treats Joachim being gay as not a big deal either for the most part. FTNW is even better than 2 about it because it has no uncomfortable homophobia and actually has a gay relationship that's treated as happy.

The Shadow Hearts trilogy isn't a shining example of gay representation but it does get better as it goes along.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

Omobono posted:

I read strong implications that this game is not Yuri's first adventure, so I'd expect even somebody not particularly bright like our protagonist to pick up some experience on how this kind of rodeo goes and how to recognize the warning signs. Although on the latter point his Mysterious VoiceTM is a bit of a cheat.

I don't know if expanded material expanded on this, but from his chat with the masks I can see a previous adventure, roughly with the same scope as Koudelka, where the masks are the main villains and he defeats them but without managing to fully exorcise them so the four assholes set up shop in his soul in revenge.


E: and while I like Disgaea it's way too different to be compared to Shadow Hearths and someone please bring an exorcist in the thread for the other comparison thanks.
Yuri was orphaned at a young age and had to fight for his survival while dealing with his powers all by himself for around twenty years. So yeah, while they don't elaborate on it too much it makes sense that he's experienced in fending for himself and dealing with the supernatural.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord
Kawashima is actually our first character based on a historical figure in this game aside from Roger.

The series really ramps up the historical characters in Covenant and FTNW, but there will be some more in this game.

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 01:41 on Jul 7, 2018

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

Gilgamesh255 posted:

:Radiating an annoying amount of smugness due to actually having physical copies of the Shadow Heart trilogy: :smug:
Psh, get a load of this scrub, I have physical copies of all four games. :smuggo:

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord
I do still need to get around to play it, but even if I hate the combat I love everything else about the game so I don't feel it would be a waste of owning it.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

Omobono posted:

Christ, I remembered Margarete, but I forgot she was Mata Hari.

I think it say a shitload about the series that Mata Hari joining the party is a forgettable detail.
To be fair this game never really brings up the fact that she's supposed to be Mata Hari unless you know her real name.

Covenant and FTNW's historical characters are much more obvious in comparison.

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 21:55 on Jul 11, 2018

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord
Fun fact, Margarete is the only party member in all four games that doesn't use magic at all, just tech several decades ahead of her time.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

ZiegeDame posted:

I don't think Ricardo's incredibly versatile guitar case is any more magical than Margarete's cell phone.
Ricardo learns magic though Stellar Charts. Shadow Hearts 1 is the only game in the series with no dedicated magic system, just character abilities.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

IMJack posted:

The descriptions of angels from ancient Levantine mythology could be pretty jacked up. Too many wings, too many faces, bizarre anatomy and geometry that wouldn't be out of place in a Cthulhu mythos book. The "baby faced pretty boy with wings" idea is fairly recent in comparison.
Even the angels that were closest to the modern pop culture depiction, the seraphim, still had such horrific faces that they constantly had them covered with their wings.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

Ratoslov posted:

The weird part is, Bayonetta's cast of angels (Minus the Joys and stuff like the cars and gunships and whatnot) are largely taken from traditional angelology. The language of angels that shows up is an actual conlang made by the sorcerer John Dee. That's a really deep pull for a game all about a big tiddy witch shooting angels and showing off her butt.
I think the deeper pull is how the Mega Ten series has Satan and Lucifer as entirely different beings, because they go with the original Jewish concept that Satan was just God's prosecutor angel and not Lucifer, the mostly Christian idea of an angel who rebelled against God and became a demon.

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 01:33 on Jul 21, 2018

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

Robindaybird posted:

It's really sad the dub quality has dipped greatly, but Koudelka was pretty drat unique in how they did everything.
The voice-acting gets better in Covenant and FTNW, but still none of them are at Koudelka's level. Good voice direction and getting the VAs to record together goes a long way.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

Robindaybird posted:

yeah, as well as not being lazy. SH1 - as Dark Id and others mentioned only partially dub the battle sounds, leading to wildly jarring differences. It always baffles me they just... quit half way? It doesn't take much to have a VA moan, grunt, or gasp for the battle sound bites.
Thing is Jeremy Blaustein localized the game, he's the guy who did the English localization for games like MGS1, Silent Hill 2 and 3, Snatcher, and Shadow Hearts Covenant so he's not some scrub. Also as I said before a bunch of the 4Kids Pokemon dub VAs worked on this and they weren't a bunch of rookies either. I get the feeling Midway just cheaped out on the localization and made them rush it or something.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

Neddy Seagoon posted:

It forces the player to try a little variety in their party strategy with the new addition for a short stretch of the game, rather than just benching Zhuzhen the moment he joins.
Pretty much this. Yuri/Alice/Margarete was my main team throughout the whole game except when the game forced me to shake it up. (Though it was more out of that all three are really good and not complacency.)

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 17:56 on Jul 22, 2018

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord
Yuri is just a big old dork.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

Speedball posted:

Oh, yeah, despite that magic is very real in this setting, some people like Kawashima are behind orthe curve. Which is funny.
Shadow Hearts is one of those settings where the supernatural is real but most regular people aren't going to encounter it on the regular.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord
Yuri is also a pretty blunt and honest dude, unlike Squall who is a brooding edgelord.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

Glazius posted:

How do you join this lottery society in the first place? Wander into the wrong bar in college?
Ya gotta be pals with vampires.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord
Fun Fact: There was a fourth Shadow Hearts game that was planned before Nautilus got dissolved, it was going to star a younger Ben years before this flashback happens.

Also,

quote:

Ugh… I’ll be all right… Heh heh heh. Not to sound ungrateful for your help, but… I don’t… exactly… Consider myself so old yet. Urgh…

quote:

<nods> The Fusion technique… I heard about it a long time ago, but I never expected to see it myself… Heh heh… how amusing to hear that fiend call YOU a demon… Talk about… the pot and the kettle…

these should probably be Zhuzhen's portrait.

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 21:07 on Jul 30, 2018

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

Gilgamesh255 posted:

Really? That's a shame; would've been interesting to see what weirdos Ben was hanging out with, maybe see if he was the straight man of the group. Hell, what kind of crisis did his group divert? If my history wasn't so laughable, I'd probably be able to make a decent guess.
There was only one another character that was planned for it before the idea got scrapped and it was (Spoilers for a character in Covenant) Kurando's dad.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

Shitenshi posted:

Wasn't the black bat from FTNW going to be a character too? Or maybe that was early fan speculation.
The latter, though its educated speculation considering that Joachim and Hilda both had early cameos too.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord
Pit fights are a staple of the series that gets expanded upon in Covenant.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord
I actually skipped a good chunk of the optional sidequests because you can miss them when I played through so it'll be good to see some of it. Didn't know they showed a cutscene after you did the pit fights.

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 21:40 on Aug 8, 2018

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord
She voiced Ben too.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord
I don't really remember this dungeon being that much of a pain to me. Though the dungeons in this game get much better from here.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

TheLastRoboKy posted:

I feel like the whole Kowloon sidequest thing would have made more sense if you were going there for the key to the tower, as opposed to the Japanese Army having it. Maybe there was a story revision at some point after all the awesome stuff had already been made? I don't really know I'm 100% speculating.
Shadow Hearts 1 just tends to obscure substantial content behind easily missed sidequests. There are lategame dungeons that you can miss out on if you don't do a missable sidequest to get a fusion. (Though its not as obtuse as getting to Kowloon)

Covenant got rid of that aside from two sidesquests, but they don't have any dungeons tied to them so you're not really losing out on content.

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 04:11 on Sep 3, 2018

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

iospace posted:

So question, and feel free to not answer if spoilers, but how far through are we?
About halfway, the Shadow Hearts games are all separated into two major halves.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

The Dark Id posted:

The Mandela of Hell shall open, and the Seraphic Radiance will be summoned!
That should be Mandala.

And yeah, Zhuzhen and and Dehaui just trained together, they're not blood related.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord
Yeah, Dehuai was trying to make a contract with the Seraphic Radiance.

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 17:30 on Sep 14, 2018

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

McDragon posted:

Shanghai probably is quite peaceful at this point. The crater might even have stopped smoking by now.
This isn't really much of a spoiler but, the series never goes back to China or mentions Shanghai again, so you wonder if the city ever really recovered.

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 17:34 on Sep 14, 2018

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord
It will be established later on but anybody powerful enough can make a fusion contract with a cosmic horror, but you're limited to just one at a time. What makes Harmonixers like Yuri and Ben special is that they can fuse with multiple demons/horrors and maintain them all.

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 10:21 on Sep 15, 2018

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

McDragon posted:

Keith is an excellent name for a vampire. It's just so normal.
It's even funnier when you compare him to (Covenant and FTNW spoilers) his siblings, Joachim and Hildegard, who have more appropriate archaic sounding names.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord

Zagglezig posted:

I remember being surprised at the changes to vampire rules over the years when I got around to reading Dracula sometime after college. In there it's garlic flowers, specifically, rather than the root bulbs you always see (except the time they chop off one's head and stuff its mouth with garlic). Crosses probably would have worked and burned on contact, but they used sacramental wafers more often than crosses. Sunlight was just a power drain. Dracula runs around in mid day at one point and he's fine, he just can't use any powers. Turning into mist and being able to go through unsealed cracks in doors and windows was also new to me.
Funny enough vampires getting killed by sunlight is quite recent in the history of vampires as it was the original Nosferatu that started it.

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Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Buglord
Kevin is so lame he doesn't even get the proper Europe boss theme.

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