Restoring a star to its former glory (I have no idea what I'm doing)

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Automotive Insanity > Restoring a star to its former glory (I have no idea what I'm doing)

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

To get those bolts out, I suggest getting some replacement bolts and metal injector hold-down clips, and then using a Dremel with a thin slitting disk, i'd cut a slot right across the top of the head of the bolt so that you can use a nice big flat-blade screwdriver to turn them?

# ¿ Jul 11, 2018 20:11

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# ¿ Apr 27, 2024 13:30

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

Pursesnatcher posted:

Yeah, it's beginning to look a lot like that's my only option. I already have a set of replacement screws (part number A 000 984 79 29, OEM all the way!), but since the clips are $12 a pop, and dremeling usually makes nice little sparks right next to those fuel lines... but yep, definitely considering it. I also need a clever way to get all the metal debris from drilling (and potentially cutting) out of the way.

You paid me back with a good laugh as well; it's also oddly reassuring to know you have to sell your soul to actually pull this stuff off...

Hmmm. Use a grinding disc and go slower? I'm not sure how great an idea it is either!

Perhaps you could snip the clip off, and then hammer a socket on top of the head of the bolt...

# ¿ Jul 11, 2018 20:44

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

This thread is making me nervous as i've got to do four of these CIS injectors on an M102 this week...

# ¿ Jul 12, 2018 00:21

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

Yeah, mercedes factory wiring doesn't look like that at all. All of those cheesy crimps, the vamp tap I spotted, and those relays just hanging out in free space; they're all aftermarket work.

Could be for a central locking remote maybe?

Anyway, my experience with old mercs and land rovers is: replace the OVP, gently close the panel up and don't shake the wires about too much! Get it working, then start ripping out the old crap once it's running OK!

# ¿ Jul 15, 2018 17:38

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

Pursesnatcher posted:

Dear diary.

Turns out the screws themselves are not aluminum at all, only the manifold they're stuck to is. I think they might be actually be galvanized steel.

aha. that'll be why they're stuck tf then!

# ¿ Jul 15, 2018 23:38

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

Pursesnatcher posted:

In short: Does anyone have any ideas about why my car suddenly hates going uphill with a fiery passion?

Some mercedes engines of that era had problems with the plastic thermostat housing. Check yours, and replace it with the updated metal one if you like.

If you have an electric fan clutch like mine, you can test it by pulling the cable to the sensor and bridging the contacts. With the engine off you should hear a nice loud click (and probably see sparks if you used a screwdriver!) when it engages.

# ¿ Jul 19, 2018 09:01

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

Oh wow. That thing is bloody beautiful.

# ¿ Jul 23, 2018 22:51

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

Some MB engines of the era needed chain guides replacing, and yeah, chains were known for stretching. In bad cases, stretched chains were known to wear grooves in the sides of the chain cover :eek:

# ¿ Jul 26, 2018 01:33

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

Definitely replace that cap, i've been left stranded with a cap that bad before.

# ¿ Sep 8, 2018 09:58

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

PainterofCrap posted:

You've said they ain't facory (or Bosch), but the last things I'd replace on that are the plug wires...you've done the plugs...once you square away the cap & rotor, see how she behaves.

If you're still suspicious about the wires: wait for a good & dark night & fire her up; open the hood, and take a good, long, leisurely look at the wires in full darkness; if they're worn or cheap, they'll leak, and you'll see plasma pulsing all over the place, up & down the leads.

If you don't: live with them until everything else is done & you're flush with cash.

Best advice right here.

# ¿ Sep 9, 2018 14:53

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

Pursesnatcher posted:

So yeah it ate up a fair chunk of the September automation budget, but SO drat WORTH IT! While everything I've done so far has yielded some improvement, this last replacement just blew everything else out of the water. Okay, all the other repairs were necessary to benefit fully from this one, but I'm still baffled. Idling is a whole lot smoother, sure, but it's the driving experience which is entirely different. The power curve is way more even, plus I now put down so much more power it's almost silly.

Called it! Awesome

# ¿ Sep 18, 2018 21:59

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

Hahaha. Yeah, time for new plug wires?

# ¿ Apr 16, 2019 21:39

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

Pursesnatcher posted:

Pfff, I guess it can't be helped. It's so weird, the wires all seem nice and, well, insulated. Don't see how it can make a spark through all of that rubber, but it obviously is, so.

Does this mean I've not been firing on that cylinder? I mean, if the spark goes into the exhaust manifold, it can't be going into the combustion chamber?

Correct!

I used to drive an old british V8; the joke was that I could lose three cylinders before noticing.

You'll see power or mpg improvements when you put new wires on it and get that cylinder firing.

# ¿ Apr 18, 2019 20:11

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

STR posted:

The PO didn't take good care of it, your best bet is to fix whatever it needs to stay legal on the road (and reliable), and just drive it. Enjoy it. Take it off road a bit. Get it dirty. Go camping. Do whatever it takes to make it trustworthy on trips, but don't make it a garage or show queen. Just use it the way it's meant to be used, stay up to date on maintenance, and use quality parts (preferably OEM) when you need to fix it.

Speaking as a former 30-y-o Merc owner, I couldn't have put it better myself!

# ¿ Apr 27, 2019 11:55

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

I remember that noise! It is definitely your engine fan.

# ¿ May 13, 2019 23:56

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

Pursesnatcher posted:

All right, so I went out and had a good tug on the fan blades on a cold engine, and I got maybe a couple of inches of rotation. After running it for a few minutes, engine temperature about 50 degrees C, I could get another inch or two using just my fingers, but no more. Plus, just from looking, I could see the fan was spinning a lot faster than the belts running around the water pump/stem/whatever � which I guess are supposed to be running the fan.

If that wasn't enough, giving it just a bit of throttle, I saw the fan accelerate intensely. I could even feel a powerful wind, pushing harder as I pulled on the throttle link � almost pushing my video-taking phone out of my hand. Big fan! So it really seems to keep completely in sync with engine RPM. That's a broken clutch, then?

Unfortunately, seems like I do. Part number A1162000722 is the clutch for most 117.965's, while HWA1172000022 is for the AMG version of the same engine. The former has a 165 mm diameter, while the latter (as far as I can figure out from searching old boards) is about 190 mm across � and my measuring tape tells me that's what my current one is.

To make matters worse, my parts guy can't even find it in Germany (and if Mercedes can, which is not certain, they routinely charge 3x what he does or more). Unfortunate, but I'll figure this out yet. Best case, the bimetal spring thing needs some WD-40 love, and worst case, I guess I'll need to try rebuilding it.

Edit: Well, if it's a bimetal spring at all. I can't wait to get my new parts though; pulling this thing out and actually getting a proper look at it is going to be super fun!

Hey, most Mercedes engine parts have the number cast right on to them; once you've got it off you might be able to find the A.......... number and find a replacement with that.

Also, I wonder if this is legit: https://crazyaboutmercedes.com/en/mercedes-benz-engine-manuals/6-mercedes-benz-service-manual-v-8-engine-m-11696-38-m-11796-50.html

e: that manual's part# is S6510191613 if you are interested in finding a copy.

meltie fucked around with this message at 00:04 on May 16, 2019

# ¿ May 15, 2019 23:34

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

It is apparently possible to refill your own clutch if all the oil has leaked out...

https://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/195595-refill-viscous-fan-clutch-pictures.html

(there's a whole bunch of fan clutch geekdom on that thread)

meltie fucked around with this message at 17:55 on May 26, 2019

# ¿ May 26, 2019 17:50

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

The Bible: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Injection-...=gateway&sr=8-1

# ¿ Jul 31, 2019 22:23

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

Pursesnatcher posted:

All right, my friends. I am officially puzzled, bemused and bewildered. My not-potentiometer is fine. It's beyond fine, and it turns out it's quite possibly a bit redundant.

We've got three pins, where number 2 is ground. The others start at 0 and infinite ohms, which flips to the opposite state when the throttle goes from zero to not-zero for one, and from not-WOT to WOT for the other. As far as I can tell, that's exactly what's supposed to happen.

But then: I had a friend over to help me test this out, and once we had figured out that it seemed to be all right, we took it out for a test drive. Almost a mile later, we both realize that we might have forgotten to put the plug back on, so I pulled over, and, uh, yeah. We had. And yet, the car was fine. Maaaaaybe a little rough running, but otherwise fine. So we put the plug back on, went back to the test run, and completed two full miles with no issue. No trace of power loss or weird throttle response.

So fuel pump was the next suggestion, but I don't know � it buzzes nicely, which evidently means it runs? Am I overly optimistic when I'm thinking perhaps fuel filter? I can't see any trace of that having been changed in my receipts, which means it's gone at least 80k miles. Or it could just be ze German vacuum system and that one hose which had come off, I don't know.

On a happier note, I can now make engine cooling! As I mentioned just a couple of posts back, I found a wiring diagram with a "refrigerant high pressure switch" in it. That, it turns out, is this:

So I just disconnected this baby here, shorted the wires, and lo � both auxiliary fans spin up at a respectable pace as soon as I turn on the ignition. Victory!

I bet it was that hose tbh. Good hack with the fans!

# ¿ Aug 8, 2019 22:16

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

Raluek posted:

There are probably drain tubes for the sunroof that go somewhere, and if they get blocked the water gets where it's not supposed to. Might run along where you're seeing water. Cleaning them out so they drain properly might be worth looking into, as a potentially free fix.

I guess that thing is just a plug for an unused port or something, but IDK why it's such a large thing to accomplish that. Why even have the vacuum line.

Yes, it'll be blocked sunroof drain tubes. You need to clean them out.

I used a cheap wire from inside a bicycle brake cable to poke them clean, until the cable came out the other side.

Although if they're completely and utterly blocked solid then you might end up pushing so hard that you disconnect the internal pipes, and that is very much not fun to reattach.

If it's not the sunroof then there may be "body drains" that you need to clean too. In my W201's case, there were two behind the engine, under the bottom edge of the windscreen. They too were blocked with leaf debris, and were making standing water pool up in the engine bay before it overflowed into the cabin.

If you don't clean them, it'll all rust through quickly and be hell to weld up again!

# ¿ Aug 25, 2019 15:39

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

Pursesnatcher posted:

Oh, those are solid tips. I just assumped the sunroof is sealed all around, but maybe not? This is the problem with having a very tall car, I guess. There's a stupendous amount of birch seeds floating around absolutely everywhere these days, so that might well have gotten in and clogged stuff up. Will check it out! My engine bay drainage is nice and open though, I did check that out already.

Ahhh yeah, because nothing ever seals properly on a car, everything has drains. The sunroof will have a gutter on each side, that goes back to a PVC drain tube, that goes down inside the roof pillars to the ground. Check a generic G-wagen manual, there should be a diagram in there somewhere. There will be 2 or 4 🙂

meltie fucked around with this message at 18:11 on Aug 25, 2019

# ¿ Aug 25, 2019 17:54

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

PainterofCrap posted:

It�s at least a Mercedes thing; I had an e320 sedan that did this. That, and the special sunroof unicorn lube

Oh, god, yeah. I think I ended up using some bike grease that had a very high teflon content or something. It held up for a year anyway.

# ¿ Aug 25, 2019 19:02

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

Pursesnatcher posted:

Alright, here's the video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5bem279KHHk

So that's immediately after starting the engine, right after I put the IACV back in. Stumbles properly in the beginning, but gets back up again by itself. It seemed mostly okay? I'm very curious as to what might be causing the odd variations in idle speed about a minute into this clip, though.

That's a low idle from cold, it should be about twice that. (edit: wrong, see zundfolge below)

My gut feel is that the random glitching is misfires and is probably to do with ignition.

I'd refer you to Kent Bergma at Mercedessource; he's got lots of videos and guides for keeping mercs of our vintage going: https://www.youtube.com/user/Mercedessource/search?query=mercedessource+idle

His main site is: https://mercedessource.com

meltie fucked around with this message at 19:48 on Aug 29, 2019

# ¿ Aug 29, 2019 18:54

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

zundfolge posted:

None of the various Jetronic cars I�ve worked on have had any facility for a higher idle when the engine is cold. They deal with cold starts by running a dedicated cold start injector that enriches the mixture until the engine starts to warm up

Huh, that explains a lot 🤦‍♀️

# ¿ Aug 29, 2019 19:46

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

Pursesnatcher posted:

The best news came in the mail, however.

A benefactor from this thread sent me what feels like it may perhaps be the greatest care package in the history of mankind, and I am forever grateful. You can remain anonymous if you want, but as I told you, this made my month. I've just been skimming through it for a little while, but this might just be the most amazing, comprehensive and understandable guide to these fuel systems there is. It covers everything I could think of, and with the added power of Google, I can pretty easily figure out what all the new and exciting things it talks about are. Morale has been running a bit low lately, but this really gave me a new hope. Now, to reading!

That's some great night-time reading material right there!

meltie fucked around with this message at 12:10 on Aug 31, 2019

# ¿ Aug 31, 2019 12:06

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

IOwnCalculus posted:

You've got a set of line wrenches, right? They'll be your only hope at dismantling that without destroying that pipe.

Even then, I don't like the odds.

Yeah, good job in securing it (wtf!!), but I wouldn't crack into it speculatively unless you're sure you need to.

# ¿ Apr 24, 2020 15:59

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

Pursesnatcher posted:

I have no idea why. It's probably in part due to our currency plummeting (yaaay overly oil-dependent economy), but even that can't explain the massive jump. Everyone I've asked for a quote got that worried, confused look on their faces when their systems came up with a figure, and they're as in the dark as me. And it's, like, just that one part, too. Rebuilt or refurbished ones start at $2-300, but since the symptoms of it being bad have died down a little, I'll cross my fingers and wait a little while longer; I'm very excited to see what new plug wires and fuel bits might result in.

Have you tried Bosch Classic directly? http://www.bosch-classic.com/en/internet/bosch_classic/produkte/produkte.html

# ¿ Apr 24, 2020 20:44

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

Have you had the IACV off and tested it to know if it's dead or not? There'll be a procedure in the book; it'll be something like "apply 12V to the pins and try and blow through it".

Pursesnatcher posted:

Quick update; tubes have arrived, so time to get that IACV sorted.

If you need to replace it: US $89.90 apparently new, and guaranteed by the seller for a year...
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1986-1991-MERCEDES-BENZ-IDLE-AIR-CONTROL-VALVE-000-141-16-25-/233487409406

meltie fucked around with this message at 14:40 on Apr 25, 2020

# ¿ Apr 25, 2020 14:37

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# ¿ Apr 27, 2024 13:30

meltie: Nov 9, 2003; Not a sodding fridge.

Pursesnatcher posted:

Wait, what's that sound? Oh poo poo it's the misfire police! Well that's okay, they've got nothing on me anymore, and I honestly had no idea this engine was supposed to run this smoothly. It's like an entirely different car. Not just because of the wires, or the IACV, or the temp sensor, or whatever, but it's way improved from just a week or two ago. It feels insanely satisfying to finally find and eliminate actual problems, and to feel the results.

There you go! Bravo!!

# ¿ May 23, 2020 01:47

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Automotive Insanity > Restoring a star to its former glory (I have no idea what I'm doing)