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Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007



Holy crap, that motocross bike sounds like a drat pod racer!

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Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


ilkhan posted:

What is "c" as it relates to charging rates?

Coulomb? The amount of charge delivered by one amp in one second.

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


Powershift posted:

Not to drag this thread down the shitter again, but Musk promises what he thinks will be possible to be delivered on the date at which he thinks it will be, and repeatedly gets it wrong. This puts other manufacturers at a serious disadvantage because they're not competing against what Tesla is producing, they're competing against what Tesla has promised.

The bolt is has been in production for nearly 2 years now, and we still have yet to see a $35k Model 3.

I don't see how the volume of the car could support 180% of the Model S's battery volume, or of a tire that could support a 5000lb+ car up to 250mph. Still, every other electric sports car will be in the shadow of the Roadster 2 until it shows up, if it shows up. They won't be able to exist as they are capable of existing because they'll be compared to what can't yet exist.

I don't think the Porsche 918 is in the shadow of anything.
Or the SLS AMG electric for that matter, except for the above.

Finger Prince fucked around with this message at 17:25 on Aug 20, 2018

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


Point is nobody makes an electric sports car, other than exotic hypercars. Nobody is planning to either, to my knowledge, other than Tesla. So the ones that exist now are not going to be judged against a hypothetical future Tesla sports car, and if anyone else has a one in the pipes, people can bench race them against the Roadster 2 all they like because neither exist.

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


GoGoGadgetChris posted:

And yet CUVs are the hottest car on the market :negative:

People always want the Thing In The Middle even though it sucks at everything.

I remember back when politics was centrist and boring and cars were radical and polarizing! :arghfist::corsair:

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


Ola posted:

You'd have to stop for grass anyway.

:vince:

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


Too good not to share.


(shamelessly stolen from a friend on Facebook)

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


Gamesguy posted:

How much does that actually translate into usable interior space though? The e-Tron has 57 cubic feet of cargo vs 52 for the Jag, and I doubt it has significantly more leg/head room. The i-pace definitely seems like a better designed car with the caveat that you have to deal with the godawful incontrol system and a company notorious for electrical issues.

Uhh... You have heard of Volkswagen, right?

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


spandexcajun posted:

^^^ Got a ride in a co workers new performance Model 3 and holy poo poo is it fast! But I'm still more then happy with my long range RWD, it's more them fast enough for any remotely legal driving :)

I finally got my T-Sportline 18" turbine wheels. Was supposed to get them early July but they were delayed multiple times.



I'm not going to put them on until spring now, since I will bet getting snow tires in a few weeks. They do look great I hope the matte black stays looking good.

I'm going with Nokian Hakkapeliitta R2 since the internet says they are the best and I have not had proper snow tires in 15 years due to having AWD or 4WD vehicles.

Any other Tesla or ICE RWD winter car drivers have better suggestions?

Has anyone heard of a ski / snowboard roof rack yet for the Model 3? I think Elon tweeted that one would be out before winter but LOL Elon time.

Honestly you can't go wrong with Blizzaks. I had their performance snow ones on my Mx5 ages ago and they were excellent. I think the current designation is WS-80?
I've got X-ices for my Prius and they're good but the "performance" aspect on them has never been tested.

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


wolrah posted:

Reminder that the majority of benefits of winter tires don't care what wheels are driven.

All cars use all four wheels for stopping and maintaining directional control. Driven wheels are only relevant to acceleration, which is rarely the actual issue when it comes to winter driving.

Spoken like someone who's never been caught out by a sudden snow storm with their summer tires on in a light weight RWD convertible, or driven their friend's 4WD Xterra through the mountains and into Calgary during a huge snowstorm, equipped with snow tires, but boneheadedly forgot to put it into 4WD.
Acceleration becomes VERY relevant.

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


big crush on Chad OMG posted:

4:20 or 16:20 is not written 20/4 anywhere. Do you think 420 is a reference to a date rather than a time of day??

Can't it be both? I mean, April 20th is known as the weed day where people have smoke outs in parks and stuff in places where its not or quasi-legal, and I'm pretty sure if you smoke weed at 4:20 on 4/20 you get like extra double high.

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


Sagebrush posted:

There is no good logical friendly reason that Tesla doesn't sell parts. They do it because (1) they are assholes who think they still own the car after you've bought it, and don't want anyone but Tesla people poking around inside, and (2) they literally can't build replacement parts fast enough to supply anyone but official repair centers.

(1) is indicated by how Tesla blacklists cars when you plug into the debugging port, how they refuse to provide service manuals in any state except MA (where they are required to by law, and still they only rent them out by the hour), how they force software updates or downgrades at their whim, etc.

(2) is indicated by the extremely long waits that people have reported at service centers and the multiple times they've had to send their car in to have the same part replaced again and again.

They certainly aren't required to sell parts to anyone who asks, but it's just hostile not to. It's not like anyone is going to discover any trade secrets that they couldn't by just buying a junkyard Model S and cutting it up.

Also it is federal law that an auto manufacturer must make replacement parts available for at least the length of the vehicle's warranty period. I don't know what Tesla's warranties are like but if they're really changing their designs as rapidly as it sounds, staying in compliance with that law is going to be a logistics hell.

Your point 1 is certainly valid, but point 2 is really just (unfortunately) modern logistics and supply chain management. Spare parts on a shelf is dead money that counts against you for your various tax fiddles. For a lot of stuff I don't doubt that even Tesla can't order any more spares from their suppliers to sell on to you, because their suppliers are producing exactly the amount required for production and no more, because they don't want to warehouse parts either. GM likely doesn't have as big a problem with this, because the amount of OEM spares being ordered at GM dealers is a rounding error compared to production and they have... let's call it a "legacy" business model.

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


underage at the vape shop posted:

You are in a subforum about working on your own cars calling it a legacy model. Being able to repair your own car is incredibly good for you. Most things that go wrong on cars should not require you to wait for papa musks blessings. Selling spares is ludicrously profitable for car companies. You don't have any idea what you are talking about, whats it like being in a cult of personality

:allears:

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


Subjunctive posted:

In California your landlord has to let you install a charger at your own cost. I wonder if that will spread to more states.

I don't know how this is supposed to work in high rise condos with underground parking garages. The landlord has to let you, but does the building management have to let you? I imagine billing would be a challenge. And then there's finding an electrician qualified to do the work in a large commercial type building who will take on such a small project. These aren't insurmountable, but depending on the building and local code for buildings like that, it could be enough of a ball ache that it just isn't worth it.

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


stevewm posted:

I absolutely HATE this on my old car... A 2011 Ford Fusion. The throttle response is such that it is nearly impossible to take off from any stop without giving everyone in the car whiplash. 1cm of pedal travel goes seemingly from 0% to 70% throttle.

My Prius is the opposite to this. The first looong portion of pedal travel is "easy does it, wouldn't want to hurt the planet", and the last 20% is "oh, you're in a hurry, ok I'll scoot".

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


Platystemon posted:

The pedal actually goes there?

Are you sure you’re driving a Prius?

I know, and yet. It's relative. Relative to a decade old Prius. What you have to do is push past what would be flooring it in any other car, push past that, and keep on pushing the pedal until you awaken the beast. The tiny, harmless beast. It's like switching from turtle to rabbit on your lawnmower (there is no double rabbit).

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


Duck and Cover posted:

Yes they can that doesn't mean they should. Like yeah you can go on a long road trip in an electric car but it'll require planning and you very well might end up stuck at a charger with nothing much to do for an hour. Pretty sure refilling a gas car takes less then an hour.

Do people go on long road trips without planning though? Like even in a ICE car, you've got to plan your gas stops, lunch break, toilet breaks, dinner breaks, etc.

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


Sagebrush posted:

Unless you're driving through Kazakhstan or something, you really don't. My car's low-fuel light comes on with about 40 miles of fuel remaining, and practically everywhere in the United States that you can reach by road is within 40 miles of a gas station.

and lol @ the idea that you have to plan out your pee stops. i'm not sure it is possible to live a less spontaneous life than that

I guess the only long trips I've ever done (other than Seattle-San Fran in a Prius so yeah I didn't even need to plan gas stops) were on my bike, and yeah, you need to be mindful of your range and plan your stops.
Pee stops, sure I'll just pull over and go by a tree. But some people have different bits and squatting by the side of the road is kind of emergency only.
I'm not talking about planning like an ascent on an unscaled mountan, just "probably stop here for lunch unless I've got the range and make good time I which case I'll push on to here", and "the weather really went for poo poo so I'm gonna stop and wait it out at the next rest stop and see if there's a better route around it".

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


http://www.speedhunters.com/2018/10...dvVwwaIksh9F09E

Finger Prince fucked around with this message at 19:58 on Nov 1, 2018

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:

jesus christ that's a lot of money

It's starting f150 crew cab king ranch money. Starts making sense to a commercial operator who's going to factor in fuel costs to the budget.

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


BlackMK4 posted:

Great, now you can hear the tires breaking loose before you go backwards into a tree instead of awesome flat 6 noise

I'm one of those weirdos who think Porsche engines sound like poo poo Turbos excepted, so to me tie fighter sounds would be a big improvement.

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


CAT INTERCEPTOR posted:

You have hearing issues. See the appropriate medical professional

They just sound like mechanical noise amplified by a hollow metal can. I get that that is exactly what an engine should sound like to some folks, but there's no music to it, no tone or drama, it's just noise. Like if I asked a Porsche engine engineer if they gave any consideration to the quality of the engine sound, I imagine they'd look at me like a golden retriever who I'd just asked to solve for x. It is a machine, why should it sound like anything but the noise that machine makes?
Sorry but it's just not for me.

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:

what kind of engine noise do you like

Most V12s, LFA V10, Lamborghini V10, AMG V8s, Aston V8s, Corvette V8s (especially/specifically in C7R variety). That's not an exhaustive list nor does it include bikes.

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


Ola posted:

This is most engines. Car culture would have you believe there is some fine audio going on, but there really isn't. It's just dumb noise associated with a desirable car. Like wine snobs can get owned in a blind tasting, car guys could listen to a Fiat Panda with open headers and think it was a Ferrari.

Disagree. Some of the hollow metal cans are carefully tuned to selectively minimize the (subjectively) bad noises and amplify the (subjectively) good ones. Others aren't because what has sound got to do with going fast. Still others just think loud = good and put no more thought into it other than that.

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


I saw a new Nissan Leaf on the road today. I was pretty surprised! It looked like a normal hatchback, even a decent looking hatchback! Not fish-like at all!

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


BlackMK4 posted:

On the other side of the coin is the Honda Clarity. I saw one of the first time last night and the rear quarter view of it looks straight up weird.

I saw one of those in California for the first time when I was there the other week. At first I thought it was the fuel cell vehicle because I didn't realize they made a PHEV. I thought, hey here's some competition for the Volt, I wonder why nobody talks about them? I thought that weird rear end was done to give it a useful Prius style hatch...



loving noooooooope! It's got a smaller boot hole than a Volvo C30 ffs!

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


big crush on Chad OMG posted:

I see that old iPod connector in hotel clock radios all the time ITYOOL 2018

At least that one was still current as of 6 years ago. That's not ancient history in the context of hotel decor renovations.

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007



Just watched the Vimeo vid, yeah the dynamic shots are 100% CGI. The bits where the humans are interacting with portions of it look like physical mock ups, but none of the on or off road footage is a real car.

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


spandexcajun posted:

https://jalopnik.com/a-jaguar-i-pace-ev-had-a-thermal-incident-while-parke-1830995550

Jag had it's first "thermal incident" with the I Pace. Does not look good, seems to just have burst into flames but no real details yet.

I do worry about these sorts of things now that one is parked in my garage, directly under my bedroom! But I also know it's extremely unlikely. Tesla has many 100k of battery packs and very few of them have had issues. Hope this I Pace indecent is a one off and not some sort of larger issue with the overall battery pack.

I have not heard of any Model 3 fires yet. S and X for sure. Anyone know of any Model 3 fires? Even if they are like after an accident or something.

I had a 1986 Toyota corolla that spontaneously combusted in my parking garage. Lucky the fire department got there before it set off the sprinkler system and ruined everyone's day, but it was pretty immolated. Have you heard the one about "is Ferrari on fire?" I'm guessing you never worried about the 55 liters of gasoline one unlucky spark away from burning your house down under your bedroom before?

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


Wibla posted:

This is a management problem.

Also re low/high power outlets: Type 1 charging with normal outlets isn't recommended for permanent charging use, at least not here in europe...

Type 2 with load balancing means that you have the opportunity to charge up quickly if the power is available, but everyone gets their fair share regardless of how many users you have, even on limited power.

The problem with management problems is you can't fix them unless you're their management.

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


Ola posted:

This is why EV spots should be planned far away from the most popular spots, even if that might mean longer cable runs. EV owners don't mind the walk at all, if they know they can charge and that the spots aren't ICEd.

Yeah but the boss only put the EV charge point requisition into the budget request so he could use it for his Tesla. You think he wants to park anywhere but right in front of the entrance?

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


spandexcajun posted:

Oh my, slower then a 10 year old Corolla, what the heck?

It's a pretty normal number for your typical euro commuter car. The irony of the North American attitude of always needing the bigger engine and more acceleration is people here still have no clue how to accelerate to highway speed before merging.

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


spandexcajun posted:

Sure, I mean we could talk about fuel price and it's effect on the market for performance cars in the US vs EU, but I was more confused by a battery pack that is significantly larger then the model 3, less range, (apparently) really bad performance numbers (compared to other EVs with similar specs) and artificially low price. Something does not add up.

But, hey, it's just early leaks so fingers crossed that VW gets this right!

It sounds like it could add up. Larger but cheaper battery pack that's limited on how much power you can draw from it, so less performance, less range, cheaper car overall.

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


spandexcajun posted:

A old (2014) model S fire was apparently caused by a bullet fired into the battery, from inside the car!

“Tesla has determined that the cause of the thermal event that occurred in the Vehicle’s battery was a bullet fired into the battery from inside the Vehicle’s passenger cabin.”

https://electrek.co/2018/12/16/tesla-fire-bullet-battery/

IDK why this amuses me, reminds me of the stories of guys with concealed carry permits shooting their dicks off.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/06/26/accidental-penis-gun_n_5511748.html

PSA, don't discharge guns inside your EVs, especially aimed at the battery pack.

Lol, the old bullet fuse trick!

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


Sagebrush posted:

Lol, I didn't know that Ford had done that. That's also pretty dumb.

However, again, you're splitting hairs about what the machines actually do versus what people think they do. People hear "co-pilot" and think "right, like he sits beside the pilot and they work together" but they hear "autopilot" and think "ah, the machine that flies the plane by itself." Co-pilot is psychologically less misleading than autopilot.

I blame Airplane!.

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


Powershift posted:

We should be 2 weeks of the f-150 hybrid debut, within a year of it hitting the road. spy shots suggest there's a plug in the front fender which makes sense because it should be the same hybrid system as the PHEV Aviator. Gm has also said more vehicles will get the "volt treatment"

The regular models are more efficient now than the silverado hybrids were when they were around, so the hybrid f-150 is going to have to be pretty drat good to catch peoples attention.



That Silverado wasn't really a hybrid in the conventional sense though. IIRC it was just a bigger, beefier starter motor and lead acid battery that let it pull away on the starter. Essentially just stop-start.

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


Powershift posted:

Volvo says they'll have a "Polestar 2" out this year with 400hp and a 300 mile range, looking like the 40.2 concept. https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a25737679/polestar-2-volvo-confirmed-2020/



And Infiniti just released the QX EV concept. https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a25742810/infiniti-qx-inspiration-electric-crossover/




So i guess this is the future then. All cars are roughly I-pace shaped with little styling bits to differentiate them.

Do any photos of even a hollow car show mock-up exist of these things, or is it just slightly/significantly worse than GT6 photo mode quality renders?

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


Sagebrush posted:

My sister related to me how a few weeks ago she saw a Tesla try to jump the light at an intersection and turn left before she (heading straight) could go through, and the road was snowy and slushy, and it ended up fishtailing onto the sidewalk and landed in a bush.

I thought they had better traction control than that? Surely the combination of electric motors and ABS gives you near-instant control over wheelspin.

Long, heavy, high torque RWD vehicle accelerating while turning on a slippery surface... Ye cannae break the laws of physics

Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


Sagebrush posted:

I do not own a Tesla, but all of the problems I mentioned are specific to the Model 3 (well I guess all of them have the weird door handles) and I only know about them from Twitter. There are dozens of videos of the trunk pouring water into the car, and the window firmware "fix" that keeps them dropped down permanently when it's cold is documented. The range decay was one specific person noticing how much range they'd lost in their car over their commute on a particularly cold day last week; this is the first winter that we've had any significant number of Models 3 on the road so it remains to be seen if that's a real issue or just one guy. It is known that the 3 has inferior battery temperature management to the S or X, though.

All that is super nit-picky stuff though that always seems to me like it comes from people who've never really been around different kinds of cars. Frameless windows sticking/icing to the door seal and breaking has been a problem with frameless windows since always. Loads of cars will dump water into the trunk when you open it. New cars at that. Even ones with diverter channels and drains. Range reduction in winter is a problem for all cars. My Prius gets less range in the winter. Snow tires, snow drag, all that will do that, you just don't think about it when you're standing outside in a blizzard filling the tank up one day earlier than you had to in the summer, you're too focussed on not getting frostbite holding the pump handle.

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Finger Prince
Jan 5, 2007


Godholio posted:

:lol: Those windshields are gonna be $$$

I had them on my 2010 Forester. Standard cold weather package stuff, doubtless pretty expensive to replace, never had to.

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