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Mystic Stylez posted:I've been playing it for 4 hours and I'm enjoying it a lot, even if it's clear that the game needs more work and better feedback/documentation on what your actions do or how some things work. If they commit to improving it I can see it eventually getting there, but who knows. They also said they will be implementing mod support after the patches, so there's that. I think it helps you track them down and find their hideout, but I’m not 100% sure.
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Aug 16, 2018 04:02
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Later on after building appropriate facilities you will be able to hunt them apparently. Early on it's useless. I'm not actually sure what having agents do analytics is for? Reading the manual it might automate the analytics board so you don't manually draw string lines? hosed up if true. poo poo from the manual I'm finding useful. I've added tiny bits to it. Targets will dodge as long as they have the Awareness to do so, but they cannot dodge attacks from adjacent tiles. Dodged attacks do minimum damage. Cover No Cover: Full damage Half Cover: Damage reduced by 50% Full cover: Damage reduced by 75% *Damage can be further reduced by equipped armour. (Not sure how armour reduction works. Might just be straight up reduced by that amount. If so wearing armour would reduce a SHITLOAD of the chip damage. Needs checking.) Breach is a safe way to enter a room with potential or known enemies; not only will you take out the enemies in the room, you also retain your Action Points (but not your fire point). Suppressed breaches will not alert enemies unless they see you/the bodies. Enemy Agents will raise the alarm if they see your Agents regardless if your Agent is inside or outside a Restricted Area. Agents wearing a Disguise can walk in front of opponents or cameras in Restricted Areas without raising an alarm. Enemy Agents see through your disguises. Get the Actor perk to walk past enemy Agents. You can even distract enemy Agents with Actor. Keep a few grand in the bank for emergencies. Take your time on the strategic map. Most story missions are not time sensitive, it seems to warn you when they are, or you're competing with a progress bar (you can reduce progress by stopping enemy Conspiracy Ops). The manual literally says blazing through the story will makes thing difficult for you. Take some chill time to train, gather money, resources. Story progress unlocks new features, enemies also become increasingly difficult. Prioritise forgery upgrades. More money per hour is amazing. Informants give up secrets. Can be info on enemies, reveal your guys perks, can unlock manufacturing blueprints or allow you to buy items/supports/hire new agents. Your Agents accrue Heat if their evacuation is compromised or if they’re seen on Infiltration missions. Heat decreases over time unless it reaches its max: at max their ID is exposed, which means you’ll need to go back to the home base for a new ID. Agents with maxed Heat will take longer to travel across the world map, and may be ambushed when idle outside the home base. Apparently agents in groups complete missions faster. Gonna try a 4 man recon job and see if it's still 10 hours. If you don’t stop an Enemy Operation marked by a red skull (called Conspiracy Plots), you earn a +1 to the Doomsday Counter. There is a conspiracy out there which moves closer to their goal with each operation completed. When the Doomsday Counter is complete, you lose the game—game over.
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Aug 16, 2018 04:49
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Cool. Something I don’t see in the manual and still don’t quite understand is that Damage Threshold—it seems to be a sort of damage reduction, which makes sense, and it goes up with armor, but I don’t know if there’s anything more than that to it.
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Aug 16, 2018 04:58
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Pirate Radar posted:I think it helps you track them down and find their hideout, but I’m not 100% sure. Once you get the 'seek' upgrade, you can learn where enemy agents are and keep tabs on them. This ends up being useful because rather than wait for a suspicious activity thing to pop up, you can see them start their actions in real time. this gives you a lot of time to prepare, and can even allow you to take other types of operations that can reveal enemy cells and the like.
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Aug 16, 2018 05:03
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Getting my butt kicked early on. Maybe I should try the Easy mode first to see if there's a difference. LOS feels definitely different from X-coms, which was my mistake. Old habits die hard. The agent customisation is nice. Could try a Mission Impossible-themed squad or something. If you could mod in agent photos later, that would be perfect. Ethan Hunt, James Bond, Jason Bourne and others need to join my team as soon as possible. Overall, the game feels like it could become something of a classic like Covert Action. A few bug fixes here and there would be good, but so far I haven't seen many problems.
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Aug 16, 2018 05:49
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SlightlyMad posted:The agent customisation is nice. Could try a Mission Impossible-themed squad or something. If you could mod in agent photos later, that would be perfect. Ethan Hunt, James Bond, Jason Bourne and others need to join my team as soon as possible. Don't forget Ocelot.
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Aug 16, 2018 06:21
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Early game you can also just not fight the optional battles at all—you’ll miss out on some loot but you can totally soak a bit of Danger on the strategic level in the beginning.
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Aug 16, 2018 06:26
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The developers are working on the LOS issues. Should see an improvement soon. You can apparently change the difficulty setting within the campaign, no need to start over.
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Aug 16, 2018 06:34
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Tactical action on missions is vital - it gives one of your agents a disguise, so you can turn off the cameras and loot the place before trying to kill the Agent your after.
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Aug 16, 2018 09:32
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I'm having a ball so far. I'm 4 hours in and haven't encountered any bugs at all. Edit: Does anyone know if you can execute a takedown after combat has been initiated? I.E. can you shoot an enemy who has too many hit points to use takedown on, in order to soften them up and then use takedown? Or can takedown only be used on unsuspecting characters? Freudian slippers fucked around with this message at 12:22 on Aug 16, 2018 |
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Aug 16, 2018 11:27
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Phew. Managed to pull off a mission impossible. Feels good. Savescumming was necessary, can not imagine trying the ironman mode. Playing on medium difficulty. I can see where the criticisms for the game come from, but I like this. Once it begins to click it can be addictive. Saving often helps. Infiltration is the main phase, not just a prelude to a gunfight like in X-com 2. The similarities in the user interface can make one approach the game a bit wrong. If I have to shoot my way out I have hosed up already and maybe reloading a save is in order. The combat can be absolutely brutal. That said, extracting my agents in a hail of bullets was tense. Medkits and grenades are awesome to have and the blinding laser ability saved my skin. You really have to use the agent's skills to the fullest and keep an eye on the awareness stats. If the devs tweak the combat mechanics just a little, this game can improve a whole bunch. The potential is already there. Hoping for more updates in the next few days. They are listening to player feedback, so that's good. If someone is on the fence about buying the game, it will be on launch discount for a few more days. No haste. For me, the game is worth it, but your mileage may vary.
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Aug 16, 2018 11:38
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Freudian slippers posted:I'm having a ball so far. I'm 4 hours in and haven't encountered any bugs at all. Yes you can.
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Aug 16, 2018 12:39
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Caros posted:Yes you can. Sweet, thanks! Codename Bagpipe's going down when I get home from work 
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Aug 16, 2018 13:08
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Definitely going to buy this at some point. For now I just want to read this thread and see if they release any patches in near future. Btw anyone playing on ps4? Hows the performance
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Aug 16, 2018 13:38
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Assuming that step out works like it does in xcom where you measure from the square next to corners, there's just no way the line of site issues are just that. https://imgur.com/a/Kx6WA2k Both of these characters were able to be shot from the dude at the top of the screen outside and a level down and very much without a sight line. It seems very, very broken.
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Aug 16, 2018 14:00
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dev's posted:We assure that we're working on fixes here. This is our top priority, along with weapon ranges. The design team is preparing a detailed explanation on how the system for calculating LoS/LoF currently works, and how it could be improved. We will be listening to your feedback and we will get it fixed. In the continuing adventures of the world's worst sleeper agent, the sleeper and his team were ambushed while investigating suspicious activity. One the first turn, the sleeper shot the enemy agent we started next to in the head, killing him. Then we ran away from the rest of the ambush. The sleeper decided his moment had come and betrayed us. While sitting still with no cover between a dude holding a sniper rifle and a dude with a pistol. A for effort mate.
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Aug 16, 2018 14:19
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SlightlyMad posted:Getting my butt kicked early on. Maybe I should try the Easy mode first to see if there's a difference. LOS feels definitely different from X-coms, which was my mistake. Old habits die hard. The covert action vibe is what drew me in too. I love that game, and it’s a bummer that they’re apparently not interested in remaking it.
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Aug 16, 2018 16:25
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Ainsley McTree posted:The covert action vibe is what drew me in too. I love that game, and it’s a bummer that they’re apparently not interested in remaking it. This plays very differently from Covert Action, but has the ambience of a spy thriller. The music, the paranoia about double agents and all that feels so right. They seem to be tweaking the details according to player feedback to some extent, so we will see how this develops.
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Aug 16, 2018 17:16
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I'm usually very skeptical of these things but it's looking like they really are being earnest about patching and improving the game, so let's hope.Devs posted:Phantom Doctrine Patch 1.0.2 released! Devs posted:CFG_Hitch Officer 1 hour ago
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Aug 16, 2018 22:03
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Someone asked earlier what determines how many agents you can bring to a tactical mission. It each mission type has a set number of slots. Been getting a load of enemy recon missions, and all of them have ended with a .45 point blank execution.  Actor is stupid OP at the moment.Weapons are tiered, each tier is a straight damage upgrade on the last. Not being proficient in a gun means it costs a fire point to reload, in addition to not being able to mod it. E: headshots cost extra awareness too. So far training is making GBS threads me off. It takes so long and relatively costs a lot for each agent. Urban ops to get proficiency in early pistols, and the one that gives the exertion perk are my go to. Exertion owns. -25ish awareness for 2 extra mobility, doesn't break stealth, 2 turn effect and cooldown. Really lets you get around. Eediot Jedi fucked around with this message at 00:16 on Aug 17, 2018 |
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Aug 16, 2018 23:11
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Knobb Manwich posted:Someone asked earlier what determines how many agents you can bring to a tactical mission. It each mission type has a set number of slots. Is there anywhere that tells you beforehand how many? When interrupting a conspiracy slot the assault option has a 1 agent icon on it so I assume that's the minimum neccessary but it sometimes it'll only allow me two agents and othertimes 4. Also it's weird how it just gathers up agents that are far away for the operation instead of need them at the location.
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Aug 17, 2018 02:26
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amitlu posted:Is there anywhere that tells you beforehand how many? When interrupting a conspiracy slot the assault option has a 1 agent icon on it so I assume that's the minimum neccessary but it sometimes it'll only allow me two agents and othertimes 4. I know, right? It breaks my immersion a little. I wonder if that can be modded out.
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Aug 17, 2018 02:43
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amitlu posted:Is there anywhere that tells you beforehand how many? When interrupting a conspiracy slot the assault option has a 1 agent icon on it so I assume that's the minimum neccessary but it sometimes it'll only allow me two agents and othertimes 4. Near as i can tell they did this because a lot of times you wouldn't have enough opportunity to get agents to the missions in time.
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Aug 17, 2018 04:01
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amitlu posted:Is there anywhere that tells you beforehand how many? When interrupting a conspiracy slot the assault option has a 1 agent icon on it so I assume that's the minimum neccessary but it sometimes it'll only allow me two agents and othertimes 4. Haven't seen it anywhere beforehand. Assaulting an enemy doing recon is 2 agents max, rescuing an informant is 3, assaulting a cell hq is 6. Yeah it is weird. Weirder how everyone that went on the trip ends up back at home base. I have my best infiltrators sitting at home doing forging so they're always available if I need them. Caros posted:Near as i can tell they did this because a lot of times you wouldn't have enough opportunity to get agents to the missions in time. Yeah. Maybe hard mode can do this.  Lead designer talking about the LOS issues. Looks like you don't just step out when against cover, you're stepping out in all cardinal directions all the time, and so is everyone else. They are working on an alternative though.
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Aug 17, 2018 04:26
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Knobb Manwich posted:Haven't seen it anywhere beforehand. Assaulting an enemy doing recon is 2 agents max, rescuing an informant is 3, assaulting a cell hq is 6. Yeah, this is exactly what I thought was going on. Just from playing I've gotten into the habit of realizing that if you don't have full cover on both sides of you, you are risk of being spotted/shot at. Not sure what they could do to fix it, but once you have the rule of thumb it isn't so bad to deal with.
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Aug 17, 2018 04:45
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Side-stepping is not a foreign concept to any XCOM player. Even when you understand how the system work it's still hard not to get shot to hell since the maps often doesn't have that many places with 3 continual walls for you to hide behind. While fighting are mostly in interior it's simply amazing how many windows there are in every single room on every map. Enemy with unlimited vision and firing range only makes this worst as there's no way to account for so many angles when you can get attacked from so many places. Not to mention enemy can just spawn in from all direction and get a flank on you. Cover is really sparse compares to XCOM (actually Hard West had the same problem, there were so many scenarios where there's a whole house of shooters sitting on the other side of the map in full cover firing down on player's squad and there's multiple stretch of opening where you can't get into the next cluster of cover. It was only tolerable in Hard West because the player's squad is comparatively more powerful compares to the agents in this game). I am also not sure why they gave enemy goons awareness
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Aug 17, 2018 05:29
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Not sure if this is a spoiler but Holy balls is body engineering good. Not just for the generally increased stats, but apparently when you get your agent's stats high enough, they begin to gain additional action points. One of my main characters switched from two action points with seven movement, to three with five. Since she also has the +2 movement for two turns ability this ends up being a huge increase in flexibility and movement. I'm now genuinely curious if you'll be able to get additional firing points.
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Aug 17, 2018 10:12
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Caros posted:Not sure if this is a spoiler but Holy balls is body engineering good. Not just for the generally increased stats, but apparently when you get your agent's stats high enough, they begin to gain additional action points. One of my main characters switched from two action points with seven movement, to three with five. Since she also has the +2 movement for two turns ability this ends up being a huge increase in flexibility and movement. I'm now genuinely curious if you'll be able to get additional firing points.  I moused over that upgrade, only saw the movement range decrease to 5, I didn't see the extra action point, I was wondering why anyone would take this loving terrible upgrade.  It looks like 100 motoric is the break point for 3 action points. I couldn't get a second firepoint but I assume I haven't found the right B.E. upgrade for it yet.
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Aug 17, 2018 10:50
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pedro0930 posted:Side-stepping is not a foreign concept to any XCOM player. Even when you understand how the system work it's still hard not to get shot to hell since the maps often doesn't have that many places with 3 continual walls for you to hide behind. While fighting are mostly in interior it's simply amazing how many windows there are in every single room on every map. Enemy with unlimited vision and firing range only makes this worst as there's no way to account for so many angles when you can get attacked from so many places. Not to mention enemy can just spawn in from all direction and get a flank on you. In xcom you step out of corner cover alone. To have it done everywhere at all times for both parties is very loving dumb because you'll just have no loving idea if you can be hit even if the space looks safe.  If you look at my screenshot my characters are two and three squares deep against a wall, specifically trying to avoid fire hiding away from the windows. It looks safe, logically it should be safe, but the characters are stepping back into the centre of the room to get shot. It's not clear or predictable and for a game like this it needs to be both ShineDog fucked around with this message at 11:57 on Aug 17, 2018 |
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Aug 17, 2018 11:49
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Yeah, the cover mechanics need tweaking. Fortunately the devs are working on it. I just had another mission where I got out by the skin of my teeth, carrying unconscious agents on the shoulders of everyone left active. drat this game feels good when you pull off an extraction like that. I can't stop humming the theme to mission impossible. 
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Aug 17, 2018 12:04
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Another thing that feels great is, if your cover gets blown somehow, those first few turns where you go from sneaking sneaking sneaking to suddenly your disguised agent is fighting their way out while your team that was off to the side is now tearing poo poo up as fast as possible
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Aug 17, 2018 12:13
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Only played a little bit, game seems really cool and the setting is refreshing. The devs seem to be interested in fixing stuff, too, so that's a plus. However, I'm playing on a TV, is there any way to increase UI scale a bit? Text can be a little hard to read.
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Aug 17, 2018 16:47
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Hey, fun fact, when rescuing informers, if you incapacitate the hitman/hitmen and then carry them out to the evac that counts as capturing, not killing them. I'm sure you all already knew that but it really helped in getting some secret documents early on. Also I felt pretty smug pulling that off for the first time and wanted to share.
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Aug 17, 2018 18:37
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I keep finding pistol suppressors but no one has the ability to equip them. I think that they need pistol proficiency in which to use them what training is that?
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Aug 17, 2018 18:47
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Twlight posted:I keep finding pistol suppressors but no one has the ability to equip them. I think that they need pistol proficiency in which to use them what training is that? From watching YouTube videos, I want to say it’s urban combat or something.
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Aug 17, 2018 18:54
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Twlight posted:I keep finding pistol suppressors but no one has the ability to equip them. I think that they need pistol proficiency in which to use them what training is that? Depends on the pistol. But the one which gives empath (Urban combat IIRC) does so for an early game pistol IIRC
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Aug 17, 2018 20:40
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I was sad when my new sniper specialist turned out to be a double agent, but also amused when she did it in a middle of 6 man mission after all enemies were already eliminated. She didn't last a turn.
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Aug 17, 2018 21:17
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Jackhammer posted:I was sad when my new sniper specialist turned out to be a double agent, but also amused when she did it in a middle of 6 man mission after all enemies were already eliminated. She didn't last a turn. If I wait until the end of the battle, they'll all be at their weakest--this can't fail
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Aug 17, 2018 21:22
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So what's the verdict on this so far? Shows promise but let it wait for a couple of weeks for the devs to iron out most of the kinks? It looks interesting, but I'm seeing some frustration in this thread.
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Aug 17, 2018 22:18
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I have been enjoying it a lot but it does not communicate a lot of its intricacies and isn't as approachable as XCom. The line of sight/always sidestepping corners issue was really not apparent. Weapons have ranges but some, like assault rifles, pretty much hit you halfway across the map and you don't miss in this game, you just do minimum damage with additional dodging from your "awareness" stat. If you're not aware of your position and enemies, you can get assault rifled to death by early game enemies very quickly. Enemies also go from limited vision in Infiltration to all the way across the map vision in combat which can be jarring. I also feel like there's a lot of confusion due to the UI style looking a lot like XCOM 1 and 2, but that's just a guess. If you try and play this super aggressive like XCOM 2 and initiate combat quickly, you're either dead or going to fail almost all your missions. If you're willing to fight past a sparse tutorial and struggle a bit to get the feel of the game's mechanics, get it now. If you want clearer gameplay and better explained mechanics, and I don't blame you, you may want to wait for a few patches for them to add more meat to the tutorials and clear up the UI.
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Aug 17, 2018 22:46
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