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Kevin DuBrow posted:Sharing a post from the historical facts thread. Those are all over the old quarters of my city in southern Spain, too. Thought they were commonplace everywhere, guess not.
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Aug 24, 2019 17:22
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So I don't know if this fits the thread, but I have this late-XVIII century cheap military handbook that apparently, judging by the handwritten names, was owned by a whole slew of people in succession (probably it was handed down to whoever came after the original propietary retired). One of the owners was apparenly quite bored at watch duty, and he entertained himself by using the latter pages to sketch pics of uniforms on his regiment, complete with rank captions and XIX style moustaches. I am no military nerd so I may be a bit lost when it comes to providing the context, but I thought the doodles were kinda neat. I'll try to snap some photos a bit later. EDIT: there's no "PYF old book defacing" but if anyone is interested in seeing a couple examples of the poo poo people wrote on XVIII-XIX century books, I may have a couple cool things around too. Top of my mind I remember a note from a student to his parents, and some kids writing poo poo in their 1868 textbook. Can do those too if you all want. Shellception has a new favorite as of 15:27 on Jul 21, 2020 |
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Jul 21, 2020 15:23
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Here we go. I'll transcribe the annotations, whenever they can be read (some are indecipherable) Teniente de granaderos del regimiento N. = Grenadier Lieutenant of the N. regiment (N. being a common placehold for a proper noun)  Can't read the first globe at all, but the second guy is saying, somehow botchedly "Soy capellán" = "I am a chaplain" EDIT: as ler latter posts, it may be "Soy armero de RegTo" = "I am the gunsmith of the regiment".  A snazzy guy with a neckerchief, I think he's just dressed elegantly but not uniformed (maybe he's the artist?). Text is mostly gibberish, numbers and scribbles but I can make up a dirty joke on the upper part. It says: "una niña le digo asu madre qe cosa era goder ysu madre respondio aprieta el culo y despues godea" = "a girl asked her mum what was "gently caress" and her mother answered "tighten your rear end and gasp"". The "joke" lies on the phonetic similarity between "joder" and "jadear". Also of note the use of g instead of j, which is common in pre-XIX century Spanish; the j was mostly unused, which is fun, because jo and go are nowadays different sounds.  Soy un Capn. de gran. del regimiento (???)ésimo 2º de línea = I am a grenadiers Captain from the (???)esime regiment 2º Line (the latter part being a way to designate infantry regiments in the 17-19th centuries). Note the "bomb" ensign on the guy's arm.  Directly below the precedent photo: "Lo ha echo el Capn. de los (?) Dn. Carlos Seny: el dia 31 de Julio de 1816. allandose de guardia en la Puerta Principal del Castillo de Sn Fernando de Figueras y lo firmo fecha ut retro. VºBº Muy Bien" (the righthandmost line is not readable) = "It was done by the Captain of the (?) Don Carlos Seny: the 31th of July 1816. Being on watch in the front door of the San Fernando Castle in Figueras. He signs and dates ut retro. Approves, Very Good". VºBº = Visto Bueno, a stock phrase still used in paperwork to signal approbation by a higher authority. EDIT: Righthand line may read "Agas ? pues mejor" = "Do (something unreadable) even better". Also, the end of the text is the latin voice "Ut retro" = "as before/as done in the reverse of the page". The whole thing sounds like the guy drew the caricatures and then someone else "approved" and "signed" them, acting as the authority; the handwritting is slightly different.  Inner cover. "I am of Juan Camin Bonet, day 6 of November of the year 1812".  Guy signed his name, then someone else apparently took his book and wrote this: "Baia enoramala Dn Juan Camin, y lo firmo pa qe sepa quien asido / soy Cogos? van? ? y yo tambien boy con mis ?" = "Go to hell Don Juan Camin, and I sign it so he'll know who did it / I am Cogos van ? and I also go with my (?)" (I can't really make heads or tails of the latter phrase, so I may be way off on the translation. ) "Enoramala" which should actually read "Enhoramala" is a now unused way of wishing someone ill luck, the opposite of "Enhorabuena" = "Congratulations". So the note was left by somebody who apparently had a grudge against the book owner? Shellception has a new favorite as of 11:29 on Jul 22, 2020 |
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Jul 21, 2020 18:32
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Carthag Tuek posted:That owns bones, thanks for posting!! Hey, thaks! Glad you liked it, I thought it was an interesting tidbit of history  . I also think it was another soldier who left that note, but I am unsure about the tone: "enhoramala" is no longer used, so it could be a friendly way of teasing a buddy, or some "hey gently caress you rear end in a top hat I vandalized your book" thing, who knows. I could try to look it up.Carthag Tuek posted:First speech bubble looks to me like "Soy [ache? de Teur] (inserted: do) 7" if that helps Hold on, this may actually be close to it. It is really cramped up, but it could be "Soy armero de RegTo" = "I am the gunsmith of the regiment". Regiments did have master gunsmiths that were in charge of the armouries. He also has a beard, unlike the other soldiers or any other depiction of Spanish XIX century soldiers I have found, and is depicted near another non-military unit, the chaplain. So that may be it!
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Jul 21, 2020 22:28
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A quick one. This was found on an otherwise almost pristine 1781 Spanish Academia grammar for students, so it should date from later XVIII-early XIX century. Sometimes annotations on schoolbooks show that they were handed down even 50-60 years after they were originally published, probably because they were expensive and "hey it won't have changed much anyway would it??". This is a letter from a young student sent abroad to his parents at home. I don't know if it was used to restore the lost paper cover, or maybe someone sent the book home so someone else could use it. Ortography is not really the fort of the writer, so I'll transcribe it as-is, then the correct form, then the translation.  "Recibo - Recibi latuya en compañia de madre yermanos, me escribio tu ermano migel el sabado diciendo que estabay buenos recados atodos y particularmente a los aguelos y tios y tias y a todos los amigos yo tengo gana de beros que tengo ganas de ber a padre y a madre alcabo de 8 8 años que no os ebisto mira si tendre ganas de beros y a Dios manda a tu ermano que te quiere y testima en el Señor - Matias" "Recibo - Recibí la tuya en compañia de madre y hermanos, me escribió tu hermano Miguel el sábado diciendo que estábais bien. Recados a todos, y particularmente a los abuelos y tíos y tías y a todos los amigos. Yo tengo ganas de veros, tengo ganas de ver a padre y a madre al cabo de 8, 8 años que no os he visto. Mira si tendré ganas de veros. A Dios manda tu hermano que te quiere y te estima en el Señor - Matías" "Receipt - Received yours [your letter] in the company of mother and siblings [probably means "the letter you, mother and my siblings wrote to me"]. Your brother Miguel wrote to me on Saturday saying you were all right. Regards to everyone, particularly the grandparents and uncles and aunts and all the friends. I want to see you all, I want to see father and mother [writer uses the formal "padre/madre" = "father/mother" instead of the more familiar "papá/mamá" = "dad/mom"] at the end of the 8, 8 years I haven't seen you. See if I'd want to see you. With God sends your brother that loves and esteems you on the Lord . Matias" Latter phrase seems to be a courtesy form. Given the time, it is not at all improbable that the estranged sibling was sent to receive some kind of religious education. His way of writing seems to imply he wasn't taught how to write that well as a child, so he'd probably not be a nobleman but some peasant kid learning abroad. In Spain, until the Public Instruction Law of 1857, which mandated the creation of public, secularized schools to try and eradicate analphabetism (estimated as a whopping 94% of the population by 1800), religious education was mostly the only way for a poorer kid to study. Richer kids would get private tutoring, usually heavily latin and classical education-based, and were usually able to get into college right away. Most people who couldn't afford that, but wanted to study, opted to join a religious (catholic) order. As monks and priests were expected to be able to read, write, understand Latin and do basic math at the very least, there they'd be schooled, usually for free or in return for their religious service. If they were good enough they'd be also able to go to college. This gave us a really christian (and male!) based intellectual elite way well into the later XIX and early XX century, which in turn would color the traditional Spanish way of thinking. Tangentially related: as women, nuns were not expected to follow through higher education. Noblewomen got schooled privately, and also did not attend college, though there are some accounts of exceptionally educated women through early-modern and modern history. The first woman to officially join a Spanish college did so in 1875, for a career in Medicine,but there are some accounts of hidden women finishing their college studies by making themselves pose as men. One of the most famous cases was Concepción Arenal, a proto-feminist and humans rights advocate that majored in Law in 1845. When she was found out, the teachers considered her so bright that they allowed her to finish her studies - by listening behind an opaque screen, so none of her classmates would be distracted by her presence.
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Jul 22, 2020 12:40
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