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galagazombie
Oct 31, 2011


Fargin Icehole posted:

I had no Idea that the guy that did the Soundtrack for Nioh did most of the JoJo soundtrack for part 3,4 and 5

While I like the soundtrack part of me is kinda bummed the same guy did the last three parts. I really liked how the first three parts all had completely different styles that fit the story but then parts 4 and 5 are just more of part 3.

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Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

Don't Blink


Hitlersaurus Christ posted:

looking forward to watching the first episode of Jojolion in my last moments as I die of old age in my underwater retirement home

That's the ideal, really. You'd hate to be around when the show catches up with the manga.

Last Celebration
Mar 30, 2010


Man, Shigecchi. He had obnoxious moments, but he was still a good boy. Kinda surprised he went out fighting and not just immediately ratting our all the stand users when his parents were threatened. Araki really had to have him die right outside of the door though, didn’t he.

Kira is pretty terrifying in his small-time monster quality; like, Dio was a horrible monster but he at least was larger than life, all Yoshikage Kira wants is a quiet routine life that just happens to involve periodic murder for his fetish. I admire the fact that he’s just a loving savant at serial killing though, this dude just makes the worst life choices in regards to keeping his hobby under wraps.


Also, I’m otherwise liking the dub a lot, but Deadly Queen really doesn’t hit the same.

Blueberry Pancakes
Aug 18, 2012

Jack in!! MegaMan, Execute!


Shigechi: Is that a severed hand?!
Kira: No, it's a movie prop. I work in the film industry and I was showing it to a friend of mine who works at this school to get his opinion on it before we use it in an upcoming film.
Shigechi: Oh, okay.


All of Kira's troubles could be solved if he was just a better on the spot liar. But years of not being caught made him overconfident.

Johnny Joestar
Oct 21, 2010

Don't shoot him?

...
...





kira is more realistic than dio, which is what makes him actually more terrifying

multijoe
Oct 15, 2007

how do i say this ... the first time i saw that ultimate life form ... i had a boner

Fun Shoe

Halfway through rewatching Battle Tendancy and it really doesn't hold up as well as I remember. Joseph is still a blast and pretty much carries the arc on his ridiculously hench shoulders, but fights still aren't quite there yet with the genuinely clever reversals and applications of powers of the later parts and largely coast of Hamon doing whatever it needs to in the current scene (Santana was a highlight though) and some of the continuity between scenes is genuinely kinda stupid, like Joseph's fatal wrist wound from Waamu disppearing without comment and Joseph pretty much walking off from Loggin's murder without raising the alarm and going straight into a comedy scene where he perves on his mum. Also the reason the Red Stone of Aja isn't destroyed is because it's apparently fated to be needed to defeat the Pillar Men but nope, it only solves a problem it created, they could have just crushed it at any time lol

Blueberry Pancakes
Aug 18, 2012

Jack in!! MegaMan, Execute!


To be fair, if they destroyed the Red Stone, then the Pillar Men could just go into hiding once they confirmed that Joseph and Co. don't have it. Remember that there are multiple points where Kars doesn't just have his zombie army murder them on the spot because they proved they own the actual Red Stone and not a fake.

Darko
Dec 23, 2004



multijoe posted:

Halfway through rewatching Battle Tendancy and it really doesn't hold up as well as I remember. Joseph is still a blast and pretty much carries the arc on his ridiculously hench shoulders, but fights still aren't quite there yet with the genuinely clever reversals and applications of powers of the later parts and largely coast of Hamon doing whatever it needs to in the current scene (Santana was a highlight though) and some of the continuity between scenes is genuinely kinda stupid, like Joseph's fatal wrist wound from Waamu disppearing without comment and Joseph pretty much walking off from Loggin's murder without raising the alarm and going straight into a comedy scene where he perves on his mum. Also the reason the Red Stone of Aja isn't destroyed is because it's apparently fated to be needed to defeat the Pillar Men but nope, it only solves a problem it created, they could have just crushed it at any time lol

Ehhh, the fights in 2 are waaayyy better than most of 3 with far more "WELL ACTUALLY" on both sides of the battle, he had just reached the limits of Hamon creativity.

galagazombie
Oct 31, 2011


I think it takes till they reach Egypt before part 3 really gets back in the groove of making the fights be mostly about unorthodox tactics and mindgames that makes JoJo JoJo. There was still a fair deal of that during the World Tour part but it usually only happened at the end of the fight instead of the whole way thru.

Blueberry Pancakes
Aug 18, 2012

Jack in!! MegaMan, Execute!


Hanged Man and Lovers stood out as fun encounters, but it really doesn't get great until Egypt.

comedyblissoption
Mar 15, 2006

Is a saint not entitled to the skin of his foot?






multijoe posted:

Also the reason the Red Stone of Aja isn't destroyed is because it's apparently fated to be needed to defeat the Pillar Men but nope, it only solves a problem it created, they could have just crushed it at any time lol
these are the best type of prophecies though

multijoe
Oct 15, 2007

how do i say this ... the first time i saw that ultimate life form ... i had a boner

Fun Shoe

Darko posted:

Ehhh, the fights in 2 are waaayyy better than most of 3 with far more "WELL ACTUALLY" on both sides of the battle, he had just reached the limits of Hamon creativity.

The journey to the west bit kind of sucked, but most of the Egypt fights are DiU quality. Alot of part 2 really does just feel like Araki saying 'Hamon works this way now' and the best fights tend to be where something else entirely is happening, like Santana & Waamu. The brisk pacing does rule though, really does make you pine for a time where the protagonists could go to a place without getting into a minimum of three lengthy fights along the way.

comedyblissoption posted:

these are the best type of prophecies though

Fair, I'm just not sure if Araki forgot, didn't realise or was in on the joke

Johnny Joestar
Oct 21, 2010

Don't shoot him?

...
...





the latter bit of part 3 is basically as long as the entirety of part 2 as it is and i'd consider the former to be the actually generally good poo poo in 3, so overall it ends up banking way more in the positive from me than 2 ever does

because even if at times it turns into Jotaro Solves The Problem, there's still fights and scenarios where someone who isn't jotaro does something

Nessus
Dec 22, 2003

I still can't believe they cast Spock as me. Spock! Can you imagine?

Of course, he was missing a few things.



multijoe posted:

The journey to the west bit kind of sucked, but most of the Egypt fights are DiU quality. Alot of part 2 really does just feel like Araki saying 'Hamon works this way now' and the best fights tend to be where something else entirely is happening, like Santana & Waamu. The brisk pacing does rule though, really does make you pine for a time where the protagonists could go to a place without getting into a minimum of three lengthy fights along the way.
I think the brisk pace both stands out in the modern landscape where One Piece has ten million anime episodes, and also means that you don't get tired of Joseph or start to see the gaps in the scenery.

Blueberry Pancakes
Aug 18, 2012

Jack in!! MegaMan, Execute!


multijoe posted:

The brisk pacing does rule though, really does make you pine for a time where the protagonists could go to a place without getting into a minimum of three lengthy fights along the way.

Yeah, this is one thing I'd say Parts 1 and 2 have over later bits.

Son of Thunderbeast
Sep 21, 2002

Hey, Adora.



Grimey Drawer

Yeah the brisk pace of part 2 is one of the things I like about it, and part of why I enjoy it so much.

I'd love to see Araki take another crack at telling a Young Joseph type story but I think that ship has sailed, plus I think he basically did that retelling of a duo dynamic with part 7 already (plus a long-overdue dunking Stroheim in the garbage) so oh well.

e: just saw this in the meme thread and lmao

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKje1hgWd-E

Son of Thunderbeast fucked around with this message at 21:48 on May 4, 2020

Pootybutt
Apr 5, 2011



I quite like a lot of pt3's pre-Egypt stuff still, and I miss that loose, "just loving around w tone to see what works" feel to it. Death 13, Lovers, Polly unintentionally trolling Enya while she's tryin got kill him, that incredibly extra sequence of Joseph almost dying via fence, The Lovers, The Sun, "I can see your underwear." HELL 2 U?! Lots of great moments.

FirstAidKite
Nov 8, 2009

Ask me about the influence of African instruments on the formation of American musical styles.


A lot of part 3 stuff pre-egypt can be summed up as Donovan/Straights style fights but that's okay imo. There is usually at least one point in each fight that is memorable and I feel like the pre-egypt stuff also works super well if you're familiar with horror flicks since each stand fight is basically Araki's take on a particular horror film or franchise that he likes, be it Alien, Night of the Living Dead, Child's Play, Duel 1971 Vroom Vroom (+ christine), Nightmare on Elm Street, The Blob, etc etc etc

Silver2195
Apr 4, 2012


FirstAidKite posted:

A lot of part 3 stuff pre-egypt can be summed up as Donovan/Straights style fights but that's okay imo. There is usually at least one point in each fight that is memorable and I feel like the pre-egypt stuff also works super well if you're familiar with horror flicks since each stand fight is basically Araki's take on a particular horror film or franchise that he likes, be it Alien, Night of the Living Dead, Child's Play, Duel 1971 Vroom Vroom (+ christine), Nightmare on Elm Street, The Blob, etc etc etc

Araki never really stops doing this, sometimes to the point of plagiarism (the backstory of a certain character in Part 6 comes to mind). My favorite example of Araki taking inspiration from random movies is Silver Chariot Requiem, which is primarily based not on Freaky Friday, as one might assume, but on Amadeus. (OK, it's based on the legends about Mozart's life that inspired Amadeus, but it's plausible that the movie played a part in Araki encountering them.) As you note, almost all fights against enemy Stands in Part 3 pre-Egypt appear to have a horror-movie (or something similar) inspiration; it's fun to list them all:

  • As the wiki points out, Tower of Gray's tongue resembles the tongue of a Xenomorph from Alien.
  • Dark Blue Moon could be inspired by the Creature from the Black Lagoon and/or Jaws, I guess.
  • Strength is very specifically the 1980 movie Death Ship.
  • Ebony Devil is Child's Play.
  • The Jojoveller artbook acknowledges that Yellow Temperance was inspired by The Blob.
  • Hanged Man is apparently based on an Amazing Stories episode called "Mirror, Mirror." It's been noted that J. Geil himself resembles Pluto from The Hills Have Eyes, but he also evokes Rugen from The Princess Bride - a European swordsman seeking revenge for his murder of a family member recognizes him by his deformed hand. (No obvious movie inspiration for Emperor, unless you count Westerns in general, but Hol Horse never gets an arc all to himself anyway.)
  • Not sure about Empress, although some have suggested David Croenberg's body horror films.
  • Wheel of Fortune is usually identified as Duel + Christine, but I'd never heard of Vroom Vroom (which doesn't even appear to have a Wikipedia article).
  • Justice is Night of the Living Dead, I guess. There's a link to Haitian zombies and pulp-fantasy zombies in the focus on Enya's control over the corpses, but the way she specifically controls people by getting existing zombies to injure them is vaguely reminiscent of the Romero zombie's bite.
  • The fight against Lovers resembles Innerspace/Fantastic Voyage, and the appearance of Lovers itself resembles the robot from Short Circuit.
  • The wiki suggests the Twilight Zone episode The Midnight Sun as an inspiration for The Sun.
  • Death Thirteen is A Nightmare on Elm Street.
  • Judgement is The Monkey's Paw (which has received at least six film adaptations).
  • Not sure about High Priestess. I've seen someone suggest The Thing, but that seems like a stretch.

Silver2195 fucked around with this message at 04:20 on May 5, 2020

FirstAidKite
Nov 8, 2009

Ask me about the influence of African instruments on the formation of American musical styles.


Silver2195 posted:

  • Wheel of Fortune is usually identified as Duel + Christine, but I'd never heard of Vroom Vroom (which doesn't even appear to have a Wikipedia article).

Nah that was just a reference to a funny jojo video that described the wheel of fortune stand power as being "Duel 1971 Vroom Vroom" and I'd link it but it has some minor spoilers for some future parts that aren't animated yet.

Blueberry Pancakes
Aug 18, 2012

Jack in!! MegaMan, Execute!


Silver2195 posted:

Araki never really stops doing this, sometimes to the point of plagiarism (the backstory of a certain character in Part 6 comes to mind).

I'm really curious how they're going to adapt that backstory and one specific fight.

FirstAidKite
Nov 8, 2009

Ask me about the influence of African instruments on the formation of American musical styles.


Thinkin about how Kira's backstory is literally a spooky campfire tale

Pootybutt
Apr 5, 2011



FirstAidKite posted:

Thinkin about how Kira's backstory is literally a spooky campfire tale

You can even ask the ghost to tell it herself.

Blueberry Pancakes
Aug 18, 2012

Jack in!! MegaMan, Execute!


Pootybutt posted:

You can even ask the ghost to tell it herself.

I love how Reimi is like "Haha, that story was just a prank." *five seconds later* "But seriously, I actually did die that way."

Last Celebration
Mar 30, 2010


I finished Part 4. In any other series I would consider Kira to be a stupidly overpowered poorly thought out character in terms of their powerset*, but it was very thematically appropriate that as powerful as he was on top of the egregious luck he had, he was ultimately brought down by everyone he hurt and trampled over in the pursuit of his best life. That and just being pretty goddamn dumb, which was probably also deliberate to an extent, like imagine a normal-rear end, maskless Dio Brando with just Killer Queen, let alone Sheer Heart Attack and Bites the Dust.

Part 4’s real real good, it’s just 75% “what if araki wrote a Saturday morning cartoon about a weird town” which was extremely my poo poo, as was most of the Kira half, but it was hard to not notice more moments of janky animation than SC, which hurts something like DiU a lot less than something more battle focused.

* I mean, Killer Queen is kind of inconsistent initially since if it could always blow up people and not just things then why didn’t he blow up the first hand as soon as he got it back, let alone setting a bomb on it before he left the house

Blueberry Pancakes
Aug 18, 2012

Jack in!! MegaMan, Execute!


You can't just blow up your girlfriend.

Besides, Kira being overconfident leads to 100% of his problems.

Johnny Joestar
Oct 21, 2010

Don't shoot him?

...
...





yeah, he knows poo poo-all about stands other than his own and is just filled with his own hubris all the time

Last Celebration
Mar 30, 2010


Yeah, I’m pretty firmly convinced the funniest scene of Jojo is still probably “HAYATO, YOU THOUGHT YOU COULD DEFY FATE, BUT I, YOSHIKAGE KIRA, HAVE ONCE AGAIN TRIUMPHED OVER ALL” followed by “OH NO, I, YOSHIKAGE KIRA, HAVE BEEN AGAIN FOUND OUT! HOW COULD THIS HAVE HAPPENED?????”

Glagha
Oct 13, 2008

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAaaAAAaaAAaAA
AAAAAAAaAAAAAaaAAA
AAAA
AaAAaaA
AAaaAAAAaaaAAAAAAA
AaaAaaAAAaaaaaAA



I like Kira's overconfidence because it results in him gloating over Jotaro and talking about how weak Star Platinum is seconds before getting punched in the face.

Xad
Jul 2, 2009

"Either Sonic is God, or could kill God, and I do not care if there is a difference!"



College Slice

Glagha posted:

I like Kira's overconfidence because it results in him gloating over Jotaro and talking about how weak Star Platinum is seconds before getting punched in the face.

This is still one of my favorite scenes to watch

Carlosologist
Oct 13, 2013

Revelry in the Dark



and Star Platinum still turned him into confetti despite Jotaro being blown up to hell and back

Blueberry Pancakes
Aug 18, 2012

Jack in!! MegaMan, Execute!


Last Celebration posted:

Yeah, I’m pretty firmly convinced the funniest scene of Jojo is still probably “HAYATO, YOU THOUGHT YOU COULD DEFY FATE, BUT I, YOSHIKAGE KIRA, HAVE ONCE AGAIN TRIUMPHED OVER ALL” followed by “OH NO, I, YOSHIKAGE KIRA, HAVE BEEN AGAIN FOUND OUT! HOW COULD THIS HAVE HAPPENED?????”

That or

"Haha, your Stand is pretty weak. You really think you can beat my Killer Queen with tha- OH GOD WHY ARE YOU SO FAST"

comedyblissoption
Mar 15, 2006

Is a saint not entitled to the skin of his foot?






Last Celebration posted:

* I mean, Killer Queen is kind of inconsistent initially since if it could always blow up people and not just things then why didn’t he blow up the first hand as soon as he got it back, let alone setting a bomb on it before he left the house
There's like no way Kira could have predicted the goblin boy had a stand that tracked him much less reveal the hand.

Electric Phantasm
Apr 7, 2011

YOSPOS



Blueberry Pancakes posted:

That or

"Haha, your Stand is pretty weak. You really think you can beat my Killer Queen with tha- OH GOD WHY ARE YOU SO FAST"

I like how he describes it

"As easy as catching a popup"

Or

"I'll drive it down like one of Joe Montana's football passes"

I don't know why I just like Sports Analogy Kira.

Last Celebration
Mar 30, 2010


comedyblissoption posted:

There's like no way Kira could have predicted the goblin boy had a stand that tracked him much less reveal the hand.

Yeah but that shouldn’t matter though, he’s carrying around the severed hand of someone he killed in his coat jacket, he should have already tagged it as a fail safe. Like, yeah Kira’s dumb compared to DIO and pretty arrogant, but not turning the hand into a bomb before leaving the house is beyond his usual brand of fuckup, which makes it just look like he couldn’t tag it with Killer Queen because his powerset wasn’t yet defined, like how Star Platinum was grabbing poo poo for Jotaro autonomously at the start of SC even though it can’t have moved that that far.

Half of Dracula
Oct 24, 2008

Perhaps the same could be


I'm not sure Kira can un bomb something he tags with KQ, though it is fair to say the rules of his stand likely weren't written at that point

comedyblissoption
Mar 15, 2006

Is a saint not entitled to the skin of his foot?






Kira is a crazy man who takes his severed hand girlfriend out in public, skirting dangerously close to being noticed. If he was the type to take precautions, he wouldn't do any of that crazy poo poo in public. The only reason he starts getting cautious is because he's being chased by stand detectives, something he's never had to deal with before.

Nessus
Dec 22, 2003

I still can't believe they cast Spock as me. Spock! Can you imagine?

Of course, he was missing a few things.



Yeah Kira's only real concern was the possibility of cops seeing him or whatever, and even then he could get rid of the goods. Kira's real power was being able to destroy any evidence of his sex murders, the death explosions were just a handy side effect.

Even if you literally recorded him with a video camera while killing a woman, it would just look like he took the woman's hand, and a moment later she disappeared, and he kept on going. He would have been able to keep doing his thing until his natural death otherwise.

FirstAidKite
Nov 8, 2009

Ask me about the influence of African instruments on the formation of American musical styles.


Nessus posted:

Yeah Kira's only real concern was the possibility of cops seeing him or whatever, and even then he could get rid of the goods. Kira's real power was being able to destroy any evidence of his sex murders, the death explosions were just a handy side effect.

Even if you literally recorded him with a video camera while killing a woman, it would just look like he took the woman's hand, and a moment later she disappeared, and he kept on going. He would have been able to keep doing his thing until his natural death otherwise.

I think it still captures the explosion, the explosion is something that I think is visible to non-stand users. He can also choose not to set off bombs he has placed as well as choose to undo them.

The thing to remember with Kira is that yeah you can say that logically he should be doing all of these things to take precautions but Kira is a lucky man who is arrogant about his luck and is completely fine with appearing as normal and middle-of-the-road as possible. He's also a serial killer who has a hand fetish and who he is is inherently illogical. He thinks he is fine so he isn't going to take any unnecessary precautions because he feels he has no reason to and it isn't a flaw of the story that the guy who is arrogant and makes plenty of mistakes when he thinks he's in control of a situation would, in a situation where he thinks he is in control, make some severe mistakes, such as asking Josuke to heal him or accidentally revealing who he is to Koichi or mirroring that same reveal but to Hayato and Josuke.

Kira's an arrogant man who makes stupid choices when under pressure and he has the luck of a cat but his 9 lives finally ran out and he brought it all on himself.

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Blueberry Pancakes
Aug 18, 2012

Jack in!! MegaMan, Execute!


Last Celebration posted:

Like, yeah Kira’s dumb compared to DIO and pretty arrogant, but not turning the hand into a bomb before leaving the house is beyond his usual brand of fuckup

I think you're underestimating the arrogance of a man who, in his second appearance, sucked meat juice off of a severed hand in the middle of a well-trafficked sandwich shop in broad daylight.

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