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SolusLunes
Oct 10, 2011

I now have several regrets.

:barf:


Bifauxnen posted:

Solus is like my new favourite mafia player rn :3:

:cripes: now I'm gonna be the one lynched D1

Also, important cat update:

https://imgur.com/a/r6LtvBu

The black cat is the toasty herocat. The torti is his sister he was trying to save. (he's very crunchy to pet)

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Bifauxnen
Aug 11, 2010

Resurrected
Living in a lighthouse
The lions and the lambs ain't sleeping yet


SolusLunes posted:

:cripes: now I'm gonna be the one lynched D1

I'm sorry! but I cannot contain my feelings, I must tell the world

Asiina
Apr 26, 2011

No going back


Grimey Drawer

oh my goooooooooood

also I'm changing my name suggestion, you need to go with Soot.

Asiina
Apr 26, 2011

No going back


Grimey Drawer



George Kansas
Sep 1, 2008

preface all my posts with this


All I can really say to the "reverse-engineered" claim is that... no I didn't? I saw bif's post and it really pinged me as scummy and worth a vote. Didn't like her responses, so I'm still voting her.

Asiina posted:

Also can we agree that chain-lynches are not actually scummy because like there's no reason that they are. Looking at someone's post and going "if this happens, I'm going to be suspicious of you" is a totally normal and town thing to say. Especially because if you're town there's always a chance you die at night, so why not put your opinions out there now. It's not like you're locking yourself into a vote by saying that. That never actually happens.

No, chain lynches are scummy because they're fake content. You can just say that tomorrow. Feeling the need to pressure someone and go "WELL, IF THIS HAPPENS, I'M WATCHING YOU!!" is not normal and town, because you don't have any of that info yet. It's a false hypothetical and I think it's both bad and scummy to pretend like "this bandwagon I am considering jumping on is where we should look for scum tomorrow" is good town content.

I guess I could see your point that chain lynches don't HAVE to be scummy? But I definitely think I'm saying "this is fake content" and giving the warrants for why I think it's scummy, I'm not just saying "X is scummy!"

hambeet posted:

people abuse the term like people used to abuse omgus.

I agree with this. omgus is a stupid thing.

George Kansas
Sep 1, 2008

preface all my posts with this


Bifauxnen posted:

I "turned it into" a discussion about semantics because BK literally called it weird for me to have used the words I did. I'll be looking forward to seeing his reaction to Asiina herself calling my description of her accurate.


BK didn't just drop a vote. He called my post "setting up your basically-a-chain-Lynch". He is pushing a whole lot of projected meaning into me going "hmm, I gotta remember this thing here just in case"

Oh, at this point I think we had a genuine misunderstanding about the term "sussing out." I just think you changing your characterization of Asiina's case over the course of your posting makes you scummy, as I have made clear.

George Kansas
Sep 1, 2008

preface all my posts with this


Bifauxnen posted:

sometimes I think Mafia isn't really about casing, it's about letting out all your aggression into punishing people for not interpreting reality the way you do

:ironicat:

Bifauxnen
Aug 11, 2010

Resurrected
Living in a lighthouse
The lions and the lambs ain't sleeping yet


BottleKnight posted:

No, chain lynches are scummy because they're fake content. You can just say that tomorrow. Feeling the need to pressure someone and go "WELL, IF THIS HAPPENS, I'M WATCHING YOU!!" is not normal and town, because you don't have any of that info yet. It's a false hypothetical and I think it's both bad and scummy to pretend like "this bandwagon I am considering jumping on is where we should look for scum tomorrow" is good town content.

I guess I could see your point that chain lynches don't HAVE to be scummy? But I definitely think I'm saying "this is fake content" and giving the warrants for why I think it's scummy, I'm not just saying "X is scummy!"

wait, so you think it's better to wait till tomorrow to pressure anyone? Why not do it now and see if anything happens?

And you seem to be getting your bandwagons confused. You say I was considering jumping on the TMM bandwagon, but IP is the one I was saying sounded scummy and should maybe look at tomorrow. And no one was even talking about IP before I popped in to comment on that post of his.

Bifauxnen
Aug 11, 2010

Resurrected
Living in a lighthouse
The lions and the lambs ain't sleeping yet



you can't even tell when I am literally writing a post ABOUT myself god

Bifauxnen
Aug 11, 2010

Resurrected
Living in a lighthouse
The lions and the lambs ain't sleeping yet


BottleKnight posted:

Oh, at this point I think we had a genuine misunderstanding about the term "sussing out." I just think you changing your characterization of Asiina's case over the course of your posting makes you scummy, as I have made clear.

where did I change my characterisation of her case? You mean the "sussing out" characterisation she said is correct?

Bifauxnen
Aug 11, 2010

Resurrected
Living in a lighthouse
The lions and the lambs ain't sleeping yet


BottleKnight posted:

Feeling the need to pressure someone and go "WELL, IF THIS HAPPENS, I'M WATCHING YOU!!" is not normal and town, because you don't have any of that info yet. It's a false hypothetical and I think it's both bad and scummy to pretend like "this bandwagon I am considering jumping on is where we should look for scum tomorrow" is good town content.

"Yeah, this bandwagon that does not even exist, with zero votes for a person no one is talking about, that is who I am considering jumping on!!"

you were so keen to jump in to be so confident off of one post of mine, but you can't even remember who the hell you're talking about when you talk about my actual positions.

Podima
Nov 4, 2009

You've got the Shine
You've got the power

lomarf


:cheers: Deadline extended by 2 hours to 10 PM EDT, making Day 1 an even 48 hours. Thank you for your patience and flexibility with the interruptions this afternoon. :cheers:

:beerpal: Votecount for Day 1 :beerpal:

BottleKnight (4): Bifauxnen, Murmur Twin, Asiina, SolusLunes
Bifauxnen (2): Bifauxnen, Bifauxnen, BottleKnight, TMMadman
TMMadman (2): Murmur Twin, Asiina, IcePhoenix, Hal Incandenza, Murmur Twin, Asiina
SolusLunes (1): King Burgundy
IcePhoenix (1): Max
hambeet (0): SolusLunes, SolusLunes
Mr. Humalong (0): Max, Max
King Burgundy (0): TMMadman, TMMadman
Max (0): Asiina, Asiina
Murmur Twin (0): Bifauxnen, Bifauxnen

Not Voting (6): Asphyxious, hambeet, IllegallySober, Mr. Humalong, sniper4625, Social Studies 3rd Period :rubshands:

With 16 people still alive, it takes 9 votes to execute.
The current deadline is October 02nd, 2018 at 10 p.m. EDT -- that's in about 5 hours.

The wagon train is moving at a steady pace. Today's execution method is Standard Majority.

George Kansas
Sep 1, 2008

preface all my posts with this


SolusLunes posted:

The 'chain lynch' is a wild misinterpretation of what bif has said. (incidentally, I've always read 'sussing out' as 'coming to a conclusion due to a collection of facts and gut reads')

Could you please explain why you think

Bifauxnen posted:

got enough reasons there, bud?

I like Asiina sussing this out and might vote TMM later, but if it turns out to be wrong this is where I'd look first for scum trying to get things rolling.

is not in any way basically a chain lynch?

like, literally my point here is her saying "I like this and I might vote for TMM, but if TMM is town, this vote is where the scum are!" It's fake. And then she retreated to saying she doesn't agree with the case at all.

I would prefer you say how I misinterpreted instead of just asserting that I did.

Social Studies 3rd Period
Oct 31, 2012

THUNDERDOME LOSER





Bifauxnen posted:

wait, so you think it's better to wait till tomorrow to pressure anyone? Why not do it now and see if anything happens?

And you seem to be getting your bandwagons confused. You say I was considering jumping on the TMM bandwagon, but IP is the one I was saying sounded scummy and should maybe look at tomorrow. And no one was even talking about IP before I popped in to comment on that post of his.

I think I have to agree here for the most part? A lot of my previous mafia experience more or less treated D1 throughout as a complete jokephase (often ending with no successful lynch per mod fiat... Yeah.) I think I like this a lot better. Yeah, it's a little rough but it still doesn't have to end in a lynch per se and pressuring even on D1 can provide info for later. Gonna have to be something to get used to, this much on D1 definitely caught me by surprise.

Hal Insandenza
Feb 12, 2004




Oh glad for the extension Iím just getting ready to leave work and wonít be able to seriously read for a little while.

TMM seems better I guess from recent posting...

George Kansas
Sep 1, 2008

preface all my posts with this


Bifauxnen posted:

wait, so you think it's better to wait till tomorrow to pressure anyone? Why not do it now and see if anything happens?

And you seem to be getting your bandwagons confused. You say I was considering jumping on the TMM bandwagon, but IP is the one I was saying sounded scummy and should maybe look at tomorrow. And no one was even talking about IP before I popped in to comment on that post of his.

I'm saying once you have the information you want, then you can use said information to case!

Bifauxnen posted:

you can't even tell when I am literally writing a post ABOUT myself god

At this point, your aggressive posting has made me pretty annoyed and I'm ok with taking a cheap snipe

Bifauxnen posted:

"Yeah, this bandwagon that does not even exist, with zero votes for a person no one is talking about, that is who I am considering jumping on!!"

you were so keen to jump in to be so confident off of one post of mine, but you can't even remember who the hell you're talking about when you talk about my actual positions.

What?? We're talking about the TMM votes, which I believe there were 2 of at the time, plus Hal saying he would vote for him? And you went from saying you liked the case and might vote to saying you didn't agree with the case and would only vote as a last resort. A pretty big moving goalpost.

Bifauxnen
Aug 11, 2010

Resurrected
Living in a lighthouse
The lions and the lambs ain't sleeping yet


BottleKnight posted:

What?? We're talking about the TMM votes, which I believe there were 2 of at the time, plus Hal saying he would vote for him? And you went from saying you liked the case and might vote to saying you didn't agree with the case and would only vote as a last resort. A pretty big moving goalpost.

I said I liked Asiina making the case, and might vote, but did not vote.

And you just now said:

BottleKnight posted:

I think it's both bad and scummy to pretend like "this bandwagon I am considering jumping on is where we should look for scum tomorrow" is good town content.

I said, that if TMM was lunched and flips town, we should look at IP as scummy tomorrow.

So were you talking about TMM? if TMM is dead town tomorrow I should look at TMM for scum?

Or were you talking about IP? And saying that I was considering jumping on the IP bandwagon which did not exist?

You are conflating the two.

George Kansas
Sep 1, 2008

preface all my posts with this


King Burgundy posted:

I side with BK over Bif in that exchange. I think its possible Bif is scum this game. But I don't feel strongly enough about it to warrant a D1 vote. I'd hate to lose her early if she's town.

So you side with me over her, but wouldn't want to lose her if she happened to be town.

King Burgundy posted:

Hmmm, ok, so we have to consolidate. I don't like the BK vote, but I don't feel strongly enough to not vote there. Would vote. That flip will help solidify other alignment reads. Still like my Solus vote. Would vote other lurkery people with ease.

Won't vote today: Bif, TMM, Asiina.

Would consider cases on others.

But then say you'd vote for me while you wouldn't vote for bif?

I'm confused.

hambeet
Sep 13, 2002



Asiina posted:

I don't really get that multi-quote post Solus just did, because it seems like you're leaning for BK as town, but then declare Bif town and vote for him.

Uhhh yeah

George Kansas
Sep 1, 2008

preface all my posts with this


Bifauxnen posted:

I said I liked Asiina making the case, and might vote, but did not vote.

And you just now said:


I said, that if TMM was lunched and flips town, we should look at IP as scummy tomorrow.

So were you talking about TMM? if TMM is dead town tomorrow I should look at TMM for scum?

Or were you talking about IP? And saying that I was considering jumping on the IP bandwagon which did not exist?

You are conflating the two.

"If TMM was lunched and flips town" = the bandwagon. The bandwagon that killed a townie player, TMM, is then where you should look for scum tomorrow, according to you. You are literally still misinterpreting my posting.

Bifauxnen
Aug 11, 2010

Resurrected
Living in a lighthouse
The lions and the lambs ain't sleeping yet


BottleKnight posted:

"If TMM was lunched and flips town" = the bandwagon. The bandwagon that killed a townie player, TMM, is then where you should look for scum tomorrow, according to you. You are literally still misinterpreting my posting.

ok that makes more sense...

if TMM died and flipped scum I wasn't going to see IP's post as scummy anymore, though. And I didnt think it was scummy enough for a vote yet, but it might have been, if he'd had a weird reaction to me pointing him out.

King Burgundy
Sep 17, 2003

I am the Burgundy King,
I can do anything!



BottleKnight posted:

So you side with me over her, but wouldn't want to lose her if she happened to be town.


But then say you'd vote for me while you wouldn't vote for bif?

I'm confused.

Sounds like you have it right. I value a town Bif too highly to risk a cuddle over something so trivial on D1. But even though I think they are wrong, a ton of people think you are scum and many people have commented on your cuddle. So regardless of who is right, it is still a great cuddle to draw further insights from tomorrow. I'm not so confident in my read of you that it is worth drawing a line in the sand over.

sniper4625
Sep 26, 2009

Loyal to the hEnd


If I have this right: BK says Bif supported Asiina's case (only to later retreat and recant under pressure) and was calling for suspicion on any TMM voters for a future chainlynch, while Bif is claiming that she was supporting Asiina making a case and was specifically calling out IP for specious reasoning on the lynch. Then uh you both started yelling at each other and things devolved. Correct?

Bifauxnen
Aug 11, 2010

Resurrected
Living in a lighthouse
The lions and the lambs ain't sleeping yet


sniper4625 posted:

If I have this right: BK says Bif supported Asiina's case (only to later retreat and recant under pressure) and was calling for suspicion on any TMM voters for a future chainlynch, while Bif is claiming that she was supporting Asiina making a case and was specifically calling out IP for specious reasoning on the lynch. Then uh you both started yelling at each other and things devolved. Correct?

not just any TMM voters. I thought IP's vote on particular sounded like it could be the kind of post a scum would make when they want to get the bandwagon moving, but felt a need to awkwardly overexplain their action with jokes.

But Asiina seemed very sincere in her own casing of TMM. It wasn't necessarily bad to want to join her. It called for more poking.

Hal Insandenza
Feb 12, 2004




sniper4625 posted:

If I have this right: BK says Bif supported Asiina's case (only to later retreat and recant under pressure) and was calling for suspicion on any TMM voters for a future chainlynch, while Bif is claiming that she was supporting Asiina making a case and was specifically calling out IP for specious reasoning on the lynch. Then uh you both started yelling at each other and things devolved. Correct?

Bif never really supported the case in a meaningful way so thatís not quite right

George Kansas
Sep 1, 2008

preface all my posts with this


sniper4625 posted:

If I have this right: BK says Bif supported Asiina's case (only to later retreat and recant under pressure) and was calling for suspicion on any TMM voters for a future chainlynch, while Bif is claiming that she was supporting Asiina making a case and was specifically calling out IP for specious reasoning on the lynch. Then uh you both started yelling at each other and things devolved. Correct?

My third point is that bif super hedged on asiina's tmm case, which she then had to nail down her opinions about later (in a way I find inconsistent with what she had previously said about asiina's case)

sniper4625
Sep 26, 2009

Loyal to the hEnd


Hal Incandenza posted:

Bif never really supported the case in a meaningful way so that’s not quite right

I mean that's the impression I got too - it seemed like she was glad someone was making an attempt at something, but the following posts made it pretty clear she wasn't enthused about the actual work product. I guess this is why I'm still leaning BK - I disagree with his fundamental suppositions regarding the hill hes chosen to die on.

George Kansas
Sep 1, 2008

preface all my posts with this


Bifauxnen posted:

not just any TMM voters. I thought IP's vote on particular sounded like it could be the kind of post a scum would make when they want to get the bandwagon moving, but felt a need to awkwardly overexplain their action with jokes.

But Asiina seemed very sincere in her own casing of TMM. It wasn't necessarily bad to want to join her. It called for more poking.

my head is exploding because this actually makes sense. i know as i'm typing this that you're going to say "But i already explained it exactly this way!!" and maybe you did and i just didnt piece it together, but (specifically the bolded part) makes a lot of sense and actually makes me feel a lot better about you

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Driving back home, will be around for deadline and will catch up then.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


I just got home and haven't read much of anything, diving in now and I should be around until deadline.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Max posted:

Driving back home, will be around for deadline and will catch up then.

:j::respek::v:

Bifauxnen
Aug 11, 2010

Resurrected
Living in a lighthouse
The lions and the lambs ain't sleeping yet


BottleKnight posted:

my head is exploding

Bifauxnen
Aug 11, 2010

Resurrected
Living in a lighthouse
The lions and the lambs ain't sleeping yet


I literally do not even know how to react this like never happens to me in mafia

##unvote while I get some coffee

George Kansas
Sep 1, 2008

preface all my posts with this


##unvote

Just read back through some posts and I think I got really caught up on the distinction between "I like the case" and "I don't agree with the case" because that just didn't make any sense to me. Bif tying it up like that makes a lot more sense on that particular point.

George Kansas
Sep 1, 2008

preface all my posts with this


Solus is really the only other person I've thought was particularly scummy today ##vote solus

hambeet
Sep 13, 2002



See I told you all this is the chillest game.

Bifauxnen
Aug 11, 2010

Resurrected
Living in a lighthouse
The lions and the lambs ain't sleeping yet


BottleKnight posted:

Solus is really the only other person I've thought was particularly scummy today ##vote solus

noooooo what have I done

Bifauxnen
Aug 11, 2010

Resurrected
Living in a lighthouse
The lions and the lambs ain't sleeping yet


##vote IP

would be better imo

George Kansas
Sep 1, 2008

preface all my posts with this


Bifauxnen posted:

##vote IP

would be better imo

I'll vote IP if that's what it comes down to near deadline, but that frustration post is one I read as genuine.

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IcePhoenix
Sep 18, 2005

Take me to your Shida



Bifauxnen posted:

##vote IP

would be better imo

:wrong:

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