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  • Locked thread
Xad
Jul 2, 2009

"Either Sonic is God, or could kill God, and I do not care if there is a difference!"



College Slice

King Burgundy posted:

Since you are around, who do you think is scum?

Hiya. Well, bif for one. Her posts have felt kinda "off" to me all game, beek being a SK makes me feel a bit better about this, since that slapfight d1 was very likely between two people of differing alignments (or two town, but we know for sure about half of it now)

and going off of the SK tangent, I mentioned yesterday but I'm always slightly suspicious of anyone that brings up a SK or other 3P role unprompted, and I know gaspy and TMM brought that up before beek's flip, so they're on my radar as well for today

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Referee
Aug 25, 2004

"Winning is great, sure, but if you are really going to do something in life, the secret is learning how to lose. Nobody goes undefeated all the time. If you can pick up after a crushing defeat, and go on to win again, you are going to be a champion someday."
(Wilma Rudolph)



King Burgundy posted:

IS, Gaspy hasn't answered me, but did you also get more than 2 shine to make things with?

I started the game with 3 Shine.

Asphyxious
Jun 25, 2012

I knew the consequences. But... I cannot apologize. I will not. If I should apologize or feel regret, then everything would have been for naught. I will never defeat the scum if I do.


King Burgundy posted:

You started with more than 2 shine Gaspy?

I did! I can make 3 things, one of each, each one takes a swig of shine!


IllegallySober posted:

What were your inventions (if you care to share?)

Absolutely not sharing that one at this stage.

Referee
Aug 25, 2004

"Winning is great, sure, but if you are really going to do something in life, the secret is learning how to lose. Nobody goes undefeated all the time. If you can pick up after a crushing defeat, and go on to win again, you are going to be a champion someday."
(Wilma Rudolph)



Asphyxious posted:

Absolutely not sharing that one at this stage.

Okay, letís try this. Do any of your items overlap with what Iíve already claimed?

Asphyxious
Jun 25, 2012

I knew the consequences. But... I cannot apologize. I will not. If I should apologize or feel regret, then everything would have been for naught. I will never defeat the scum if I do.


IllegallySober posted:

Okay, letís try this. Do any of your items overlap with what Iíve already claimed?

Havenít you only mentioned a padlock?

No I donít make padlocks.

Referee
Aug 25, 2004

"Winning is great, sure, but if you are really going to do something in life, the secret is learning how to lose. Nobody goes undefeated all the time. If you can pick up after a crushing defeat, and go on to win again, you are going to be a champion someday."
(Wilma Rudolph)



Asphyxious posted:

Havenít you only mentioned a padlock?

No I donít make padlocks.

I mentioned that and this:


IllegallySober posted:

What I gave him was a one-shot Shinecop. I figured by giving him that he could either use it to clear me, or would at minimum feel better about me being town.

Asphyxious
Jun 25, 2012

I knew the consequences. But... I cannot apologize. I will not. If I should apologize or feel regret, then everything would have been for naught. I will never defeat the scum if I do.


IllegallySober posted:

I mentioned that and this:

Whatís a shinecop? Like a rolecop for shine roles?

Again, no.

Referee
Aug 25, 2004

"Winning is great, sure, but if you are really going to do something in life, the secret is learning how to lose. Nobody goes undefeated all the time. If you can pick up after a crushing defeat, and go on to win again, you are going to be a champion someday."
(Wilma Rudolph)



Asphyxious posted:

Whatís a shinecop? Like a rolecop for shine roles?

Again, no.

Hmmmmmmm.

Okay.

Referee
Aug 25, 2004

"Winning is great, sure, but if you are really going to do something in life, the secret is learning how to lose. Nobody goes undefeated all the time. If you can pick up after a crushing defeat, and go on to win again, you are going to be a champion someday."
(Wilma Rudolph)



So gaspy gave something to Beet N1 and Max N2, both of whom havenít used it yet (Max obviously since he just got it last night)

I gave my items to KB N1 and Solus N2. KB used his N2, and Solus is dead and canít use it.

Bifauxnen
Aug 11, 2010

Resurrected
Living in a lighthouse
The lions and the lambs ain't sleeping yet


ok gonna write my claim post next but while reviewing the flips I just noticed something way more pressing that needs to be addressed:

Podima posted:

:rip: Asiina, aka Werner Tennyson, Migrant-Aligned Vanilla {Snitch}, was shot dead on Night 1! :rip:

what the gently caress, Pod

that name is taken!!

Bifauxnen
Aug 11, 2010

Resurrected
Living in a lighthouse
The lions and the lambs ain't sleeping yet


I am Vanilla {Adapter} and I performed these actions:
N1: No action
N2: Defense (failed)

Bifauxnen
Aug 11, 2010

Resurrected
Living in a lighthouse
The lions and the lambs ain't sleeping yet


also confirming that SS3P successfully brought me into a masonry N1, then Max on N2

Bifauxnen
Aug 11, 2010

Resurrected
Living in a lighthouse
The lions and the lambs ain't sleeping yet


as for scum reads, I still have a bad feeling about Gaspy. He seemed to be doing the same kind of interaction with me like he had in FF7 when he was a godfather: try and be cautious enough to not straight up call me scummy, but just act "confused" about some of the things I said. Enough to just cast a bit of shade. He's not out to start a fight though, he's just "wary". Now that there's a cop result (or two? still gotta fill in my spreadsheet) on him I guess I can hold off on him as usual, but with these many freaking cops around something has to be hosed.

Next up is sniper. He was pretty quiet all along, and his claim seems a bit too conveniently delayed after the fact. Plus he does seem to be rolefishing all the time... Gaspy was actually the one I saw most pointing this out, but that doesn't mean much of anything. It is totally like him to at least lightly bus a scum bud if they make any posts that seem just objectively bad.

Third choice today would be IS. Besides the earlier points made about him, I don't like how last night he just happens to give his item to the NK. I'm still filling in a lot of data here so sorry if I missed you already saying this IS, but why did you even choose Solus to give an item to?

Referee
Aug 25, 2004

"Winning is great, sure, but if you are really going to do something in life, the secret is learning how to lose. Nobody goes undefeated all the time. If you can pick up after a crushing defeat, and go on to win again, you are going to be a champion someday."
(Wilma Rudolph)



Bifauxnen posted:

Third choice today would be IS. Besides the earlier points made about him, I don't like how last night he just happens to give his item to the NK. I'm still filling in a lot of data here so sorry if I missed you already saying this IS, but why did you even choose Solus to give an item to?


IllegallySober posted:

What I gave him was a one-shot Shinecop. I figured by giving him that he could either use it to clear me, or would at minimum feel better about me being town.

Murmur Twin posted:

Interesting. Were you at all worried that he might be scum?

IllegallySober posted:

No, I actually read him for town pretty strongly by the end of yesterday, so I wasnít concerned about that.

Passing out now, back in 8-10 hours.

Bifauxnen
Aug 11, 2010

Resurrected
Living in a lighthouse
The lions and the lambs ain't sleeping yet


lol, literally to look more townie, got it

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Full disclosure: Iím posting this having not read the last page or so because I want to hear discussion on my results.

Actually Iím gonna do it in a separate post for TMMs thing

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


I am a migrant-aligned Vanilla {Snoop} who started with two shine.

On n1 I targeted gaspy and got MIGRANT
On n1 I was inspired, which doubles the use of my next shine

On d2 I received a singed lasso, good for a 1x roleblock. I havenít used it yet.

On n2 I targeted sniper and got ďyour action failedĒ. I also targeted ss3p and got NOT MIGRANT.

My logic was that I wanted to target people who I didnít have an organic read on.

hambeet
Sep 13, 2002



Interesting

hambeet
Sep 13, 2002



Soo scum who can create a masonry or just a scum team?

hambeet
Sep 13, 2002



Wait I don't think I was the first to say that

hambeet
Sep 13, 2002



Ahh yeah it was tmm

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Lol awesome.

Asphyxious
Jun 25, 2012

I knew the consequences. But... I cannot apologize. I will not. If I should apologize or feel regret, then everything would have been for naught. I will never defeat the scum if I do.


This is a lot to process.

I mean itís all terribly exciting but now thereís so many moving parts.

- I can see SS3P as scum
- I can see Bif as scum
- canít see max as scum

So TMMís theory that the masonry is the scum team in plain sight doesnít work for me either. It wouldnít be a clever gambit, itíd be a stupid one. Even with TMMís lie detector, thereíd be no reason to set up 3 scum. They could have just sacrificed SS3P. I canít see max OR bif thinking that was a good idea.

MMTís reasoning for picking those two is both very good and very foreign to me. I canít work out why but thereís this feeling that itís a setup. But then THAT doesnít make sense either.

Maybe the lie detector stuff honestly made scum fumble? Thatíd be nice.

Asphyxious
Jun 25, 2012

I knew the consequences. But... I cannot apologize. I will not. If I should apologize or feel regret, then everything would have been for naught. I will never defeat the scum if I do.


Social Studies 3rd Period posted:


One of TMM or maybe Bif? So far I've generally been agreeing with some of the general points, but based on the vague lines of discussion, seeing a flip on either of them I think would be an interesting piece of the grander puzzle.




When asked who they would vote for, they offer up me, TMM and... Bif.

Isnít that a bit odd? Considering they were now in a masonry with bif? Why mason someone you were on the fence with, why soft bus your mason buddy with no real reason?

Hal Insandenza
Feb 12, 2004




Asphyxious posted:

When asked who they would vote for, they offer up me, TMM and... Bif.

Isnít that a bit odd? Considering they were now in a masonry with bif? Why mason someone you were on the fence with, why soft bus your mason buddy with no real reason?

A bit odd but I also think a new scum with masonry powers might well mason a scumbro first to have someone with them in the masonry to help out

I could also see there being both a town and scum inventor and I think itís awfully convenient that IS visited the kill covering any potential watch/tracks

So Iíll stick with my original scum picks and swap SS3P for Max

hambeet
Sep 13, 2002



Asphyxious posted:

This is a lot to process.

I mean itís all terribly exciting but now thereís so many moving parts.

- I can see SS3P as scum
- I can see Bif as scum
- canít see max as scum

So TMMís theory that the masonry is the scum team in plain sight doesnít work for me either. It wouldnít be a clever gambit, itíd be a stupid one. Even with TMMís lie detector, thereíd be no reason to set up 3 scum. They could have just sacrificed SS3P. I canít see max OR bif thinking that was a good idea.

MMTís reasoning for picking those two is both very good and very foreign to me. I canít work out why but thereís this feeling that itís a setup. But then THAT doesnít make sense either.

Maybe the lie detector stuff honestly made scum fumble? Thatíd be nice.

yeah i pretty much ran through all of that in my head while i was bottling my beer :beerpal:

so lynching ss3p (lol 3p) we find out if mmt was correct and can instantly see if he was a mason recruiter or not. if not well, the gig is up, but i highly doubt that'd be the outcome.

hambeet
Sep 13, 2002



HOWEVER, we still have the 800 cop claims to deal with and now have to take into account a possible lie detector too. that's horrendously op for town if all accurate.

hambeet
Sep 13, 2002



anyway

##vote Social Studies 3rd Period

hambeet
Sep 13, 2002



:beerpal: Votecount for Day 3 :beerpal:

Social Studies 3rd Period (1): hambeet
IllegallySober (1): Asphyxious

Not Voting (10): Bifauxnen, Hal Incandenza, IllegallySober, King Burgundy, Max, Murmur Twin, sniper4625, Social Studies 3rd Period, TMMadman, Xad :rubshands:

There are 12 people still alive. The person with the most votes at the end of the day will be executed.
The current deadline is October 08th, 2018 at 9 p.m. EDT -- that's in about 14 hours, 2 minutes.

:siren: Today's execution method is Plurality (the person with the most votes at the end of the day will be executed thrown to the coyotes). The game day will be much shorter than typical. :siren:

Hal Insandenza
Feb 12, 2004




Yeah ##vote SS3P

Max
Nov 30, 2002



I am Vanilla {Snoop} and I performed these actions:

N1: inspect hambeet, got Migrant-Aligned as a result
N2: inspect bif, action failed.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Will post possible scum picks later this morning so please don't turbo yet (but SS3P is the right vote imo) I just have a packed schedule for the next few hours.

Hal Insandenza
Feb 12, 2004




Max did you see that news where that Banksy painting self destructed? I was hoping the print I gave you somehow burst into flames too.

Bifauxnen
Aug 11, 2010

Resurrected
Living in a lighthouse
The lions and the lambs ain't sleeping yet


so now that I got my own chart done up, I wanted to check KB's work:

King Burgundy posted:

We have a lot of provable actions last night that kind of narrow who the killer could be.

I think Max and Beet's failure claims were natural and early but I suppose you could disagree with me. Gaspy gave an item to Max. I jailed someone. MMT is going to give us a cop result. SS3P masoning someone. TMM Announcing.

If we believe Xad and Sniper, Bif was in Jail and Sniper was in Jail.

That leaves IS and Hal. Only possible killers. We know at least that IS is NOT lying about handing out items since he gave me a jail item on N1. It also gives him some mad cred since not many scum are going to give out a jail item like that, so if it was really down to those two I'd lean Hal. But would there really not be any protective roles in a game with two kills(three if we believe Bif is a vig)?

Having said that. I don't necessarily believe Xad and Sniper. What if there is a partial truth there and I really did Jail Sniper as planned. But what if instead of jailing, Xad's confound is actually like a modified version of Asiina's games smokescreen power where they target someone and it fails all results on them. In this scenario, Xad and Bif would have preplanned that he was going to "jail" her to prevent any results happening on her while she did the kill last night. So that would make at least Xad and Bif scum, and I think the third would still be Sniper. If so, Xad is the only one MMT could have a result on, so we'll find that out soon? If it was this scenario and I was somehow wrong on Sniper, that is where I come in with a few of my other maybe scum choices.

---

I like this theory because I'm still trying to figure out how Pod, who hates cops, messes with our expectations with all the cops in this game. My nexus theory would be one way. This confound power would be another way, but they don't really coexist. We know the cops aren't all broken since MMT has gotten both results. If they got the confound power to mess with results, I'd also expect them to have a godfather or the like. So yeah. That's where I'm at for now. I'll reevaluate as necessary tomorrow once I see MMT's result.

That bold bit didn't feel right to me. That statement has a lot of caveats, in the middle of him listing out different possibilities and mentioning a bunch of other hypothetical stuff... but it seemed to still be moving along too hasty. Like the concession that maaaybe we could doubt Beet or Max's claims despite him finding them "natural", but no such doubt at all about how "MMT is going to give us a cop result."

He mentions other options like maybe we could have sanity issues or a godfather to deal with... but despite mentioning early, in passing, how we could maaaybe doubt Max or Beet's snoop claim, when he comes back to sum things up about the cop problem in particular, he never really comes straight out to list it as a main option to explain it here. That one of the many Snoops could just be scum.

Hal Insandenza
Feb 12, 2004




Yeah bif I felt the same way. His list presumes no one is lying at all and two scum arenít confirming fake actions which doesnít seem very KB to me

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Max posted:

Will post possible scum picks later this morning so please don't turbo yet (but SS3P is the right vote imo) I just have a packed schedule for the next few hours.

Same here - work is slammed (itís a holiday and they didnít schedule anyone beyond the skeleton Monday crew) and then I have class and I barely slept last night.

Iíll give the game a read / respond in a few hours but today (and probably tomorrow) Iím going to be somewhat limited re: time I have to play

My gut reads right now are that the scum exist in the pool of TMM, IS, SS3P, and sniper.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Murmur Twin posted:

Same here - work is slammed (itís a holiday and they didnít schedule anyone beyond the skeleton Monday crew) and then I have class and I barely slept last night.

Iíll give the game a read / respond in a few hours but today (and probably tomorrow) Iím going to be somewhat limited re: time I have to play

My gut reads right now are that the scum exist in the pool of TMM, IS, SS3P, and sniper.

Glad to see you're thinking on the same page.

My current scum picks are SS3P, IS, and sniper.

SS3P currently has the investigation on him, I know the snoop thing is real on my end and that more than one person obviously has it, so I'm going to trust that result for the day.

IS and sniper are the two players that can't really resolve their work out of everything else that's happened. Plus I find IS's reasoning of wanting to give the one shot cop to someone just so they could clear him really suss. Why have someone clear you when you know your alignment?

I've been going back and forth on bif, but after seeing the masonry chat, I really doubt I'm looking at two scum faking the content that they've put down so far. If SS3P is scum, I don't think bif is.

Can post more later and vote once people have had their say.

Social Studies 3rd Period
Oct 31, 2012

THUNDERDOME LOSER





Murmur Twin posted:

I am a migrant-aligned Vanilla {Snoop} who started with two shine.

On n1 I targeted gaspy and got MIGRANT
On n1 I was inspired, which doubles the use of my next shine

On d2 I received a singed lasso, good for a 1x roleblock. I havenít used it yet.

On n2 I targeted sniper and got ďyour action failedĒ. I also targeted ss3p and got NOT MIGRANT.

My logic was that I wanted to target people who I didnít have an organic read on.

I'm legit not sure what to say or really how to defend against this - really, with this information voting me is probably the right move, but well. I know from my role information that I'm the Vanilla Gossip, and would absolutely be happy to submit to the lie detector test for it, because I know what I am. Unless I'm somehow insane or secretly 3P without knowing it, I guess? I have one last invitation to send to the masonry, and I'd be happy to send it to whoever.

I will say this, and again, noting I lack any sort of meta knowledge or context, but: it seems a little odd to me that in a game with a supposedly five - five! - cop roles, a couple of inventors, and so on, one of the powers the scum would get would be to... invite people into a masonry? (And I hope the masonry I create is at least accepted as real, with both Max and Bif confirming - d'be a hell of a scum ploy, I guess.) No, I think it's much more likely from my perspective some of our cops are insane or not telling the truth entirely. As such, futile as it may be, I'm gonna ##vote MMT mostly out of self-defense at the moment, but we'll see.

Hal Insandenza
Feb 12, 2004




Max can you see bif and SS3P convos from before you were in the masonry?

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Max
Nov 30, 2002



Scum have had the power to create masonries in other shine games before.

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