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OnimaruXLR
Sep 15, 2007
Lurklurklurklurklurk

Flamboyant Murderer was an orphan because of a cascade of misfortune (his mother died, and the midwives got into a fight because they were afraid of taking the blame, and his father came home to find his son newborn among a pile of bodies), there isn't nececssarily a specific connection to the Xi You court shennanigans

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Phobophilia
Apr 26, 2008
This space intentionally left blank.


Also SPK's house was seperated from the SBD by an entire canyon of wasteland.

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



And another great episode. At this point it's the normal thing, we are being accustomed to greatness.

An incredible fight scene to start with, Lin being smooth as hell, funny banter, nice chemistry between monk and princess, it was a complete episode. Urobochi also covers well possible plot holes, like why Shang didn't use the index against that formidable enemy, or what the new enemies think of Lin, they aren't really that stupid.

Turin Turambar fucked around with this message at 16:46 on May 8, 2021

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010

No way...


College Slice

Turin Turambar posted:

And another great episode. At this point it's the normal thing, we are being accustomed to greatness.

An incredible fight scene to start with, Lin being smooth as hell, funny banter, nice chemistry between monk and princess, it was a complete episode. Urobochi also covers well possible plot holes, like why Shang didn't use the index against that formidable enemy, or what the new enemies think of Lin, they aren't really that stupid.

I feel like in some cases its worth examining it like a D&D session; Demon Lady fumbled her persuasion roll (and her pride prevents her from giving a longer more substantial explanation other than "This evil man foiled my plans once!") and the General and Mantis Boy fumbled their Insight checks where they got an ambiguous reading that they read into it what they wanted or expected to hear.

But I didn't quite catch it, is there a specific reason for Shang not to use the Index, was it just being cautious of Ming preparing some kind of trap, or because Instrument Lady got injured before he could consider using it?


But yeah this is such a great series, I feel like this season has spoiled us a lot.

ElBrak
Aug 24, 2004

"Muerte, buen compinche. Muerte."

If a dude is schooling your rear end and he asks you to bring out your nuke, you might not wanna bring that nuke out. Just saying.

Lemon-Lime
Aug 6, 2009


Raenir Salazar posted:

its worth examining it like a D&D session

No, it isn't. Fiction does not work like a garbage roleplaying game.

e; vv

Darth Walrus posted:

This is an Urobuchi work, and he's an avid D&D player who's previously incorporated his experience into his writing.

The fact that Urobochi played RPGs has nothing to do with it. Characters in fiction act in a certain way because the author demands that they act that way to further the narrative they're constructing, not because the character ~failed a spot check~.

This isn't even "read another book" territory, it's "read literally any book, please, I'm begging you, and also play literally anything else."

Lemon-Lime fucked around with this message at 19:09 on May 8, 2021

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010

No way...


College Slice

Lemon-Lime posted:

No, it isn't. Fiction does not work like a garbage roleplaying game.

Yes, it is. Because if you're constantly nitpicking scenes based on "Why didn't they just talk to each other!" Like they're beep boop robots and not individuals with hang ups, personality quirks, and mistakes in communication, you're missing the point of fiction being about telling a story. Suggesting that there are underlying mechanics of one stripe or another to explain "immersion breaking behaviour" is just a means of facilitating someone's enjoyment of a creative work and avoid hyperanalyzing every bit of dialogue for plot holes.

It's just a specific way of rebranding "willing suspension of disbelief".

Darth Walrus
Feb 13, 2012




Lemon-Lime posted:

No, it isn't. Fiction does not work like a garbage roleplaying game.

This is an Urobuchi work, and he's an avid D&D player who's previously incorporated his experience into his writing.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010

No way...


College Slice

Darth Walrus posted:

This is an Urobuchi work, and he's an avid D&D player who's previously incorporated his experience into his writing.

I actually forgot about this, there was an anime iirc that was an adaption of a D&D game between him, the Monogatari guy, the Durarara author and others. Which is not to suggest that Urubuchi rolled some dice to determine how that scene played out; only that it is a useful way of reframing fiction to not get hung up on potential inconsistencies.

But, as I mentioned further up it is I think observable that the way Shang and others talk to each other is reminiscent of the way D&D/ttrpg players talk to each other when adventuring. So I think borrowing language from D&D and tabletop rpgs to describe and talk about Thunderbolt Fantasy is fairly apropos.

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



Raenir Salazar posted:


But I didn't quite catch it, is there a specific reason for Shang not to use the Index, was it just being cautious of Ming preparing some kind of trap, or because Instrument Lady got injured before he could consider using it?


Well, the bad guy goal was to steal the Index, and he is a powerful sorcerer (unlike our group of heroes), so I guess they were wary he had an ace under his sleeve to take it or gain power through it or whatever.

About Lin's scene, it made sense, because the writer only had to remind us that the alliance between the demon and the other guys is weak, it's more like an convenient arrangement, they may be bad guys but still consider the demonkind as the enemies of humankind. So it's totally admissible if some other human, like the Enigmatic Gale, fought against her before their current alliance, if she was doing some disgusting magic ritual or whatever. And Lin totally attacked the Mask's weak point, he doesn't consider himself an evil villain, he is working for his country.

Can Of Worms
Sep 4, 2011

That's not how the Triangle Attack works...


ElBrak posted:

If a dude is schooling your rear end and he asks you to bring out your nuke, you might not wanna bring that nuke out. Just saying.
Yes, that's basically what bard girl said to Shang during the fight right after the villain taunted him to bring out the index.

Turin Turambar posted:

And Lin totally attacked the Mask's weak point, he doesn't consider himself an evil villain, he is working for his country.
My understanding from that scene is that mask general is just playing along with Lin to avoid revealing that he doesn't trust him; after Lin and Xing Hai leave he admits that he is a "twisted lowlife" just like Lin.

The preview for the next episode look interesting, it suggests that we're going to meet more demons, possibly high ranking ones based on the episode title, so we might be getting some insight on demon politics.

Phobophilia
Apr 26, 2008
This space intentionally left blank.


Raenir Salazar posted:

I actually forgot about this, there was an anime iirc that was an adaption of a D&D game between him, the Monogatari guy, the Durarara author and others. Which is not to suggest that Urubuchi rolled some dice to determine how that scene played out; only that it is a useful way of reframing fiction to not get hung up on potential inconsistencies.

But, as I mentioned further up it is I think observable that the way Shang and others talk to each other is reminiscent of the way D&D/ttrpg players talk to each other when adventuring. So I think borrowing language from D&D and tabletop rpgs to describe and talk about Thunderbolt Fantasy is fairly apropos.

That was Chaos Dragon, and in the end it turned out total dogshit.

Anyway, the D&D comparison is at best a metaphor for how characters behave, it's not ideal. Lin's honeyed words were juuust good enough to slide through Xing Hai's angry complaints. And really, Wan Jun Po is only pretending to be taken in by Lin, and Lin knows that he's pretending. But Wan and Gui are misreading Lin's motivations, they think he's like every other power hungry rear end in a top hat who's out for themselves and after the power of the SSI. From Wan's perspective, if Lin hosed over Xing Hai, it was because Xing Hai was a direct threat to him (when really, it was Lin loving over Xing Hai because lmfao owned biatch). And so Wan would expect Lin to try and gently caress over the Order right as it's time to deliver the goods, but Lin's going to pre-empt them because sike! He was never after the Index in the first place!

Kwyndig
Sep 23, 2006

Heeeeeeey




Yes the Enigmatic Gale prefers to foil your plans well before they come to fruition, it's more fun to frustrate them in a way they can't get out of.

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gimme the GOD DAMN candy
Jul 1, 2007


he prefers to gloat about how he already hosed someone over and they helped lin do it to themselves every step of the way. jumping in, ruining an evil scheme on the spot and gloating about it really isn't lin's thing.

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