|
So with clone wars wrapping up I'm still wondering just how hard contemporary Mandalorian culture got wrecked during the clone wars if thirty years later their history of conflict with the Jedi has all but become a myth. Even if the Forgemaster was a Maul loyalist during their civil war, it's weird that she has taken such a hardline stance on what the Jedi were to Mandalorians, calling them sorcerers. Then again Mandalorians also decided to play Game of Thrones for a few years with noble houses during Rebels before falling back on their nomadic clan roots for the Mando tv show, so who knows what they believe or how knowledgable they are on any given day.
|
#
¿
May 2, 2020 13:45
|
|
|
|
| # ¿ Nov 9, 2025 18:45 |
|
|
Do the Manchurian candidate clones reactions to Order 66 stack up well against the Battlefront 2 version of events where they knew what was coming? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2lgG2ENW5Ac
|
|
#
¿
May 4, 2020 02:00
|
|
|
Okay so I've watch the episode now. Really good ending even if I still disagree with brainchips controlling the clones. I am honestly conflicted on The Clone Wars as a series. I always felt that it kneecapped itself whenever it was hitting a stride and I probably dislike more episodes than I actually enjoy. But when it is good it is really loving good, which makes its weaker episodes so frustrating. I think my biggest issue with the show is how its focus changed as the seasons progressed. Seasons 1-3 are my favourites because the show felt like more of an ensemble piece where we got to see the war from multiple perspectives, taking advantage of the breadth of stories you could tell during the timeframe. As the show went on the focus narrowed down to Anakin, Obi Wan, Ahsoka and Rex, and this was a two edged sword. On the one hand it allowed us to finally see the friendship of Anakin and Obi Wan get the coverage it needed, but it also meant that a lot of the side characters fell by the wayside, with some going for entire seasons without being shown and then appearing again for contrived reasons. The only reason that Barriss was the traitor who framed Ahsoka when she left the Order was because the show hadn't developed strong relationships with Ahsoka and many other characters (hell remember when they tried to give her a romance with Corkie?). So Barriss, who hadn't been seen since a cameo in season 3, is suddenly a traitor because they needed it to be a personal betrayal for Ahsoka. It felt contrived and it was the result of the narrowed focus clashing with the more vignette style of storytelling from the first seasons. And that's honestly more of what I liked. Beyond the Umbara arc in season 4 I really didn't care for anything in the later seasons, with Season 5 easily being the worst and the abridged Season 6 bringing up the awful biochip plot I can't stand and then frustratingly being the only time they gave Fives something interesting to do after Umbara. Even the stuff they've done for season 7 with the Bad Batch feels extraneous, since it's clear that their focus was on the Siege of Mandalore and the conclusion of Ahsoka and Rex's story. As a conclusion for the two of them, it's fantastic and easily stands as one of if not the best bits of Clone Wars ever. I just don't think it's the best conclusion for the series as a whole but that again goes back to my preference for the early stuff showing a wider story than for a sequential serial of Ahsoka's personal journey
|
|
#
¿
May 4, 2020 02:35
|
|
|
How about we don't go back to Rebels? Leave that where it is and do something new. I'm all for a Rise of the Empire show but it would have to deal with the impact of an immediate aftermath of the clone wars rather than jumping to the rebellion era again. Something without Jedi for a change. I feel that Disney star wars is at its best when it is doing something new, which is why Mandalorian is great fun and the Clone Wars finale was so good. Order 66 has had numerous depictions but treating it in such a personal manner that the finale did was pretty unique. But I think we need to step away from the Jedi and the Force for a while and do something else. I'm still waiting on my starfighter tv series, Dave. Give me Rogues or give me death. Hell, give me Confederate remnants who joined the CIS for independence reasons rather than their primary MIC backers and show them forming the first rebellion in the weeks after the clone wars ended, fighting a losing battle as the Empire mops up the remaining separatists who suddenly lack the power of a trillions strong droid army.
|
|
#
¿
May 4, 2020 07:00
|
|
|
My Lord isn't really that out of line for deferral to a Supreme leader.
|
|
#
¿
May 4, 2020 23:40
|
|
|
twistedmentat posted:I always preferred the idea that the Clones were unaware of their orders. Some media, like Battlefront 2's solo campaign suggested that the Clones knew all along what was going on and that just is mean. I'm glad that was made non-canon now. I honestly prefer them knowing what was going to happen. It's a dilemma of loyalty to friends or loyalty to the state. And the clones are ultimately soldiers while the Jedi are not. Some definitely take the moral stand and refuse the order while others follow orders to the letter. I don't know how anyone could listen to Tem Morrison's narration in Battlefront 2 and not see the layers to it when he's discussing clone reactions to Order 66.
|
|
#
¿
May 5, 2020 02:50
|
|
|
But everyone loves exaggerated jerky animations making up for a lack of quality animation because funny! Just like we love idiot protagonists who don't take anything seriously but the rest of the cast just shakes their head at that little scamp and his wacky ways! ... What do you mean Resistance is getting cancelled???
|
|
#
¿
May 5, 2020 14:38
|
|
|
The basic clone troopers were definitely not mindless flesh automatons in the old canon. Even the flash grown spaarti clones that were implied to be lesser than the kamino clones were still bright and capable of free thinking and moral objections. The Empire pretty quickly began phasing out Jango Fett clone production because of the number of mutinies during Order 66 and the later Clone Rebellion because the working theory was that an entire army built from the same template was too susceptible to corruption. If one clone is able to be influenced to choose friendship over duty then so are others. Saying that the old canon didn't differentiate clones, be they troopers up to ARC Troopers is being reductive. Perhaps not to the extent of regular clones customizing their helmet patterns like TCW but still plenty of characterization. The big difference in the old canon is the relationship between the clones and the Jedi, which is a lot more complicated than in TCW. One thing clone wars doesn't really touch on is that Jedi were never trained to be military commanders. Some took to it well like Anakin and Obi Wan while others waffled on tactics because they aren't generals. And no this is not limited to Karen Traviss books. Plenty of clones in legends had trouble with their commanders because of the Jedi inexperience with warfare. Commando units took 50% casualties on geonosis by being deployed as frontline infantry. Ad-hoc Jedi units like the Padawan Pack were slaughtered leaving clones without ranking officers. Yoda, who was a capable commander, was intentionally sidelined by Palpatine because he was leading the grand army too well and throwing a wrench into Sheev's plans to bleed the Jedi dry. The working relationship between the Jedi and the Clones was touchy a lot of the time, with people like Quinlan Vos surviving Order 66 due to his inherent mistrust of the clones. Clone wars usually treats the Jedi as superhuman warriors leading from the front and earning the trust of their men. For a show that is more interested in the emotional relationship between characters than the professional relationship, the show doesn't always go in depth with discussions of tactics and the proper roles that Jedi are suited for. Meanwhile Legends was full of pedantic nerd authors who loved that poo poo. Seriously the 501st Journal is a bafflingly good bit of writing for a tacked on singleplayer campaign in Battlefront 2 good version. Arc Hammer fucked around with this message at 04:41 on May 6, 2020 |
|
#
¿
May 6, 2020 04:39
|
|
|
bunnyofdoom posted:Side note: Read up on the Padawan Pack and what the appeared, and holy poo poo it seems to be a stupid Dark and edgy for sake of Dark and Edgy bullshit. Oh yeah I'm not defending the quality of the writing, but I am using the scenario as an example of the kind of difficulties the Jedi faced in the old canon. The Battle of Jabiim as a concept is neat as a major hurdle in the early days of the clone wars, but its execution in the comics leaves a lot to be desired. Thank god for the New Essential Chronology. It may have errors and literally ends on a cliffhanger but it does an admirable job of turning decades of contradictory star wars media into a readable account that is often more compelling than the actual books.
|
|
#
¿
May 6, 2020 15:50
|
|
|
Disney has a rather unpleasant relationship with Stormtroopers where they're comic relief, take horrendous cannon fodder casualties, and then also get disturbing backstories about indoctrination and kidnapping. They at once treat them even more callously than the OT while also giving them more depth while seemingly not noticing the issue with the violence inflicted on them.
|
|
#
¿
May 6, 2020 18:24
|
|
|
Solo brought back the Imperial Army from Legends to make a distinction between the Corps and the regular army. But even the Stormtroopers in Solo were average Joe's who shot the poo poo with one another. Same with the Scouts in Mandalorian. They're just people.
|
|
#
¿
May 6, 2020 21:43
|
|
|
I can't believe I'm saying this, but I have to give props to Kevin Kiner. I've never really been a fan of his music since it sounds like budget Williams and that's often the worst approach to take when doing Star Wars music. That being said, he did a bang up job with Season 7. I know that you can't always get a full orchestra to do show tunes, but what he put out for this season was quite good. Good job, Kiner. And now to walk back all that praise by saying he's never made a tune as catchy as several of the Mandalorian tracks Ludwig Göransson pumped out. That show's musical identity is built out of Rocky Balboa, Ennio Morricone and Chambara films and it is awesome. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wf9t_ack258
|
|
#
¿
May 7, 2020 03:43
|
|
|
That's the trouble when you go an humanize an antagonist. It makes it harder to pull the trigger. They don't have to be right, but they are still human. The sequels have got an utterly hosed disconnect between intentionally tragic enemy grunts and the traditional star wars need to see Stormtroopers brutalized.
|
|
#
¿
May 7, 2020 03:56
|
|
|
Guys, it was already explained how the homestead burned down, and we didn't even need one of those STAR WARS EXPLAINED/THEORIES/DECODED videos to do it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvigB7GFqJ8
|
|
#
¿
May 7, 2020 04:12
|
|
|
I do like the way that Clone Wars recontextualizes Obi-Wan's knowledge of Anakin and Padme's relationship. In the show it's blatantly obvious that Obi-Wan knows what is up between the two. Thing is, I don't think it's ever made clear that Padme knows that he knows. So when he visits her in Sith and drops the bomb that he knows Anakin is the father, instead of it being a reveal that he finally knows why Padme is reluctant to help him find Vader, it is instead an admission by Obi-Wan that he knew the whole time and it's more like he's trying to let her know how much he cares for both of them rather than admonishing her.
|
|
#
¿
May 7, 2020 19:53
|
|
|
https://twitter.com/Polygon/status/1258867498121752576 Well, poo poo.
|
|
#
¿
May 8, 2020 21:43
|
|
|
Phylodox posted:I mean, if anyone can bring back Boba Fett and have it not be stupid, it's the guy who brought back Darth Maul and had it not be stupid. It took them a loooooooong time to rehabilitate Maul. Unless you think that bringing up his brother Savage Oppress for two whole episodes before giving us Spider Gollum Maul was good writing.
|
|
#
¿
May 8, 2020 23:42
|
|
|
Mando was definitely rescued by Death Watch prior to the events of Season 7, which makes me wonder if the Mandalorians returning to their nomadic roots was already in motion before the Siege went down and was only finalized when the Empire strip mined the planet and slaughtered the clans
|
|
#
¿
May 9, 2020 14:37
|
|
|
I'm not sure if I'd want to give him oversight on everything. Filoni has done a lot of good but what we really need is more experimentation rather than finding one thing that works and sticking with that. He managed to end Clone Wars well, but I still hold that on the whole the show tended to be on the weaker side more often than not. We need more out there ideas that are able to be properly explored rather than just going "this show did well and our movies have been mangled, double down on Mandalorian!" A good ending can make up for a lot of crap, but I don't enjoy thinking about all the junk I'd have to wade through on a rewatch of all of Clone Wars. There's plenty of stuff in there is rather not view again.
|
|
#
¿
May 10, 2020 04:03
|
|
|
Has anything been said about Mandalorian coming to Blu Ray?
|
|
#
¿
May 11, 2020 04:35
|
|
|
Or most of clone wars season 5. Just sloppy sloppy stuff that season compounded by issues that had been nagging at the show in previous seasons rearing their ugly head.
|
|
#
¿
May 11, 2020 14:39
|
|
|
I often find im alone on this but I found season 5 to be far weaker than the other seasons. It's where most of my issues with Ahsoka come to a head, namely her lack of meaningful interaction with many characters outside of Anakin Obi Wan and Rex. The whole notion that she was betrayed by a close friend in The Wrong Jedi doesn't land very well when that close friend is Barriss, who had all but vanished from the show after her two parter in season 2. I've said my part about Maul. He ended his run much, much better than he started, but his first few episodes at the end of season 4 through season 5 were pretty dire. Overall season 5 feels really rushed and compacted, with them tying together different plots that don't have much in common for the sake of contriving reasons to get characters together and resolve hanging plots as quickly as possible. Or they were giving us pointless nonsense like A Sunny Day in the Void. Most of the season just didn't do anything for me. The Onderon arc I bounced off of pretty hard, which I chalk up to my aversion to Corkie. Arc Hammer fucked around with this message at 15:23 on May 11, 2020 |
|
#
¿
May 11, 2020 15:20
|
|
|
I will say though that my least favourite episodes are the ones that have to do with The Force, and that goes for Rebels as well. The Mortis episodes, Yoda's vision quest with Gollum Yoda and the Bendu are all episodes of can't stand. Witwer, you're a great Maul, but the Son sounds like you were channeling your inner Starkiller and put your balls in a vice to sound that whiny and petulant.
|
|
#
¿
May 11, 2020 15:26
|
|
|
I've just never found placing an organizational structure on the Force to be that interesting. Jedi and Sith and Nightsister are all constructs of sentient species, making the Balance of the Force into a literal Father/Son/Daughter dynamic or a bunch of floating space mimes being Force Guardians or the Bendu being a physical embodiment of "the middle" is just stupid. There is a lot to be said about how "the middle" side of the Force isn't an actual philosophy, but is instead a refusal to choose and just delaying the inevitable. The fault of the Force lies not in the Force itself but in the organizations that wield it. Giving the Force figures of authority not beholden to these structures just feels wrong. Arc Hammer fucked around with this message at 15:50 on May 11, 2020 |
|
#
¿
May 11, 2020 15:44
|
|
|
There's enough weird and wild ways they could explore the subject matter without using such blatantly obvious original sin allegory. Again I just feel that explaining the motivations of the Force on its own terms rather than through a person's interpretation of The Force cheapens it. Kreia wouldn't be nearly as interesting am antagonist in KOTOR 2 if her working theory that the Force was actively malevolent turned out to be true.
|
|
#
¿
May 11, 2020 16:02
|
|
|
Just to be clear I'm not trying to change people's minds on this since I'm definitely in a minority with my opinions. I have my issues with the show but it's not like I can really change how they were released or what they wanted to cover. It's simply stuff I don't care much for or stuff I think they didn't do a particularly good job exploring.
|
|
#
¿
May 11, 2020 16:54
|
|
|
Teek posted:Nobody post this yet? New Hot Toys Captain Rex revealed. They're going to start doing more Clone Wars stuff. Now imagine him being chubby with a beard and walking around in stormtrooper armour like he poo poo his adult diaper. Stupid Rebels.
|
|
#
¿
May 13, 2020 04:40
|
|
|
Or you could end up with the wonky alien designs from the prison barge episode. Clancy Brown looked okay as a devaronian and Game of Thrones Osha was a good twilek the but the Twilek guy looked terrifying.
|
|
#
¿
May 13, 2020 05:15
|
|
|
The virgin Bib Fortuna versus the Chad Syndulla.
|
|
#
¿
May 13, 2020 05:30
|
|
|
The Tie Defender is an overdesigned, super expensive crutch for pilots who can't achieve similar results in a Tie Avenger.
|
|
#
¿
May 16, 2020 18:46
|
|
|
Funky Valentine posted:Counterpoint: it looks rad as poo poo Still prefer the Avenger. 
|
|
#
¿
May 16, 2020 18:51
|
|
|
Vinylshadow posted:The Star Wars: Darth Vader: Dark Lord of the Sith comics went into that and its really good Really hitting that Dark Forces colon vibe.
|
|
#
¿
Jun 19, 2020 02:33
|
|
|
To be honest I'd rather see an Aphra and Vader buddy cop series where he constantly threatens to kill her while she gets away with bullshit amounts of luck rather than read through that comic where a nurse falls in love with Vader again.
|
|
#
¿
Jun 30, 2020 00:06
|
|
|
If it drums up interest for a Republic/Imperial Commando game ill take it. Sev is never coming home is he? 
|
|
#
¿
Jul 13, 2020 19:00
|
|
|
I think Bad Batch would have been less contentious if season 7 had been longer and it wasn't seen as taking up "valuable" episode space.
|
|
#
¿
Jul 13, 2020 19:46
|
|
|
While I commend him fir being very talented, he's never going to replace Tem Morrison in my eyes.
|
|
#
¿
Jul 13, 2020 22:52
|
|
|
You could have had another Sunny Day in the Void situation. Or loving Corkie and his Scooby-Doo investigation into poisoned tea smuggling on Mandalore what the gently caress was going on in Season 3 that made them think that was a good followup to the great season 2 Mando episodes.
|
|
#
¿
Jul 14, 2020 06:26
|
|
|
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IEZZjYneQqQ I'll take this over Bad Batch.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 12, 2020 17:42
|
|
|
Sev is Alive and living witha Geonosian who looks like his mother and I will hear nothing to the contrary. He can't be dead.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 12, 2020 17:55
|
|
|
|
| # ¿ Nov 9, 2025 18:45 |
|
|
Just keep the four voice actors for Delta Squad instead of relying on Baker. They've brought back Morrison and the only work I can see Raphael Sabarge getting any time soon is the new Mass Effect game. Delta is great and they should get their own show.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 13, 2020 07:21
|
|