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Discussion Quorum
Dec 5, 2002
Armchair Philistine


I just spun up two spare Raspberry Pis and put them to work on TN-Grid

Last time I looked at that project they were doing some sort of botany project that didn't seem too interesting to me, so I kinda lost track of them until all of this stuff started up. Seems like a lot of others did the same, because there are only a few really active teams (besides Gridcoin). We have 9 goons, not all of whom are active, and just broke the top 20. If nothing else it's worth adding for when your Rosetta WUs dry up.

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Discussion Quorum
Dec 5, 2002
Armchair Philistine


I've been wondering the same thing. I doubt a farm of SBCs would be as good on a performance per dollar basis as a cheap old x64 box with plenty of RAM. Maybe not on a performance per watt metric either. Even more so for GPU-enabled apps.

For reference, I have an old Android phone running a variety of projects. An Asteroids WU takes around 15-16 hours, vs 15 minutes on my GTX 1070. I also have a pair of Pi 3B+ running TN-Grid. They turn around 4 WUs every 15-18 hours, vs my Ryzen 2600X which can do 12 every 3 hours if I run it flat out. I am only running these because they were laying around and every cycle helps right now.

My curiousity is more towards used corporate SFF desktops. You can get them with 8GB of RAM and an i5-4xxx for less than $150. I haven't looked but I bet a first-gen Ryzen and 350-based board would be pretty cheap as well, except for the cost of DDR4 RAM.

Speaking of Pis, they finally pushed me over the edge to get my top 10% badge for TN-Grid (after sitting as the highest-ranked 25%'er for a while) It ain't gonna get better than that so I feel free start running some Rosetta and WCG again.

Discussion Quorum fucked around with this message at 19:07 on Apr 19, 2020

Discussion Quorum
Dec 5, 2002
Armchair Philistine


New project targeting CoViD-19:

https://www.csic.es/es/actualidad-d...-busca-farmacos
https://boinc.ibercivis.es/

It's in Spanish but they're looking for existing antiviral drugs that could be used to treat CoViD. Not many users yet but I gather that the team (or at least the institution) has run BOINC projects in the past. Looks like there are no work units available at the moment but having literally just launched, that's not really surprising - there are about 25k tasks currently in progress though.

Discussion Quorum
Dec 5, 2002
Armchair Philistine


Tuxide posted:

TN-Grid seems to be on the final stretch of what they're currently doing for COVID-19. The current relevant batch of workunits there start with a prefix going from 165735_Hs to 166977_Hs, and they seem to have been assigning these in order. I'm currently seeing a 166813_Hs on my own list of tasks.

That's only about 50% of the way there (~55% based on the highest task in my queue, 867). I do like the transparency so that we can measure progress, though.

edit: actually you're right, it's >90%, I am blind and misread the lower number

Discussion Quorum fucked around with this message at 03:23 on Apr 25, 2020

Discussion Quorum
Dec 5, 2002
Armchair Philistine


vodkat posted:

Does anyone have any recommendations or posts elsewhere about energy/price efficient ways to setup a little bionic farm? I really like the idea of having a few machines linked together running bionic, ideally some sort of cheapish single board computer that won't be a massive energy drain. Obviously there seem to be quite a lot of people doing this with raspberry pi's but I was wondering if there are other options out in the flood of single board computers, maybe some with gpu's optimised for machine learning or whatever?

As I often turn out to be, I might have been wrong in dismissing SBCs on a price/performance basis. Obviously if your budget is $50 for hardware and ~$0 for power, a Pi is the way to go, but I assumed that by any measure a modern CPU would blow it away. Well, I started noodling around on the idea of "used mid-spec computer vs used lovely cheap corporate box" and made this. Lots of assumptions that could be dumb in there, but based on said assumptions the Pi 3 and especially Pi 4 could win handily on total cost/performance.

Based on this and my lack of space for building a dedicated crunchbox at the moment, I may supplement my Pi 3's with a couple more recent SBCs. The new Odroid C-4 looks like it may be good for this if it truly delivers Pi 4 performance without the heat issues.

The flip side of course is that a Pi is still low-throughput, and a Pi farm that matches the output of any reasonably powerful PC would be a lot of space/work/etc. But if you want to donate $5-$15/mo in total value on CPU projects and don't mind a bit of computer janitoring, it looks like it's actually not a waste of money.

On another note, it looks like a on a per-core basis a Google Cloud Compute n1 vCPU can do gene@home tasks ~4-5x as fast as a Pi 3B+, meaning each vCPU is ~1-1.25 Pis at ~$18-$25/mo per vCPU. Not a good deal if you're looking for another way to do small-dollar donations without a lot of heat or physical computer touching (but there is a $200 free trial credit...).

Discussion Quorum
Dec 5, 2002
Armchair Philistine


I didn't have time to do much more than skim the Ibercivis thing previously, but here is a translation of the first couple paragraphs for some more context:

quote:

Encontrar un fármaco utilizado en el tratamiento de otras enfermedades virales que actúe contra el coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) es el propósito del proyecto de ciencia ciudadana COVID-PHYM, impulsado por el Consejo Superior de Investigaciones Científicas (CSIC) y la Fundación Ibercivis. Puesto que algunos medicamentos en uso ya han demostrado ser suficientemente seguros para la salud humana, podrían estar disponibles para tratar a pacientes con COVID-19 mucho antes que un compuesto de nueva creación y, por tanto, acelerar el control de la pandemia.

Bajo esta premisa, el grupo Biophym del Instituto de Estructura de la Materia del CSIC se ha propuesto realizar simulaciones de la interacción de fármacos empleados contra el ébola, la infección por VIH, la gripe o la hepatitis B con la maquinaria de replicación del genoma del virus SARS-Co-V. Para ello recurrirá a técnicas informáticas y a la ayuda de los ordenadores de miles de personas voluntarias conectadas a través de la plataforma de computación distribuida de Ibercivis. Estas operaciones mostrarán si alguna de las moléculas logra inhibir una proteína clave en la multiplicación del virus denominada ‘ARN polimerasa dependiente de ARN’. De ser así, el fármaco se convertiría en un candidato idóneo para ser probado en ensayos clínicos con personas.

quote:

The proposal of the citizen science project COVID-PHYM is to find pharmaceuticals used in the treatment of other illnesses that are effective against SARS-CoV-2, led by the Superior Council of Scientific Investigations (CSIC) and the Ibercivis Foundation. Since some medications in use have already been demonstrated to be sufficiently safe for human health, they could be available to treat patients with COVID-19 much sooner than a newly created compound, therefore accelerating the control of the pandemic.

Based on this premise, the Biophym Material Structure group of CSIC has proposed to create simulations of the interactions of drugs employed against ebola, AIDS, influenza, and hepatitis B against the genetic replication mechanism of the SARS-CoV virus. For this it will turn to information technology and the help of the computers of thousands of volunteers connected through the distributed computation platform of Ibercivis. These operations will demonstrate if any of the molecules are able to inhibit a key protein in the replication of the virus called "RNA-dependent RNA polymerase"*. If successful, this drug could be converted into a candidate for human clinical trials.

* I'm not a biologist and had to guess at the RNA stuff with the help of Google, could be off there

Discussion Quorum
Dec 5, 2002
Armchair Philistine


mdxi posted:

lso, I looked at your spreadsheet. I couldn't tell if you were amortizing hardware costs across some span of time, or if you were estimating that a Ryzen 3600 would use over $50 of electricity per month

Total cost per month is: depreciation + (electric cost per kWh) * watts * (hours/mo) * (1 + cooling factor)/1000

Depreciation is over 36 months assuming most things have some residual value that can be recaptured (eBay or re-use on an upgraded system, etc.). Electric cost is my incremental cost per kWh. Watts is an estimate from the Outervision PSU calculator. Cooling factor (currently 120%) assumes that for every "watt" of heat generated, the A/C will have to expend 1.2 watts to cool the room back down. That's a SWAG but it seems like it would have to be >1.

The cloud instance in this case is a 2-core "high CPU", not one of the shared core instances. Looks like it is hard-throttled to a certain performance threshold since BOINC measured it at exactly 1 billion ops/s across both projects it's running. It's still far more expensive than comparable hardware, though.

Discussion Quorum
Dec 5, 2002
Armchair Philistine


TN-Grid staff commented that there are still CoViD-19 related work units coming through, but they are now mixed in with non-CoViD units. They specifically gave ENPEP and TMPRSS2 as examples although I don't have any of those currently. On Rosetta, over 3/4 of my tasks are currently tagged COVID-19 so it certainly seems like the pace has picked up. I was running 100% TN-Grid but am now winding down that queue in favor of Rosetta, so goons may slip a bit. Sorry

Apparently Ibercivis is using the default BOINC credit mechanism which is bad and has some people annoyed? IDK, I'd rather they prioritize science (and generating more WUs, I haven't had any in a while) over developing a better credit mechanism but up-going numbers are important to a lot of people.

Discussion Quorum
Dec 5, 2002
Armchair Philistine


I talked myself out of building a farm of ODroid C4s on the basis that I didn't really have a way to make a case. Then I got the email that my local makerspace has come up with a way to reopen. A farm of efficient SBCs would be better for my situation than another PC puking out fan noise and hot air, and I'm holding off for Zen3/Ampere before I upgrade. And I have some extra acrylic laying around. I'm bored and want a project but there are probably more productive things I could do right now. We shall see.

In bad-but-maybe-good news, the fans on my GTX 1070 are dying and I'm still in warranty. Sounds like a lot of people are getting 2070s or 2070 Supers as replacments so fingers crossed

e: card is fine, I am dumb

Discussion Quorum fucked around with this message at 01:51 on May 4, 2020

Discussion Quorum
Dec 5, 2002
Armchair Philistine


More or less. I was going to hold off on upgrading anything until Zen4/Ampere, then get the midrange CPU and whatever the most cost-effective 4k60 GPU is, be it a 2070 Super or 3060 or 3070 or whatever. The result should be a computer that will last me a very long time. So I didn't really need an upgrade but having something nicer to sell would have reduced the net cost

mdxi posted:

... with a little bit of "god I need to do something" on the side. I'm currently trying to channel that feeling into something that doesn't involve spending money.

This is 100% where I was when thinking about building an SBC farm - do something but scaled back a bit. I realized during this GPU fiasco, though, that I could buy a used 1650 (or 1060) and probably make a much bigger dent in computing needs than a fleet of even C4s/Pi4s/etc., and for less money and way less computer touching. So now I feel mentally free to spend my time on something else and if I still feel the itch, throw a $150 GPU at GPUGRID/OpenPandemics(?).

Unrelated, anyone else getting wildly inconsistent times on ibercivis tasks (when you get them at all)? I've got some finishing in 3 hours and others estimating almost 15. (e: I think it's just bad at estimating time required, a lot of those tasks are already done)

Discussion Quorum fucked around with this message at 22:49 on May 4, 2020

Discussion Quorum
Dec 5, 2002
Armchair Philistine


I realized today that my PC will be right by the thermostat in the new apartment we're moving to. Only other place to put it is the bedroom, which is even more problematic. Positioning may help but otherwise RIP my RAC. Gonna cronch hard for the next few weeks while I figure out a more thermally appropriate way to donate a bit each month. SBCs probably.

Relevant: http://web.eece.maine.edu/~vweaver/...n_machines.html

Discussion Quorum
Dec 5, 2002
Armchair Philistine


I was surprised to see my task list so full of OPN work this morning considering I got all of zero beta units. Also it looks like it's on Android too - I have an old phone running WCG and Rosetta which has a ton of OPN tasks.

Discussion Quorum
Dec 5, 2002
Armchair Philistine


mdxi posted:

The beta didn't initially include ARM (it's not just Android, it's also Linux on ARM), but they added it during the second phase, I think.

Yeah but I didn't get any on PC either. Granted I was mainly running Rosetta and Ibercivis (whenever WUs were available, anyways) so my WCG work rate fell off a fair bit. I've also never gotten a single Africa Rainfall task, although I know that one is sensitive to machine settings and haven't really investigated the matter.

Rexxed posted:

I didn't realize there was a BOINC for android. I have like 50 phones that used to be for GPT earning stuff that aren't in use right now, might put a few on there and see how hot they get.

Mine doesn't get very hot, but it's a lovely old Moto G5S+ so YMMV. It is slightly warm to the touch, warm enough that I don't use it on my current phone but that's mostly out of paranoia around wanting to make the battery last as long as possible. I don't care about the Moto because I sold it on eBay, it got returned because "wifi doesn't work" (yes it does), and I don't give enough of a poo poo to try to sell it again for < $50

You don't have a full selection of projects but I run Rosetta, some WCG projects (mainly SCC and now OPN), and Asteroids.

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Discussion Quorum
Dec 5, 2002
Armchair Philistine


I found that Ibercivis tasks were hard to get for a while, although during the week if I force an update in the morning (US, early afternoon Spanish time) I seem to have better luck.

GPUGrid work seems to have dried up for me as well, so I grab a batch of Asteroids every now and then. Might go back to running F@H until OPN comes out with a GPU client.

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