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I think that's one of those things where a huge pundit got a bee in his bonnet about some harmless thing and mobilized his legions of hateful ghoul supporters to pester the city. I forget which pundit though.
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Jul 13, 2019 10:19
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Lurdiak posted:I think that's one of those things where a huge pundit got a bee in his bonnet about some harmless thing and mobilized his legions of hateful ghoul supporters to pester the city. I forget which pundit though. As I understand it, Sohrab Ahmari first got the conservative press riled up about it, and it then trickled from there to Breitbart. As far as I know the main impetus behind the contrived protests is Facebook astroturfing by the usual TERF "mom" groups.
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Jul 13, 2019 10:27
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I just woke up and my brain instantly reminded me that skwirls post is a thing that actually exists, in real life, so thanks for ruining my morning
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Jul 13, 2019 14:52
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site posted:I just woke up and my brain instantly reminded me that skwirls post is a thing that actually exists, in real life, so thanks for ruining my morning I deleted the comments because they upset you. I didn't mean to hurt you, but I did and that sucks and I'm sorry.
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Jul 13, 2019 17:02
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i think you misunderstand, it's not that the comment hurt me, it's that it was an entirely asinine take. like, who here do you think needed to be told that drag and being trans are two different concepts? is that something you would feel comfortable tweeting at lilah?
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Jul 13, 2019 17:22
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site posted:i think you misunderstand, it's not that the comment hurt me, it's that it was an entirely asinine take. like, who here do you think needed to be told that drag and being trans are two different concepts? is that something you would feel comfortable tweeting at lilah? Even in TYOOL 2019, there are still a loooooot of people who lump gay, trans, "drag", and all other nonbinary into one big pile.
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Jul 13, 2019 17:29
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while true, i do not suspect that there are many, if any, in this particular audience, who do. nor do i think lilah herself would and if there are somehow people who visit this thread that still do not understand the difference after a couple years of talking about trans issues just in the time i've been here, well that does make me feel bad that 1. i, or any other trans poster, have apparently not been able to get through, or even worse 2. that people just dont care enough to learn and integrate this site fucked around with this message at 17:36 on Jul 13, 2019 |
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Jul 13, 2019 17:32
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https://twitter.com/kylaTea/status/1150070277776334849
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Jul 13, 2019 19:58
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Wait is Jimmy Palmiotti tied up in that poo poo? You'd think being married to a prominent woman creator would preclude that but I've seen people do shittier things.
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Jul 14, 2019 11:27
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Dreqqus posted:Wait is Jimmy Palmiotti tied up in that poo poo? You'd think being married to a prominent woman creator would preclude that but I've seen people do shittier things. If you aren't extremely online it's easy for the gaters to frame things in a way that makes them look like victims. There was some writer who when they first heard about it was all "of course they shouldn't be censoring and black listing creators just for being conservative" then some of their friends who knew what was going on clued them in and they were like "oh, seriously? gently caress those guys with a cactus."
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Jul 14, 2019 17:03
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Skwirl posted:If you aren't extremely online it's easy for the gaters to frame things in a way that makes them look like victims. There was some writer who when they first heard about it was all "of course they shouldn't be censoring and black listing creators just for being conservative" then some of their friends who knew what was going on clued them in and they were like "oh, seriously? gently caress those guys with a cactus."
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Jul 14, 2019 17:10
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FMguru posted:I'm convinced the reason the original GG got as much traction as it did is because its surface-level claim to be about "ethics in videogame journalism" really struck a chord in gamers who noticed just how godawful and corrupt 99% of videogame journalism actually is. Eh, not really. While there are plenty of valid complaints about videogame journalism, the complaints that GG brought forth were total nonsense and it mostly caught on with the bandwagon of people who got upset over a Zelda game not getting a high enough score or whatever. It was *never* about even the surface-level ethics in video games journalism, it was about politics and cliques in video games journalism. From the start GG was just an excuse to use 'ethics' to get their own way, the same as people talking about politics in comic books being something new, and that was plain from the start. The people who latched onto it weren't looking for ethics in games journalism, they were looking to make people stop talking about uncomfortable subjects in games. There was no point in GG history where they discussed actual ethics or journalistic integrity unless it involved trying to make someone stop calling bikini chainmail stupid. I think it's important to note this because otherwise it gives people an excuse for their behavior. "No, see, I DID genuinely care about ethics in video games" only works if they even made the surface-level attempt to do that but they didn't. Nobody who paid even an iota of attention to GG would make any mistake about what their focus was. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 17:36 on Jul 14, 2019 |
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Jul 14, 2019 17:33
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There's this con called Tokyo in Tulsa that decided the best place to position their Artist Alley was an abandoned Hobby Lobby 4 miles away https://twitter.com/elefluff/status/1149170024680239104?s=20 https://twitter.com/auroradesu/status/1149692910784471041?s=20 Naturally they're getting dragged east to west on Twitter, so the best course of action was to start tossing out the artists who complain. https://twitter.com/nerdandtie/status/1150270335725576192
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Jul 14, 2019 18:14
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Dreqqus posted:Wait is Jimmy Palmiotti tied up in that poo poo? You'd think being married to a prominent woman creator would preclude that but I've seen people do shittier things. The only thing I can recall (aside from this, I guess) was being one of the folks who jumped to Frank Tieri's defense when he was threatening a critic. And Tucci's been playing this centrist card for a while now, so maybe that's Palmiotti's thing too.
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Jul 14, 2019 18:26
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Honestly from reading Palmiotti’s twitter for a while he just seems kind of dim
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Jul 14, 2019 18:37
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This is where the cliquishness of any small industry comes into play. Frank Tieri is not really Comicsgate affiliated in any way that I've seen cited, but he's also an older straight white dude who probably has done a dozen things that could be labelled problematic by modern readers in print and social media. He responded absolutely terribly on Twitter to some people who would fall under the umbrella of "anti-Comicsgate" or "progressive" or "SJW" or whatever else, and so that interaction was perceived as Anti-Anti-Comicsgate, or from Bounding in Comics or whatever rear end in a top hat's view, Pro-Comicsgate. Comicsgate aside, Tieri has been working in the industry forever and is old old friends with a whole gaggle of NYC comics pros who broke in during the 1990s, including Joe Quesada and Jimmy Palmiotti and Amanda Conner and Billy Tucci and etc. etc. That group all jumped to their sainted friend Francis's defense, which also put them in the perceived Anti-Anti-Comicsgate crew, and muddied the waters because a few of them (Tucci most notably, not so much any of the other people I've mentioned) are legitimately Comicsgate Adjacent, though not outspokenly so like an EVS or Mike S Miller way. So yeah, if you're not in the trenches and don't really seem to pay much attention to politics, Billy Tucci (a guy Palmiotti has known for 30+ years) wants Palmiotti to talk on a panel about crowdfunding/self-publishing (something Palmiotti is vocally proud about having done since the 1990s) alongside with a bunch of other white dudes that broke into comics in the 90s in New York and also some video game guy, I can see how you agree to this with no malice or deliberate endorsement of Comicsgate, given that only Tucci and Tenapiel have any connection to it that I can see. This doesn't change the fact that it's a panel in 2019 about crowdfunding comics that is comprised almost entirely of white dudes in their 50s from New York who broke into traditional comics publishing 25-30 years ago, which is myopic at best and insanely exclusionary in reality, but it doesn't follow that they're all Comicsgaters now either.
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Jul 14, 2019 18:46
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Dreqqus posted:Wait is Jimmy Palmiotti tied up in that poo poo? You'd think being married to a prominent woman creator would preclude that but I've seen people do shittier things. See also: the Breitweisers, including Elizabeth, the talented one. Plus Chris Sims appearing on progressive comics sites where they pretend he didn't lead a harassment campaign resulting in a woman's PTSD and ejection from comics - he likes Sailor Moon and Xena now! All is forgiven! (Not that he's CG, but his circumstances feel like the same ballpark) Space Fish fucked around with this message at 00:38 on Jul 15, 2019 |
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Jul 14, 2019 19:48
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Space Fish posted:See also: the Breitweisers, including Elizabeth, the talented one. Chris Sims has since publicly apologized and he is not the same person that did that poo poo anymore.
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Jul 14, 2019 20:23
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Space Fish posted:See also: the Breitweisers, including Elizabeth, the talented one. Comics Alliance issued a statement about it. They said they believed he changed, his apology sincere, the whole nine yards.
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Jul 14, 2019 21:09
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Unlucky7 posted:Chris Sims has since publicly apologized and he is not the same person that did that poo poo anymore. I'll also point out that in the years since that apology and trying to mend bridges the target of his "harassment" has sicced mobs on him twice. actually gently caress it since I'm going in on it: yeah no she sucks outright, her entire claim in the years since was "a freelancer kept me from getting more work" and it's been enough to rile up the uninformed repeatedly to hassle the guy who tried to break good. That's never been a level of power an occasional writer had at the company but there's always more people who don't know any details and just go "clearly the man was bad here" when aimed at him like a cannon. claw game handjob fucked around with this message at 21:15 on Jul 14, 2019 |
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Jul 14, 2019 21:13
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We're at a point in society where an apology isnt enough. The offenders entire life and livelihood has to be razed to the ground with no chance at being rebuilt.
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Jul 14, 2019 22:03
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Dawgstar posted:Comics Alliance issued a statement about it. They said they believed he changed, his apology sincere, the whole nine yards. Forgive my ignorance since I’m just now reading up on Comicsgate and following this thread, but what’s the deal with Sims? I always loved his coverage of Morrison’s Batman run, I’d hate to find out he’s a chud now.
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Jul 14, 2019 22:18
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Big Mean Jerk posted:Forgive my ignorance since I’m just now reading up on Comicsgate and following this thread, but what’s the deal with Sims? I always loved his coverage of Morrison’s Batman run, I’d hate to find out he’s a chud now. So the incident in question is this, and if you want to call me a biased party, I'm open to correction. Years ago, Sims is just a comics blogger, this is pre-CA, a lot of other stuff. He basically slams on Valerie D'Orazio a lot on his blog, some of it about her work, some of it about her. He is a bit of a dickbag at this time to more than a few writers he doesn't like, but there aren't many of those who are women for a lot of reasons*. Keep in mind that at this point I believe he has never been on more than a single comic book, if that, I forget the exact timeline on some of this since he deleted the egregious posts with the apology. Val's career begins waning as his star is rising, and the claim she makes is that Sims and a cabal of men at Marvel (I do not believe she ever claimed this is why DC won't hire her anymore) push her out of the company and stop hiring her. Years later when this comes up again because she begins trying to weaponize the claim, he looks back at his old writings, goes "Yeah, so, I didn't get her fired or anything, but I was an absolute shitheel, and I own that fact, and I want to say that I was a real prick and this is no longer the man I am." This apology is still on his website as far as I am aware. Val has, again, still launched two more mobs at Sims in the wake of metoo/comicsgate claiming Sims is why she doesn't work anymore. * obviously one of those being it's the late 2000s and there aren't a lot of women writers in comics claw game handjob fucked around with this message at 22:27 on Jul 14, 2019 |
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Jul 14, 2019 22:25
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Specifically, Sims was pals with the editor of Val's book at Marvel which was (I believe) Cloak and Dagger and was somehow instrumental in getting the book cancelled. I always wondered how this thing keeps getting brought up. At this point it's like holding James Gunn's 'earlier stuff against him.
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Jul 14, 2019 23:34
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He even put up an apology on Comics Alliance itself at the time.
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Jul 14, 2019 23:37
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Dawgstar posted:I always wondered how this thing keeps getting brought up. At this point it's like holding James Gunn's 'earlier stuff against him. As I said, I was completely unaware of it until it was mentioned on this page.
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Jul 15, 2019 00:08
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On Comics Alliance, no less!
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Jul 15, 2019 00:14
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Rhyno posted:We're at a point in society where an apology isnt enough. The offenders entire life and livelihood has to be razed to the ground with no chance at being rebuilt. I mean depending on what they've done I'm fine with it. EVS, for example,
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Jul 15, 2019 01:06
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Rhyno posted:We're at a point in society where an apology isnt enough. The offenders entire life and livelihood has to be razed to the ground with no chance at being rebuilt. I don't want Chris's life and career reduced to breaking rocks or anything. It was just a shallow jab! If the social gavel were mine, I would judge that he keep writing comics. "But he apologized" (on Comics Alliance, even!) runs somewhat counter to the apology he posted on his website, where he said: "This is not a plea for forgiveness, or a clean slate. If what I did changes how you feel about me and my work, that’s completely understandable; I was wrong, and in every way the bad guy." I used to root for Brian Wood until it turned out he used his position in comics to invite Tess Fowler to his hotel room at a convention, - running around on his pregnant wife, no less - then turning verbally hostile when she didn't return his advances. I think there's a difference between "that creator is not that type of person anymore" and "supporting creators who know well enough not to be that type of person to begin with." There has to be room for forgiveness somewhere in the middle, but ultimately forgiveness is up to each individual. Maybe everyone in comics has skeletons in their closet and would need some level of whoops-I-didn't-have-boundaries leeway if we knew the truth about them.
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Jul 15, 2019 01:07
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Yeah, Sims is one of the depressingly few examples of a sincere apology.
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Jul 15, 2019 01:12
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Things to say when you're a good Christian and definitely not a sex creep https://twitter.com/Dominique_Skye/status/1150542161714323456?s=20 https://twitter.com/lornadane3/status/1150470407214063617?s=20
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Jul 15, 2019 01:18
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Nevermind
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Jul 15, 2019 01:22
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FMguru posted:I'm convinced the reason the original GG got as much traction as it did is because its surface-level claim to be about "ethics in videogame journalism" really struck a chord in gamers who noticed just how godawful and corrupt 99% of videogame journalism actually is. In a similar vein to how a men's rights activist who actually gave a poo poo about men's rights would have a wholly different set of priorities, nobody in GG who claimed their quasi-movement was about "ethics in video game journalism" was actually doing anything that would address the issues that it has. If the surface-level claim attracted you to the movement and you didn't immediately notice it was a smokescreen, you were beyond help.
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Jul 15, 2019 02:37
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GG was started by some guy going "My ex is a worthless lying whore", and instantly thousands of guys who really care about Ethics In Journalism agreed and sympathized with him. Totally a legit thing to be sure.
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Jul 15, 2019 04:28
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ryonguy posted:GG was started by some guy going "My ex is a worthless lying whore", and instantly thousands of guys who really care about Ethics In Journalism agreed and sympathized with him. It's always been interesting (in an I cannot believe this way) that ComicsGate doesn't even have the thin veneer of 'ethics in game journalism.' CG started over women having a milkshake in honor of Marvel publisher Flo Steinberg. They put the 'we just want good comics!' spin on it, but really they were outraged minorities were in comics. Featured or working. It literally started with 'EW, GIRLS!' (None of whom actually wrote stuff for Marvel, they were all staff.)
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Jul 15, 2019 12:49
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ryonguy posted:GG was started by some guy going "My ex is a worthless lying whore", and instantly thousands of guys who really care about Ethics In Journalism agreed and sympathized with him. On top of it, it was this narrative that Zoe Quinn's games had been given glowing reviews or whatever you want to call it because she slept with the journalists at Kotaku but there were no reviews. It was all based on rumors and hearsay that fell apart under the slightest scrutiny and was just an excuse for sad guys to rage. It just metastasized into a big tent movement for misogyny and racism. A guy at one of my comic/game stores I went to actually believed that video games journalists were millionaires because video game companies make millions. It was just a ridiculous avalanche of bullshit that never had an inkling of truth to it despite the problems within the industry and the bribery that goes on, mainly because games journalism brings in so little money. RocknRollaAyatollah fucked around with this message at 15:45 on Jul 15, 2019 |
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Jul 15, 2019 14:01
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Especially considering the majority of the bribes journos gets is 'hey, give us a good review or we'll stop sending you review copies' or 'hey, come to this specially curated event to give you a good impression of our company and game that will color your review'. Which, to be fair, can be devastating to a small review site if it's not ready for it. But the idea that games journalists get millions, hell even HUNDREDS of dollars in bribes is ludicrous.
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Jul 16, 2019 00:17
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Flytrap posted:Especially considering the majority of the bribes journos gets is 'hey, give us a good review or we'll stop sending you review copies' or 'hey, come to this specially curated event to give you a good impression of our company and game that will color your review'. The closest thing to what they think happens regularly that ever actually happened was Jeff Gerstmann getting fired. But they hate him for being a liberal cuck or whatever.
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Jul 16, 2019 00:19
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"give us a good review and we'll give you a lifetime supply of doritos"
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Jul 16, 2019 00:41
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Flytrap posted:Especially considering the majority of the bribes journos gets is 'hey, give us a good review or we'll stop sending you review copies' or 'hey, come to this specially curated event to give you a good impression of our company and game that will color your review'. The only legit "ethics in gaming journalism" thing I've seen is when a staff writer at IGN (you know this is an old story because IGN had staff writers) gave Kaine & Lynch 2 like a 6.5/10 and that week the publisher had paid to completely blanket the website in Kaine & Lynch poo poo. I think they fired the guy when he wouldn't change his review.
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Jul 16, 2019 07:09
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